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quote:

Originally posted by Fledz Of course I'm dancing for crying out loud, what do you think I'm doing? Chin-stroking and standing there for 6 hours with my hands in the air? Well done on making me look like I'm a candy raver (which you're terrible at doing btw). I enjoy different artists, different music, different genres, different events for different reasons unlike some of you jaded ****s who just complain, whine, bitch and moan if somethin isn't up to your standards. So Digi likes what he likes? Great, I'm happy for him. I like that too but just not always. The difference between myself and some of you is that I can have fun in a multitude of different environments in multiple ways and that is what dance music and music in general is about. It's about having fun, not about having a cry about how "back in my day" and what you think is perfection. Guess what? Your perfection is someone elses rubbish and vice versa. Deal with it, learn to live with it or become a jaded old fuck like the majority of posters in MD. And shit, this looks like it belongs in the MD anyway. Why do we have to turn everything in this forum to shit?

If I go to an event,which isn't that often, I want to see dancers:

gogo, stringers, poppers, tutters, lockers, breakers, steppers, stringers, glowstickers, liquiders.

If it's a good party then there will be people like that.

If someone thinks the DJ is god than it probably makes the music sound better, but I don't like that kind of DJ worship mentality.

One night during the warm up slot there was this decently sized break circle and the DJ drops this progressive house tune with a 30 second breakdown and throws his arms into the arm. No one was impressed and people in the circle were just kind of tapping their toes waiting for it to be over. He wasn't even paying any attention to what was going on to the dance floor...

Good dancers at an event add so much, it's incredible.

If you want to bop up and down like a cork that's fine, but you can't tell we've lost something.

I guess I just can't accept that some of you will ever get it. The things he does, says, and his actions in management and promotion are completely transparent. He is a sell out in any sense of the word and I don't understand how you guys can't see that. He was immensely talented and it's just sad to see the downward spiral his career has taken.

It's all about the money and the fame. You can tell. Throwing Kanye West in his sets; working with the biggest vocalists that can stand him; 12/17 tracks on his album are collabs. One day you will all be intelligent enough to see what a clown he is and hopefully there will be some new artists who actually deserve the adoration and respect of the fans and clubbers. It's not just him either, but he is the worst. It seems everyone at the top sells out in order to get there. I don't see one person that has been strong to their roots and just done what they love. Sad fucking times.

quote:

Originally posted by mfitterer1 I guess I just can't accept that some of you will ever get it. The things he does, says, and his actions in management and promotion are completely transparent. He is a sell out in any sense of the word and I don't understand how you guys can't see that. He was immensely talented and it's just sad to see the downward spiral his career has taken. It's all about the money and the fame. You can tell. Throwing Kanye West in his sets; working with the biggest vocalists that can stand him; 12/17 tracks on his album are collabs. One day you will all be intelligent enough to see what a clown he is and hopefully there will be some new artists who actually deserve the adoration and respect of the fans and clubbers. It's not just him either, but he is the worst. It seems everyone at the top sells out in order to get there. I don't see one person that has been strong to their roots and just done what they love. Sad fucking times.

First paragraph: Saying his career is going downwards while he is still the 3rd most popular dj worldwide is a bit harsh isn't it?

Second paragraph:
"Throwing Kanye West in his sets;"
Ever heard of thinking outside the box? Or playing what you like as a dj?

"working with the biggest vocalists that can stand him;"
prove it.

"12/17 tracks on his album are collabs"
If that makes him less good of an artist you probably don't like bands, otherwise you're a hypocrite. Working together on projects is fun and he surely doesn't need it.

"One day you will all be intelligent enough to see what a clown he is and hopefully there will be some new artists who actually deserve the adoration and respect of the fans and clubbers."
This is the world turned upside down. Blaming the artist in question for having fans. Hilarious.

"I don't see one person that has been strong to their roots and just done what they love."
Yes he never really was a dj/producer . And he never had fun dj-ing either.

Your statements reflect a lot of negativity while you refrain from making any objective statements. It's all based on your opinion for the sake of having an argument. Sad fucking times indeed.

I'm out of here. It's time to let this epic display of inadequacy and poor arguments fade away.

you're just whining 'cos you haven't got to play ibiza yet

quote:

Originally posted by macrocosm you're just whining 'cos you haven't got to play ibiza yet

Meh. I'm on the island right now and everyone I spoke to wasn't going to see him on Tuesday because he's such a sellout tool
Personally I couldn't bring myself to do it either.

Armin absolutely rocked his final set at Armada last night though.. 3 hours of mayhem
Seven Cities
Southern Sun
1999
etc., so many rocking old tunes as well as banging new stuff

quote:

Originally posted by macrocosm you're just whining 'cos you haven't got to play ibiza yet

That almost makes sense.

What exactly has Tiesto done to warrant all of this "fame" ?

For those new comers, let me put this in perspective for you. How would you view a wannabe Deadmau5 that came along wearing a mouse hat and playing half the tunes that Deadmau5 plays? I ask this because that's exactly what Tiesto did except he was copying Oakenfold.

Oakenfold started the "jesus" pose. Oakenfold wasn't the first to spin Trance, but he was, without even debate, the most important figure in Trance history because he brought it to the masses. All Tiesto did was try to live in his shadow. Playing a lot of the same tunes, acting a lot like him on stage, trying to get the same tour schedules going, etc. He's been an idea thief ever since anybody has known who he is. I can't fathom how people can #1 respect him and #2 actually believe he did something for Trance. If Tiesto was never born, Trance would be exactly where it is now (it would probably be better.) So again, why are people so obsessed with somebody who has somebody writes his music, steals tunes, steals ideas, and claimed his way to fame by literally living in the shadow of Paul Oakenfold.

Tiesto might be a great guy and he may love the music more than most, but it doesn't change the fact that he is not an innovator and has done a lot of unethical things in his career and never really did anything for dance music. I personally believe, with 100% conviction, that Trance music as we know it would be much better off today if Tiesto never existed.

Bull fucking shit. I know for a fact that alot of people do enjoy tracks with big breakdowns.. not everyone goes out to show off their latest 360 degree spins and uber sexy dance moves. People aren't watching you in slow motion as if you're in some lame teenage dance movie.. give them a high five after they do the splits rofl.

We dance just fine to Epic music fuckstick, take that to the bank.. just because you don't like it don't generalise the hell out of it. I started going out to events in 1999 and it's now 2009 and my outlook has stayed the same.

quote:

Originally posted by mfitterer1 Play it in your radio sets fine; but when you're playing in front of people and supposed to make them dance do you think it makes sense to chain 3 2 minute long breakdowns together??? How are people supposed to dance to that?

I'll give you my only experience with Tiesto. Keep in mind, that at this time, I had very little respect for the type of music he played. I just thought it was too "cheesy, supersaw" at the time. Earlier this decade, when I was still DJing on a regular basis, a promoter friend of mine booked me to play at a club here in Dallas where he was headlining. I was supposed to close after he was finished, but for some unknown reason, the promoter asked me to go on right before he did.

So I went on and played for about 30 minutes. Since I knew what type of music he was going to play, I threw down some "progressive trance" type stuff which I knew would lead well into his the trance type stuff...think John Digweed GU19 type stuff.

Anyway, Tiesto finally comes to the DJ booth. The crowd was already going nuts but they went even more mental when they saw him step into the booth. I greeted him, and he shook my hand and I asked if he was ready to go on. He told me "Nah, you're doing great, play a couple more." So I did, and he was just hanging out rockin along to the music with everyone else. I played two more records (yes, records), then turned it over to him by taking my headphones out of the mixer.

So, he got on the decks, and plugged in his headphones.

Now, for those of you who dont know, one of the biggest signs of disrespect you can show another DJ is to stop his record when you come on, especially if the crowd is totally into it. I fully expected him to do this (I had it done to me before), but to my surprise, he lines up his record and let my record play out in full before mixing out in the end. He gave me the knowing nod of "good job, thank you" and proceeded to play his set.

Now this was an international superstar DJ, coming on after some local yokle, who he didn't know from Adam. He could of easily just stopped my track, started off with his record and never even given me the time of day, but he was nice enough to show me the respect of acknowledging that I had done a good job warming up the crowd for him, and let me have my little moment of glory. I dont know about any of the other comments on this thread, but that was a super cool thing to do, and I got nothing but nice guy vibes from him during that incedent. I may not have had much respect for the music he played, but I certainly respected him doing that, and it was much appreciated.

My .02.

quote:

Originally posted by Storyteller First paragraph: Saying his career is going downwards while he is still the 3rd most popular dj worldwide is a bit harsh isn't it?

Popularity means oh so much huh? Do you happen to notice what demographic makes up the top 5? 21 and under. You're saying a bunch of kids who have no clue what good music really is are an accurate representation of someone's talent or career? The fact he is #3 still SHOWS how much his career is going downwards.

quote:

Second paragraph: "Throwing Kanye West in his sets;" Ever heard of thinking outside the box? Or playing what you like as a dj?

Ever heard of sticking to your roots? He's a sell out that sticks to whatever is hot at the moment so that in turn he can keep in the top 5 of the dj poll; duh! For a guy so many say is so passionate about the music it sure doesn't seem that way when he hops around so much.

quote:

"working with the biggest vocalists that can stand him;" prove it.

Go look at his upcoming albums tracklist please

quote:

"12/17 tracks on his album are collabs" If that makes him less good of an artist you probably don't like bands, otherwise you're a hypocrite. Working together on projects is fun and he surely doesn't need it.

I do like bands; but Tiesto is not a band. Do you not see he is trying to reach more people by hitting each big name vocalists fan base? I hope you're not that naive.

quote:

"One day you will all be intelligent enough to see what a clown he is and hopefully there will be some new artists who actually deserve the adoration and respect of the fans and clubbers." This is the world turned upside down. Blaming the artist in question for having fans. Hilarious.

Blaming the artist for taking advantage of immature too dumb to make their own decisions children. The only thing he has in his arsenal is a good marketing team. You take that away and he is nothing.

quote:

"I don't see one person that has been strong to their roots and just done what they love." Yes he never really was a dj/producer . And he never had fun dj-ing either.

A real dj wouldn't put a pre recorded set on in front of thousands of fans and play it off as if it was live. A real dj wouldn't force promoters to charge $65 for tickets because he is so fucking greedy he charges 50k for a show. If it was about the music this would never happen. Great example is tomorrow night in Seattle. Cosmic Gate (who are much more talented as dj's as well as producers) are playing for FREE! Could you ever see Tiesto doing that? Hell fucking no!

quote:

Your statements reflect a lot of negativity while you refrain from making any objective statements. It's all based on your opinion for the sake of having an argument. Sad fucking times indeed.

Maybe you missed the part where I sad I will expose every fake ass twat for the fake ass twat that they are. That's all i'm doing.

quote:

Originally posted by Aesthetic Bull fucking shit. I know for a fact that alot of people do enjoy tracks with big breakdowns.. not everyone goes out to show off their latest 360 degree spins and uber sexy dance moves. People aren't watching you in slow motion as if you're in some lame teenage dance movie.. give them a high five after they do the splits rofl. We dance just fine to Epic music fuckstick, take that to the bank.. just because you don't like it don't generalise the hell out of it. I started going out to events in 1999 and it's now 2009 and my outlook has stayed the same.

Please tell me how you dance through a 2 minute breakdown? After you're done with that tell me how you dance through a whole night of 1.5-2 minute breakdowns chained one after another. There's a reason trance fans are focused on the dj reaching for the lazers. There's also a reason why it's no longer the most popular edm genre.

quote:

Originally posted by Eric J I'll give you my only experience with Tiesto. Keep in mind, that at this time, I had very little respect for the type of music he played. I just thought it was too "cheesy, supersaw" at the time. Earlier this decade, when I was still DJing on a regular basis, a promoter friend of mine booked me to play at a club here in Dallas where he was headlining. I was supposed to close after he was finished, but for some unknown reason, the promoter asked me to go on right before he did. So I went on and played for about 30 minutes. Since I knew what type of music he was going to play, I threw down some "progressive trance" type stuff which I knew would lead well into his the trance type stuff...think John Digweed GU19 type stuff. Anyway, Tiesto finally comes to the DJ booth. The crowd was already going nuts but they went even more mental when they saw him step into the booth. I greeted him, and he shook my hand and I asked if he was ready to go on. He told me "Nah, you're doing great, play a couple more." So I did, and he was just hanging out rockin along to the music with everyone else. I played two more records (yes, records), then turned it over to him by taking my headphones out of the mixer. So, he got on the decks, and plugged in his headphones. Now, for those of you who dont know, one of the biggest signs of disrespect you can show another DJ is to stop his record when you come on, especially if the crowd is totally into it. I fully expected him to do this (I had it done to me before), but to my surprise, he lines up his record and let my record play out in full before mixing out in the end. He gave me the knowing nod of "good job, thank you" and proceeded to play his set. Now this was an international superstar DJ, coming on after some local yokle, who he didn't know from Adam. He could of easily just stopped my track, started off with his record and never even given me the time of day, but he was nice enough to show me the respect of acknowledging that I had done a good job warming up the crowd for him, and let me have my little moment of glory. I dont know about any of the other comments on this thread, but that was a super cool thing to do, and I got nothing but nice guy vibes from him during that incedent. I may not have had much respect for the music he played, but I certainly respected him doing that, and it was much appreciated. My .02.

While that is respectful it should be expected and on top of that it doesn't mean he isn't a sell out or that he actually appreciates the music.

quote:

Originally posted by mfitterer1 blah

The way I feel all he's been doing is for the fun of it. I'm pretty sure he loves his job. I think you're naive for actually thinking your opinion matters for what he WANTS to do. He can charge that much because people pay for it. and sticking to your roots isn't relevant at all. If it was, you and I would still be sucking our moms tits for milk.

I think flaming established artists is childish, they are famous for a reason. What you think is not relevant and the accomplishments speak for itself. Blaming an artist for wanting a bigger fanbase is just stupid, isn't it a challenge to try and get more people to like your music?

I'm sorry but everything is you say is off the charts retarded whining with semi-facts dan't prove nothing. He's just doing what he likes/wants and you're blaming him for doing so or being able to do so. If you dislike him that why not learn to deal with that instead of putting this much effort in this endless discussion?

quote:

Originally posted by Storyteller The way I feel all he's been doing is for the fun of it. I'm pretty sure he loves his job. I think you're naive for actually thinking your opinion matters for what he WANTS to do. He can charge that much because people pay for it. and sticking to your roots isn't relevant at all. If it was, you and I would still be sucking our moms tits for milk. I think flaming established artists is childish, they are famous for a reason. What you think is not relevant and the accomplishments speak for itself. Blaming an artist for wanting a bigger fanbase is just stupid, isn't it a challenge to try and get more people to like your music? I'm sorry but everything is you say is off the charts retarded whining with semi-facts dan't prove nothing. He's just doing what he likes/wants and you're blaming him for doing so or being able to do so. If you dislike him that why not learn to deal with that instead of putting this much effort in this endless discussion?

Yes he can charge that much but if it was about the music he wouldn't. It's about the money. The same reason he continues to change his sound. If you haven't noticed Just Be was the last album under the Tiesto sound. Ever since then it's just "what do the masses want to hear".

I noticed you ignored many of my points; thank you for admitting defeat.

No I'm just pretending to be the bigger man and agreeing to disagree.

I don't dance through the breakdowns.. trance tracks are so long in length the rest of the track is enough time for me to dance..

Some people actually feel emotion during breakdowns and enjoy the story side of it.. shock horror I know.. "..but that means we have to wait 2 whole minutes to do some awesome breakdance moves in slow motion to impress everyone on the dancefloor!"

IMO those guys are bigger wankers than the guys with their hands in the air.. fucking showponies.. "look at me dance"

quote:

Originally posted by mfitterer1 Please tell me how you dance through a 2 minute breakdown? After you're done with that tell me how you dance through a whole night of 1.5-2 minute breakdowns chained one after another. There's a reason trance fans are focused on the dj reaching for the lazers. There's also a reason why it's no longer the most popular edm genre.

this has been a very contentious thread and i just wanted to throw in a little anecdote.

the other day i was walking through my college dorm (yes, i am literally a child, deal with it) and heard some trance music blasting from one of the rooms. i went over there and said hi to the guy, hoping to strike up some conversation about electronic music. he was listening to the latest tiesto club life podcast, which was a bit disheartening, but i figured that he might have some other favorites.

"so, what are you into?" i asked him.

"well i love tiesto," he responded.

"anyone else?"

"uh no not really"

"ever hear of, say, paul van dyk?"

"uh no. i really just listen to tiesto"

this is why tijs sucks. he's turned himself into a brand, a rallying point that idiots look to as the consummation of all things "techno". even in his podcasts, the emphasis is never on the tracks he's playing but on the fact that he is the one mixing it. he doesn't bring people into electronic music, he just brings people into his own little gay fan club and keeps them there. it's utterly pathetic

quote:

Originally posted by supersaw abuse this is why tijs sucks. he's turned himself into a brand, a rallying point that idiots look to as the consummation of all things "techno". even in his podcasts, the emphasis is never on the tracks he's playing but on the fact that he is the one mixing it. he doesn't bring people into electronic music, he just brings people into his own little gay fan club and keeps them there. it's utterly pathetic

Sorry, I haven't really followed this thread very closely, but I don't see the connection or the problem here. So what if someone likes Tiesto's music? How is relevant that, if you like Tiesto, you should also have to listen to and like everything in the same/similar genre? I have certain bands/artists in virtually every genre that I like, even though I may not necessarily care for the genre as a whole or the other representative artists. How is that a problem?

BTW, just curious which college you go to (I'm from Michigan myself - MSU, baby!!!)

quote:

Originally posted by cryophonik Sorry, I haven't really followed this thread very closely, but I don't see the connection or the problem here. So what if someone likes Tiesto's music? How is relevant that, if you like Tiesto, you should also have to listen to and like everything in the same/similar genre? I have certain bands/artists in virtually every genre that I like, even though I may not necessarily care for the genre as a whole or the other representative artists. How is that a problem?

there's no requirement that says that just because you like one artist you have to like a bunch of other things like it. i guess for me it's more of a personal frustration than anything else, because i've always been a strong proponent of musical exploration within any genre, and if you tune yourself out to what's out there beyond one artist, it cuts that exploration off at the head

quote:

Originally posted by supersaw abuse this has been a very contentious thread and i just wanted to throw in a little anecdote. the other day i was walking through my college dorm (yes, i am literally a child, deal with it) and heard some trance music blasting from one of the rooms. i went over there and said hi to the guy, hoping to strike up some conversation about electronic music. he was listening to the latest tiesto club life podcast, which was a bit disheartening, but i figured that he might have some other favorites. "so, what are you into?" i asked him. "well i love tiesto," he responded. "anyone else?" "uh no not really" "ever hear of, say, paul van dyk?" "uh no. i really just listen to tiesto" this is why tijs sucks. he's turned himself into a brand, a rallying point that idiots look to as the consummation of all things "techno". even in his podcasts, the emphasis is never on the tracks he's playing but on the fact that he is the one mixing it. he doesn't bring people into electronic music, he just brings people into his own little gay fan club and keeps them there. it's utterly pathetic

This is exactly what I'm talking about.

quote:

Originally posted by cryophonik Sorry, I haven't really followed this thread very closely, but I don't see the connection or the problem here. So what if someone likes Tiesto's music? How is relevant that, if you like Tiesto, you should also have to listen to and like everything in the same/similar genre? I have certain bands/artists in virtually every genre that I like, even though I may not necessarily care for the genre as a whole or the other representative artists. How is that a problem? BTW, just curious which college you go to (I'm from Michigan myself - MSU, baby!!!)

The connection is this. It isn't a personal frustration that he is speaking about (assuming because I think I know what he is saying).

These people like he described above only listen to Tiesto because it was marketed to them. They'd listen to Korn or Jay Z or Kanye West for the same reasons. Not saying they do but they are the fodder the commercial music industry markets their products to. I.e. weak minded objectionable, dumb, non independent. They will eat up whatever is thrown their way. So because Tiesto has the biggest marketing campaign (and a free podcast on iTunes (AVB doesn't or it'd be the same thing with him) people listen to him.

Because these people (or as I like to refer to them "Units") have never heard electronic music before; they naturally think Tiesto is good because he is the first they have heard. They have nothing to compare it to. Because of their personality prototype listed above they settle for listening to his stuff and look up to him like a king instead of further exploring the genre and finding the true talent. Because so many kids are exposed to Tiesto's music it also becomes a fad and he becomes a popular name to listen to (which has nothing to do with his music and everything to do with his image and brand name).

Also you look at his ISOS and Magik compilations and it's very easy for someone who isn't familiar with the rest of the artists and industry to think Tiesto made all of the tracks that he uses. This is done by creatively titling everything in id tags. Tiesto is often listed more prominently than the artist thus making the listener believe he is the creator of the track when in reality he just mixed it.

You take Tiesto's marketing campaign away from him and he isn't even ranked in the top 100 in the dj mag poll. Why do you think he continues to shift his style to more and more commercial sounding music? Because his plan and that of his marketing campaign is to hit all of the people who aren't into edm yet and cross them over (because established fans would never enjoy his music because it takes away from the non commercial vibe he fodders). He puts out music so frequently between his podcast, concerts and albums; people are satisfied with just listening to him and nobody else because they see him in the #3 spot and such great success over time in the polls and they think the music he makes is justified. It's a giant circle.

quote:

Originally posted by supersaw abuse this has been a very contentious thread and i just wanted to throw in a little anecdote. the other day i was walking through my college dorm (yes, i am literally a child, deal with it) and heard some trance music blasting from one of the rooms. i went over there and said hi to the guy, hoping to strike up some conversation about electronic music. he was listening to the latest tiesto club life podcast, which was a bit disheartening, but i figured that he might have some other favorites. "so, what are you into?" i asked him. "well i love tiesto," he responded. "anyone else?" "uh no not really" "ever hear of, say, paul van dyk?" "uh no. i really just listen to tiesto" this is why tijs sucks. he's turned himself into a brand, a rallying point that idiots look to as the consummation of all things "techno". even in his podcasts, the emphasis is never on the tracks he's playing but on the fact that he is the one mixing it. he doesn't bring people into electronic music, he just brings people into his own little gay fan club and keeps them there. it's utterly pathetic

If the guy was actually curious he could have sought out other artists for himself, but the thing is he's just not that into it.
For that guy, Tiesto is perfect for him.

quote:

Originally posted by Storyteller dan't prove nothing.

dan't prove nothing.
dan't prove nothing.
dan't prove nothing.
dan't prove nothing.

quote:

Originally posted by Aesthetic I don't dance through the breakdowns.. trance tracks are so long in length the rest of the track is enough time for me to dance.. Some people actually feel emotion during breakdowns and enjoy the story side of it.. shock horror I know.. "..but that means we have to wait 2 whole minutes to do some awesome breakdance moves in slow motion to impress everyone on the dancefloor!" IMO those guys are bigger wankers than the guys with their hands in the air.. fucking showponies.. "look at me dance"

Haha, uh, I don't think anybody's talking about the b-boys here. I really don't care that people are doing some repetitive shuffle or two-step as long as they're moving. But tripping balls and mashing out and generally being nothing more than a traffic obstruction isn't really acceptable, I mean fuck, you can do that anywhere, you can do that at home.

Look at any video from the old raving days, that was trance music, but people still danced, there was energy, tons of it. You couldn't walk in there and not want to dance. And instead of interminable breakdowns for your "break" you had chillout rooms to hang out in if you were too tired or fucked up. That's a "party" - not hanging around alternating between waving your hands in the air and standing around with your eyes half-closed.

And don't give me some bullcrap line about how it's better in the club because of the "vibe", the vibe is in the motion, it's only better at the club for trance crackers because everybody else is doing the same thing and so you feel like less of a lamewad for it.

How boring wouldnt it be if track never had a break ?

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