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Why, me of course.

So what's ambient then? No beat? I thought that was ambient trance?

Everyone obviously has a slightly different definition for the various forms of ambient music. Obviously some people here think it's justifiable to talk about Ambient House as though it were just ambient, but condemn any mention of ambient "trance".

Personally, I would say that ambient trance is an ongoing break that is characteristic of regular trance tunes. In other words, it doesn't need a beat to be trance, all it needs are the melodic synthesizers and characteristics that define regular trance, but without a driving beat. It's a mistake, however, to think that ambient only constitues soft music. You can combine ambient sounds and moods with driving percussion.

And what's ambient?

Ambient really just means an encompassing atmosphere, environment or feeling. But there are some general rules when it comes to the genre, although the details share virtually no unanimity.

quote:

Originally posted by auranaut And what's ambient?

Go listen to Global Communication - 76:14. Now that's real ambient of the highest quality.

If you listed Blank & Jones as ambient trance you've already lost this argument long ago and should really just give up.

quote:

Originally posted by UWM If you listed Blank & Jones as ambient trance you've already lost this argument long ago and should really just give up.

Blank & Jones primarily make non-ambient trance. I think we all know that. But I should hardly be surprised by your premature criticism, especially since this issue involves me.

I find it hilarious that over 14 pages of near constant argument, nobody has yet agreed with Hydarnes about anything.

Does that surprise you in the least?

Another day, another argument...

quote:

Originally posted by Hydarnes Personally, I would say that ambient trance is an ongoing break that is characteristic of regular trance tunes. In other words, it doesn't need a beat to be trance, all it needs are the melodic synthesizers and characteristics that define regular trance, but without a driving beat.

You are confusing fact with opinion. What you think is WRONG. Ambient trance is NOT what you say it is.

The definition of ambient trance stems from ambient house. I believe you now understand what ambient house is. For the sake of clarity:

"Ambient house music takes the catchy, simple beats of house music, specifically the TR-808 sound, and combines it with warm synth pads." (Wikipedia)

It follows, then that ambient trance takes the beats of TRANCE music and combines it with the characteristics of ambient. This is an accepted definition. If you take the "melodic synthesizers and characteristics that define regular trance, but without a driving beat" you are NOT left with something that is undeniably trance.

Many forms of house and techno are have similar "melodic synthesizers and characteristics". If you strip them of their beats, you are left with something that is not sufficiently distinguishable from trance. Trance is necessarily defined, in part, by its BEAT.

to be honest, wikipedia is no more credible a source than hydarnes himself.

and trance isn't defined by its beat. because it isn't the only genre that has beats. i mean, house could be defined by its beat too. and dnb, and techno, and everything else with a beat. a beat doesn't make it trance. almost every kind of music has a beat.

if you want to know what makes trance trance you have to figure out what every trance track has that other genres don't.

Ambient house is more of a buzzword than anything, as it dates from a time when every new genre was labelled "house", even if it didn't stem from house at all. Ambient house is essentially ambient with very sluggish, dubby beats that aren't really intended to be danced to. The important thing is that these beats are pretty superficial to the track, and are mainly to add to the flow of the track. Ambient house is very much ambient and very little house.

Ambient trance is more or less trance but lacking a beat. It isn't connected with ambient any further than lacking a beat.

quote:

Originally posted by Aiwendil to be honest, wikipedia is no more credible a source than hydarnes himself. and trance isn't defined by its beat. because it isn't the only genre that has beats. i mean, house could be defined by its beat too. and dnb, and techno, and everything else with a beat.

Wikipedia is a nonideal source. I struggle, however, to find suitably credible sites with information on electronic music. But I do believe the definition of ambient house (and ambient trance) is widely accepted. I must say though that trance isn't defined solely by its beat. It's defined in part by its beat. Part of what differentitates trance from house, techno and dnb is the difference in the beats. Not all, but part.

quote:

Originally posted by starglider Part of what differentitates trance from house, techno and dnb is the difference in the beats. Not all, but part.

what the fuck are you talking about

quote:

Originally posted by Aiwendil what the fuck are you talking about

If you were to define trance, how would you do it? Would you not mention the beat?

Anyway. This argument was difficult enough before, but I'm afraid we're making it exponentially worse. It was never my intention to argue what makes trance trance, and I doubt I'm capable of doing it. I've said what I wanted to about ambient, and I'll leave it at that.

i'm asking you, how are all trance beats different from house beats or techno beats.

quote:

Originally posted by Hydarnes Blank & Jones primarily make non-ambient trance. I think we all know that. But I should hardly be surprised by your premature criticism, especially since this issue involves me.

Last time I heard B&J - Desire, I didn't think of it as ambient. I'll give it another listen.

And Hip-Hop is not a genre

B&J - Desire does actually have ambient parts, and a mix of it doesn't have beats at all. Now whether this is ambient trance or just ambient, I won't even bother arguing about.

Have fun.

Woah, another huge Hydarnes vs everyone thread on genres. I must really read this when i get bored.

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