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-- Iran rejects nuclear inspections unless Israel allows them
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Originally posted by CHRles Hey, let's all chant together your slogan - Hezbollah! Hezbollah! Oh allah, we love the Hezbollah! Hamas! Hamas! Hamas! In Hamas We Trust! Down with USA! Down with zionsim! Down with the West! Let's kill all those infidels! Nope, no brainwashing going on at all with those chants in the background. Gotta love those Hezbollah and Hamas supporters - they have so much passion and positive energy Those 2 groups have done so much good for humanity. The high tech world, the sciences, noble peace prize winners, entertainment. Oh wait a minute! No those are all things Jews have done. Whoops.

since when do i support any of these groups? lol i'm just stating the facts of the zionists who are trying to do anything in their power and selfish minds for their own profit or agenda.

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Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN so what youre saying is that you support the use of nuclear weapons, as long as its used by iran and not by the US or israel. gotcha.

Negative sir,I said Iran has the rights to defend itself,I dont even know why a nation today would even consider using nuke in the first place,it would simply outrageous and a huge mistake.When a country like Iran in the situation that they are in today surrounded by US troop all around,it would simply make them untouchable and it would make it almost impossible for the US to invade them.I said before I ll say it again,Iran isnt stupid to use nukes they are fully aware of the consequences of such actions.

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Originally posted by CHRles I was just about to post the same thing. It's so great that people have "noticed" that I'm somehow becoming more ignorant, LOL. Some ppl should be looking in the mirror instead. What exactly is Iran's beef with Israel? It's not like they really give a shit about the Palestinian cause. Iran didn't take part in any of the Arab Israeli wars. Even in the 80s, after the revolution, Iran was buying weapons from Israel during Iran's war with Iraq. Israel has been closely monitoring Iran's progress as far as developing nuclear weapons for the past 15 years. Why? Larglely b/c Iran always threatens to wipe Israel off the map. In fact, even as we speak, while Israel is celebrating its 60th anniversary mr. Ahmedanijad continues with his hate speeches about Israel being dead, or soon being eliminated. I don't see the prime ministers or presidents of neighboring countries promising and saying such things. You may not hear any positive words from people like Assad on Israel, but at the same time Prior to Iran's ambition to obtain nukes Israel didn't have any desires to get into conflict with Iran. In the 70s, when the great Shah was in power there were direct flights between Israel and Iran. So yeah, the Israeli lobby in Washington, and American lobbyists around the world keep pushing this topic to be resolved. Nowadays Iran's a country with a leader who seriously thinks or claims there aren't even any gay people living there, or there isn't a gay "problem" that is "infecting" his country.

For someone who knows alot about what goes on inside Iran and their politics,I must say you really dont know much because if you did you would know that Irans president has no power in the country when it comes down to the use of millitary.All he is is talk and really to try to get reactions out of people like yourself. I highly doubt anyone in Iran wishes to wipe off Israel off the map,I do on the other believe that many would love to see Israels zionist regime to be wiped off the map.


Is is juse me or does it seem that you are getting a kick out of mocking Irans president all the time?perhaps you should go take a closer look at your current president in the white house and then go and mock other leaders around the world,because clearly he isnt such a good exmaple for a leader of a democractic country.

I've no problem mocking Bush, that's almost too easy. And yet, I'm happy he is my president when faced with the prospect of having someone like Ahmedanijad as my leader. If he's just a puppet leader I'm even happier Bush is my president b/c I don't want the kind of religious leader Iran has to be in charge of anything.

As for Israel's "crimes". Let's talk about the Palestinians for a minute seeing as how I love to go off on a tangence. Would be great if there was peace between the Palestinians and Israelis, and some of the blame does rest on Israel's shoulder, make no mistake, but here's the problem: Most Arabs simply say to themselves those poor Palestinians, what have they ever done - they ignore what the bad things that Palestinian militias are involved in. Most Arab leaders on the other hand don't care about Palestinians at all, and have in fact over the years killed lots of Palestinians (in response to Palestinian provocation).
King Hussein of Jordan had to deal with the PLO between 1965-70, and at one point in 1970 he got fed up with them. He kicked the PLO out of Jordan during black september, in the process killing a LOT of them. Egypt and Syria also kicked out all palestinian militias around that era.
The PLO in the early 70s moved to Lebanon, and next thing you know Lebanon is facing a civil war. The Christian/Maronite Arabs were pretty brutal in the way they sometimes treated Sunni Muslims during this war, but the PLO were the worst with the way they took control of southern Lebanon and neighborhoods in Beirut. They killed Lebanese, raped women, pillaged villages. In fact, the Shiite villagers of southern Lebanon were very turned off by the PLO at this time. Also, throughout the latter half of the 70s the PLO constantly provoked Israel by firing at it, and Israel couldn't take it anymore by 1982 - the Israeli army entered Lebanon, and by 1985 forced the PLO to completely surrender and leave Lebanon. Israel were hoping this would lead to peace with Lebanon (which Syria later foiled), but part of the problem was that some of their Christian allies butchered/slaughtered entire Sunni villages. It wasn't Israel that killed those Arabs, but Israel just sat idly by.
In 1979 when Israel signed its famous peace treaty with Egypt Gaza should have been handed back to Egypt - they were the ones in control of the territory prior to 1967. You know what though? Sadat didn't want it. He didn't negotiate for the Palestinians to gain control of that land, but rather left it in Israeli hands.
In the early 90s Kuwait kicked out ALL of the Palestinians living in Kuwait as a response to the Palestinians support of Sadam Hussein. To this day Kuwaitis arent very sympathetic towards the palestinian cause.
It's fucked up b/c Palestinians in general are nice open minded Arabs. They're not overly religious (none of the Arabs of the Levant are) and not really violent by nature. They could have had a state of their own by now if they had smarter and less corrupt leaders.

These days the smart Palestinians don't live in Gaza. They live in the West Bank, in Jordan (whose economy is booming), or in the US. Israel was actually only a small part of what was once known as Palestine, back when the British and the Turks controlled the land. Pretty much all of the Levant, meaning all of Jordan, Syria, parts of Lebanon and Egypt, as well as Israel, were called Palestine. Amazingly enough Palestinians today only claim Israel as Palestine. The truth is that many of the Palestinians living in the Middle East are living in Palestine...just not in the Israeli part of Palestine.

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Originally posted by SiLveR_NrGy_985 lol as long as the Federal reserve keeps manipulating the economy for the personal gain of the ruling class the american system is bound to be a continuing failure,

You're my boy and all, but I've gotta say you're wrong. The "American system" is what made this country THE superpower and strongest democracy in the world only within a matter of less than 300 years. The American system pulled Europe back on its feet after World War II and Europe would not be what it is now if it were not for the American system. Those are all capitalist economies, you know. I don't know how the American system ties in with Israel and Iran. While I'm not a big fan of the whole "Israel situation", for lack of better words, it has nothing to do with capitalism or how this country's run. Before you talk about "the ruling class" and rich people, remember that there are many countries in this world that are neither capitalist nor democratic that contain some of the richest men in the world. Being non-capitalist or non-democratic doesn't suddenly make a country better for its people or working class.

If you said foreign policy a la Bush administration was to blame for our economic slump, I'd more than agree with you, but you can't just say capitalism (which has been part of this country for more than 2 centuries is all of a sudden causing a 1$ = 1.60Euro exchange rate).

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Israel 'has 150 nuclear weapons' Ex-US President Jimmy Carter has said Israel has at least 150 atomic weapons in its arsenal. The Israelis have never confirmed they have nuclear weapons, but this has been widely assumed since a scientist leaked details in the 1980s. Mr Carter made his comments on Israel's weapons at a press conference at the annual literary Hay Festival in Wales. He also described Israeli treatment of Palestinians as "one of the greatest human rights crimes on earth". Mr Carter gave the figure for the Israeli nuclear arsenal in response to a question on US policy on a possible nuclear-armed Iran, arguing that any country newly armed with atomic weapons faced overwhelming odds. "The US has more than 12,000 nuclear weapons; the Soviet Union (sic) has about the same; Great Britain and France have several hundred, and Israel has 150 or more," he said. "We have a phalanx of enormous capabilities, not only of weaponry but also of rockets to deliver every one of those missiles on a pinpoint accuracy target." Most experts estimate that Israel has between 100 and 200 nuclear warheads, largely based on information leaked to the Sunday Times newspaper in the 1980s by Mordechai Vanunu, a former worker at the country's Dimona nuclear reactor. The US, a key ally of Israel, has in general followed the country's policy of "nuclear ambiguity", neither confirming or denying the existence of its assumed arsenal. However, Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert included Israel among a list of nuclear states in comments in December 2006, a week after US Defence Secretary Robert Gates used a similar form of words during a Senate hearing. Former Israeli military intelligence chief Aharon Zeevi-Farkash told Reuters news agency he considered Mr Carter's comments "irresponsible". "The problem is that there are those who can use these statements when it comes to discussing the international effort to prevent Iran getting nuclear weapons," he said. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7420573.stm

Hmm not that we didnt know about this before,but this very scary stuff.Iam sure they would use them all against at least a few countries around them.

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Originally posted by hardcore trancer Hmm not that we didnt know about this before,but this very scary stuff.Iam sure they would use them all against at least a few countries around them.

which is scarier - a nuclear Israel, a country surrounded by declared enemies, in which it's largest city is only 13 miles from the border of the west bank, 60 miles from the border of egypt, and about 70 miles from the border of Lebanon; or, a nuclear Iran, which is attempting to become the dominate player in the region, and it's capital is comfortably located in the north central part of the country approximately 200 miles from its neighbors borders? The point, Israel has a clear goal in having nuclear weapons: deterrence. As the new big dog in the region, what's Iran's goal in striving for a nuclear weapon? It can't be to deter Israel because common sense would dictate that a country as small as Israel would be highly vulnerable to attack from many angles. Iran no longer has to worry about Iraq, and no other country in the region seems to be a military player. If Iran is striving to become a nuclear power to deter the US, well, that's stupid because George Bush thought Sadam was doing the same thing, and look what happened to him. I happen to think a nuclear Iran is more dangerous because Israelis have nowhere to hide. The use of a nuke by Israel would be the absolute last option.

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Originally posted by jerZ07002 which is scarier - a nuclear Israel, a country surrounded by declared enemies, in which it's largest city is only 13 miles from the border of the west bank, 60 miles from the border of egypt, and about 70 miles from the border of Lebanon; or, a nuclear Iran, which is attempting to become the dominate player in the region, and it's capital is comfortably located in the north central part of the country approximately 200 miles from its neighbors borders? The point, Israel has a clear goal in having nuclear weapons: deterrence. As the new big dog in the region, what's Iran's goal in striving for a nuclear weapon? It can't be to deter Israel because common sense would dictate that a country as small as Israel would be highly vulnerable to attack from many angles. Iran no longer has to worry about Iraq, and no other country in the region seems to be a military player. If Iran is striving to become a nuclear power to deter the US, well, that's stupid because George Bush thought Sadam was doing the same thing, and look what happened to him. I happen to think a nuclear Iran is more dangerous because Israelis have nowhere to hide. The use of a nuke by Israel would be the absolute last option.

The lesson here is...If you are going against the American Empire, you better have nuclear weapons. Iran is surrounded on two fronts by their enemies. Additionally there are two aircraft carrier groups right off their coast. You think Israel feels threatened? Iran feels the exact same way.

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Originally posted by Krypton Iran is surrounded on two fronts by their enemies. Additionally there are two aircraft carrier groups right off their coast. You think Israel feels threatened? Iran feels the exact same way.

are you intellectually unable to see past March 2003 regarding ANYTHING including Iran's nuclear ambitions?

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Originally posted by Krypton The lesson here is...If you are going against the American Empire, you better have nuclear weapons. Iran is surrounded on two fronts by their enemies. Additionally there are two aircraft carrier groups right off their coast. You think Israel feels threatened? Iran feels the exact same way.

while i don't disagree with the logic in the post (because as i previously said in a different thread that having a nuclear weapon is why the US didn't attack NK or pakistan), Iran apparently does not have a nuke yet. As evidenced by the Iraq war, the US has shown its willingness to prevent a country from becoming a nuclear power. By not showing force against NK, the US has also showed that it will not attack a nuclear power. As a non-nuclear power, Iran is more prone to attack by attempting to acquire a nuke than it would be if it already had one or wasn't trying to acquire one. So, this leads me to believe that a logical leader, if the country was not a nuclear power, would either 1) not develop nuclear weapons, or 2) do a much better job of covering it up than Iran has thus far. I guess my point is that Iran doesn't fear the US as much as we think it does, or its leaders are just crazy. I'm not sure. Nevertheless, the point was only that Israel has to be extremely cautious about how it uses a nuke because a retaliatory attack could literally wipe out a huge chunk of the country. The same can't be said for Iran.

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Originally posted by jerZ07002 which is scarier - a nuclear Israel, a country surrounded by declared enemies, in which it's largest city is only 13 miles from the border of the west bank, 60 miles from the border of egypt, and about 70 miles from the border of Lebanon; or, a nuclear Iran, which is attempting to become the dominate player in the region, and it's capital is comfortably located in the north central part of the country approximately 200 miles from its neighbors borders? The point, Israel has a clear goal in having nuclear weapons: deterrence. As the new big dog in the region, what's Iran's goal in striving for a nuclear weapon? It can't be to deter Israel because common sense would dictate that a country as small as Israel would be highly vulnerable to attack from many angles. Iran no longer has to worry about Iraq, and no other country in the region seems to be a military player. If Iran is striving to become a nuclear power to deter the US, well, that's stupid because George Bush thought Sadam was doing the same thing, and look what happened to him. I happen to think a nuclear Iran is more dangerous because Israelis have nowhere to hide. The use of a nuke by Israel would be the absolute last option.

I have to say Israel is scarier to have Nuclear Weapons.

Looking back, Iran hasn't attacked any country since over 200 years ago compared to Israel on the other hand.

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Originally posted by Lemonad I have to say Israel is scarier to have Nuclear Weapons. Looking back, Iran hasn't attacked any country since over 200 years ago compared to Israel on the other hand.

Israel has had nukes for half a century. they've fought more wars and conflicts themselves than any country in the world within that time, including the US.

of the last "200 years" Iran has been run by a death cult for only the last 30. now they're developing nukes.

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Originally posted by Q5echo Israel has had nukes for half a century. they've fought more wars and conflicts themselves than any country in the world within that time, including the US. of the last "200 years" Iran has been run by a death cult for only the last 30. now they're developing nukes.

They fought wars against basically weak opponents.

If it wasn't for the US, Israel would have been a worthless entity.

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Originally posted by Lemonad They fought wars against basically weak opponents. If it wasn't for the US, Israel would have been a worthless entity.

they fought f**king Nasser's Egypt, dude. the most powerful Middle East army of it's time. oh AND Jordan, Syria and anyone who wanted to help.

they defeat armies through a little luck, balls and intelligence. (not necessarily in that order) nukes tend to level the playing field for countries that lack those three things.

we get it. you hate Isreal...but use your f**king head. learn some shit FFS.

why does hating Israel make people so stupid?

I don't hate Israel as much as you hate Iran.

They couldn't defeat Hezbollah for one thing which was backed by the tacticians of Iran.

Mate, the tacticians in control of those Arab are plain stupid if a war could only last 6 days... how the hell are you comparing anything to that you idiot.

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Originally posted by Lemonad They couldn't defeat Hezbollah for one thing which was backed by the tacticians of Iran.

Israel doesn't have anything against the Lebanese people as a whole other wise they'd the use Hezbollah as a mop. they did actually all the way up to the Litani River in the summer of 2006. then pulled back.

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Mate, the tacticians in control of those Arab are plain stupid if a war could only last 6 days... how the hell are you comparing anything to that you idiot.

it lasted 6 day b/c like i said. they had some luck. some balls. and some brains. read about it instead of blaming these imaginary "tacticians".

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Originally posted by Q5echo Israel doesn't have anything against the Lebanese people as a whole other wise they'd the use Hezbollah as a mop. they did actually all the way up to the Litani River in the summer of 2006. then pulled back.

If they even cared about the Lebanese people then cluster bombs would never have been used.

The International community has agreed to ban them, except for a meager amount of countries, not surprisingly including Israel and USA.

Way to not have anything against anyone The government is worse than roaches.

Let me hear your opinion on cluster bombs, and back it up by comparing an atrocity Iran has caused that is worse than Israel dropping clusters causing dismemberment on little children.

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Originally posted by Krypton The lesson here is...If you are going against the American Empire, you better have nuclear weapons. Iran is surrounded on two fronts by their enemies. Additionally there are two aircraft carrier groups right off their coast. You think Israel feels threatened? Iran feels the exact same way.

speaking of American empire,I would want to have a bunch of nukes close by if this was the case:

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Originally posted by Lemonad Let me hear your opinion on cluster bombs, and back it up by comparing an atrocity Iran has caused that is worse than Israel dropping clusters causing dismemberment on little children.

A typical zionist reply to that would be: "Israel has the rights to use any weapons against anyone no matter what the consequences are for its survival".

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Originally posted by Q5echo are you intellectually unable to see past March 2003 regarding ANYTHING including Iran's nuclear ambitions?

Are you able to see perspectives apart from you own? Look at it from the Iranian high command's perspective. They are surrounded by enemies. They want to reawaken their former Persian greatness. And in today's world, that means acquiring a nuclear weapon. Security Council status. But with acquiring a nuke comes the realization of mutually assured destruction which most war apologists like to forget. If Iran even attempts a nuke launch on Israel, Tehran will be turned to glass 100x over. The Iranian leadership, like all leaderships with nuclear weapons know mutually assured destruction. It is clearly obvious Iran desires a nuke (if they do) as a means of deterrence from outside attack or domination.

Do you want to make a premise/conclusion argument, or keep trying to attack my credibility?

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Originally posted by Krypton Iran has all the functioning institutions of any western country. Your pathetic notion that they are somehow backwards in culture is completely WRONG...

[nsfw]http://irantoday.co.kr/photo/2007/09/23/iran_execution-thumb-510x446.jpg[/nsfw]

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Originally posted by emc^2 [nsfw]http://irantoday.co.kr/photo/2007/09/23/iran_execution-thumb-510x446.jpg[/nsfw]

[nsfw]http://torture.justsickshit.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/10/butter-electric-chair-botched.jpg[/nsfw]
[nsfw]http://www.ccadp.org/davis3.jpg[/nsfw]

Come on, guys, pictures are not worth a thousand words in this case...

No Graphic Material: There's no need to post pictures or videos of people killing, dying, blowing up, deteriorating or tap dancing. In short, no NSFW material will be allowed. Should you post any graphic material, do not use the [img] tag, and warn potential clickers about the nature of the content.

Even though the quoted pic is not nearly as shocking as the ones Krypton posted, there's no need to resort to this.
- Lira

quote:

Originally posted by emc^2 [nsfw]http://irantoday.co.kr/photo/2007/09/23/iran_execution-thumb-510x446.jpg[/nsfw]

Yeah you sure have a good way to prove your point idiot.

emc^2 wants to post pictures of Iranian executions...as if we in America don't use electricity to kill our condemned!!

My point to emc^2 is...what's your point? America has used firing squads, electricity, poison gas, and poison drugs to kill off our condemned.

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