TranceAddict Forums (www.tranceaddict.com/forums)
- Political Discussion / Debate
-- How Flight 77 Hitting The Pentagon Would Really Look?
Pages (6): « 1 2 3 4 [5] 6 »
I'll tell you why diseases are on the "rise." (although statistically I find no mention that today more people live in a diseased state than at any other time in history)
1. People live longer. Many of the diseases you're talking about are a product of aging. Why did we have no Alzheimer's or Parkinson's, and why do we have increased rates of cancer? Because people live longer. Your DNA slowly and naturally oxidizes throughout your entire life. Eventually you have problems. 4,000 years ago people lived to the ripe old age of 30. Now, people live to be 80 and beyond. That's 50 more years of in which to aquire disease.
2. Diseases are diagnosed better now. Thousands of years ago there were three forms of death. Either you died of a traumatic incident, you got "sick" and died, or you died of "old age." Now, every time someone dies, we have to have an explaination for it. Heart disease, CHF, diabetes, etc. Today every time a person has any type of chronic condition, we give it a name and slap it on them. 1,000 years ago you lived with what you had, and no one put a name on it. Now we have names for all these different diseases that have been around forever, and so now we have lots of people walking around with labels on. It may seem that we are more disease-prone today, but I would argue the opposite. We name and diagnose more diseases today, but we actually have less as a percentage of the overall population.
Taking antibiotics does not make bacteria "more powerful," it simply makes tham drug resistant. There is a difference. Before the advent of antibiotics many people died of infections we today consider benign. With drug resistant bacteria, you can no longer treat them with common antibiotics, but the body fights them in exactly the same manner as any other infection. It is no more "powerful" than the previous line of bacteria other than you can no longer treat it with the "older" antibiotics. If you are going to equate the "power" of a bacteria with its resistance to medicine I guess you're conceding that the power of a disease is relative to its strength against modern drug treatment and not as it acts against our own immune system. The diseases are only "more deadly" because they are no longer treatable with medicine. They are no "more deadly" than the non drug-resistant strains. If you don't take antibiotics, the drug-resistant and non drug-resistant strains will kill you just the same.
And I beg to differ, you told me that native Americans didn't have type I diabetes, in fact you said:
| quote: |
| As for diabetes: yes, I know about that. Its just the same story for tuberculosis. My point is, natives dont have it. |
| quote: |
| Diabetes: refer to what I just said. We have created this disease. Natives never had this originally. |
| quote: |
| As for diabetes: yes, I know about that. Its just the same story for tuberculosis. |
| quote: |
| Originally posted by NeoPhono Diabetes in the Pima Indians (oh, what's that?) |
"poor Lou Gehrig, how'd he not see that comin...here Lou, have a hot dog and a hummer on me."
| quote: |
| Originally posted by Shakka And I'm pretty sure Lou Gehrig's disease is not new since Gehrig died of ALS in 1941. And it's probably not a far stretch to believe ALS existed well before that, only it wasn't well chronicled. It's probably about as new as polio, which, thanks to modern medicine, has all but been eradicated. Who wants to wager that "drug-free" Magnetonium has had more than one vaccine in his life? |
| quote: |
| Originally posted by Magnetonium Actually, I am done with this thread. Hopefully one day, if not too late, you'll be able to see things outside of your propaganda books about how amazing the world is. |
| quote: |
| Originally posted by Magnetonium Actually, I am done with this thread. Hopefully one day, if not too late, you'll be able to see things outside of your propaganda books about how amazing the world is. |
| quote: |
| Originally posted by Magnetonium I was vaccinated when I was young, it wasnt my choice, and frankly it doesnt matter anymore. And I never said that Indians had ABSOLUTELY NO degenerative diseases, they had significantly less. I see that you guys think that everything is fine, the governments are honest, the world health is improving, people's life expectancy is on the rise, standards of living are higher, governments no longer lie to us .. .EVERYTHING IS F-CKING BETTER. And plus the environment is in top shape. Environment has never been healthier. We dont release harmful amounts of pollution and chemicals into environment, our soil is stronger, bla bla bla bla bla bla .... Alright, you can live in your ignorance. I am tired of this thread. Actually, I am done with this thread. Hopefully one day, if not too late, you'll be able to see things outside of your propaganda books about how amazing the world is. |
| quote: |
| Originally posted by Shakka Nobody is trying to make the claim that everything is hunky-dory and that the world is without myriad problems. However, I think that what's rubbing many the wrong way is that you have an incredibly black/white viewpoint on this subject (which, in and of itself is not necessarily a bad thing, however the conclusions you are jumping to are, IMO). If it's not A, then the government must be behind a grand conspiracy to hoodwink you. It's clear from your posts that you think you already have all the answers, even when presented well-qualified opinions from people who know far more about the subject matter at hand than yourself, and who have much more rational conclusions supported by physical evidence to back their own assertions, as opposed to simply stating something followed by "Fact!!" (FYI, I'm talking about Neo). If you want to throw in the towel, by all means. I think the board members have been quite tolerant and willing to entertain your conspiracy theories to this point. |
| quote: |
| Originally posted by Magnetonium Honestly to say, I dont have time for piling up links to back up every word I said here, especially when a lot of claims were made against my points with little or no evidence to back them. I dont know why I even came to this forum area, I rarely chat anyway. I am a very busy man. I was basically stating that humans are in a lot of trouble right now as a result of environment damage, government corruption and lies, religion, disease, wars, etc. There's plenty of evidence to back some of my points, and some others are my conclusions from them. But enough. Let ignorance prevail (as I described in better detail in my previous post). I have more success spreading my word outside of computer, and developed some good friends as a result and we are trying to help people out of the sh-thole that the civilization is going into. |
| quote: |
| Originally posted by Sunflower I understand what you're saying, but do you think any of those are new? Humans have been plagued with "environment damage, government corruption and lies, religion, disease, wars, etc" ever since our beginning |
Oh, as for poisons in food I just looked at my book shelf and 'Excitotoxins - The Taste That Kills' is an EXCELLENT book to back my point on harmful chemicals that are in foods today (and as well I'd like to recommend for reading the controversial book by Kevin Trudeau 'Natural Cures They Don't Want You To KNow About'). I dont feel like describing the Excitotoxins book, I am pretty sure google can give you a description. Basically it talks how aspartame, MSG and other chemicals alike are harmful to the body, and the studies show the harmful effects on the body.
Well what do you suggest the government do to combat all these problems then?
| quote: |
| Originally posted by Sunflower Well what do you suggest the government do to combat all these problems then? |
| quote: |
| Originally posted by Magnetonium Dont you think you should be doing something about it? It all starts with you. Dont expect government to force people around the world to change their damaging ways of life to stop the destruction of our biosystem of the planet (its not like its one of their priorities anyway; their real priority is do make sure they win the next elections). People will not accept such demands. AND Governments no longer have the power anyway. Corporations and very wealthy people are the ones with real power today, because money runs the world. People forgot that its actually them who have the real power to change things, but we are lost in the money trail. So it is up to us to show example for people to follow, but the problem with this is that wealthy people's lifestyle needs for someone living in poverty, and it will not exist otherwise. Its kind of like sports, one person wins and the other has to be a loser as a result; winners cant exist without losers. Same thing with rich people - they exist because other people suffer (and there are more poor people than rich because money is at stake). Economic growth requires resources from the planet. And our planet does not contain infinite supplies of fuel, trees, fresh drinking water, food, etc. etc. Do you want me to show you "proof" now for this? Or dont you think this is common sense? The change starts with you. The more people live a healthier for the world way, others will follow - like a domino effect or gravity or whatever you may call that. Every dollar that you will not spend on harmful to the planet causes will result in less money for the damage to continue living off. Remember, it all starts with you ... What have you done so far? |
| quote: |
| Originally posted by Sunflower lol. yea im going to start combating modern medicine because they create super disease |
To explain it to you in detail: bacteria multiplies in the body, does some damage. Drugs come in, kill most of bacteria. Some develop resistance to it, many reasons why it can happen (abuse of drugs, improper amounts, fast evolving bacteria, stronger resistance, incorrect drugs, health deficiencies, etc). Then different drugs are introduced to the body (all drugs have side effects, by the way, which require other drugs to suppress them and so forth). By now this bacteria has multiplied back to its previous numbers. This new drug kills most of the bacteria. Small amount become resistant to that drugs, and so on. Thus, the bacteria becomes STRONGER with every mutation, and HARDER to defeat. When it spreads, it becomes harder to get rid of. So simple, yet you try to twist my point!!!!
iF Drugs and anti-biotics were in fact successful, all diseases that they were developed to eliminate would have been gone by now, which is NOT the case. Wake up!!!
| quote: |
| Originally posted by Magnetonium No, forget what I said earlier. I dont want to talk about that, yuy miunderstood me and are twisting what I said. Seems like you just want to ignore what I said in my preivous post and continue to draw holes in my story. Basically, it seems like you dont understand or dont care about the situation on our planet. And thats why calamities will happen, because people will refuse to change. People believe they have the power to do what they want to nature, and then God and religion will come and save them at the last moment. As we speak, forests are cut in Amazon and world's population increases, and every newborn requires more resources, and then other people require additional resources because they cant manage very well (like the fact that North America is the number one consumer of energy in the world, and one of the leading waste makers as well) while much of the world lives off pennies and many of them dont even have television sets, some never heard of internet or know who Britney Spears. They can barely survive. And they blame us. And we dont care. And so on. Too much information to type up here, its unfortunate so many people dont care. Nature and resources cannot be easily replaced, in fact much of it can NEVER be brought back. So when will the destruction stop? Cloning and genetic engineering cannot reverse the damage. We need to stop the damage, and start reseeding the planet. How many times do I have to say this? Or are you going to ignore this and say some stupid non-relevant crap just to change the topic? Shame on you!!! Where's your sense of responsibility for your actions! |
| quote: |
| Originally posted by NeoPhono You could sell your computer and use the proceeds to help those who have never heard of the internet. It would also help reduce the waste of resources in the form of electicity and give you more time to go out and spread your message. Remember, the change starts with you! |
| quote: |
| Originally posted by Magnetonium iF Drugs and anti-biotics were in fact successful, all diseases that they were developed to eliminate would have been gone by now, which is NOT the case. Wake up!!! |
| quote: |
| Originally posted by Magnetonium I use computer to spread my message, and not to download pron and spend endless hours chatting away about nothing. I donate money to specific charities, I am a member of Green Party Of Canada (I donated there too), I talk to people about this, I encourage and support change, I spread the word. What you just said there makes me laugh, cause obviously you have done nothing. If you would have done something, you would have replied with what you did. But instead you pick on someone one, the way the Canadian political elections campaign works (dont vote for them, they're bad they do this-'n'-that-'n'-this!!!! vote for us instead!) Cheap. Shame on you. |
]. Regardless, everyone does their own thing, and I do mine. I just think it's funny hearing this guy spew his rhetoric.)
| quote: |
| Originally posted by DrUg_Tit0 Well, you are starting to make some more sense now, but this part is where you're still a bit off. Antibiotics can't really exterminate a specific disease because there are always thousands of people all over the world who are in various states of being infected. To exterminate a disease, you would have to have every single person in the world go through an antibotic therapy for a month or so at least. That is simply impossible to do, because a single infected individual can screw up the whole concept. This way the best we can do is to cure people with antibiotics, and if the bacteria become resistant, invent another antibiotic. But some diseases were infact exterminated completely by using antibiotics, it's just that it was a really costly, complicated, and time consuming procedure. |
| quote: |
| Originally posted by Magnetonium Bla bla bla. Basically antibiotics are not helpful, maybe you should tell the government to put them in a one giant vaccine package to inject in the younger people, but then again, the problems will not go away. Very often those same people who take anti-biotics take them again and again, meaning that they actually dont help much but making these people reliable on them, like on a drug. |
| quote: |
| I give them a credit for exterminating some diseases like smallpox, but those diseases are not very mutating, so it even could have been done with less powerful medicines. |
| quote: |
| Newer diseases out there, genetic and contagious alike, are beyond the treatment of drugs and anti-biotics = in fact all that the medicines do is enhance these diseases. |
| quote: |
| How about working on preventative measures than wasting so much money on the aftermath of out mistakes? |
| quote: |
| Drugs and anti-biotics do not solve the problem. Disease is still there, and the ways that this disease is evolving hasnt been properly looked at. |
| quote: |
| (natural medicines are actually banned in many places mainly because they get in the way of pharmaceutical business). |
| quote: |
| Its time for multi-trillion-dollar drug companies that mave made a huge profit fromm people's suffering to step aside and let others try their hand at disease. |
| quote: |
| Ask yourself: How did people survive from disease in earlier times, even before civilization? You think they had drugs and anti-biotics to help them? Or would it make sense that the body is not made for drugs and their damaging ways to the body that our bodies havent been made for? |
Alright, since I see there are some people in the States here, especially the medicine pro's then explain me these facts, and why we're being lied to (medicine is actually not a fact, but something that changes all the time):
1) Corporate crime is number one crime in north america
2) bloodletting was once proven to cure most illnesses, now its considered totally ineffective.
3) margarine was considered to be much healthier than butter. now research often suggests exact opposite is true
4) chocolate and oily foods were touted to be the ause of acne. Now research suggests that they do not contribute in any way to acne
5) homosexuality was once classified as disease
6) midical doctors touted that baby formula was much better than breast milk for children. now the exact opposite is shown to be true
7) milk was recommended for coating the stomach and alleviating stomach ulsers. Now it is discouraged and has been found to aggrevate ulcers.
8) why is it: if you kill someone you go to jail. but if you make a product that kills people, you will just be slapped a fine and then maybe continue making your medicines/drugs/products.
9) Over 10,000 Americans die every year from hospital "errors"
10) medical science stated that diet had absolutely no effect on disease or illness. now wer are told that diet has a huge effect on the prevention and cause of disease
11) medical science once had scientific evidence that the removing on tonsils annd appendix improved health and should be done to vritually everyone. now the medical science has reversed that theory.
12)children with astma were told to stay in enclosed pool area because the humidity was good for the asthmatic condition. Now the research suggests that the chlorine in the air from the pools actually aggrevates and makes the asthma worse.
13) chlorine and fluorine are deadly poisions when taken in high amounts, yet they're found in most of our drinking/tap water
14) the most obvious example is that there are thousands of drugs that have been approved by FDA BECAUSE THEY WERE SCIENTIFICALLY PROVEN to cure or prevent disease, in addition to have been touted as safe. Yet, years later, they have been pulled off the market after deaths, or have been proven to actually not cure or prevent disease as originally thought, or those drugs have had terrible side effects and turned out to be too dangerous for people to use.
15) In 1902, the people of the day believed that they knew all tgere was to know about the cure and prevention of disease. Yes they say this almost every year. Fifty years from now people will laugh at today's medicine and cry it foul for being so dead wrong.
16) scientific "facts" and medicinal "evidence" is usually accompanied by "It seems" or "It appears based on current observations and current research ..." or "I believe this to be true" bla bla bullshit.
17) therefore, there are vritually no medical facts. tHERE ARE OPNLY MEDICAL OPINIONS.
18) Surgery fails tens of thousand of North Americans every year, many of which HAVE TO HAVE SURGERY AGAIN OR SUFFER SOME SERIOUS PROBLEMS AS A RESULT.
19) more people have colds, cancers, diabetes, heart disease, sclerosis, muscular dystrophy, asthma, migraine headaches, joint, neck, and back pain than ever before!!!
20) more people have fatigue, stress, anxiety, depressions, insomnia, bad skin, dandruff, acid reflux, ulcers, stomach problems than ever before
21) medical science has absolutely, as a result, 100 percent, failed in the curing and prevention of illness, sickness and disease - and thats IN UNITED STATES ALONE!!! WHERE THE GOVERNMENT ACTUALLY GETS IN TOUCH WITH DRUG COMPANIES TO SELL AS UCH AS 5 TRILLION DOLLARS IN DRUGS TO AVERAGE AMERICANS!!! wow, thats a lot of money. There's a reason for pharmaceutical industry being one of the most powerful industries in the world.
22) more people visit doctors than ever before, more people take prescription and non-prescription drugs, more surgeries are performed, more ... more more
23) the percentage of Americans dying from cancer today is the same that is has been in 1950, in 1971. Over 200 billion dollars have been spent on to prevent and cure cancer. Yet today you have a greater chance of getting it than EVER BEFORE. aAmericans spend over 2 trillion dollars on health care, yet American infact mortality rate is higher than 20 other developed countries.
24) American life expectancy has been the highest in the world up until 1950s. Since then, life expectancy of USA is lower that at least 15 other coutries around the world
25) the average American doctor has over 30 different prescription and non-prescription drugs in the ir cabinet. Doctors there write over 3 billion prescriptions every year!!!
26) THE ONLY REAL WINNERS in the cure and prevention of drugs are drug companies and health-care companies themselves, whose profits are at all-time high
27) who are the winners on obesity? the corporations sell diet food, diet pills, and other weight-loss paraphernelia and are making more money than before
28) a healthy person never needs to take a drug. How many of these kind of people are out there? Judging by statistics, more and more people every day take drugs, and drug companies spread out all over the globe
29) drug companies have been known to suppress information that affects their profit, or other competitor drugs, especially the natural medicine variety.
30) all publicy trade corporations (durg companies included) have a legal responsibility to their shareholders to icrease profits, its the LAW!
30) US Law states that in order to sell drugs, you need to have them approved by FDA. Natural medicines are not patented so therefore cannot be "drugs" and are illegal in USA, because you need to have a license and have your "drug" certifiable by FDA. iF YOU CLAIM TO HAVE A CURE FROM NATURAL HERB OR SOMETHING THAT IS NOT APPROVED, your office will be raided with guns drawn, like in Nazi Germany, your company shut down, and you possibly in prison.
31) countless of industries have claimed that their products were safe and approved only to be shown quite the opposite much later.
32) all drugs have side-effects to them. Why is that? Is it maybe so that you would have to buy more drugs to cover those side-effects? And why is it that all that drugs do is suppress your symptoms?
33) drug companies do not want to cure people, their goal is not to cure disease. If everyone in the world has healthy, they would simply go out of business. A drug company only wants to sell more drugs
These are just some of the examples. But I bet you will just decry them as absolute non-sense.
Reminds me of a line from Kingpin...
audio link
Ishmael: "You really should try to quit Mr. Munson. They say it's bad for your heart, your lungs, it quickens the aging process."
Roy Munson: "Is that right? Who's done more research than the good people at the American Tobacco Industry? They say it's harmless. Why would they lie? If you're dead, you can't smoke."
I'm sure there are plenty of people and companies out there that have auspicious motives, however you once again paint with a very broad brush, and I think it's a tactical error on your part. While you may actually have some facts correct, you still haven't cited a single authoritative source to back up your assertions other than simply saying "Fact!".
Besides, wasn't the original topic of this threat about Flight 77 hitting the Pentagon and the government conspiracy behind it?
Good lord, you really are insane.
Let's see some sources to your "facts."
(Here comes the "instead of answering my questions, you just try to attack me and blow holes in my story" response.)
Powered by: vBulletin
Copyright © 2000-2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.