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-- Who Killed Trance?
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Quantity killed trance. Suddenly it was common that any moron could make a trance tune and get signed. No talent or creativity needed. Only a decent Computer and userfriendly Software and some practice. The good tunes by cerative people out there faded away in the dust off the enormous amount of releases. And the big focus on DJ'ing and not producing also plays a big part.

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Originally posted by Soeder And the big focus on DJ'ing and not producing also plays a big part.

That i can imagine. I'm really sick of the hystery around dj'ing and this obsession people have with djs, praising them just because they select some good tracks when they spin or because they put a photo of their ugly face on the cover of a worthless mixed compilation. If people hear a good tune on a radio show, then it's the dj/host who's good. Just look at recent threads here, "is it me or is avb getting better". He drops amazing tunes, than the important thing is armin, not the creators of the tunes. That's just lame.

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Originally posted by SMC That i can imagine. I'm really sick of the hystery around dj'ing and this obsession people have with djs, praising them just because they select some good tracks when they spin or because they put a photo of their ugly face on the cover of a worthless mixed compilation. If people hear a good tune on a radio show, then it's the dj/host who's good. Just look at recent threads here, "is it me or is avb getting better". He drops amazing tunes, than the important thing is armin, not the creators of the tunes. That's just lame.

This may result from people being confused about what a "DJ" actually does. This confusion may come from simple ignorance and from the common practice of producers tacking "DJ" in front of their names on productions (or DJs producing their own tracks and doing so).

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Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles This may result from people being confused about what a "DJ" actually does. This confusion may come from simple ignorance and from the common practice of producers tacking "DJ" in front of their names on productions (or DJs producing their own tracks and doing so).

And because people are stupid idolators.

TIESTO IS GODD!

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Originally posted by SMC If i only downloaded the odd melodic track i would get the impression all of it is sean tyas and complete crap. But that's not the case. I didn't say i think you only listen to asot, but judging from your small list you seem to be very focused on the melodic scene (with the exception of Hybrid). It's just that i find it very hard to understand that you criticize the current state of the trance scene, praise the early/mid-90s sound and want more trancy trance to return, but you don't include a single one of Vibrasphere's productions from the past year in your list.

i dont like vibrasphere lol but thats just me. and im not just focused on the melodic scene but that is my favourite type of trance basically which is why they were in a small list of my favourites of last year, that doesnt mean i havent looked elsewhere. trance is a huge genre so ofcourse id want to listen to alot of different sub genre's

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Originally posted by Mr.Mystery Yeah, because people off their fucking tits really give a shit about what's playing.

lol i agree for once.

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Originally posted by the gamemaster i dont like vibrasphere lol but thats just me. and im not just focused on the melodic scene but that is my favourite type of trance basically which is why they were in a small list of my favourites of last year, that doesnt mean i havent looked elsewhere. trance is a huge genre so ofcourse id want to listen to alot of different sub genre's

Then we could perhaps agree on that what according to you is "dying" is merely the type of trance you are concerned with and that you like, that your statement does not encompass certain styles of trance that you don't like and/or don't listen to.

this guy obviously loves crying...........while listening to trance

typical prog, anthem and epic trance are getting shitter and shitter and poppier imo. while goa and psy are just getting their ideas recycled really, it doesnt seem to have changed that much over the past 5 years. i still like break trance but tech trance i just hate.

my point is though that although there is some good stuff out there, the main genre's of trance (prog basically) is just losing what made it so great to hear in the first place and becoming less and less like trance. the pinnacle of this is avb and tiesto.

ofcourse trance as a whole is not "dead", thats not wat im trying to say.

Good. But what is typical prog? I never associated avb and tiesto with progressive trance.

Re: Who Killed Trance?

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Originally posted by Muff2K Tiesto or Oakey?? i would have to say oakenfold started the death of trance. but once tiesto got huge, hold sold out quicker than Paul. very disappointed in the scene the last couple years. everything is so copycat, and nowadays everyone is jumping on the electro bus. anyone who's been around here since 98/99 can relate. Oakenfold owned 1999 Tiesto owned 2001 and now? both sellouts, money does some dirty things to people. like steal their creativity.

How can one or two people kill trance?? I'm sorry but I just don't think anyone is that significant....Especially Paul fuckin Oakenfold or Tiesto. I've never really liked Tiesto. However, there are two tracks that I have bought for him though. One was in 1998 and one about a year ago (LETHAL INDUSTRY/ FLIGHT 643). I heard him spin one time but it was all boring trance when he played.....I absolutely hate Paul fuckin Oakfold the king of trainwrecks of boring trance.....There aint nothing that he makes or spins that don't put me to sleep....

But hey! That's just my opinion. I don't judge DJs on that silly DJ list or that DJ mag silly list. I judge on rather they make me want to dance, with the music they throw down, or if their music don't. I think music is the DJs most important quality! They have to spin flawless too. I have no ideal how Paul Okenfold is even in the top 20 on the DJ list!! He has a reputaion for trainwrecks here in the states! Yeah, they both might have sold a lot of releases somehow...but so does every other big time DJ that is not ranked so high.

Anyway....I, myself, am a lover of hard trance and club trance. I haven't heard any good hard trance or club trance from ether....except one old and one more recent from Tiesto. Those two tracks, in my eyes, aren't enough to vaught him up to number 1 though....So, maybe I'm being biased. I like Kai Tracid, Talla 2xlc, Dave 202, DJ Snowman, DJ Abyss, Miss Shiva, and tons of local trance DJs in Frankfurk and Koblenz! I think they would put Paul fuckin Okenfold to school! Tiesto??? I don't know...I've only heard him once...He was flawless when I heard him. Just though his music was boring. But people like him and his music....so...

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Originally posted by SMC Good. But what is typical prog? I never associated avb and tiesto with progressive trance.

back in the day typical progressive trance (or anthem trance) was probably alot of ferry corsten's stuff, or ayla, airscape, avb, three drives on a vinyl, etc. etc. i would call in my memory progressive trance aswell. nowadays alot of it has got so many fucking vocals in it alot of the time its more like epic trance alot of the time or even closer to pop or vocal trance. or in other words shit.

Re: Re: Who Killed Trance?

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Originally posted by Rick Mage How can one or two people kill trance?? I'm sorry but I just don't think anyone is that significant....Especially Paul fuckin Oakenfold or Tiesto. I've never really liked Tiesto. However, there are two tracks that I have bought for him though. One was in 1998 and one about a year ago (LETHAL INDUSTRY/ FLIGHT 643). I heard him spin one time but it was all boring trance when he played.....I absolutely hate Paul fuckin Oakfold the king of trainwrecks of boring trance.....There aint nothing that he makes or spins that don't put me to sleep.... But hey! That's just my opinion. I don't judge DJs on that silly DJ list or that DJ mag silly list. I judge on rather they make me want to dance, with the music they throw down, or if their music don't. I think music is the DJs most important quality! They have to spin flawless too. I have no ideal how Paul Okenfold is even in the top 20 on the DJ list!! He has a reputaion for trainwrecks here in the states! Yeah, they both might have sold a lot of releases somehow...but so does every other big time DJ that is not ranked so high. Anyway....I, myself, am a lover of hard trance and club trance. I haven't heard any good hard trance or club trance from ether....except one old and one more recent from Tiesto. Those two tracks, in my eyes, aren't enough to vaught him up to number 1 though....So, maybe I'm being biased. I like Kai Tracid, Talla 2xlc, Dave 202, DJ Snowman, DJ Abyss, Miss Shiva, and tons of local trance DJs in Frankfurk and Koblenz! I think they would put Paul fuckin Okenfold to school! Tiesto??? I don't know...I've only heard him once...He was flawless when I heard him. Just though his music was boring. But people like him and his music....so...

two entire people are not the sole cause of something dying but the fact is that the biggest names in trance started it, they are usually the ones who come up with all the innovation and ideas in genre's and they are whether we like it or not (or were) the "role models" for alot of trance producers and definitely dictated alot about the style of their specific types of trance. avb was meant to be the next big thing but when he turned so much trance almost into pop and that was that became the most popular type of trance it was never going to do the genre favours.

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Originally posted by the gamemaster back in the day typical progressive trance (or anthem trance) was probably alot of ferry corsten's stuff, or ayla, airscape, avb, three drives on a vinyl, etc. etc. i would call in my memory progressive trance aswell. nowadays alot of it has got so many fucking vocals in it alot of the time its more like epic trance alot of the time or even closer to pop or vocal trance. or in other words shit.

Hmm, those are about the best examples of melodic trance, or anthem as you say, or epic/uplifting/whatever. But not progressive. Ask anyone. I've never seen anyone call corsten, ayla, airscape, avb and three drives progressive.

jam and spoon, matt darey, push, the visions of shiva? man i get so confused between different subgenre's sometimes lol.

Re: Re: Re: Who Killed Trance?

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Originally posted by Rick Mage How can one or two people kill trance?? I'm sorry but I just don't think anyone is that significant....Especially Paul fuckin Oakenfold or Tiesto. I've never really liked Tiesto. However, there are two tracks that I have bought for him though. One was in 1998 and one about a year ago (LETHAL INDUSTRY/ FLIGHT 643). I heard him spin one time but it was all boring trance when he played.....I absolutely hate Paul fuckin Oakfold the king of trainwrecks of boring trance.....There aint nothing that he makes or spins that don't put me to sleep.... But hey! That's just my opinion. I don't judge DJs on that silly DJ list or that DJ mag silly list. I judge on rather they make me want to dance, with the music they throw down, or if their music don't. I think music is the DJs most important quality! They have to spin flawless too. I have no ideal how Paul Okenfold is even in the top 20 on the DJ list!! He has a reputaion for trainwrecks here in the states! Yeah, they both might have sold a lot of releases somehow...but so does every other big time DJ that is not ranked so high. Anyway....I, myself, am a lover of hard trance and club trance. I haven't heard any good hard trance or club trance from ether....except one old and one more recent from Tiesto. Those two tracks, in my eyes, aren't enough to vaught him up to number 1 though....So, maybe I'm being biased. I like Kai Tracid, Talla 2xlc, Dave 202, DJ Snowman, DJ Abyss, Miss Shiva, and tons of local trance DJs in Frankfurk and Koblenz! I think they would put Paul fuckin Okenfold to school! Tiesto??? I don't know...I've only heard him once...He was flawless when I heard him. Just though his music was boring. But people like him and his music....so...

quote:

Originally posted by the gamemaster two entire people are not the sole cause of something dying but the fact is that the biggest names in trance started it, they are usually the ones who come up with all the innovation and ideas in genre's and they are whether we like it or not (or were) the "role models" for alot of trance producers and definitely dictated alot about the style of their specific types of trance. avb was meant to be the next big thing but when he turned so much trance almost into pop and that was that became the most popular type of trance it was never going to do the genre favours.

I don't care how big people think they are. They still are not that significant to the trance scene....No one is. Not even my favorite DJ/ producer. Tiesto and Paul fuckin Oakenfold are not the only ones coming up with ideals and tunes. Do you actually think that Kai Tracid or Talla 2XLC are going to look to Tiesto or Paul fuckin Oakenfold for ideals?? lol...Yo, I don't think so. I don't think that Tiesto or Paul fuckin Oakenfold are the biggest names in trance. I personally think that there are a lot of DJs that are just as big as them....in the real world. There are no one person that sticks out above the rest! There's too many great DJs and producers! Don't take that silly DJ mag list seriously. It's nothing but a complete farse.

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Originally posted by the gamemaster jam and spoon, matt darey, push, the visions of shiva? man i get so confused between different subgenre's sometimes lol.

Jam and spoon have done a little bit of everything, but matt darey and push are other examples of melodic, the visions of shiva too, but that was in a slightly different context since it's such an old project.

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Originally posted by the gamemaster back in the day typical progressive trance (or anthem trance) was probably alot of ferry corsten's stuff, or ayla, airscape, avb, three drives on a vinyl, etc. etc. i would call in my memory progressive trance aswell. nowadays alot of it has got so many fucking vocals in it alot of the time its more like epic trance alot of the time or even closer to pop or vocal trance. or in other words shit.

AvB and Airscape are not progressive trance, other than maybe a few tracks.

Breeder, Humate, Bedrock, Evolution, BT, Oliver Lieb (LSG), Sander Kleinenberg, Quivver, Tilt. Those guys did progressive trance.

Ferry? Yeah, if you're talking about his "Albion" alias. Otherwise, no.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Who Killed Trance?

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Originally posted by Rick Mage I don't care how big people think they are. They still are not that significant to the trance scene....No one is. Not even my favorite DJ/ producer. Tiesto and Paul fuckin Oakenfold are not the only ones coming up with ideals and tunes. Do you actually think that Kai Tracid or Talla 2XLC are going to look to Tiesto or Paul fuckin Oakenfold for ideals?? lol...Yo, I don't think so. I don't think that Tiesto or Paul fuckin Oakenfold are the biggest names in trance. I personally think that there are a lot of DJs that are just as big as them....in the real world. There are no one person that sticks out above the rest! There's too many great DJs and producers! Don't take that silly DJ mag list seriously. It's nothing but a complete farse.

ah yes there are people who stick out above the rest. and yes they are that significant and ofcourse a kai tracid isnt going to copy them but alot of their fans and people who start to get into the scene and then possibly make music will alot of the time go with the trends. although rarely will u get a sander van doorn or whoever come along and do something unique and different. im not referring to the dj mag list u tool. this is just the reality of this industry, your sasha's, digweeds, pvd's, bt's, etc. dictate alot of the direction that the genre is going to take.

and yea i love all those artists aswell jivejobingles, its just fucking hard to tell the slight differences every time..

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Who Killed Trance?

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Originally posted by Rick Mage How can one or two people kill trance?? I'm sorry but I just don't think anyone is that significant....Especially Paul fuckin Oakenfold or Tiesto. I've never really liked Tiesto. However, there are two tracks that I have bought for him though. One was in 1998 and one about a year ago (LETHAL INDUSTRY/ FLIGHT 643). I heard him spin one time but it was all boring trance when he played.....I absolutely hate Paul fuckin Oakfold the king of trainwrecks of boring trance.....There aint nothing that he makes or spins that don't put me to sleep.... But hey! That's just my opinion. I don't judge DJs on that silly DJ list or that DJ mag silly list. I judge on rather they make me want to dance, with the music they throw down, or if their music don't. I think music is the DJs most important quality! They have to spin flawless too. I have no ideal how Paul Okenfold is even in the top 20 on the DJ list!! He has a reputaion for trainwrecks here in the states! Yeah, they both might have sold a lot of releases somehow...but so does every other big time DJ that is not ranked so high. Anyway....I, myself, am a lover of hard trance and club trance. I haven't heard any good hard trance or club trance from ether....except one old and one more recent from Tiesto. Those two tracks, in my eyes, aren't enough to vaught him up to number 1 though....So, maybe I'm being biased. I like Kai Tracid, Talla 2xlc, Dave 202, DJ Snowman, DJ Abyss, Miss Shiva, and tons of local trance DJs in Frankfurk and Koblenz! I think they would put Paul fuckin Okenfold to school! Tiesto??? I don't know...I've only heard him once...He was flawless when I heard him. Just though his music was boring. But people like him and his music....so...

quote:

Originally posted by the gamemaster two entire people are not the sole cause of something dying but the fact is that the biggest names in trance started it, they are usually the ones who come up with all the innovation and ideas in genre's and they are whether we like it or not (or were) the "role models" for alot of trance producers and definitely dictated alot about the style of their specific types of trance. avb was meant to be the next big thing but when he turned so much trance almost into pop and that was that became the most popular type of trance it was never going to do the genre favours.

I don't care how big people think they are. They still are not that significant to the trance scene....No one is. Not even my favorite DJ/ producer. Tiesto and Paul fuckin Oakenfold are not the only ones coming up with ideals and tunes. Do you actually think that Kai Tracid or Talla 2XLC are going to look to Tiesto or Paul fuckin Oakenfold for ideals?? lol...Yo, I don't think so. I don't think that Tiesto or Paul fuckin Oakenfold are the biggest names in trance. I personally think that there are a lot of DJs that are just as big as them....in the real world. There are no one person that sticks out above the rest! There's too many great DJs and producers! Don't take that silly DJ mag list seriously. It's nothing but a complete farse.

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Originally posted by the gamemaster ah yes there are people who stick out above the rest. and yes they are that significant and ofcourse a kai tracid isnt going to copy them but alot of their fans and people who start to get into the scene and then possibly make music will alot of the time go with the trends. although rarely will u get a sander van doorn or whoever come along and do something unique and different. im not referring to the dj mag list u tool. this is just the reality of this industry, your sasha's, digweeds, pvd's, bt's, etc. dictate alot of the direction that the genre is going to take. and yea i love all those artists aswell jivejobingles, its just fucking hard to tell the slight differences every time..

Maybe I said that wrong....What I meant to say is, yes, people do stick out....but don't even think that Paul fuckin Oaken fold or Tiesto are the only ones that are sticking out....And they aren't the only ones who have "alot of their fans and people who start to get into the scene and then possibly make music will alot of the time go with the trends" ...And why am I a tool?? I hate the DJ mag and DJ list. It's just there are too many people who think that Paul Oakenfold and tiesto are the biggest DJ due to that silly list. I personally think that Talla 2xlc, by himself, is bigger than both.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Who Killed Trance?

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Originally posted by Rick Mage I don't care how big people think they are. They still are not that significant to the trance scene....No one is. Not even my favorite DJ/ producer. Tiesto and Paul fuckin Oakenfold are not the only ones coming up with ideals and tunes. Do you actually think that Kai Tracid or Talla 2XLC are going to look to Tiesto or Paul fuckin Oakenfold for ideals?? lol...Yo, I don't think so. I don't think that Tiesto or Paul fuckin Oakenfold are the biggest names in trance. I personally think that there are a lot of DJs that are just as big as them....in the real world. There are no one person that sticks out above the rest! There's too many great DJs and producers! Don't take that silly DJ mag list seriously. It's nothing but a complete farse. Maybe I said that wrong....What I meant to say is, yes, people do stick out....but don't even think that Paul fuckin Oaken fold or Tiesto are the only ones that are sticking out....And they aren't the only ones who have "alot of their fans and people who start to get into the scene and then possibly make music will alot of the time go with the trends" ...And why am I a tool?? I hate the DJ mag and DJ list. It's just there are too many people who think that Paul Oakenfold and tiesto are the biggest DJ due to that silly list. I personally think that Talla 2xlc, by himself, is bigger than both.

no and im not saying they are the only ones sticking out. and btw they arent big names because of how high they rate in the dj list and votes like that, they are high in those votes because they are such big names. the misconception is that they are the best dj's and producers because of that list when really they are just the most famous. get it?

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Who Killed Trance?

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Originally posted by the gamemaster no and im not saying they are the only ones sticking out. and btw they arent big names because of how high they rate in the dj list and votes like that, they are high in those votes because they are such big names. the misconception is that they are the best dj's and producers because of that list when really they are just the most famous. get it?

I disagree. I think that is the only reason why people think that they are the two biggest DJs is because of that stupid silly list. It's certainly not because of any tunes that they have made. I personally think their tunes are basicly weak. Yeah, Tiesto has a couple tunes that sounds nice...but I have heard better in recent days and in the past. But hey! Maybe that's just me.

As for they wouldn't be ranked, so high on the DJ list, if they weren't really the biggest names....I call bullshit. Only two hundred thousand, or so, people vote on that list. Out of how many trance heads in the world??? There are millions in Germany alone! Yet, everyone, in Germany that I talk to, are like "huh??" when I mention the DJ list. Maybe I just been looking in the wrong places and talking to the wrong die hard tranceheads in Germany.... Imagen what the charts would look like if all the millions of trance heads voted....I bet it would look a lot different than it has today and in the past.

And how many people, who vote on that list, do you actually think that really knows anything about the trance scene?? They see some fuckin commercial trance DJ, in a commercial or on MTV, and that is the only name that they know! Also, I bet most, who vote, are from USA, Canada, and England! ...I'm not buying that Christopher Lawence is bigger than Talla 2xlc, Westbam, Dave 202, or Kai Tracid....no way in hell....

As for DJing...Paul fucken Oakenfold needs to take some DJ lessons. Tiesto is good. In fact he is flawless from what I have seen. But so are any other good professional DJ who can spin. I think Talla 2xlc is way better. They are no where near close to being the biggest trance DJ in the world. Yeah, they are big but so are a lot of other DJs/Producers. So in a way....Paul fuckin Oakenfold and Tiesto are not that significant...At least I don't think they are. Get it??

oh god, your missing the point completely. its not just about those two guys and the dj list is completely insignificant, tiesto, avb, sasha, these sort of guys are the biggest names and im not talking about how good they are or arent im talking about basically how famous they are which are two completely different things. and they are fucking significant, they were some of the leading trance producers in terms of quality about 6 years ago (although this is argued). why are u associating Talla 2xlc as a "big name" ffs? he isnt, maybe he is better but im sure alot of people have not heard of him and he's definitely not an innovator in terms of trance like say ferry corsten or pvd used to be. stop getting the words popular and good confused, paul oakenfold is shit now, tiesto is shit now, avb is shit now, pvd is shit now, etc. etc. but they have all gotten bigger at the same time sasha has moved on, oliver lieb has moved on (for a while now) this is the point we're trying to make, alot of the pioneers of trance are now gone or shit. and dont u get it, they rank so highly on these lists because of that and i already told u the misconception is that they are the best at what they do because of the lists but it does signify that they are popular among n00bs and people who have listened to trance for years aswell.

besides we are talking about productions in this thread, not djing, everything u've said has been pretty much irrelevant.

and u say that people who voted for them dont know anything about the trance scene, well thats the fucking problem these sorts of guys who were arguably some of the best producers in the business or were predicted to be started making shit that was accessible to people who didnt even like trance because it lost the qualities that made trance great in the first place. thats wat made them big in general and not just big among "tranceheads", that made them commercially "big" rather than just incredibly popular among people who had been trance fans since its foundations or slightly later. then alot of people started to copy them also trying to please crowds outside of the trance scene but then losing wat made it great in the scene itself.

armin, no?

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