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i think lots of you guys dont have a clue of regulations about number of people in clubs...

try to find how many people are aloud, according the the regulations and laws, and youll shit in your pants...

i personaly think a thread like this, first, will not change anything about the issues your discussing, second, could compromise the future of that club...

its my opinion...thats all

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 bucky... hows the club scene doing in Buffalo? Oh yeah i forgot... THERE ISNT ONE! If threads like this keep happening we will just be another Buffalo (no offense to my buffalo friends who are actually trying to start something cool down there but this had to be said)

What the fuck are you talking about? Buffalo has a club scene, and a decent one for a city of a FRACTION the size of Toronto. Most people from Buffalo don't think there is one here because they goto Toronto so much and are spoiled. We get the same DJ's you get up there, but we get to hear them in smaller clubs and not in death like conditions.

If people put effort into things they would get much better, but people promoting events don't put in the effort needed, except for Sphere. All the others are failing becuse they don't promote.

"death like conditions"

My vote for exaggeration of the year.... you should go work for CNN they need people like you

Seriously though, I am just not getting why they wouldn't do that little thing that would make such a big difference, and would help the opinion some people have towards Guv.....How hard is it to stop letting in some people after a certain number...or just allow to sell a certain number of tickets..? They would still make the money they need, and the people who really cared about going to such a big event would make sure to buy tickets in advance or just show up early...The extra hundreds to get in that make everybody's night not as satifying would be the drunk ass ginos getting out of regular clubs and just don't feel like going home and head for the Guv! They don't necessarely go there for the music (i'm not saying none of them do, I'm talking about the majority), so why don't we leave the music lovers enjoy what they came for instead of pissing them off cause they can't even move or dance !!!?

Or why not just come on the regular saturdays when the music is better and its not full of posers?

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 "death like conditions" My vote for exaggeration of the year.... you should go work for CNN they need people like you

Are you blind and/or ignorant? If I was a reporter I'd report things just like that. And then goto the bar, get a drink, and have fun and just know that it's to be expected when going to the Guv. lol

Thta's exactly what I am saying !!!! MUSIC LOVERS !!!!
Some people DO go for the DJs while others are posers and only go for the heck to go !!!!
If people are there for the DJ, let them enjoy the DJ if you don't care about it !!!!

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 Or why not just come on the regular saturdays when the music is better and its not full of posers?

easy there, that's a totally different topic.

id say telling someone to come on a less crowded night with better music is related to this

quote:

Originally posted by Skipper easy there, that's a totally different topic.

LOL at your post. Easy where?? What you gonna do? Spank him??? Sooo touchy....

quote:

Originally posted by BubbleGirl How hard is it to stop letting in some people after a certain number...

Hmm, let's see... imagine you're an owner of a club like that, you know you can fill the clup up to the tits on special events, and still have a few hundred people waiting in line to get in. Now, those people waiting to get in are a source of at least $20-30 for you (cover charge + water, let's say). That's another few thousand bucks in your pocket, easily. You follow so far? Ok, good... because that's where the greed starts to kick in, you got bills to pay, an opportunity to make an extra few thousand that you didn't have yesterday knocks on your door, and what would most people do? Open the door, of course...

You can complain all you want, but $$$ seems to be doing all the talking these days...

I am not saying that I do not agree with you !!!
The whole subject here is : Should money overcome people's safety !!!?
Owners will say yes, but should they ?
Should there maybe be something to draw a line and put a limit to this whole thing ??? If money is everything...and we would allow everything for the sakes of money....Daddy would be pimping his daughther...why not...the door is open...there is money offered for it...!!! I know I am going really far from the subject, please bare with me. I am not trying to provoque anyone, just give my opinion. I am just trying to say that money rules in this world, but maybe something should be done so it doesn't go to the extreme !!!!

As some people explained to me, the thing with the Guv is that they are technically never overcrowded. When you count up all the rooms and emergency exits in there and divide by the amount of people, it technically is never overcrowded and therefore the fire marshall cannot do anything about it. end of story.

maybe a complaint will raise the issue of this sort of thing happening but it will take a lot of time. hope whoever is making the compliant follows up on it.

quote:

Originally posted by FunKenLouis try to find how many people are aloud, according the the relations and laws, and you shit in your pants...

i thinkn thast a good idea, Jayx1, can you actually get us the numbers for how many people are allowed in any given room at any given time? and even how many people are there for any given event?

you say you work there, and its not that bad. Common lets see the numbers. put your money where your mouth is.

and if you say...oh i cant get access to that info, common thats bullshit. everybody hears lose figures at their work, of stuff they arent supposed to.

So do yourself and us a favour, get us numbers, if you are right, then we will have to accept it. but dont post cause you are afraid of being wrong.

funny how the people bitching are probably the ones that only come once a year.

I bet the majority of you guys have no idea what goes on at the guvernment on a weekly basis

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 funny how the people bitching are probably the ones that only come once a year. I bet the majority of you guys have no idea what goes on at the guvernment on a weekly basis

WHO CARES!

Honestly, I'm getting really tired of people missing the point.

IF I CHOOSE TO GO ONCE A YEAR OR 52 TIMES A YEAR, IT SHOULD BE SAFE EVERY SINGLE TIME I GO.

it IS safe always...

quote:

Originally posted by BubbleGirl If money is everything...and we would allow everything for the sakes of money....Daddy would be pimping his daughther...why not...the door is open...there is money offered for it...!!! I

what are you talking about?!

why do you wanna go to fire marshall so bad?! you have to admit, crowd flow been preatty good since LoL2002. i am sure charles got so many complaints and calls after LoL that he was forced to do something about that issue. and he did. why don't you write a letter, official letter or something and give it to charles. i am sure if 20, 50, 100 whatever people sign it it will have better effect then going to fire marshall. over crowding of the guv doesnt take place every week or even every month! for god sake. and just keep in mind that going to that corrupted fire marshall, can (and possibly will) have reverse effect.

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 it IS safe always...

foolish...........were you at Ferry?

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 it IS safe always...

Then why do SO MANY PEOPLE complain after every special event?

Re: Ok this is rubbish

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 Let me start off by saying yes i do work there because im sure someone will bring it up eventually. Let me assure you though that I would be saying the exact same thing if i didnt. I only do the guv job because it's fun, i dont need the money. Also, this is my personl view and has nothing to do with management or anyone else at the club Anyways, a few things to comment on First off, going to the fire marshall is pointless. Why? because he is already well aware of what goes on. Obviously professional decisions have been made. Are you a fire marshall, building code inspector etc? Are you a professional in this field? Let me assure you that the club gets inspected on a regular basis and obviously the authorities see things fine. Going to the media is another bad idea. Do you not remember what they did to our scene 4 years ago? The media hyper inflates and exaggerates stories with the intention of getting little grey haired grannies steaming mad so that they will tune in tomorrow night. It looks like its even worked on you guys. The reason city hall stopped parties at the better living centre is because the news media portrayed raves as violent gun infested druggies just waiting to shoot each other. We all know that isnt true. May I also add, anyone who talks about pay-offs and crooked people online so openly may be flirting with liabel lawsuits from the fire marshall. Im sure the fire marshall wouldnt appreciate people openly calling him a criminal. Maybe i'll have to make a complaint to the fire marshall as well As for searches.... so people bitch about getting searched and then they bitch when somebody sneaks a weapon in and does some damage. Funny how the same people bitching about "over capacity" due to safety are the ones bitching about the searches that are designed for their safety. Which is it going to be people? The Z103 factor. Isnt it funny how everyone on one hand blames Z103 for playing ferry corsten yet wants guv to go back to the good old days when it used to be Z103 music (granted mark used to get that stuff light years before 103 and sometimes 103 even discovered it off him) I honestly did not like the music back then. The person who said "the guvernment used to be more underground back then"....ok now what drugs have u been taking? If anything the music is far more underground today and all the ginos that used to hang out have moved on to hiphop. I personally like the techno/prog/house/breaks that are played on regular saturdays much more than Rank 1 and Darude from the "good old days". The crowd. Sadly this has always been a complaint of mine in Toronto. There are some true party people here but the majority are juicebags and posers and personally im happy that they no longer, for the most part come to the guv main room. The problem here is Toronto, not the club. Ive been to places where thousands of people have gone off to Digweed... im sorry but Digweed bores me... imagine these people if they reacted to a nice hard techno set from Mark Oliver.... taht being said... most of the time we have a pretty decent crowd at the guvernment. As for the main beef about overcrowding. Honestly guys it wasnt THAT bad. Yes I agree that Labour of Love 2002 was a big problem and i can tell you that although the club has been quite busy since, there has never been a repeat of that day. Corsten was busy but i wouldnt call it over crowded. If you want to see overcrowding try going to Europe or South America where u cant even move because there are so many people. Im talking involuntary crowd surfing here. You have no idea Oh and as for Guv making talent so much more expensive in Toronto. What a Torontocentric point of view. Whoever said this needs to get out more. Its not Guvernment that raises the DJ fees. These guys charge what they charge and it happens to be that only guvernment can pay these fees in Toronto. Remember Toronto is competing with the rest of the world where in most places a big party is considered 30,000 people and not 8000. Consider yourselves lucky that there is a place that has enough capital to be able to pay these DJs what they are asking because otherwise theyd just skip toronto. International DJs dont need Toronto when they can get their asking fees elsewhere in the world.

even though i'm probably going to get flamed for this, i have to say i fully agree with everything you've said in your post

we were closer to front by the box that the chics dance on and honestly we didnt think it was that bad. we had some room to move honestly. i felt like it wasnt as crowded as it has been for some other events, but i could be wrong(which i am sure atleast one person will tell me i am after i post this) Just my opinion.

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 it IS safe always...

What do you define as safe? If there was a fire in that place and everyone was running for the exits. People WOULD get trampled, and probably die.

That is not safe.

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 funny how the people bitching are probably the ones that only come once a year. I bet the majority of you guys have no idea what goes on at the guvernment on a weekly basis

like i just asked, please tell us what goes on on a weekly baisis.

i go for pretty much every special event, and its always crowded as hell!

so if all the posts are just opinion, and not fact. what is fact? right now you are our closest link to the guv.

please inform us of the truth, and stop telling us we are wrong.

Re: Ok this is rubbish

quote:

Originally posted by Creamfields

You, shut up.

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1

As for you, I didn't have time to rip your post apart earlier and it seems like this thread has gotten a little out of control since then, but it's time to get this back on track and discuss the real issues here.

quote:

Let me start off by saying yes i do work there because im sure someone will bring it up eventually. Let me assure you though that I would be saying the exact same thing if i didnt. I only do the guv job because it's fun, i dont need the money. Also, this is my personl view and has nothing to do with management or anyone else at the club

Good. Let me start off by saying that unless you've got some special information for us, the question of whether or not you work at the Guv is fully irrelevant and my opinion of your post would be the same either way.

quote:

First off, going to the fire marshall is pointless. Why? because he is already well aware of what goes on. Obviously professional decisions have been made. Are you a fire marshall, building code inspector etc? Are you a professional in this field? Let me assure you that the club gets inspected on a regular basis and obviously the authorities see things fine.

And I suppose you've been privy to these inspections? You know what goes on? If you are saying the fire marshall is aware of what goes on and is permitting it, then you yourself are comitting libel (see below), since said fire marshall would have to be actively overlooking a clearly illegal situation for this to be true.

quote:

Going to the media is another bad idea. Do you not remember what they did to our scene 4 years ago? The media hyper inflates and exaggerates stories with the intention of getting little grey haired grannies steaming mad so that they will tune in tomorrow night. It looks like its even worked on you guys. The reason city hall stopped parties at the better living centre is because the news media portrayed raves as violent gun infested druggies just waiting to shoot each other. We all know that isnt true.

Since when was anybody talking about going to the media? In any event, the media has wrecked things in other places by taking drug-related incidents and blowing them out of proportion. Crowd control is an entirely different issue, I doubt it would result in any Canadian equivalent of a "rave act" - just a reprimand to the Guv by forcing the legal authorities to do something about it. Some media exposure would probably be good for the Guv, now that you mention it.

quote:

May I also add, anyone who talks about pay-offs and crooked people online so openly may be flirting with liabel lawsuits from the fire marshall. Im sure the fire marshall wouldnt appreciate people openly calling him a criminal. Maybe i'll have to make a complaint to the fire marshall as well

I believe you mean "libel" - in any case, as I said, from what you've implied you seem to be guilty of that yourself. However, I sincerely doubt that the fire marshall is overly concerned about what people say about him on an online forum. Honestly now, if you DON'T think that any and all authorities (including police, fire marshall, higher government, etc.) employ at least a FEW crooked people, then what planet are you from? Everyone knows this and everybody talks about it, and unfortunately for your "legal" argument, truth is a valid legal defense against charges of libel.

quote:

As for searches.... so people bitch about getting searched and then they bitch when somebody sneaks a weapon in and does some damage. Funny how the same people bitching about "over capacity" due to safety are the ones bitching about the searches that are designed for their safety. Which is it going to be people?

Yes, because I hide weapons in my crotch all the time. Some of them are very small, too - better make sure to thoroughly check the right nut AND the left nut because it could be hiding between the hairs on either one of those. Puh-leeze, the type of searching they do is absolutely ridiculous to call a "weapons only" search - they are searching for drugs, so they can bring them to their dealers inside and sell them for profit. It doesn't take an economist to figure out why this is a cost-effective practice for a club.

quote:

The Z103 factor. Isnt it funny how everyone on one hand blames Z103 for playing ferry corsten yet wants guv to go back to the good old days when it used to be Z103 music (granted mark used to get that stuff light years before 103 and sometimes 103 even discovered it off him) I honestly did not like the music back then.

I actively hate and flame the z103 whining as much as anybody here, but what does that have to do with this topic, at all?

quote:

The person who said "the guvernment used to be more underground back then"....ok now what drugs have u been taking? If anything the music is far more underground today and all the ginos that used to hang out have moved on to hiphop. I personally like the techno/prog/house/breaks that are played on regular saturdays much more than Rank 1 and Darude from the "good old days".

Who said this? I believe they said that the Guv used to have better parties back then, not that it was "underground." Not having been to the Guv in those days, I can't agree or disagree with that sentiment, but if the people who make these statements have been loyal patrons of the Guv for years and have only recently been turned off of the place, why would I not take their opinions seriously?

quote:

The crowd. Sadly this has always been a complaint of mine in Toronto. There are some true party people here but the majority are juicebags and posers and personally im happy that they no longer, for the most part come to the guv main room. The problem here is Toronto, not the club. Ive been to places where thousands of people have gone off to Digweed... im sorry but Digweed bores me... imagine these people if they reacted to a nice hard techno set from Mark Oliver.... taht being said... most of the time we have a pretty decent crowd at the guvernment.

Toronto crowd sucks in many ways. This is true. Crowd at the Guvernment represents a pretty average cross-section of regular Toronto dudes and dudettes, although perhaps a little more on the sleazy side (as you'd find in any club, not just the Guv). But again, what's your point, we aren't complaining about the quality of the crowd - just the size of it.

quote:

As for the main beef about overcrowding. Honestly guys it wasnt THAT bad. Yes I agree that Labour of Love 2002 was a big problem and i can tell you that although the club has been quite busy since, there has never been a repeat of that day. Corsten was busy but i wouldnt call it over crowded. If you want to see overcrowding try going to Europe or South America where u cant even move because there are so many people. Im talking involuntary crowd surfing here. You have no idea

I wasn't there, but evidently some of the people who were there did think it was THAT bad. Your comparison to LOL 2002 is simply not valid - are you trying to say that it must be just as bad as LOL2K2 in order to be considered dangerous? I think that perhaps the municipal regulatory board would disagree with you on that issue.

quote:

Oh and as for Guv making talent so much more expensive in Toronto. What a Torontocentric point of view. Whoever said this needs to get out more. Its not Guvernment that raises the DJ fees. These guys charge what they charge and it happens to be that only guvernment can pay these fees in Toronto. Remember Toronto is competing with the rest of the world where in most places a big party is considered 30,000 people and not 8000. Consider yourselves lucky that there is a place that has enough capital to be able to pay these DJs what they are asking because otherwise theyd just skip toronto. International DJs dont need Toronto when they can get their asking fees elsewhere in the world.

Of course it's a Toronto-centric point of view! We're talking about the scene in TORONTO! Nobody is saying that Guv raises the DJ fees, but they are almost like a monopoly in clubland, crushing all the small businesses. Some little place like Element or Pulse raises enough money to put on an event that they think can draw a nice crowd, and Guv counters with a massive five-DJ party, so nobody ends up going to the little place (except those that you would call "elitists"), and those ordinary clubs can't survive.

quote:

funny how the people bitching are probably the ones that only come once a year. I bet the majority of you guys have no idea what goes on at the guvernment on a weekly basis

Last summer, I went to Guv every week solid for about 2 months. There's no denying that summertime is the best time to go, and yet, for some reason I just stopped enjoying it after a while. Why? Well the music is alright, but I just couldn't stand the crowd and the smoke and the general atmosphere. I know what goes on on a weekly basis - sure, it's not as crowded as the "special events", of course it's not - but you know what, it's not exactly what I'd call "comfy". Is it "safe?" Yes, but that's not what we are complaining about, we are complaining about the times when it ISN'T SAFE! Try to make a note of that, since you still seem not to have figured that out. We don't care what happens on regular nights, we care what happens on irregular nights when it's ridiculously overcrowded and more than a little dangerous and illegal.

Moving on...

quote:

and what will happen if osama decides to bomb a club event? What if man never makes it to mars?

Relevance?

quote:

Seriously i dont think over crowding at the guvernment is as bad as portrayed here. I think there are just people who are angry that they cant flail their glow sticks around without hitting someone with them.

Yes, surely you must have noticed by now that our forum absolutely LOVES glowsticks. We talk about glowsticking ALL the time. In fact, our pre-meets are nothing but massive glowsticking warmups where we all practice our m4d gl0ws7icK1nG sk1llZ.

/sarcasm

quote:

Clubs are always going to have lots of people. If not they close.

Do you run a club? Do you know how the economics work? Do you know how any business works? It's not about just making a profit, it's about maximizing it. Clubs will have "lots" of people, yes, but they don't need to be *choked* with people in order to turn a decent profit.

quote:

Im no Fire Marshall, im not in charge of security and i dont know what kind of numbers go through on a given night.

Then of what possible use is your "insight"?

quote:

And btw neither do any of you.

This is true, but what we do know is that we had no room to move, and that clearly means that any kind of panic/fire/incident would be a complete disaster. If we can barely breathe when everybody is calm, how could we breathe when people are in a panic?

quote:

All i know is that the club is routinely inspected and it is still up and running so obviously the authorities are satisfied that the club is meeting standards. To watch all you armchair fire marshalls is actually quite funny.

"Armchair fire marshalls?" That's a bit of a stretch isn't it, seeing as how the starter of this thread was seeking out the fire marshall. You're not making a whole lot of sense here - you have absolutely no way of knowing what transpires between the club management and the fire marshall, or if the club is ever inspected at all, since you yourself admitted that you've never seen it happen.

As for "meeting the standards", we know what the legal capacity of the Guv is and there are hundreds of pictures floating around TA alone that could easily prove that they've exceed that number (by a very large margin).

I think that addresses just about everything. But please, feel free to continue your nonsensical rants and fight for your precious overstuffed Guv - I'll be right here to expose that ignorance.

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