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-- S&P downgrades U.S. credit rating from AAA
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So will you guys finally lower your expenses and increase the goddamn taxes? This is fucking ridiculous.
^
No.
This is great, the whole world is currently blagging us, and rightfully so.
I love the ads up top now. They are all about credit scores. hehe.
It's a revenue problem, not a spending problem? America would be on the path to prosperity if the government just took more tax revenue? The same government that spends trillions on banksters and immoral wars? Medicare on pace to consume GDP in two generations, but tax breaks for the rich are the problem?
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| Originally posted by Arbiter Well, these are the same idiots who gave AAA ratings to the mortgage-backed securities that precipitated this whole "time of ongoing fiscal and economic challenges," so it's not as if the U.S. having a AAA rating meant anything to begin with. |
Does anyone have any more graphs?
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| Originally posted by nchs09 It just reflects confidence in future investments --- so ya, it is a bit important. |
i guess it's time to start shorting bonds.
http://www.google.ca/finance?q=NYSE%3ATBT
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| Originally posted by TranceArmstrong It's a revenue problem, not a spending problem? America would be on the path to prosperity if the government just took more tax revenue? The same government that spends trillions on banksters and immoral wars? Medicare on pace to consume GDP in two generations, but tax breaks for the rich are the problem? |
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| Originally posted by DOOMBOT You are bringing up good points that unfortunately get ignored by most people. |
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China tells U.S. "good old days" of borrowing are over NEW YORK/SHANGHAI (Reuters) - China bluntly criticized the United States on Saturday one day after the superpower's credit rating was downgraded, saying the "good old days" of borrowing were over. Standard & Poor's cut the U.S. long-term credit rating from top-tier AAA by a notch to AA-plus on Friday over concerns about the nation's budget deficits and climbing debt burden. China -- the United States' biggest creditor -- said Washington only had itself to blame for its plight and called for a new stable global reserve currency. "The U.S. government has to come to terms with the painful fact that the good old days when it could just borrow its way out of messes of its own making are finally gone," China's official Xinhua news agency said in a commentary. After a week which saw $2.5 trillion wiped off global markets, the move deepened investors' concerns of an impending recession in the United States and over the euro zone crisis. Finance ministers and central bankers of the Group of Seven major industrialized nations will confer by telephone later on Saturday or on Sunday, a senior European diplomatic source said. The source said the credit rating downgrade had added a global dimension on top of the euro zone debt issue, raising the need for international coordination. "The G7 will confer by telephone. It's not yet confirmed whether it will be in one stage or in two stages, tonight and tomorrow," the source said. French Finance Minister Francois Baroin, who would chair such a meeting under France's G7 and G20 presidency, said it was too early to say whether there would be an early G7 gathering. In the Xinhua commentary, China scorned the United States for its "debt addiction" and "short sighted" political wrangling. "China, the largest creditor of the world's sole superpower, has every right now to demand the United States address its structural debt problems and ensure the safety of China's dollar assets," it said. It urged the United States to cut military and social welfare expenditure. Further credit downgrades would very likely undermine the world economic recovery and trigger new rounds of financial turmoil, it said. "International supervision over the issue of U.S. dollars should be introduced and a new, stable and secured global reserve currency may also be an option to avert a catastrophe caused by any single country," Xinhua said. In Washington, President Barack Obama urged lawmakers on Saturday to set aside partisan politics after the debt battle, saying they must work to put the United States' fiscal house in order and refocus on stimulating its stagnant economy. S&P blamed the downgrade in part on the political gridlock in Washington, saying politics was preventing the United States from addressing its deficit and debt problems. Obama called on Congress to back measures to give tax relief to the middle class, extend jobless benefits and pass long-delayed international trade pacts. "Both parties are going to have to work together on a larger plan to get our nation's finances in order," he said. "In the long term, the health of our economy depends on it...in the short term, our urgent mission has to be getting this economy growing faster and creating jobs." STAY COOL In contrast to the Chinese criticism, France's Baroin said France had faith in the United States' ability to get out of this "difficult period." Friday's U.S. unemployment numbers were better than expected and so things were heading in the right direction, he said. "Therefore, one should not dramatise, one needs to remain cool-headed, one should look at the fundamentals," he told France's iTele. While the impact of the rating cut on financial markets when they reopen on Monday may be modest because the decision was expected, the shift may have a long-term impact for U.S. standing in the world, the dollar's status, and the global financial system. "I think even if it was half-expected, the consequence will be far reaching," said Ciaran O'Hagan, fixed income strategist at Societe Generale in Paris. "It will weigh on secure assets. The bigger reaction will be on risky assets, including equities and on agencies (Freddie Mac, Fannie Mae) and states backed directly by the federal government." But he added: "U.S. Treasuries will remain a benchmark. This is a ship which takes a long time to turn around." Norbert Barthle, a budget expert for German Chancellor Angela Merkel's conservatives said the downgrade would certainly provoke further turbulence in markets. "I'm not surprised about the U.S. rating downgrade, rather I am astonished that for weeks, international rating agencies have focused their attention on the European debt situation but not the American one. For a while, there have been clear worries about America's economic woes but also the fact the U.S. is heavily indebted." NO EARLY ITALIAN ELECTION In Europe, Italian Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi on Saturday ruled out calling early elections to stem market panic that has pounded Italian assets and forced his government to bring forward austerity measures. Italy buckled on Friday to world pressure by pledging to bring forward cuts to balance the budget in 2013 in return for European Central Bank help with funding. European policy makers are concerned that a debt emergency in the euro zone's third largest economy could completely overwhelm bailout mechanisms set up to help smaller troubled countries like Greece or Ireland. Italy is due to go to the polls in 2013 but Berlusconi dismissed any suggestion of emulating Spain, where Prime Minister Jose Luis Rodriguez Zapatero has called an early election to tackle the crisis. "This has absolutely not been talked about," Berlusconi told reporters. "This has never been an option." The European Union's top economic official praised Italy's decision to accelerate budget-balancing measures and structural economic reforms and said swift implementation was now crucial. "I strongly support this announcement and call on the authorities to quickly translate it into concrete measures," European Economic and Monetary Affairs Commissioner Olli Rehn told Reuters in a telephone interview. "This will help to boost potential growth, secure budgetary retrenchment and bolster market confidence," Rehn said. The European Central Bank sources said the bank remains divided over whether to buy Italian government bonds but even some of those who favor the move say Italy should do more to front-load austerity measures. Two sources said they expected ECB President Jean-Claude Trichet to hold a teleconference of the bank's policy-setting Governing Council over the weekend to discuss how to respond to turmoil in financial markets and Italy's latest measures. China and Japan have called for coordinated action to avert a new worldwide financial crisis. India's finance minister Pranab Mukherjee told reporters: "There is no need to unnecessarily press the panic button." (Additional reporting by Reuters bureaux; Writing by Angus MacSwan) |
Over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and
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| Originally posted by bananas So will you guys finally lower your expenses and increase the goddamn taxes? This is fucking ridiculous. |
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| Originally posted by Lews Over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and |
I heard everything that occurs during a presidency is only because of the current president and staff that's in charge.
Literally everything. Blame them for everything. Every little thing.
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| Originally posted by The17sss The truth hurts eh? |
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| Originally posted by enydo I heard everything that occurs during a presidency is only because of the current president and staff that's in charge. Literally everything. Blame them for everything. Every little thing. |
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| Originally posted by idoru I don't understand why it's so hard for people to understand that both sides deserve equal blame for this mess. |
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| Originally posted by idoru Oh yeah? Well, you wanna know what I heard? I heard that if a president has a really shitty term, then it's safe to assume that his losing opponent would've been an absolutely stand-up guy and that nothing could have possibly gone wrong. |
But seriously, I didnt have a in depth look into the American situation, but just to take look how other countries have dealt with financial crysis (my own country included) - you cut your expenses, you raise the taxes, just tighten your belt for a couple of years. Aint that the appropriate course of action?
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| Originally posted by The17sss |
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| Originally posted by EddieZilker Because, so far, the blame game is really working out for us. |
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| Originally posted by idoru Bingo. This left vs. right bullshit needs to get the fuck out of here. |
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| Originally posted by bananas But seriously, I didnt have a in depth look into the American situation, but just to take look how other countries have dealt with financial crysis (my own country included) - you cut your expenses, you raise the taxes, just tighten your belt for a couple of years. Aint that the appropriate course of action? |
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| "Cutting federal spending by $900 billion over 10 years" is Washington-speak for increasing federal spending by $7 trillion over 10 years. And, as Washington had originally planned to increase it by $8 trillion, that counts as a cut. If they'd planned to increase it by $20 trillion and then settled for merely $15 trillion, they could have saved five trillion. See how easy this is? And, if none of these parties seems inclined to pay down the debt now, what are the chances they'll feel like doing so by 2020 when, under these historic "cuts," it's up to $23 trillion-$25 trillion? |
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| Originally posted by EddieZilker Not just out of here. Out of the US, entirely. |
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| Originally posted by TranceArmstrong It's a revenue problem, not a spending problem? America would be on the path to prosperity if the government just took more tax revenue? The same government that spends trillions on banksters and immoral wars? Medicare on pace to consume GDP in two generations, but tax breaks for the rich are the problem? |
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Some critics continue to assert that President George W. Bush�s policies bear little responsibility for the deficits the nation faces over the coming decade � that, instead, the new policies of President Barack Obama and the 111th Congress are to blame. Most recently, a Heritage Foundation paper downplayed the role of Bush-era policies (for more on that paper, see p. 4). Nevertheless, the fact remains: Together with the economic downturn, the Bush tax cuts and the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq explain virtually the entire deficit over the next ten years (see Figure 1). The deficit for fiscal year 2009 was $1.4 trillion and, at nearly 10 percent of Gross Domestic Product (GDP), was the largest deficit relative to the size of the economy since the end of World War II. If current policies are continued without changes, deficits will likely approach those figures in 2010 and remain near $1 trillion a year for the next decade. ... Some commentators blame recent legislation � the stimulus bill and the financial rescues � for today�s record deficits. Yet those costs pale next to other policies enacted since 2001 that have swollen the deficit. Those other policies may be less conspicuous now, because many were enacted years ago and they have long since been absorbed into CBO�s and other organizations� budget projections. Just two policies dating from the Bush Administration � tax cuts and the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan � accounted for over $500 billion of the deficit in 2009 and will account for almost $7 trillion in deficits in 2009 through 2019, including the associated debt-service costs. [6] (The prescription drug benefit enacted in 2003 accounts for further substantial increases in deficits and debt, which we are unable to quantify due to data limitations.) These impacts easily dwarf the stimulus and financial rescues. Furthermore, unlike those temporary costs, these inherited policies (especially the tax cuts and the drug benefit) do not fade away as the economy recovers (see Figure 1). Without the economic downturn and the fiscal policies of the previous Administration, the budget would be roughly in balance over the next decade. That would have put the nation on a much sounder footing to address the demographic challenges and the cost pressures in health care that darken the long-run fiscal outlook. |
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