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-- Defending Afghanistan
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Originally posted by Magnetonium We shouldn't be sacrificing our limited troops for American agenda. At the same time we are hurting out international reputation and passing up important regions which really need a peacekeeping mission.

I always find it funny the amount of effort Canadians exert when traveling overseas to ensure the natives (of wherever they are traveling) do not think they are americans. The only real differences between americans and canadians are government provided healthcare, a sense of entitlement among some segments of the population to 'entitlements', and you guys say, "aaA" after every other word. The reality is, Canadians need to support american agenda because we buy so much of your shit. Moreover, if canada was ever in a military conflict, the US would provide immediate protection. In fact, if it wasn't for the US, russia probably would have claimed much of Canada's arctic region once oil was discovered. Canada is rather insulated from conflict for two major reasons (i) its isolation, and (ii) its close connection with the US.

quote:

Originally posted by jerZ07002 I always find it funny the amount of effort Canadians exert when traveling overseas to ensure the natives (of wherever they are traveling) do not think they are americans. The only real differences between americans and canadians are government provided healthcare, a sense of entitlement among some segments of the population to 'entitlements', and you guys say, "aaA" after every other word. The reality is, Canadians need to support american agenda because we buy so much of your shit. Moreover, if canada was ever in a military conflict, the US would provide immediate protection. In fact, if it wasn't for the US, russia probably would have claimed much of Canada's arctic region once oil was discovered. Canada is rather insulated from conflict for two major reasons (i) its isolation, and (ii) its close connection with the US.

Dont forget those maple syrup covered cheese eating surrender monkeys they have... aka Quebecians!

for everyone crying foul of the foreign armies in afghanistan, what would you have them do?

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Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN for everyone crying foul of the foreign armies in afghanistan, what would you have them do?

It's not what would we have them do. It's what the politicians need to do. They need to realize the futility of democracy in Afghanistan of all places. And act accordingly by withdrawing foreign troops. This really is sucking our country dry in a time when we're running huge deficits and a gigantic national debt. Never mind the horrible strategic situation, historically, and culturally, in the region. We just don't belong there. Period.

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Originally posted by jerZ07002 I always find it funny the amount of effort Canadians exert when traveling overseas to ensure the natives (of wherever they are traveling) do not think they are americans. The only real differences between americans and canadians are government provided healthcare, a sense of entitlement among some segments of the population to 'entitlements', and you guys say, "aaA" after every other word. The reality is, Canadians need to support american agenda because we buy so much of your shit. Moreover, if canada was ever in a military conflict, the US would provide immediate protection. In fact, if it wasn't for the US, russia probably would have claimed much of Canada's arctic region once oil was discovered. Canada is rather insulated from conflict for two major reasons (i) its isolation, and (ii) its close connection with the US.

Canada is the top exporter of oil to USA - dont forget that. You need our trade and resources. Its a mutual economic dependence, friendship, yes. But whats with the rubbish about Russia taking over Canadian Arctic? Russia only claims sovereignity up to the North Pole - not claiming the Canadian territorial waters. The same way Russia isn't threatening Norway ...

Military conflict AGAINST Canada? WOW, thats a new one. And no - we are insulated from conflict because we don't stick our noses into every country's business. But you Americans do. And for that much of the world dislikes you - and for that so many Americans wear Canadian flag pins when travelling abroad. Eh? And you pressure Canada to do your dirty work for you, serve as cannon fodder in Afghanistan, so that we can also drag ourselves down. Good thing is that Canadian economy is slowly but surely being diversified ...

We are doing a lot for USA and if we really start acting like you guys and do what you want us to do then Canada will lose its sovereignty - isn't that obvious! So it's no-brainer than Canada SHOULD have an independent voice, to protect its interests while maintaining good relations with everyone.

Look - if we had it like you Americans did - for example: the banks, we would be really screwed now. But we followed a different path - and decided to keep the banks on the leash and as a result today Canadian banks are stronger than ever, and only little bit affected by the crap going on south of the border. Several Canadian banks have now jumped in the TOP 10 in North America due to decline of many American banks.

quote:

Originally posted by jerZ07002 I always find it funny the amount of effort Canadians exert when traveling overseas to ensure the natives (of wherever they are traveling) do not think they are americans.

Just an FYI... we do this because we get much better treatment in much of the world when people know we're Canadian as opposed to American. Whether or not this preferential treatment is warranted or not is questionable; however, I can attest that it is the reality.

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The only real differences between americans and canadians are government provided healthcare, a sense of entitlement among some segments of the population to 'entitlements', and you guys say, "aaA" after every other word.

First; it's "eh" not "aaa." Second; on a person to person basis there is very little difference between Canadians and Americans... on a political culture level there are vast differences; albeit subtle.

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The reality is, Canadians need to support american agenda because we buy so much of your shit.

No, the reality is that we need to be good neighbours. This will often require us supporting the US agenda (which we often do) but we can have differences of opinion... our interdependent economies are not going to sever ties simply because we don't do all the US' bidding.... the whole Iraq thing is a good example.

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Moreover, if canada was ever in a military conflict, the US would provide immediate protection.

This is likely true for two reasons; 1) protecting Canada is beneficial to US interests, and 2) the mutual defense pact that is a cornerstone of NATO kind of demands it. While your assertion is true I do find it rather interesting that it has never actually happened... not once... the US had never come to the aid of Canada... ever. The US can't really say the same of Canada though... you guys always seem to forget that.

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In fact, if it wasn't for the NATO, Russia and the US probably would have attempted to claim much of Canada's arctic region once oil was discovered. Canada is rather insulated from conflict for two major reasons (i) its isolation, and (ii) its close connection with NATO.

I just fixed up that last bit for you.

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Originally posted by Magnetonium [COLOR=FF7F50] Canada is the top exporter of oil to USA - dont forget that. You need our trade and resources. Its a mutual economic dependence, friendship, yes.

I'm not in total disagreement with you here; however, let's be honest with ourselves... there is economic interdependence with the US and Canada because it is in both of our interests to have it this way. If our trade relationship were to end both countries would suffer; however, the US would have a much easier time finding new suppliers for resources then Canada would finding new markets for same.

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And you pressure Canada to do your dirty work for you, serve as cannon fodder in Afghanistan, so that we can also drag ourselves down.

Don't blame the Americans for our involvement in Afghanistan... that's folly. We are in Afghanistan because our best ally was attacked by an enemy that the Afghan government of the day was sheltering. This is what allies do; they come to each other's defense. Having allies such as we do via NATO serves our interests; in order to maintain such alliances we must assist our allies as we would require them to assist us if the roles were reversed; subsequently, our involvement in Afghanistan (initially at least) serve(s)/(d) our interest.

You're making a classic error that Canadians often make... you're blaming the elements of our foreign policy that are inconsistent with our own view of Canada/Canadians on US influence; however, you're forgetting that in order to protect our interests and safeguard those things that are most "Canadian" we need to support our allies/partners/friends.

So much for progress of human rights in Afghanistan! What are the Canadian troops dying for, again? This is ridiculous ...

http://www.thespec.com/News/CanadaWorld/article/540886

quote:

Canada protests Afghan 'rape' law Wives can't refuse sex, leave house or gain child custody April 01, 2009 OTTAWA � Canadian officials contacted the Afghan government yesterday to express concern about new legislation that would reportedly allow men to rape their wives. The Canadian government reacted with outrage following reports that the Karzai administration has approved a wide-ranging family law for the country's Shia minority. The legislation is believed to contain articles that make it illegal for Shia women to refuse their husbands sex, leave the house without permission, or have custody of children, the London-based newspaper The Guardian reported yesterday. Canadian officials contacted the office of President Hamid Karzai, and Foreign Affairs Minister Lawrence Cannon spoke to two Afghan cabinet ministers yesterday seeking clarification. Karzai's office has so far refused to comment on the legislation. Critics say Karzai's government approved it in a hurry to win support in the upcoming election from ethnic Hazaras � a Shia Muslim minority that constitutes a crucial block of swing voters. Canada, which has lost 116 soldiers in Afghanistan and spent up to $10 billion propping up the Karzai government, has demanded more information about the law. "If these reports are true, this will create serious problems for Canada," said International Trade Minister Stockwell Day. "The onus is on the government of Afghanistan to live up to its responsibilities for human rights, absolutely including rights of women. "If there's any wavering on this point from the government of Afghanistan, this will ... create serious problems and be a serious disappointment for us." Day was fielding questions in the House of Commons about the reported law while Cannon was in Europe attending an international summit on Afghanistan. Late yesterday, Canadian officials said they had learned the law was not yet in effect but that they remained "very concerned."

We've been in a constant state of war since the country's birth. If it wasn't Afghanistan it would be somewhere else. Don't kid yourself about that. Warfare is natural.

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Originally posted by Zild We've been in a constant state of war since the country's birth. If it wasn't Afghanistan it would be somewhere else. Don't kid yourself about that. Warfare is natural.

and very profitable....

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Originally posted by LazFX and very profitable....

will to power

quote:

Originally posted by Zild will to power

Power to give the power of will....



so blazed!!!! ha ha ha

Laz i'm pretty sure I'm going active army after i graduate... if they waive me that is.


Now that is funny.

quote:

Originally posted by Zild We've been in a constant state of war since the country's birth. If it wasn't Afghanistan it would be somewhere else. Don't kid yourself about that. Warfare is natural.

Not the same for Canada. Canada was not a result of nationalism, and no statues have been sculpted to some martyr here ... we dont have national heroes and lack patriotism that you guys have that drive you to maintaining warfare that will one day result in your demise. Cracks can already be seen in your invincible machine.

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Originally posted by Magnetonium Not the same for Canada. Canada was not a result of nationalism, and no statues have been sculpted to some martyr here ... we dont have national heroes and lack patriotism that you guys have that drive you to maintaining warfare that will one day result in your demise. Cracks can already be seen in your invincible machine.

What invincible machine? Empires rise and fall. It is simply the nature of the beast. Oh yeah and when we go you go too.

quote:

Originally posted by Zild Laz i'm pretty sure I'm going active army after i graduate... if they waive me that is.

Dude thats great. honestly it is. your experiences will multiply by leaps and bounds... I am sure even Q will tell you that going into the service gave him a different perspective on life....he just came out wrong with his whole GOP/Rush Limbaugh ball licker phase he is in now. ha ha ha

If I would not of broke my neck, I would of stayed in the Navy for a long time.

quote:

Originally posted by Zild What invincible machine? Empires rise and fall. It is simply the nature of the beast. Oh yeah and when we go you go too.

That is true, if America falls, or should I say when it falls and changes into a totally different animal, Canada will no longer be Canada. Like Zild said, its simply the nature of the beast. It will happen, history does repeat itself. Humans are damn near incapable of reinventing them selves.... look at even the most trivial things in humanity.... fashion, music, myths aka: religions,

You do know the are remaking the fucking Karate Kid with Jacki Chan playing Mr. Miaggi, right??

quote:

Originally posted by LazFX That is true, if America falls, or should I say when it falls and changes into a totally different animal, Canada will no longer be Canada. Like Zild said, its simply the nature of the beast. It will happen, history does repeat itself. Humans are damn near incapable of reinventing them selves.... look at even the most trivial things in humanity.... fashion, music, myths aka: religions, You do know the are remaking the fucking Karate Kid with Jacki Chan playing Mr. Miaggi, right??

Soviet Union collapsed but much of Eastern Europe has reinvented itself, with exceptions to the countries like Ukraine and Belarus who have Russia partly to blame. Look at Czechs today, currently leading the EU.

So Canada will be fine when you guys go down - unless you physically take us down with you. Otherwise Canada will readjust and refocus on EU and other partners.

American Empire's fall will affect many countries in some way, but that doesn't mean the world will stop and we all die from it or start speaking Arabic or Spanish all of a sudden. You need to look at things more rationally.

So do you. When Rome fell the city and the people and the land didn't just cease to exist. What we are talking about is the power you now enjoy by being allied with us will be gone.

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Originally posted by Zild So do you. When Rome fell the city and the people and the land didn't just cease to exist. What we are talking about is the power you now enjoy by being allied with us will be gone.

We were fine before. Not so long ago, when we were close to the British. I was studying some Canadian history lately and funny how it wasn't that long ago when we tried to protect ourselves from America and its Manifest Destiny (threatening Canadian national integrity) and the liberal system, and imposed tariffs to protect Canadian goods and economy.

"Peace, order, good government" vs. your "Liberty, opportunity and pursuit of happiness".

Your American system has really killed off our old Canadian values. Time to get them back. There was a time when we weren't dependent on you guys and didnt need your tanks because we were too busy protecting ourselves from your aggression.

Who knows - maybe next thing you know Canada will be allied with Russia? British came and went, Americans may do so too, who's next?

Fuck if that is how you want it we'll roll over on you with no qualms. I've always wanted a 51st state.

quote:

Originally posted by Magnetonium Not the same for Canada. Canada was not a result of nationalism, and no statues have been sculpted to some martyr here

What? Do you even know the history of Canada? Most of the residents of what later became Canada in the late 1700s and early 1800s came here from the US because they wished to remain British rather then become American Citizens. These British North Americans and/or there descendants later decided to confederate their independent colonies to form Canada precisely because they wanted to remain British North Americans and were fearful that the very large and battle hardened Union armies in the US would simply turn north and annex their colonies after winning the US civil war. British North American nationalism later developed into Canadian nationalism; however, it is absolutely flawed to say that Canada was not founded on nationalism. Additionally, in the Canadian war museum there is a beautiful room, right in the centre, that houses (only) the unknown soldier... clearly, you've never been; however, I assure you it is a powerful monument to countless martyrs. Just about every Canadian City has a cemetaph honouring our dead from The Great Wars, Korea, and all foreign missions. There is National War Memorial, the Newfoundland National War Memorial, National Aboriginal Veterans Monument, Nursing Sisters Memorial, The Memorial Arch, The Commonwealth Air Forces Memorial, the Book of Remembrance (held in the Memorial Chamber in the Peace Tower), The Halifax Memorial, The Victoria Memorial, The Canadian National Vimy Memorial (easily one of the most spectacular war memorials in the world), The Juno Beach Centre, plus countless National Battlefields and Cemeteries both in Canada and Europe (note; I've only included those monuments actually owned and maintained by the Canadian Federal Government... if I were to include the private memorials and those constructed by our allies and the benefactors of our forces world-wide the list would be absolutely staggering). Honestly, the more you post the more you reveal that you either have an extremely poor understanding of Canada and the Canadian identity or your hatred for the US and desire to seem morally superior has blinded you from truth.

quote:

Originally posted by Magnetonium So Canada will be fine when you guys go down - unless you physically take us down with you. Otherwise Canada will readjust and refocus on EU and other partners.

In the long run we'd be okay but never quite as good and certainly not without a lot of pain in the meantime.

Fuck this!! It would be easier just to fucking invade you.


in all honesty... I mean I heard the other day on Fox News that your army is for shit. so watch it lil man.



we are watching you........ especially Canadians of the Old Mother Russia persuasion. eh comrade??

quote:

Originally posted by Magnetonium We were fine before. Not so long ago, when we were close to the British. I was studying some Canadian history lately and funny how it wasn't that long ago when we tried to protect ourselves from America and its Manifest Destiny (threatening Canadian national integrity) and the liberal system, and imposed tariffs to protect Canadian goods and economy. "Peace, order, good government" vs. your "Liberty, opportunity and pursuit of happiness". Your American system has really killed off our old Canadian values. Time to get them back. There was a time when we weren't dependent on you guys and didnt need your tanks because we were too busy protecting ourselves from your aggression. Who knows - maybe next thing you know Canada will be allied with Russia? British came and went, Americans may do so too, who's next?

Riiiiight, that's why the US is your number 1 trading partner ay?

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