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-- paul van dyk "i make music for the clubbers, not the critics"
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haha theres so much shit talking here

Indeed...

quote:

Originally posted by adi_hanson done. bacon sandwiches for breakfast

mmmm a blt sounds good right now

In response to the quote itself:

It shows. Hey, at least he's being honest and admitting that he's making cheese that will get the crowd going, as opposed to acting as though he's underground.

Not only PvD that turned towards a more pop-version of trance, but overall the trance tide is. Tijs and Armin took the same path and produce garbage, however PvD's sets are still decent due to the fact that he still tries to improvise and bring maybe a reworked version of a known track as opposed to Armin that whores around with his promos sent to him by his jockey-friends.

I just re-watched the music video for Forbidden Fruit and it got me thinking about this...

The thing with older Paul van Dyk songs (and older trance really), is how earnest it was. It was really just kinda out there, heart on its sleeve and all that. Those Seven Ways tracks that System J reviewed (I just read your review by the way and great job), are just straight forward and, um, this sounds horrible, "honest" (?) (bleh).

In fact, the whole genre, the whole mood of the scene at the time, etc etc had to be built on that sort of earnestness/honesty. The whole "feel good", euphoria-kinda thing of trance just withers in the face of cynicism. As soon as either the DJ or the audience starts getting cynical, the whole thing falls apart (as it did).

Today, Paul van Dyk just sounds cynical, and this is (I think) what nefardec was getting at--so are we. Saying you make music for the "clubbers" comes off as cynical, because we know it's not really that simple for PvD. Playing "Time of Our Lives" at the end of every set (sidenote: I haven't seen him play live for almost 4 years now, and is he really still playing that???) is just a cynical thing to do. It's allegedly supposed to create this euphoric moment with some guy telling the audience "This is the time of our lives", ie. really spelling it out for the audience on what clubbing is supposed to be I guess, but when you know it's going to be played like clockwork, it's just hollow and (to beat a dead horse) cynical.

quote:

Originally posted by Stasis I just re-watched the music video for Forbidden Fruit and it got me thinking about this... The thing with older Paul van Dyk songs (and older trance really), is how earnest it was. It was really just kinda out there, heart on its sleeve and all that. Those Seven Ways tracks that System J reviewed (I just read your review by the way and great job), are just straight forward and, um, this sounds horrible, "honest" (?) (bleh). In fact, the whole genre, the whole mood of the scene at the time, etc etc had to be built on that sort of earnestness/honesty. The whole "feel good", euphoria-kinda thing of trance just withers in the face of cynicism. As soon as either the DJ or the audience starts getting cynical, the whole thing falls apart (as it did).

"Honest" is actually a good way of describing it. And "feel good" as well. I love the euphoric feeling some of those older tracks create. That's really what I'm after in dance music.

I can enjoy the sounds and atmosphere in the current wave of techno-tech house stuff, or the dark moodiness of deep house, but for me nothing in dance music ever compares to the way that the good old trance and prog tracks intertwined and layered a bunch of melodic elements to create that combination hypnotic-euphoric feeling. [cue remarks about unicorns and lasers]

Most of the tech stuff doesn't do that for me, and a lot of trance today seems "cynical" in comparison to the stuff that preceded it because of the way it has raped the same sounds and song structure for around ten years. Some psy-trance does the hypnotic-euphoric bit for me, but I find a lot of the time in psy the focus is put more on being "trippy" than on actually creating a moving piece of music, which can annoy me depending on my mood.

quote:

Today, Paul van Dyk just sounds cynical, and this is (I think) what nefardec was getting at--so are we.

Your comments about cynicism reminded me of this thread:

http://www.tranceaddict.com/forums/...ance+music+life

Anyway, I don't think that the people who have really embraced the "tech" trends are necessarily "cynical," it's just that they don't want to be (or be seen as) over-earnest rave kiddies who expect their music to provide them with some wonderful sense of togetherness and euphoria and life-altering experience. That's not a "cynical" attitude as much as it is a self-conscious and cautious one. So they go for a more subdued vibe, because that's what suits their personality or attitudes toward partying and socializing. But the kind of earnestness I described seems to be what pervaded a lot of dance music ten to twenty years ago. And of course the drugs, ecstasy and hallucinogens, were probably a big contributor to that vibe.

clubbers are critics.

Of course when anyone brings up the feel-good lovey-dovey vibe, I have to break out the Berliner Trance documentary: [[ LINK REMOVED ]]


Also check out this old UK report on the acid house scene, with footage from some parties: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W4LR1a_l8rw

^ Notice two things in the second video: (1) the totally whacked-out, unrestrained way that almost everybody is dancing (2) "no alcohol on sale."

Didn't know where to post is, maybe a new topic, but anyways:

Who likes livesets might like this Dutch site:

http://www.musicincontrol.nl/index....egory/livesets/

you can conclude from that PvD quote that there apparently are just too many nuthead clubbers who don't have any taste!

the trance scene has become a gigantic inflated marketing bubble ruled by a few superstars earning their arses full of cash on mega events where they pump masses of people into gigantic halls ... the releases are shallow, the music bad, the spirit gone and yet still everybody raving on like it was their last day...

no wonder that I quit this more than six years ago...

quote:

Originally posted by RTP you can conclude from that PvD quote that there apparently are just too many nuthead clubbers who don't have any taste! the trance scene has become a gigantic inflated marketing bubble ruled by a few superstars earning their arses full of cash on mega events where they pump masses of people into gigantic halls ... the releases are shallow, the music bad, the spirit gone and yet still everybody raving on like it was their last day... no wonder that I quit this more than six years ago...

Apparently these clubbers are having a great time and isn't that were it is all about?
Then you also shouldn't go to any pop/rock concert like U2, Rolling Stones etc, because they also earn huge amounts and fill stadions with many people......

quote:

Originally posted by SYSTEM-J How much to do with this issue do those quotes have? They seem very tenuously connected at best to me, certainly not saying anything that you couldn't more succinctly phrase yourself.

but dooooood try reading those quotes after ur smokin weed mannnn

quote:

Originally posted by Trance-MB Apparently these clubbers are having a great time and isn't that were it is all about? Then you also shouldn't go to any pop/rock concert like U2, Rolling Stones etc, because they also earn huge amounts and fill stadions with many people......

Yes, that's a directly comparable situation.

quote:

Originally posted by Mr.Mystery Yes, that's a directly comparable situation.

Indeed. Just like the people in 2 girls 1 cup are clearly enjoying themselves. Isn't that what it's all about?

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