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-- OMG ASOT 250 this Thursday !
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quote:

Originally posted by Purple Read the post above you, this time slowly again. kthanxbye.

I read it, it reads like shit, and as always you've picked on my weight as a way of insulting me. It doesn't even deserve a reply.

kthxdie

Will the PAIR of you quit it, just hit the ignore button on each other, if this childish rubbish carries on, you BOTH will get suspended.

quote:

Originally posted by Ian Actually my first post here was to somebody who gave a very biased pro-bigname dj opinion, which I responded to. The problem is that the moment any of the people who're known to have different tastes post, they're labelled haters, even if their replies are to reply to ignorant comments like those I first replied to from starboy. Carrying on from this, I saw a point wrong from paulandrews who has since corrected what he was saying, it looked wrong, so I proved him wrong. After this, I get bitched at by kids like purple because I dare post in a thread on a free forum where anybody with an opinion has a right to be. Anything thereafter has just been answering accusations & questions placed, to which if myself & others don't post, the place would just end up as a fanboy movement.

I know that most of your (Ian) posts in this forum was just to explain the reason why things are like they are or why the bashers doesnt like asot etc. But if you look at the early posts here you can clearly see that its hate & not just that they dislike the radioprogram. They want to post a comment like that here to get attention from a "fanboy" to later on create another flamed topic. So that they can be labelled haters is correct as i see it because its far from always its because of a fanboy they are replying negative.

quote:

Originally posted by trancedanne i guess the asot haters will cry tonight when they see how many that will listen to asot 250

quote:

Originally posted by Ian Anything thereafter has just been answering accusations & questions placed, to which if myself & others don't post, the place would just end up as a fanboy movement.

oh, you are so sure, you�re so indispensable here? the forum does NOT need you! face it!

and what is wrong about being a fan btw? we all are (i hope) fans of trance (house, techno..) music!

principle of this music is dancing, enjoying it, you won�t stop the process by posting that asot sucks. there are permanently coming newbies with NO idea about how trance sounded in 1998, you can�t do anything with that, you�re no messiah.

quote:

But the way some of them get all mega-defensive at any criticism is hilarious. Hey, they're claiming we all secretly listen to ASOT and just pretend we don't like it cause of jealously! I think we're perfectly entitled to make fun of them when things reach that point.

can't argue with you there man, too many counterexamples in this thread, some people do word their posts in a way that just provokes more people to flame, on both sides of the disagreement.

quote:

Originally posted by Neo95gt you seem to know what you're talking about. So who do you think are the new and exciting upcomming dj's like armin was when everyone liked him?

I remember TA when everyone was all about some armin, so many people had the "sound of goodbye" lyrics in their sigs, and the TA IRC channel(which doesn't exist anymore I think) had for its topic heading "PvD = God, AvB = God in training". Really I don't think such a huge portion of TA will ever get behind a single DJ like the way they did for PvD and Armin back then, these days the forum population is way too diverse (for the better IMHO) for that to happen, but back then we had these characters like starfox who all spread this "OMFG I DIE" stuff and everybody (including myself) really got into it and had a lot of fun filling up the #armind channel every week. The group was a bit smaller and the regulars of that day had these really charismatic ways which got everyone following the music that those kids liked, up until mid 2002 or so. The closest thing I can find to a universally accepted DJ on this site is J00F, but he is hardly upcoming.

Personally I have changed my ways to only do legal downloads. I follow a bunch of netlables and lately have been enjoying alot of "freetekno" which you can find from the sites that are linked off of network23.org. A lot of that music would be classified as "hardcore", and a lot of it sounds so harsh and nasty that one imagines it is done for the purpose of excluding certain kinds of fans. It is mostly ameteur musicians and unknown DJ's. I feel a need to support the people who release music which isn't so legally restricted in this age of DRM and DMCA and TPM and lawsuits against people just because they like trading music with each other. I beleive that these activities should be legal so I listen to artists which allow us to participate in them. I realize that looks like I am mixing my politics with my musical taste too much, but I have found in this catalog of legal music so many exciting new sounds that I hardly miss the side of this music which is much more restricting of my freedoms. I don't beleive that surrendering the control of my computer is necessary for music to survive so I am weaning myself of all the music which aims to do just that with DRM, lawsuits, and trusted computing, which kinda relegates me to freetekno, netlables, ameteurs, academics, livesets, and linux. With all the complaints that music is getting too commercial, it surprises me that more people haven't tried to find this noncommercial category of music freely available online.

To tell you the truth, it has made me spend more money on music that I used to, I truely beleive that trading recordings is good for our scene, makes better informed fans, and helps people find good tunes to buy, but I will only buy from muicians who encourage us do this.

quote:

Originally posted by paulandrews and what is wrong about being a fan btw? we all are (i hope) fans of trance (house, techno..) music!

Just to clarify this

fanboy is different to 'fan'. A fanboy is someone who defends a producer or dj to the death, unable to accept any constructive criticism or anything bad said about their hero. They regularly cause problems because it stops any reasonable debate going on. check threads from 2002/3 against 2005/6 and you'll see what I mean. As you say, we're all fans of the music anyway, but this is kinda a hero worship that nobody deserves imo.

there were MANY fanboys on TA in 2002

quote:

Originally posted by Ian Just to clarify this fanboy is different to 'fan'. A fanboy is someone who defends a producer or dj to the death, unable to accept any constructive criticism or anything bad said about their hero. They regularly cause problems because it stops any reasonable debate going on. check threads from 2002/3 against 2005/6 and you'll see what I mean. As you say, we're all fans of the music anyway, but this is kinda a hero worship that nobody deserves imo.

aah.. true. agree on that one, though i don�t think there are so many fanboys here on TA at the mo. maybe tiestoinmix (everywhere he posts he spoils the topic) or how�s that greek guy called, but that�s all for me. i don�t think the fanboys are the big problem... maybe 4 years back TA was so young there was no space for the "haters" or the "grown up" members.

quote:

Originally posted by Zombie0915 there were MANY fanboys on TA in 2002

yeah, i thought so, and Ian was prolly one of them so maybe that�s the reason why he thinks there were no fanboys.

quote:

Originally posted by Zombie0915 can't argue with you there man, too many counterexamples in this thread, some people do word their posts in a way that just provokes more people to flame, on both sides of the disagreement. I remember TA when everyone was all about some armin, so many people had the "sound of goodbye" lyrics in their sigs, and the TA IRC channel(which doesn't exist anymore I think) had for its topic heading "PvD = God, AvB = God in training". Really I don't think such a huge portion of TA will ever get behind a single DJ like the way they did for PvD and Armin back then, these days the forum population is way too diverse (for the better IMHO) for that to happen, but back then we had these characters like starfox who all spread this "OMFG I DIE" stuff and everybody (including myself) really got into it and had a lot of fun filling up the #armind channel every week. The group was a bit smaller and the regulars of that day had these really charismatic ways which got everyone following the music that those kids liked, up until mid 2002 or so. The closest thing I can find to a universally accepted DJ on this site is J00F, but he is hardly upcoming. Personally I have changed my ways to only do legal downloads. I follow a bunch of netlables and lately have been enjoying alot of "freetekno" which you can find from the sites that are linked off of network23.org. A lot of that music would be classified as "hardcore", and a lot of it sounds so harsh and nasty that one imagines it is done for the purpose of excluding certain kinds of fans. It is mostly ameteur musicians and unknown DJ's. I feel a need to support the people who release music which isn't so legally restricted in this age of DRM and DMCA and TPM and lawsuits against people just because they like trading music with each other. I beleive that these activities should be legal so I listen to artists which allow us to participate in them. I realize that looks like I am mixing my politics with my musical taste too much, but I have found in this catalog of legal music so many exciting new sounds that I hardly miss the side of this music which is much more restricting of my freedoms. I don't beleive that surrendering the control of my computer is necessary for music to survive so I am weaning myself of all the music which aims to do just that with DRM, lawsuits, and trusted computing, which kinda relegates me to freetekno, netlables, ameteurs, academics, livesets, and linux. With all the complaints that music is getting too commercial, it surprises me that more people haven't tried to find this noncommercial category of music freely available online. To tell you the truth, it has made me spend more money on music that I used to, I truely beleive that trading recordings is good for our scene, makes better informed fans, and helps people find good tunes to buy, but I will only buy from muicians who encourage us do this.

Yea seems like people on here like J00F a lot. But like you said, he's not upcomming. I've been listening to him here and there for awhile and always thought he was alrigt....

And I try to stick to livesets, they're usually better anyway. The CD's the dj's produce are usually kinda weak

quote:

Originally posted by Ian Just to clarify this fanboy is different to 'fan'. A fanboy is someone who defends a producer or dj to the death, unable to accept any constructive criticism or anything bad said about their hero. They regularly cause problems because it stops any reasonable debate going on. check threads from 2002/3 against 2005/6 and you'll see what I mean. As you say, we're all fans of the music anyway, but this is kinda a hero worship that nobody deserves imo.

There aren't so many fanboys here ATM. The problem is that some of the earlier registered TA's can't accept ppl still like to listen to Ti�sto or Armin; even without worshipping them. And when they defend that particular Dj once (to say he likes one tune for example); then he gets flamed and imaged as a loser/fanboy... That's what's wrong.

I myself listen to many many dj's; from prog to psy... I give all of them a try; and remember a couple of good tunes. But I still like to listen to Ti�sto & Armin too; so there's absolutely nothing wrong with that. But I don't consider Ian or Rebel9 or Mr. Mystery etc elitists; they know a lot about music, and they don't intend to start a flamewar.
I'm more against users who lets say like Sasha and enter a Tiesto-topic just to make fun of him... These guys are the real pain for TA. (This was a clear hint to someone particular )

quote:

Originally posted by paulandrews yeah, i thought so, and Ian was prolly one of them so maybe that�s the reason why he thinks there were no fanboys.

There was a lot of hope back then, for armin, tiesto, pvd etc. This was before internet radio & lots of labels, almost towards the end of the previous generation of things, and it was a lot nicer. Sure tracks got praise but they also got a lot of criticism, but on the whole it was taken better

quote:

Originally posted by Ian Just to clarify this fanboy is different to 'fan'. A fanboy is someone who defends a producer or dj to the death, unable to accept any constructive criticism or anything bad said about their hero. They regularly cause problems because it stops any reasonable debate going on. check threads from 2002/3 against 2005/6 and you'll see what I mean. As you say, we're all fans of the music anyway, but this is kinda a hero worship that nobody deserves imo.

Ive seen threads on TA from back then...everyone and thier mom was worshiping Tiesto. granted he may have deserved it back then.

quote:

Originally posted by Ian There was a lot of hope back then, for armin, tiesto, pvd etc. This was before internet radio & lots of labels, almost towards the end of the previous generation of things, and it was a lot nicer. Sure tracks got praise but they also got a lot of criticism, but on the whole it was taken better

So you just admitted you don't like anything popular. Outstanding

quote:

Originally posted by RapidFire Ive seen threads on TA from back then...everyone and thier mom was worshiping Tiesto. granted he may have deserved it back then.

yeah. in 2001/2002 Tijs was really on his game. 2003 he kinda dropped down in his standards in a lot of opinions, yet he won #1, which was sad in the fact many of us had gone off him (and he'd had a few problems with ta's ego-wise) which had been reported. Armin was seen as extremely promising, and when he played stuff from hybrid etc too, a lot of us did like him. A lot of the problem I believe is due to internet radio. There's too many similar sets which oversaturate the scene imho, meaning everything seems to get older faster because it's hard to avoid it. People going to see big names can already ID a lot of the stuff before they go, which also takes away the surprise element which I believe is a good thing.

quote:

Originally posted by Push2005 There aren't so many fanboys here ATM. The problem is that some of the earlier registered TA's can't accept ppl still like to listen to Ti�sto or Armin; even without worshipping them. And when they defend that particular Dj once (to say he likes one tune for example); then he gets flamed and imaged as a loser/fanboy... That's what's wrong. I myself listen to many many dj's; from prog to psy... I give all of them a try; and remember a couple of good tunes. But I still like to listen to Ti�sto & Armin too; so there's absolutely nothing wrong with that. But I don't consider Ian or Rebel9 or Mr. Mystery etc elitists; they know a lot about music, and they don't intend to start a flamewar. I'm more against users who lets say like Sasha and enter a Tiesto-topic just to make fun of him... These guys are the real pain for TA. (This was a clear hint to someone particular )

Sasha fans are the last ones which should bash Tiesto fans. Since no other DJ have gone more downhills than him IMO. I rather listen to Armin or Tiesto any day than Sasha. Seriously this electro hype he is pushing is horrible
I'm sure there are loads of fans of it. But those older Sasha fans which remember him as the Sasha which mixed GU009 and GU013 know what I'm talking about when I'm saying "bring back da old Sasha!"

I don't really think people are that much different. There were "trance is dead" topics every week back then just like there are now. There were trolls, stupid coments, fanboys, haters, and all of that just like now. It was a different group of people, but still plenty of drama. Maybe these threads didn't reach ten pages, probably closer to 5 but that was because more of us were on dialup back then.

Things were a bit more carefree as far as mp3s and stuff were concerned, there was a lot more activity on the IRC channels. But those things are more technoogy and legal changes, we are into torrents and DC hubs now it seems, and we don't talk about them in public(but rest assured when you find those places there are a LOT of TA's there)

There was still Ishkur and he was on the same campaign then as he is on now, people said this same shit about dj's and stuff but it was more directed towards oakey and pvd than armin and tiesto. There was a shit ton of drama and arguing in 2002, a lot of people call it "the prog wars". I was 17 when I came here, too young to party in the US, found my way here via napster. Like it or not file sharing made TA what it is today, in 2001 the overwhelming majority of people just came to this site for mp3s. One would go through these threads to find tacklists then search every track over napster or audiogalaxy.

Not much has changed, the crowd is a little bigger, we follow a slightly different set of trends, and we are a bit more careful about our music sharing, that is pretty much it IMHO. We still had ID&T, Radio 1, digitally imported, people even then were able to hear everything that there was to hear.

Also, there were a lot more dirty pictures, we posted lots of sexy women and expensive cars and stuff, remember that?

quote:

Originally posted by Neo95gt So you just admitted you don't like anything popular. Outstanding

I don't see how i did I liked most of what was 'popular' in the late 90s, early 00s, I listened to ASOT early on, but I believe the beginning of the downfall came with the Armada label. It was around that time (even though the first releases were very good in 2003) that the 'trance by numbers' theorum came about, tracks became too similar, then with producers like andy moor, adam white & markus, they became too predictable. You could predict the structure of every track on the first listen. Then pointless vocals began, Atrc, burned with desire etc etc which again pushed me away. I began exploring other genres because I craved new creative music, and it's widened by horizon by doing so, however I do remain skeptical about some things that are about today because I just don't feel the genre i loved anymore.

quote:

Originally posted by RebeL9 Sasha fans are the last ones which should bash Tiesto fans. Since no other DJ have gone more downhills than him IMO. I rather listen to Armin or Tiesto any day than Sasha. Seriously this electro hype he is pushing is horrible I'm sure there are loads of fans of it. But those older Sasha fans which remember him as the Sasha which mixed GU009 and GU013 know what I'm talking about when I'm saying "bring back da old Sasha!"

I've never rated sasha in my life, I always found when he was playing the now 'oldskool' sounds that here were better DJs such as Carl Cox, Top Buzz & other names, some of who don't play now or aren't as well known, others who like cox & sasha moved onto other sounds.

quote:

Originally posted by RebeL9 Sasha fans are the last ones which should bash Tiesto fans. Since no other DJ have gone more downhills than him IMO. I rather listen to Armin or Tiesto any day than Sasha. Seriously this electro hype he is pushing is horrible I'm sure there are loads of fans of it. But those older Sasha fans which remember him as the Sasha which mixed GU009 and GU013 know what I'm talking about when I'm saying "bring back da old Sasha!"

the stuff he spins is quality. the same cant be said about armin and tijs' stuff. they spin pop. he spins slightly more serious dance music..which would be harder to get into for any pure fan of trance. not to mention he knows how to construct a set and mix well unlike Tijs.

sasha is past his prime no doubt but he still puts out quality stuff...armin and tijs do not.

quote:

Originally posted by Ian I don't see how i did I liked most of what was 'popular' in the late 90s, early 00s, I listened to ASOT early on, but I believe the beginning of the downfall came with the Armada label. It was around that time (even though the first releases were very good in 2003) that the 'trance by numbers' theorum came about, tracks became too similar, then with producers like andy moor, adam white & markus, they became too predictable. You could predict the structure of every track on the first listen. Then pointless vocals began, Atrc, burned with desire etc etc which again pushed me away. I began exploring other genres because I craved new creative music, and it's widened by horizon by doing so, however I do remain skeptical about some things that are about today because I just don't feel the genre i loved anymore.

I guess I just dont take this shit as seriously as you do. I just listen to it at the gym and rock out to it at the clubs and I love it all. o well

quote:

Originally posted by RapidFire the stuff he spins is quality. the same cant be said about armin and tijs' stuff. they spin pop. he spins slightly more serious dance music..which would be harder to get into for any pure fan of trance. not to mention he knows how to construct a set and mix well unlike Tijs. sasha is past his prime no doubt but he still puts out quality stuff...armin and tijs do not.

I'm not so sure. I find alot of the stuff Sasha plays just plain boring. But on the other hands that is just not my style. It's just not the kind of music I would dance my feets off to.
As you said Sashas strenght is his mixing and setting up a set which is superior to Tiesto which trainwrecks way too often to be called a top DJ.

quote:

Originally posted by RebeL9 I'm not so sure. I find alot of the stuff Sasha plays just plain boring. But on the other hands that is just not my style. It's just not the kind of music I would dance my feets off to.

different strokes. some people love dancing to the slower funky house/prog stuff and others love less subtle music. myself, I can appreciate both if done right.

On a higher note, ASOT starts in 4 hours :coold:

To bad I'm at work :down:


and whoever knows where my smileys are from gets bonus points

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