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I don't think you can speak for me in that regard. I've said on numerous occassions that I am not in favour of a GST cut, period.

If the CPC broke their promise to cut it twice, and instead further reduced the debt, or any of the other options listed, I'd have praised the change of heart (while indeed mocking them for breaking their promise, lol, but I'd still be happy about it).

politicians keeping promises is great, provided one agrees with what was promised in the first place...which I do not.

I think it's extremely unfair to imply that Mulroney's GST and NAFTA are what allowed all subsequent administrations to make their financial decisions.

Once again, the CPC cannot be criticized...and now what the Liberals did in the past was only because of some groundwork laid by a previous Conservative gov't.

right.

quote:

Originally posted by MarkT I don't think you can speak for me in that regard. I've said on numerous occassions that I am not in favour of a GST cut, period. If the CPC broke their promise to cut it twice, and instead further reduced the debt, or any of the other options listed, I'd have praised the change of heart (while indeed mocking them for breaking their promise, lol, but I'd still be happy about it). politicians keeping promises is great, provided one agrees with what was promised in the first place...which I do not. I think it's extremely unfair to imply that Mulroney's GST and NAFTA are what allowed all subsequent administrations to make their financial decisions. Once again, the CPC cannot be criticized...and now what the Liberals did in the past was only because of some groundwork laid by a previous Conservative gov't. right.

The GST added an instant I-don't-even-know-how-many billions of dollars to the Federal coffers. Exports increased by a HUGE margin thanks to NAFTA and created a HUGE windfall of cash for the feds. To call it 'unfair' to imply that the GST, NAFTA and yes, some big spending cuts by the Liberals were the sole contributors to the new-found ability of our government to balance the books, pay down our debt, AND pay for all the social services we enjoy is either very naive, or denial.

Go ahead and criticize the CPC. I switch back and forth between parties based firstly on who seems genuine, and backs it up with action, and secondly on whether or not I agree with what they're doing. The Liberals did nothing and stole our money, that's a FANTASTIC record over the course of 13 years. I voted for Paul Martin because I felt he deserved a chance to change things and improve our country. He did nothing and promised everything. Now we have another Liberal candidate who sat around doing nothing in Chretien's cabinet spouting pipe-dream rhetoric about the environment, and doing little else. As much as I try to stay moderate, the Liberals sure do make it VERY easy to stay a conservative these days.

On the flip-side we have the Tories led by Harper, who have kept most of their promises (although the wait-times guarantee was a bunch of hot-air, but so is every other promise made in regards to health-care from all parties, we need an overhaul of the entire system, not simply more money and wait-times promises) and are continuing to keep the books balanced and pay down the debt. That speaks of integrity to me, integrity that the Liberals don't have. Liberals make bold promises, then break them all and govern like Conservatives. Until the CPC starts promising things I don't agree with, or start breaking their election promises as blatantly as the Liberals, they have my vote.

Now I honnestly expect massive personal income taxes reduction now that the GST has been reduced. Its time to give room to provinces to hike theirs to pay the bills like Harper has said. (he still barely touched the personal income taxes).

quote:

Originally posted by Spam ...

keep in mind the GST replaced the 13.5% FST and was intended to be revenue neutral (though that no doubt proved not to be the case over time). But I would be curious to see the "net gain" in federal coffers. Early figures I found indicated $50 billion gross, but only $20 billon net after costs, rebates, payouts to comp provinces for HST implementation, etc. Then, of course, you need to subtract whatever the gov't was collecting from the FST. I'm honestly curious though and not suggesting the GST did NOT add billions...I just haven't found the actual figures.

It's kind of hard to debate though when you say things like "the Liberals did nothing and stole our money, that's a FANTASTIC record over the course of 13 years". come on. even the most ardant Liberal hater can't stand behind such sweeping, dismissive statements, lol.

in any case, this has gone *way* off track...

my point is to suggest that the ~$12 billion dollars in GST revenue could have been put to better use by the CPC and that it's more PR move than sound policy.

if you disagree, then I'd like to see your argument for why the GST cuts were the BEST option...and answering that it's great to see a party stick to its election promises is NOT an valid argument in that regard. To say it's 'better than nothing' isn't valid either. Why is this the BEST option...because shouldn't we hold that standard for all of our administrations...doing what is BEST for the country?

I hope you're hungry!

I am! I'm eating a sub right now

I can't wait for that extra few cents in GST savings on my future sub purchases...I'll be freakin' rich!

I save 2 cents on every extra large coffee I buy at Tim Hortons....that equals a total savings of approximately $8.00 a year for me....WOW...I think I will buy that 52" Plasma with all the money I am saving.

Bitch bitch whine whine

moan

quote:

Originally posted by infinity HiGH moan

quote:

Originally posted by MarkT keep in mind the GST replaced the 13.5% FST and was intended to be revenue neutral (though that no doubt proved not to be the case over time). But I would be curious to see the "net gain" in federal coffers. Early figures I found indicated $50 billion gross, but only $20 billon net after costs, rebates, payouts to comp provinces for HST implementation, etc. Then, of course, you need to subtract whatever the gov't was collecting from the FST. I'm honestly curious though and not suggesting the GST did NOT add billions...I just haven't found the actual figures. It's kind of hard to debate though when you say things like "the Liberals did nothing and stole our money, that's a FANTASTIC record over the course of 13 years". come on. even the most ardant Liberal hater can't stand behind such sweeping, dismissive statements, lol. in any case, this has gone *way* off track... my point is to suggest that the ~$12 billion dollars in GST revenue could have been put to better use by the CPC and that it's more PR move than sound policy. if you disagree, then I'd like to see your argument for why the GST cuts were the BEST option...and answering that it's great to see a party stick to its election promises is NOT an valid argument in that regard. To say it's 'better than nothing' isn't valid either. Why is this the BEST option...because shouldn't we hold that standard for all of our administrations...doing what is BEST for the country?

You got me, I was arguing like a 10 year old instead of thinking before I typed.

What would have been the BEST option or use for the 1% GST? I would have allocated it entirely to the national debt, which would have led to huge long-term savings, and a small immediate savings through interest costs that could have been passed down to the people. But giving the money back to the people straight-up is the second-best option to me. I'll take second-best when the alternative is voting for any of the other parties in Canada. If something needs a huge funding increase, I'm in the camp that says prioritize your shit and get it done. I'm not a member of camp "Tax the hell out of everyone and then tax them some more when we need more money to run our services." There are plenty of programs the feds fund that should be cut before raising taxes ever happens. There's waste in the system, and covering it up with GST and higher taxes is the wrong way to go about fixing it.

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