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-- The Supersaw Thread
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This is my attempt at a supersaw. I'm not 100% happy with it but it's decent.

MP3 Sample:
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Reason 3.04 Combinator Patch:
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quote:

Originally posted by Eldritch This is my attempt at a supersaw. I'm not 100% happy with it but it's decent. MP3 Sample: [[ LINK REMOVED ]] Reason 3.04 Combinator Patch: [[ LINK REMOVED ]]

Yeah this one is pretty good, unlike most of the others (including my one)

As a related question now that we seem to know what synths to use is how are people eq'ing there synths? I think to get a good sound this is really important! Where do you like to boost, where do you cut... if you eq depending on the octave the note is in how do you go about it?


For example for notes c5 and above I like to roll the tops off abit at about 13.5 to get rid of the hissyness. Do a very wide q boost say around 9khz of a 1 db or 2. And finally do a medium q reduction of a few db's around 500 and at at about 200 to reduce the resonant muddyness. Oh and low shelf sub 150 hz range of about 8db. This will vary depending on the notes being played but just do a sweep to find the resonances and thats where u cut alittle! What about you guys?

ehhh. it depends on alot of things, not just EQ.

and all of that depends on the synth you use.

i cant sleep so i fiddled on my virus b and came up with this:

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second attempt. my first attempt recorded really blurry and quiet and i didnt understand why - just found out one of the input cables on my virus wasnt plugged in all the way. reuploading now :\ it does have post processing on it however: namely, fruity chorus (although any chorus with a high EQ will do it), fruity delay 2 (set to ping pong delay) and the whole thing is compressed using voxengo crunchessor.

ill post the unprocessed sound later so you can see how much of an effect post processing has - it really changes the treble and mids since the virus oscillators are not very bright. with a little bit more work i think i can get it closer. the filter isnt quite right. i know its wrong actually because im using the 6 pole filter and both filters. i dont think the JP even has a 6 pole filter. i just used it because it sounds nice.

edit: i forgot to mention. theres also an EQ on it. bright. ill bet my last euro that the supersaw oscillator has high shelf EQ on it because it is so bright. actually, thats what i did with my virus patch right at the end of the effects chain. stuck a high shelf around 10 khz and a low shelf around 200 hz. that took the emphasis away from the mid ranges. now that i listen to it, theres a bit too much boom on the low end so i probably have to soften that low shelf a bit.

another thing: for virus users - the pure saw wave oscillator doesnt sound anything like the saw wave or the supersaw oscillators on the JP. especially below C4 on a piano roll. the virus pure saw wave gets really 'buzzy' below C4 for some reason. i also had this problem when emulating a 303 on my virus b (which can be done by the way and i can prove it). but you can compensate for the differences in oscillator properties by mixing between waveforms and EQing the end result.

i had to mix waveforms to get a JP'esque saw wave sound. first oscillator is a mix of saw and square (nearly all square) with a bit of PWM. osc2 is mostly saw with a tiny bit of square and the third oscillator is slaved. they are all mixed in equally. then both oscillator pulse widths are modulated in opposite directions using LFO1 and LFO2.

when you add the slaved oscillator there will be a kind of audible 'hissss' accompanying the sound. thats normal and kind of like the JP supersaw too. in fact, on the virus theres not enough hiss in my opinion. so i added some extra white noise in the oscillator sub menu. rack it up to 127 so you can hear it really clearly, then increase the noise colour so that it sort of 'harmonises' with the note you are playing. then turn it down to about 25 so its barely, barely audible. obviously, analogue boost and punch intensity is maxed. for making most VA or analogue sounds it usually is.

after that its the usual routine: use LFO 3 to modulate tuning of osc1 & 2, detune up until you start to hear a strong 5th (between 45 and 55). then unison x3 and high unison detune. the rest is random detail in the mod matrix to make it sound more alive - i set the first assign source as random with its destination as osc3detune. every time you press a key, it randomly detunes the 3rd oscillator slightly giving it a bit of subtle random movement and makes it a little more analoguey.

if you dont have a virus then i guess you could use any synth that allows you to mix sines, saws and squares with PWM. albino springs to mind straight away although i hate its filter... oh well...

things i need to correct but know about at this stage:

1) saw wave oscillator behaviour below C4. below C4 the virus saw gets really buzzy and bitty and its a dead giveaway.

2) attack transient. i have recursivelely modulated both filter and amp attack in the mod matrix because the JP attack envelopes are non linear. at least from the sound sample i had. i cant tell what it is though so i fluked it and tried to get as close as i could. need to redo this slightly.

3) PWM goes nuts at around 18 seconds and also periodically throughout. ill fix that since its probably not oscillating correctly.

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with a virus TI you could probably get really really close - almost indistinguishable because the hypersaw oscillator is brighter than the regular virus saw oscillator. and it has the 3 band EQ from the Vc.

here is another one from me : http://perso.wanadoo.fr/TranceDevot...heRushComes.mp3

lol, funny how the main melody people are using is Airwave, over and over again.

System F anyone?

I think that the airwave melody is the best example of supersaw
Click Me

quote:

lol, funny how the main melody people are using is Airwave, over and over again.

actually i used it because someone, few a months ago on this forum posted a 'guess which one is pro53 and which one is the JP8000' thread. he used that airwave melody.

i just reference my JP emulations on that soundclip because its the only clip of a real JP8000 that i have.

if someone could post a clip of the raw supersaw oscillator, without anything on it. then filter sweep with 0 resonance. then filter sweep with 1/3rd resonance that would be kind of useful for alot of people making emulations.

version 2.2 of the virus b supersaw is on the way.

quote:

Originally posted by FrancoR I think that the airwave melody is the best example of supersaw Click Me

some sync problems on this one

and derivative's one is nice but I think the filter used doesn't really match.

hurrr! im gonna update it in a sec.

i dont own a JP and dont have any kind of reference sound so i dont know how the filter sounds like when it sweeps. the only reference i have is that 'supersaw B.wav' that someone posted playing an airwave melody. no filter sweep though.

if someone would be gracious enough to post details of the JP filter and a soundclip of someone sweeping a straight saw oscillator. then a straight supersaw oscillator, with 0 resonance and then with resonance at around 1/3rd of the way up. then ill try to emulate it on virus b and post the specs.

but i need a reference. i got really close to the 303 filter (and really close to the 303 saw wave) on virus b but i had audiorealism bassline as a reference model.

ehhh. heres the update:

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i didnt bother with the filter sweep this time since i dont know what the real deal sounds like. i fixed the PWM issues and the LFO sync. upped the detune too. im not normally into really heavily detuned sounds (they sound out of tune to my ears, especially above C6). but you kind of have to use loads of it to get close to the tone of a supersaw. i think i have the tone nearly down to a tee. theres not enough saws though and there are still issues.

the problems:

1) i dont have enough voices on my virus b to playback this patch in 1 go (only have 24 voices. less actually since im using the 3rd oscillator). it consists of 2 parts in a multi timbral patch. the high intervals are played as normal (unison is on x4 now. cannot go any higher without voices cutting out). heres the problem, the underlying sub part is the same patch only with 0 resonance and unison x8. therefore to play the whole thing in realtime you would need a virus TI (the 32 voice limit on a virus C is not enough).

2) i have used post processing on this since i dont have the EQ of the virus C. effects i added - fruity chorus, fruity delay 2, parametric EQ and the whole thing is compressed using voxengo crunchessor. i changed the high shelf and low shelf, pulling the high shelf more into the upper mids. but theres slightly too much mid now. i sorted out the low end boom i think. the virus saw waves however are too dark to replicate a supersaw without a high shelf EQ.

even with the compressor i had to run it into soundforge and manually lower the gain on all the clipped peaks. there were lots of really huge spikes that just ate up headroom. by doing this i saved 4 dB of headroom.

once i nail a supersaw on a virus b, i wanna work on a perfect prophet 5 clone...

i imagine building supersaws on a virus TI would be 10 times easier. more voices, shelf EQs, hypersaw oscillator. etc.

nice update. it sounds really close now.
If you want to hear a supersaw, try the rb2k1 mp3 demo http://www.rb2k1.com/rtbv1.htm
or the 3rd Xploration mp3 demo from vengeance sound http://www.soundwizard.de/Sounds/ww...l%20Schleis.mp3

here is another supersaw melody (FM7) : http://perso.wanadoo.fr/TranceDevotion/sanctuary.mp3

I thought i'd join in an contribute to the almighty super saw thread. This I made with a Virus C. The main difference in character from the JP-80X0 to the virus (besides the brightness factor) and other VAs is that the JP-80X0 supersaw and saw waveform has a more sharp aggressive bite to it. The Virus sounds smoother, more creamy.



Right click here, save as, rename to mp3

Here's a new version of my supersaw. It's alot sharper than before and to me it sounds pretty close to the real thing.
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I have fruity loops 3 (fl studio 4 and 5 run too slow and the sound is choppy on my computer) and I dont know what to download or buy to get the supersaw sound. I'd very much prefer downloading something for free, and Im using such an old program because Im still a beginner and Im learning the basics.

www.kvraudio.com > search for superwave p8 > download superwave > use superwave.

also... search the forums for ambins ensemble for reaktor... if you have reaktor ofcourse.

thanks, but uh, I downloaded superwave and put it in my effects folder, and I got it to open in fl, but any changes I made with it didn't exactly do anything. Do you know why?

what fx folder? put it in the vst folder (altho i dont remember the version floops started supporting vst). anyway if its open you can use it.

so whatdo you mean? you play notes and nothing comes out?

Its in the vst and it opens properly. Just when I add it as an effect to a sample, the sample doesn't change at all when I change something on the superwave

It's a soft synth, not an effect

aaaahhh lol... go to channels > add one > superwave, and add it as a plugin, like you do with 404 etc. then play some notes.

its not going to effect a sample its a sound generator by it self.

well in the first place I'd gone to plugins/fruity/generators (theres no channel folder) and it appeared on the channel list in fl, but when I tried to open it, it said the plugin couldn't be found. I also tried plugins/generators, and it didn't even appear on the list there.

maybe superwave is vst2 and fruity supports only vst... you would have to switch to 4 or 5 in that case.

re-install it and see what happens.

bah, the sound gets all choppy with 4 and 5. Probably because I have a damn celeron processor.. I'll be getting a new computer for christmas though.

A bunch of shit in reason.

http://s50.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=...X611UQU5OZ5BGE7

Fucking mint.

Only thing reason is good for.

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