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quote:

Originally posted by Krypton So dividing by zero can sometimes actually give us a real answer? No

Cowboy, your universe's mathematical laws do not apply to mine.

Bottom line, wether someone believes in god or not is completely their business. Last time I had Jehova's witness come at my door it was a funny scene. To summarize, I had to curse them out because they tried telling me that I can still follow my Catholic beliefs and become a Jehova's witness Christian. I almost lost it and yelled "what the fuck are you talking about you fucking Jew?" and slammed the door on them.

quote:

Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN So, god doesn�t exist then?

first cause

quote:

Originally posted by Krypton There is in my opinion a Great Architect of the Universe. Mathematical order cannot manifest itself out of disorder or nothingness.

there is no such thing as disorder


even if you are a materialist and believe that the magical big bang is the origin of everything, you have to realize that this unfolding of space time only happened one way, and then everything else resulting from that original event can be predicted at some level, if you had the tools to predict it.


there are only levels of apparent disorder that result from exceedingly complicated and subtle patterns


there is also no great architect of the universe separate from the universe or even from you and me. it is all one movement.

quote:

Originally posted by SuspicionVandit Cowboy, your universe's mathematical laws do not apply to mine.

what do you call this universe where you can divide by zero, and get something out of nothing?

quote:

Originally posted by Krypton first cause

what?

quote:

Originally posted by Krypton what do you call this universe where you can divide by zero, and get something out of nothing?

alternate universe

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Originally posted by nefardec there is no such thing as disorder

I never implied there was and that is my view. All I'm saying is I don't believe something can come from nothingness. Our physical laws didn't exist 10^-43 second after the Big Bang. What this primordial reality was, we are far from knowing, but before 0 seconds after the Big Bang is an even bigger mystery. I just hold the view of our universe coming from a supernatural source. I mean supernatural in the sense that whatever reality our universe came from, it came from outside of our space-time continuum.

Agree to disagree, but that's just my view.

quote:

Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN what?

"so god doesn't exist then?"

Only the Great Architect can divide by zero and create something out of nothing.

quote:

Originally posted by SuspicionVandit alternate universe

I call it impossible.

quote:

Originally posted by Krypton Really? So dividing by zero can sometimes actually give us a real answer? No, not so. Something can't come from nothing.

What does dividing by zero have to do with the start of the universe?

And why does a first cause have to be a personal one like God? And if you're not arguing that it's a personal cause, why call it "God" at all?

[I love it: cosmology in the COR.]

quote:

Originally posted by Krypton "so god doesn't exist then?" Only the Great Architect can divide by zero and create something out of nothing.

So who created god then?

quote:

Originally posted by Krypton I never implied there was and that is my view. All I'm saying is I don't believe something can come from nothingness. Our physical laws didn't exist 10^-43 second after the Big Bang. What this primordial reality was, we are far from knowing, but before 0 seconds after the Big Bang is an even bigger mystery. I just hold the view of our universe coming from a supernatural source. I mean supernatural in the sense that whatever reality our universe came from, it came from outside of our space-time continuum. Agree to disagree, but that's just my view.

Its an infinite cycle of contraction and expansion... you should know that mr stock trader guy.

The idea of God and creation is just to put tangible human traits to something that is complete and total randomness. The fact that our mere existence is but a fluke in the infinite spectrum of time and space...

quote:

Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN So who created god then?

Duh, Super God... who was created by Bristol-Myers Squibb

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Originally posted by Joss Weatherby Its an infinite cycle of contraction and expansion...

Reminds me...everybody should read this little Isaac Asimov story:

http://www.multivax.com/last_question.html

quote:

Originally posted by Joss Weatherby Its an infinite cycle of contraction and expansion... you should know that mr stock trader guy. The idea of God and creation is just to put tangible human traits to something that is complete and total randomness. The fact that our mere existence is but a fluke in the infinite spectrum of time and space...

this understanding of god is not the understanding of god that any true mystic has. this is the popular understanding of god that allows simple people to live modest lives and to be decent citizens in society.


i wouldn't call it a cycle so much as a simultaneity. the cycle is the effect of perspective

well, im just speculating on what I think is up with the universe. Not saying I am right because it's so complex of an event I don't think anyone is 100% correct on anything beyond

{t|time < 10^-43} seconds

after the Big Bang.

quote:

Originally posted by nefardec there is no such thing as disorder even if you are a materialist and believe that the magical big bang is the origin of everything, you have to realize that this unfolding of space time only happened one way, and then everything else resulting from that original event can be predicted at some level, if you had the tools to predict it. there are only levels of apparent disorder that result from exceedingly complicated and subtle patterns there is also no great architect of the universe separate from the universe or even from you and me. it is all one movement.

"The very concept of 'order' is laughable to me. Can anything in the world really be conceptualized and given perfect uniformity? Where is the event which will always happen the same way or can even be repeated in exactly the same way under controlled conditions? How can you claim to line up four identical buttons in a perfect row when at a molecular level the items are as different as an apple and an orange are to us? Even gravity does not always repeat itself."

- Peter Strachan

quote:

Originally posted by Domesticated "The very concept of 'order' is laughable to me. Can anything in the world really be conceptualized and given perfect uniformity? Where is the event which will always happen the same way or can even be repeated in exactly the same way under controlled conditions? How can you claim to line up four identical buttons in a perfect row when at a molecular level the items are as different as an apple and an orange are to us? Even gravity does not always repeat itself." - Peter Strachan

lol did he ever take math class?

whether you are a materialist or a mystic, ideas still exist somewhere, and 2 goes after 1.

quote:

Originally posted by nefardec lol did he ever take math class? whether you are a materialist or a mystic, ideas still exist somewhere, and 2 goes after 1.

Where did you get the concept that "idea = order"?

quote:

Originally posted by Domesticated Where did you get the concept that "idea = order"?

that's not what i was saying.

what i am saying is, the idea of '1' and the idea of '2' are just as real as an apple or an orange, whether you believe that ideas are located in the electrical-chemical processes of a brain or a superimplicate order of vibrational energy in a holographic universe or that god invented math.

1 always goes before 2 if you are counting up.

I thought this would be a good place to ask as any, as I'm not too well versed in Quantum Phyisics- what do you make of the double slit experiment..it's a bit hazy to me, but from what I remember, the results of the experiment was altered by the installation of an obervational mechanism. Essentially the electrons being fired through the slits behaved very differently when observable.

I saw this on a comic called Dr. Quantum by Fred Alan Wolf I think.

quote:

Originally posted by DJ Damerchi I thought this would be a good place to ask as any, as I'm not too well versed in Quantum Phyisics- what do you make of the double slit experiment..it's a bit hazy to me, but from what I remember, the results of the experiment was altered by the installation of an obervational mechanism. Essentially the electrons being fired through the slits behaved very differently when observable. I saw this on a comic called Dr. Quantum by Fred Alan Wolf I think.

didn't they end up in another universe or something?

quote:

Originally posted by DJ Damerchi I thought this would be a good place to ask as any, as I'm not too well versed in Quantum Phyisics- what do you make of the double slit experiment..it's a bit hazy to me, but from what I remember, the results of the experiment was altered by the installation of an obervational mechanism. Essentially the electrons being fired through the slits behaved very differently when observable. I saw this on a comic called Dr. Quantum by Fred Alan Wolf I think.

basically the act of observation collapses the wavefunction

quote:

Originally posted by DJ Damerchi I thought this would be a good place to ask as any, as I'm not too well versed in Quantum Phyisics- what do you make of the double slit experiment..it's a bit hazy to me, but from what I remember, the results of the experiment was altered by the installation of an obervational mechanism. Essentially the electrons being fired through the slits behaved very differently when observable. I saw this on a comic called Dr. Quantum by Fred Alan Wolf I think.

i don't understand your question lol


are you asking what it was?

basically it split a beam of electrons and the electrons appeared wherever the scientists, as observers, expected them to appear

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