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Originally posted by dEsidEL I think you're trying to say that you find people in this city don't seem to have a sense of style or fashion in their dress compared to other large urban centres you've been in (obviously this is a generalization, but you're basing this on your own observations.) Let me know whether I'm off base with this.

I think that in Toronto, there is certainly a good amount of people that are quite creative with what they wear (ie people who walk up and down Queen W). When comparing to where I live right now (Lyon, France), I'd say that people in Lyon dress "better" generally, in the sense that you would never catch a French person wearing track pants outside (it's actually pretty funny, because whenever you see a girl with track pants walking around, you KNOW she's English or North American and that she just got here). However, most people in Lyon or France in general dress exactly the same, and I find there to be a lack of creativity in what they wear.

I definitely do agree though that there are a lot of people in Toronto that look like they rolled out of bed and walked outside for the day. It's pretty bad!

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Originally posted by Jayx1 -Danforth on a summer evening for a drink

Goddamn right! All you east-side haters don't know what you're missing here.

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Originally posted by Capo di tutti I thought i was going to witness a holy war on saturday afternoon when the "Jesus is Lord" dude, black muslims (wearing black framed glasses, trench coats, fedoras and bowties) and Muslims (mostly Arabs) were recruiting and parading all within 20 feet of each other outside the sears doors.

LOL that must have been entertaining.

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Originally posted by Capo di tutti I thought i was going to witness a holy war on saturday afternoon when the "Jesus is Lord" dude, black muslims (wearing black framed glasses, trench coats, fedoras and bowties) and Muslims (mostly Arabs) were recruiting and parading all within 20 feet of each other outside the sears doors.

Awwwwwww!

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Originally posted by Intangible LOL! Yeah I know what you mean. And something about people with dogs, I automatically say "Hi" "Good morning" or something... I think maybe because small town dog walkers are always so overly friendly...

I never really thought about this, but it's true! I never really say hi to random people, but the rare time that I do is when I'm walking a dog and someone else walks by me with their dog. I wonder why...

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Originally posted by slingshot The NIMBY'ism in Toronto is quite ridiculous and is a major impediment to the growth of the city in many aspects. (In my opinion of course)

Definitely!

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Originally posted by malek -nightlife is almost non-existant ( nightlife is not only about clubbing )

Would you care to elaborate on this?

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Originally posted by dEsidEL ...in most places that I've been where this type of thing is allowed, seldom do you see people (and if you do it's usually the tourists) walking down the street with a beer in hand.

[color=ccff00]Except in Berlin. It was quite surprising to see people walking around at any time of the week, and at any time of the day, drinking out in the open.

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Originally posted by The Highroller I think that in Toronto, there is certainly a good amount of people that are quite creative with what they wear (ie people who walk up and down Queen W). When comparing to where I live right now (Lyon, France), I'd say that people in Lyon dress "better" generally, in the sense that you would never catch a French person wearing track pants outside (it's actually pretty funny, because whenever you see a girl with track pants walking around, you KNOW she's English or North American and that she just got here). However, most people in Lyon or France in general dress exactly the same, and I find there to be a lack of creativity in what they wear. I definitely do agree though that there are a lot of people in Toronto that look like they rolled out of bed and walked outside for the day. It's pretty bad!

I believe this sort of thing varies widely across the developed world. In North America at least, there seems to be a very carefree attitude when it comes to dress and fashion. Obviously it's not to say that everyone feels this way. You go down Queen West and you'll see a much more street fashioned inspired style. Head to Yorkville and you'll notice the high end fashion couture look. It all depends on where you are. Outside of specific areas, I'd agree that in general, people aren't too conscious of how they dress unless they're dressed for a certain occasion.

But if you think Toronto's bad, try traveling to some parts of the States where it seems like literally everyone shops out of the same Hollister, A&F, or Old Navy store. I notice this especially in suburban or rural areas. When I was last in the States down in Sandusky, Ohio I swear it seemed as if people literally rolled out of bed in the morning. Juxtapose that against later when I headed to downtown Cleveland, there were people who were more "conforming" when it came to style. Again it all depends on where you are. Larger cities where various styles of fashion made available will influence the way people dress. The New York City look will vary widely against the look of Batavia County residents.

I think Europe is a different thing altogether. People there have a much higher standard when it comes to fashion and dress no matter the time of day or place. This goes hand in hand with their sense of style in almost every aspect be it architecture, vehicles, or advertising. It's a key component in their lifestyle and hard to compare with North American practices. This has been known for some time. I think when comparing Toronto to other places in the world, it's probably a lot more fair to be comparing it within the North American context.

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Except in Berlin. It was quite surprising to see people walking around at any time of the week, and at any time of the day, drinking out in the open.

Of the times I've been in Berlin, I was there during major occasions/festivals be it the Love Parade or the World Cup so I think what I saw was definitely not the norm. Though outside of the events taking place at the time, I tended to notice that most people kept their drinking confined to patios and restaurants and didn't notice too much drinking on the streets. Something I found in most parts of Europe. Although you can probably make the better comparison in your current situation.

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Who will step up to show off our city? Billboards, slogans not enough to lure tourists May 15, 2008 Royson James What's the next big idea to lure tourists to Toronto? The next big attraction? With their latest report, another earnest navel-gazing effort that tells us what many have surmised for years, tourism officials have no shortage of things to fret and worry about, salivate over and ponder. They have more questions than answers. They identify gaps but don't tell us how to fill them. Toronto is a global destination. More tourists (10.6 million) came here last year than ever before. They spent $4.5 billion on hotels, restaurants, attractions, performing arts, shopping, taxis, meeting places et cetera. And this industry supports 100,000 jobs. So, why are industry officials nervous, edgy, saying things like, "We must take it to the next level. It's just not good enough?" Because competitor cities are constantly upgrading and improving. Because fewer Americans are coming, worried or put off as they are by passport requirements and less buying power with the Yankee dollar. Because local attractions are viewed as tired and visitors say, increasingly, they are not getting as much as they expected from their visits. Because more and more view our service as below expectations. Because few outside the well-connected know that Toronto is a gem of a location. And those who do aren't telling enough about it. Because Torontonians are at once too modest and too self-satisfied � not prone to brag about Toronto's achievements, unmotivated to compete for first place. Because we have one of the world's great science centres and people here don't even know it. That's saying much when the Ontario Science Centre, despite its lack of local acclaim, still attracts the most visitors of any cultural attraction in the province. Because when visitors do come here, there's little visible expression that we were expecting them and have gone out of our way to accommodate them. Because a group of 40,000 could roll in for a convention and hardly make an impression, which means, consequently, the city might make little or no impression on them. Chicago, meanwhile, is likely to have recorded messages from the mayor, decals on news boxes and other welcome banners. Because, despite a kitty of $30 million a year (money from hotel room levies), Tourism Toronto and industry officials have shown a decided lack of marketing genius. In fact, marketing efforts like the fiasco of Toronto Unlimited advertising have proven embarrassing. All that said, the experts are taking another stab at making Toronto a superb host to the world. Tourism Toronto is to launch a new effort today. It'd better be smart, snappy, clearly doable with short-term effects and results. Yesterday, the tourism sellers came to council's economic development committee to deliver the findings of their $70,000 survey of visitors and industry workers. It was a frustrating exercise. Just about everything they said was true. And already said. Already we know the what, when and where and much of the why. We need the who. Who will move us from "almost premier-ranked" to the top? Who'll establish the new culture of hospitality excellence? Who will demand it, institute it, encourage the industry to live by it, and motivate the public to buy into it? Slogans and billboards alone won't do. Consider: The addition to the Royal Ontario Museum was recently named one of the seven new wonders of the world, architecturally speaking. Somebody may want to celebrate, promote and trumpet that in circles where Toronto is considered a destination with little new. This entire effort cries out for the type of civic boosterism resident in the small-town Canadian or loudmouth American mayor. Toronto waits. Either will do. Royson James usually appears Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday. Email: [email protected]

source:
http://www.thestar.com/Article/425570

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A Toronto tourism button from 2005. Learn to love tourists this summer May 15, 2008 Vanessa Lu City hall bureau chief When guests are coming over, it's time to tidy up the house and roll out the welcome mat. That's exactly what all Torontonians must do to make visitors feel more welcome, say tourism officials, given that surveys show today's tourists go home a lot less satisfied with their visits here than they did 10 years ago. "It's everyone's responsibility to sell this city. It's everyone's obligation to ensure we welcome our visitors," Councillor Michael Thompson said at a meeting of the economic development committee yesterday. A report was released at the committee on new tourist strategies. A campaign launched under the slogan "We've been expecting you" is meant to make sure tourists feel wanted and loved from the minute they arrive at the airport, train station or hotel. It will encourage average folks to do things like stop on the street to help a visitor fumbling with a map, or go out of their way to explain how the subway system works. "It goes beyond customer service. It's the sense of welcome. It's the things you would do if someone were coming to your house � spruce up the house, get the candles out, put the kids in the backyard," said David Whitaker, president and CEO of Tourism Toronto. The agency plans to unveil draft logos for the campaign today, as well as announce a new scholarship program, a major convention "win" and an initiative involving comic Russell Peters. Still in the planning stages, the "We've been expecting you" campaign could include welcome buttons or signs, and extra training for hospitality staff. It could also mean a city-wide campaign on bus shelters, in subway stations and even bumper stickers on government cars. Residents could be educated on the importance of tourism to the economy and the role they can play to make the city much more welcoming. Whitaker said he hopes the campaign, a collaborative effort between industry and the city, might roll out later this year, though the price tag has not yet been determined. A study done by the University of Guelph for Tourism Toronto found that in 1998, nearly 70 per cent of respondents were "very satisfied" with their Toronto experience. By 2006, that had dropped to less than 50 per cent. Similarly, in 2006, only 17 per cent said service here exceeded their expectations, compared with 30 per cent in 1998. Councillor Adrian Heaps said tourism is not a "product" � a direct rebuttal to officials who kept insisting yesterday that Toronto has a great product. "It's a cash register that rings up the till on all the activities that feed into it. It's a philosophy," Heaps said. The emphasis should be on service and results, he said, regardless of whether it involves a business improvement association, a hotel manager or the guy who cleans the washroom. "We shouldn't be proud of saying: `I'm sorry, there are no rooms available.' `I'm sorry, we don't have that in stock.' `I'm sorry, there isn't a tour like that,'" Heaps said. Terry Mundell, president of the Greater Toronto Hotel Association, said the key is to make Toronto more compelling to tourists with both public and private investment in new attractions. "You can have all the marketing resources in the world," Mundell said, but, "If you don't have a product to market and sell, it doesn't matter how many dollars you have."

source:
http://www.thestar.com/News/GTA/article/425568

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Originally posted by Kamka + 1 I remember when I went to Slovakia after what seemed to me like many yers of being only in Toronto... I was so surprised seeing beautiful women on the streets, dressed up elegantly even when they just went to the grocery store... not overly or unecessarily fancily, just in nice, appropriate clothes and tidy appearance. And I think that the average salary there in relation to the standard of living is not necessarily better there than here (although that depends on individual factors too)....

tidy, that's the word I was looking for
and I strongly believe that you don't have to buy and wear expensive clothes to look presentable, so salary shouldn't be even a factor

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Originally posted by The Highroller Except in Berlin. It was quite surprising to see people walking around at any time of the week, and at any time of the day, drinking out in the open.

i definitely saw that when i was in berlin a couple of weeks ago. especially around the tower and alex platz. lots of punks and goths there as well.

when i was in salzburg, there were small groups of people having picnics on the river waterfront who openly had alcohol and shisha. mind you this was at 10.30 in the morning so it was a bit suprising for me.

pfft, going to your 8:00am lecture in PJ bottoms and flip flops is the best. Sure, your crazy bed-head hair may be distracting to those behind you, and the stench of your currently unshowered pits may distract those sitting on either side of you, but the comfort factor! just cant be beat.

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Originally posted by kaniz pfft, going to your 8:00am lecture in PJ bottoms and flip flops is the best. Sure, your crazy bed-head hair may be distracting to those behind you, and the stench of your currently unshowered pits may distract those sitting on either side of you, but the comfort factor! just cant be beat.

LOL...that's just lazy

I mean it's great if people can do that, but I personally couldn't handle the feeling of looking that way. When I was in school, many of my class mates have done it, and I don't judge, but it's still alien to me, and I probably would never understand it

Yeah I get that it's just college and not a fashion show...but seriously, the whole track pant/ugg/sweats/slob/whatever thing is plain fucking trash.

It's hilarious all the sheep that buy that as style though.

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Originally posted by jennypie Yeah I get that it's just college and not a fashion show...but seriously, the whole track pant/ugg/sweats/slob/whatever thing is plain fucking trash. It's hilarious all the sheep that buy that as style though.

+1 perfect description

in college and i went to college in Kitchener (LOL)

The girls were either ready for the club, ready for a track meet or ready for a sleepover with the girls

There were even these girls who planned days. Warm up pant day, pink day...and my favorite "side ponytail" day...it got sickening after a while

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Originally posted by jennypie Yeah I get that it's just college and not a fashion show...but seriously, the whole track pant/ugg/sweats/slob/whatever thing is plain fucking trash. It's hilarious all the sheep that buy that as style though.

you tell them Jennie

Seriously. Is it so hard to take a shower and just throw on some jeans and a cute tee-shirt? Kids these days!

And don't even get me started on the stupid whores at the gym!

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Originally posted by jennypie Seriously. Is it so hard to take a shower and just throw on some jeans and a cute tee-shirt? Kids these days! And don't even get me started on the stupid whores at the gym!

bwahaha
for some reason my gym has very conservatively dressed girls
maybe it's the area, I don't know

It's the clothes so much as it's the make-up and hair.

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Originally posted by jennypie Yeah I get that it's just college and not a fashion show...but seriously, the whole track pant/ugg/sweats/slob/whatever thing is plain fucking trash. It's hilarious all the sheep that buy that as style though.

I absolutely hated going to York, where girls would wake up at 5am, for 8am class just to dress as if they were going to the club. When I visited other Universities, Mac, Queens, it was so nice to see people just dressed like they don't give a fuck, because they were just going to learn.


Pro:
- general lack of caring towards pot. Cops and pedestrians really could care less if you are smoking joint in public. It is as if the GTA has already deemed it legal, and people just accept it.
- Immigrants all getting along. Have you ever seen a Jamaican with a thick accent talk to a Pol with an even thicker accent? I cannot understand either of them, but some how they understand each other. Really amazing imo.

Con:
- not enough festivals here that are separate from cultures. I mean, Toronto has a million+ South Asian (Indian) events in the summer. I would love to see more random festivals, around art, or themes, or just anything different.
- transport to other cities. There are so many small towns and cities I would love to visit in Ontario, but just cannot because I do not drive. The buses are infrequent, and expensive.

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Originally posted by Orko I absolutely hated going to York, where girls would wake up at 5am, for 8am class just to dress as if they were going to the club. When I visited other Universities, Mac, Queens, it was so nice to see people just dressed like they don't give a fuck, because they were just going to learn.

yeah but nothing's wrong with dressing at least a little bit presentable
it's not high school anymore ffs's! half of York looked like they're on an orientation day from a nearby school

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Originally posted by Orko I absolutely hated going to York, where girls would wake up at 5am, for 8am class just to dress as if they were going to the club. When I visited other Universities, Mac, Queens, it was so nice to see people just dressed like they don't give a fuck, because they were just going to learn.

You should see the school I go to in Lyon. The French girls do it up proper every day of the week. Every single hair is in place with perfection, impeccable make-up, classy outfits. They don't mess around. It looks like they get up at 4am to get ready every morning, lol.

I don't see anything to hate about girls dressing up like that. I think it's fucking awesome, haha.

However, it is hilarious seeing these girls in the gym with their serious hair-dos and their make-up on the treadmill.

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Originally posted by Orko I absolutely hated going to York, where girls would wake up at 5am, for 8am class just to dress as if they were going to the club. When I visited other Universities, Mac, Queens, it was so nice to see people just dressed like they don't give a fuck, because they were just going to learn.

hahahah it's official, we have nothing in common.

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Originally posted by The Highroller I don't see anything to hate about girls dressing up like that. I think it's fucking awesome, haha.

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Originally posted by jon jon hahahah it's official, we have nothing in common.

haha glad to see guys concur

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Originally posted by SasH21 LOL...that's just lazy I mean it's great if people can do that, but I personally couldn't handle the feeling of looking that way. When I was in school, many of my class mates have done it, and I don't judge, but it's still alien to me, and I probably would never understand it

I get it, but wouldn't do it myself. I never went to class in PJ bottoms. I did now and then go straight from bed to class and skip the shower if I was running late, but would atleast toss on jeans and a clean shirt before I left the door. (This is when I lived on rez and could run back home to shower right after class)

There's been a few times I've gone to head to the corner store with a friend and been in PJ bottoms or track pants or something and go to change into proper pants and he's all "so what, your just going to the corner and back", and my thought is "so what, I dont want to be seen in public looking like that much of a slob"

I may not have the best fashion/style sense - but some things you just shouldn't be running around in public in.

GOOD - Kensington, High Park, Mt. Pleasant Cemetery, Leslie Spit, and other green spaces, the relative ganja-friendliness compared to other major centres in North America, Trinity-Bellwoods drum circles, back-alley graffiti, farmer's markets, the variety of foods (India Bazaar! 400 different sushi restaurants! Tibetan *and* Ethiopian in the same 'hood!) and other wares from different countries - few of the things that I can think of that make Toronto a decent place to live.

NOT SO HOT - the appalling lack of support for independent culture. Toronto's a corporate city, and as such, if it isn't big business (or approved or sponsored by it), it doesn't have much of a chance of surviving. Even going down to Harbourfront for a sponsored event like the Beats, Breaks and Culture fest on a Saturday afternoon, and finding maybe a couple of hundred people listlessly milling around listening to top-notch local talent that rain-or-shine would draw huge, hands-in-the-air crowds almost anywhere in Europe is typical for this city. Sad, really fucking sad.

Bike-unfriendly - is it really that hard for City Hall to encourage and endorse bicycle culture in the downtown core?

Trendoid rent prices - in our search for a new apartment, we lucked out and found a decent, caring landlord, but the majority of people renting out downtown property are out to freaking lunch. Don't care if your house is located near "trendy Queen West", $1450 +utilities for a 2-bedroom that smells like cat piss and needs a major overhaul is wishful thinking - saddest part is that some wannabe is probably still going to shell out for it, just to be near the so-called "action". This was the case with most places we viewed - gouging for no reason other than the fact that most people are suckers and will pay the asking rate.

Pedantic Population - a Holt Renfrew on Bloor and some shiny, electronic billboards on Yonge Street does not a world-class city make. Guess it's due to a large suburban population, but a lot of peeps need to wake up to the fact that there's more to life than shopping and talking about what you watched on TV last night. There's next to no cafe culture in Toronto because everyone's either in too much of a hurry to sit down and relax, or working off the week's stress by getting shitfaced on a patio. And jeans and a sweatshirt have been the municipal uniform for far too long - are you afraid of a little colour? Drone-ishly Bore-ing.

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Originally posted by Harmonika This was the case with most places we viewed - gouging for no reason other than the fact that most people are suckers and will pay the asking rate.

haha

Queen West 1
Harmonika 0

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