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yeah being able to click and get the results of every song lined up for you in the same key and bpm, id say thats pretty robotic. that was the original argument, was it not?

Do you consider the alphabet robotic?

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i didnt say none of us should be trying to scratch, i said none of us were a JZ and that its hard to find good turntablists these days, but put words in my mouth please, rub some more sensationalism all over it and top it off with a "you have your head stuck up your ass because you write music" cheap shot and we can just go back and forth all night.

No, actually, thats VERBATIM what you said. And all the crap you've added afterwards is backpedaling.

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well im sorry for coming off as such. this is probably the millionth ableton argument ive been in this week.

so your insane insecure ranting isn't isoalted to just this board? Good for us!

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ok guy playing at skate country on airline highway is not that big of an achievement. get over yourself. if youve been making a living djing for 12 years that would make you about 8 years too old to be posting on this board anyway.

I haven't played a skating rink or a wedding in my life, but I have had residencies all over the Southeast, and played raves when there was such a thing. Now I take time out of my schedule to help new DJs. Like I was doing in this thread for 7 pages before you posted. I also provide input on new DJ products and software for more than one company, which is one reason why I'm still active in the DJ community.

I bet this thread would look alot better with you on ignore...

Hmm, actually when I unhook the wire going to the Line In, it stops squealing (I can't believe I haven't even tried that yet).

So, what exactly does that mean? Still a grounding issue or something totally different?

quote:

Originally posted by nem0nic Do you consider the alphabet robotic? No, actually, thats VERBATIM what you said. And all the crap you've added afterwards is backpedaling. so your insane insecure ranting isn't isoalted to just this board? Good for us! I haven't played a skating rink or a wedding in my life, but I have had residencies all over the Southeast, and played raves when there was such a thing. Now I take time out of my schedule to help new DJs. Like I was doing in this thread for 7 pages before you posted. I also provide input on new DJ products and software for more than one company, which is one reason why I'm still active in the DJ community. I bet this thread would look alot better with you on ignore...

can we hug this one out man

Blake just stick to what you do best and do something productive, go make a remix or something we're not "beatmatching nazis" you seem to be very angry take it and your negativity else where...you'd still look like a knobhead behind the screen with your Ableton "live". I know that promoters here would never book you anyway. We can all mix on a computer )

blake you firestarter

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Originally posted by Blake_Jarrell Sasha sets up next to tables because he uses a Mac, and we all know what that means.

ha nice see avalon cd for clarification

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Originally posted by Prism Blake just stick to what you do best and do something productive, go make a remix or something we're not "beatmatching nazis" you seem to be very angry take it and your negativity else where...you'd still look like a knobhead behind the screen with your Ableton "live". I know that promoters here would never book you anyway. We can all mix on a computer )

you need a hug too dont you? did you not even read the thread? i dont even use ableton most of the time.

quote:

Still a grounding issue or something totally different?

I have to admit I'm at a total loss here. I was thinking feedback, but after hearing it again it doesn't really SOUND like feedback. Is it possible that the LINE IN on your computer is one of these multifunction jacks like I was talking about?

Or lets try this too. Go into your Windows volume control mixer app and find the output for LINE IN. It might also be called something like INPUT MONITOR. MUTE that source and drag the fader to zero while you're at it. Note that this is just muting the OUTPUT of this source, you'll still be able to record with it.

Now hook everything up the way you had it and see if it's still making the noise. If not, then it WAS a feedback loop. Post again if is still making the noise.

Blake, I'm actaully a fan of yours. I bought Destin Beach when it charted on Balance last year, and Okoboji when I heard Hybrid drop it on Proton (HUGE Hybrid fan, and they're a reason I'm pushing for better DJ interfaces/technology). So you have a little bit of my money. Maybe I do need a hug and took your opinion too personally. At least we all have something in our lives we can be this passionate about.

quote:

Originally posted by nem0nic Blake, I'm actaully a fan of yours. I bought Destin Beach when it charted on Balance last year, and Okoboji when I heard Hybrid drop it on Proton (HUGE Hybrid fan, and they're a reason I'm pushing for better DJ interfaces/technology). So you have a little bit of my money. Maybe I do need a hug and took your opinion too personally. At least we all have something in our lives we can be this passionate about.

awesome, im sorry for coming off like a cock gobbler

on the LINE IN topic, my line in on my laptop plays foreign radio stations whenever i hook a mic or anything to it, im not kidding.

I used to have the same noise with my set-up when I was recording. A few things that seemed to help out was grounding ur computer (I assume it's a desktop). It sounds stupid but it helped me out. I just used a wire to ground my computer case to the ground pin on the mixer. Another test you can do, (i do not recommend this as a long term solution, but to help find the noisey piece), is get a power bar, remove the third pin of the plug and plug everything into that bar. Try to record again, and see if the noise is gone.....then start unplugging and test.

Personally, I have no problems with people thinking that Ableton isn't a good tool to use for DJing.

That just gives us DJs who only use it now a serious leg up on how to maximize it to its fullest before everyone else who decides to ignore it (at their own risk) gets on board.

I've been using Live exclusively for the last year (haven't bought a record in like 14 months now - only use DJ download sites) and have spent the last year trying to figure out how make it work in front of a crowd.

the minute you figure out that successful DJing has almost nothing to do with the means and everything to do with timing, interaction with the dancefloor, and track selection (i.e. programming), the faster you learn how to make it work.

Now, I have more fun DJing than ever. And I've been doing this for about 17 years now (I'm 37). I've recently added a drum machine to my set up (w/ a Xone:3D) and there is nothing like it (the combo). It can get a bit hairy trying to set up when I get to a gig, but now its pretty easy. I can pretty much show up anywhere and interface with any DJ set up.

For what is worth, I just don't understand the need to have search items like BPM in traktor for Live. The audio is maleable and besides, with enough preparation (er, like listening to your vinyl and putting it in your record box w/ some organization) you can name your files with the information you need. If you know your music and can search for a key word (artist or track name), everything else is rather irrelevant.

I categorize my tracks in folders that describe sound or genre, and then have the name of the file contain BPM, intensity of the track, and the name. Pretty easy. Warp everything. Good to go.

The one thing that I think laptop DJs make the mistake of doing is mostly ergonomic. They put the laptop between them and the crowd. MISTAKE. Put that bitch off to the side and use it ONLY for reference. Keep the mixer, your body, and your eyes on the crowd. Vibe off your music and get a controller and map your controls so you don't have to touch the mouse but maybe 10% of the time (moving a track from the browser to session if you got an idea for a mix that you weren't thinking of when you loaded your session view before the gig).

And for those that think loading the session view prior to a gig is cheating, then I would just ask you to consider if it is cheating for a DJ to prepare their record bag of vinyl before a gig so they know their records and what order "might" work that night. Of course, that isn't cheating, its called preparation. All smart DJs do that. Loading a session view in advance just means that you have your "record bag" ready to play. Now you don't have to really study the laptop during a gig, you just remotely control the selection from your controller and you are bumping your tracks with ease.

I think the criticism of Live is unwarranted. Of course it can be better, but so could the process of playing vinyl. What a burden that has lifted when not having to try to support a dying medium simply for the sake of comfort.

and in all honesty, I've used FinalScratch, Traktor - and have been mildly intersted in Torq simply because it has rewire capability - but I just don't get why people feel the need to hold on to playing music back on a turntable as the way to go.

Its antiquated - unless you are a turntablist. That's where I understand. But if you are mixing electronic dance music, Live is the way to go.

(Damn, now I just violated my first sentence in this thread by trying to convince others of the power of Live. Especially Live 6! YOWZA. amazing.)

.02,

rob.

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Originally posted by robtronik and in all honesty, I've used FinalScratch, Traktor - and have been mildly intersted in Torq simply because it has rewire capability - but I just don't get why people feel the need to hold on to playing music back on a turntable as the way to go.

It simply all comes down to preference.

quote:

Originally posted by nem0nic For DJs that ONLY need vinyl control, SSL is still the option I would recommend. But if you want ANY other features, almost any other vinyl control system is more suitable than SSL, because SSL isn't feature rich.

nem0nic:
You seem to know quite a bit on the subject. I'd really appreciate if you could explain why you recommend SSL as the option for someone who only needs vinyl control. You see, that's exactly my case. I just want something that allows me to play mp3s on my vinyl decks. I don't need any other feature. I was hesitating between FS2, SSL and Conectiv. So, why is SSL in your eyes the best choice for someone like me? Is is more stable, bug-free or what?

Hello fellow old guy!

Again, I didn't say that anything is cheating. What I said was that I thought the browser sucks, it lacks support for DJ centric physical interfaces, and requires preproduction. It IS NOT a DJ app, even though a small percentage of DJs have made it into one. I DO eventually think Ableton will release a DJ oriented app, because many of the changes in V.5 were geared towards making Live more DJ friendly. And I'm glad it works in your situation. But it doesn't work for everyone - not even DJs who have embraced all digital DJing and use MIDI controllers combined with apps like TDJS. They don't use it for the same reasons I outlined above.

Once you see Live support physical interfaces for DJs (and once more appropriate controllers are created), you'll see the interest in Live by DJs at large increase. I also personally think that having Live support OSC will do wonders for it, because at that point you have a good protocol for not only handling external controllers that require full duplex 2 way communication (so controls can autoamte o match changes in software settings), but also a protocol over networked computers that enables ReWire like connection to other apps (so imagine begin able to run a seperate laptop other apps ala BT's Laptop Symphony).

quote:

I'd really appreciate if you could explain why you recommend SSL as the option for someone who only needs vinyl control.

SSL has a ton of advantages over other apps when it comes to vinyl control.

It has the lowest latency.

It uses the USB interface, which is compatible with a much wider variety of hardware than other interfaces. This does limit it's ability to go beyond 44.1/16, but many DJs don't need it.

Their support is great, and it's got the added benefit of having an active community of people that can ALSO help you fix problems. These folks are familliar with the way you DJ (because they spin like you as well) and can relate when you describe things to them.

The app itself is not as CPU intensive as other apps (including Torq). Again, this means that it will run well on a wider variety of platforms (older hardware).

So better performance and good support.

nem0nic:
Thanks so much for taking the time to explain this to me. Looks like SSL is the right choice for me!

the biggest issue with Ableton is the pre-production. If I could just load up tracks and fire away then Ableton would be the one for me.


BUT, since I have thousands of tracks that need to be warped in order to play then Ableton just isn't gonna cut it.

I have done sets with Ableton, but in the end it was more work for the same end result.

I know use Ableton to make tracks and remixes.

I have been using torq for a week now and I love the browser and the fact that I can just pick a track and play it and not have to worry about the pre production.

right. this is why I think it is funny when people say that using Live isn't really work. It is actually way more work than just buying a vinyl record and mixing it right off after you buy it.

On the flipside, when you do the prepatory work with Live, the payoff can be enormous, IMO.

rob.

quote:

Originally posted by robtronik right. this is why I think it is funny when people say that using Live isn't really work. It is actually way more work than just buying a vinyl record and mixing it right off after you buy it. On the flipside, when you do the prepatory work with Live, the payoff can be enormous, IMO. rob.

quoted for emphasis

quote:

Originally posted by Ryan0751 I don't know... in MOST cases, I'd rather have a DJ stand around for 6 minutes and let a track play that some brilliant producer spent many hours making (and I want to hear), rather than hear a "DJ" hack it to bits and overlay cheesy effects just for something to do. I'd much rather have a DJ spend those 6 minutes really thinking about which track to play next, and wow me with that.

that is a fucking superb point extremely well made.

[HAT OFF]

Jarv

[/HAT ON]

At the end of the day, right now there are guys who can play amazing sets on vinyl, CDJ's, FS, SSL, Traktor, Ableton, and with other assorted devices/software. Just because DJ's are learning to speak to you in a different language than you're used to, doesn't mean what he has to say is any less valid. It's the message that counts.

/sappy analogy post.

quote:

Originally posted by pumavisor808 the biggest issue with Ableton is the pre-production. If I could just load up tracks and fire away then Ableton would be the one for me. BUT, since I have thousands of tracks that need to be warped in order to play then Ableton just isn't gonna cut it. I have done sets with Ableton, but in the end it was more work for the same end result. I know use Ableton to make tracks and remixes. I have been using torq for a week now and I love the browser and the fact that I can just pick a track and play it and not have to worry about the pre production.

Strange I can do Ableton sets on the fly if I need to with unwarped tracks. Takes about 10 seconds to warp em properly.

So, I'm kind of sad. After a week of having Torq, I don't think I'll ever go back to anything else. But I'm looking at about 500 vinyls here, and I have no reason for them anymore. That was a lot of money I spent on those!

Anyone looking for used Hip-Hop records?

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Originally posted by djkoolaide So, I'm kind of sad. After a week of having Torq, I don't think I'll ever go back to anything else. But I'm looking at about 500 vinyls here, and I have no reason for them anymore. That was a lot of money I spent on those! Anyone looking for used Hip-Hop records?

You can still use them.. i like swapping between serato and the vinyl's i do own.. It's like going old school again while being able to mix any song into that song i had on vinyl ages back

nelly

10 seconds? Come on... sure it takes that to move warp marker 1 in place, but I like to create a 16 bar loop and go through through the WHOLE track making little adjustments, then back again. And I warp against a common kick beat I always use, hard to do that live.

How do you do it?

quote:

Originally posted by Zild Strange I can do Ableton sets on the fly if I need to with unwarped tracks. Takes about 10 seconds to warp em properly.

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