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Originally posted by echosystm If you think audio warping, audio quantising and pitch correction are not useful, you are even more of a retarded noob than I thought.

No, because i'm a real artist who doesn't cut melodies and shit from other peoples music. I use synths and real time audio, not samples. Those things are all fucking useless for me. Pitch correction? Lol. Novelty effects at most. You sound almost as bad as those who boast about having the Soundgoodizer. A novelty FX.

quote:

Originally posted by sixofour.604 Pitch correction? Lol. Novelty effects at most.

oh man, i'm actually starting to like having you on this forum. it's a constant reminder that no matter how bad of a day i'm having, it could always be worse - i could be you. rofl.

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Originally posted by echosystm oh man, i'm actually starting to like having you on this forum. it's a constant reminder that no matter how bad of a day i'm having, it could always be worse - i could be you. rofl.

Its kinda why I like coming here, when my day is bad, i can look and go "atleast I'm not those guys"..only with me, I actually do it, i'm not just saying it to sound snarky.

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Originally posted by sixofour.604 Your exprience doesn't even make you a novice yet. Shut the fuck up lol. I have 11 years exprience with FL...that destroys any kind of qualification you think you might have. I don't have 2 years exprience with cubase, because i'm not an idiot, I tried Cubase for a couple weeks, it didn't work out, so I did the smart thing, I went back to what I know. And yes, Cubase is archaic. Look at the sequencer it has...its from fucking 1988. I know trackers that have an easier to use sequencer. The shit you mentioned, the only thing remotly useful is VST3. and VST3 isn't a "cubase thing", its a format made by stienberg, because the company makes a good instrument format, doesn't mean all their other products are just ducky. I had a dnb beat I made playing while I wrote this post, so its kinda like your getting your ass kicked to a sound track.

11 years experience and still nothing to show. Fuck it must suck to be you! If FL has worked so well for you why'd you ever even attempt to use another daw???

Roffl about arguing over who has more experience with a daw!

quote:

Originally posted by sixofour.604 How is anaylising audio in an anaylser not a proven method to find out if the audio sounds different from ableton than any other DAW? Fucking, did you really just say we have no real way to tell if audio sounds different in ableton??? Fucking HELLO WE HAVE EARS DUMBASS. You can just, you know...fucking listen to the different DAWs and HEAR a difference. If 50 people listen and 45 hear a difference, you don't have to do any tests, the audio sounds different. mfitterer1 is a fucking douche. Fucking people and thir subjective ass mentalities. The world is objective. Things are a certain way, reguardless to who precives it. If a shirt is red, its fucking red, if someone is color blind and doesn't see red, then that means they see it wrong. They are wrong, and broken.

Because every daw has minute differences in their settings. Small differences can cause small audio changes but people have always said there were big audio issues with ableton; which have never been proved. The only thing that has been proved is that each daw is minutely different.

You always know you're backed into a corner when you contradict yourself from sentence to sentence. You say that we have analyzers but then you realized nobody has ever been able to prove any difference with an analyzer so then you take a human element such as the ears and claim that if a lot of people say something it must be true.

Audio is not color so don't even try that analogy.

Thank you for calling me a douche I know that's your only way of admitting defeat. It's pretty fucking simple bro; you can't convince people that something is fact based off of an/many opinions. You need subjective facts. Hence I say again, prove it; or get back on the short bus; bitch!

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Originally posted by mfitterer1 people have always said there were big audio issues with ableton; which have never been proved.

The fact that everyone says there is..is proof that there is. That is the proof--->--->---> "everyone says it sounds different." <---<---<---<--- If everyone says it sounds different, and it does infact sound different, then guess what, it becomes an objective FACT that it sounds different. Infact, you don't even need witnesses, you just have to listen, if something sounds different, then something sounds different.

If I listen to Black Sun Empire - Arrakis, and then I listen to Bruno Fergani - Combined Forces, I can tell they are different songs, because I just listened to them and heard it, I don't need to go into a lab and do hundreds of tests to "prove" they are different...I don't have to do that because i'm not a douche like you who likes to nitpick little issues for no reason at all.

Also, there is no such thing as subjective facts. A subject fact would mean something is a fact based on someones point of view. but facts are objective, that means they are facts without requireing someones point of view. Ableton sounds different by default, YOU have already admited it does because of dithering and warp settings. Your argument is dead, defeated and gone, you agreeed with our side, even further you gave a REASON why ableton sounds different... Why now, are you still saying there is no difference?

quote:

Originally posted by echosystm oh man, i'm actually starting to like having you on this forum. it's a constant reminder that no matter how bad of a day i'm having, it could always be worse - i could be you. rofl.

hahahah, so true

quote:

Originally posted by sixofour.604 Also, there is no such thing as subjective facts. A subject fact would mean something is a fact based on someones point of view. but facts are objective, that means they are facts without requireing someones point of view.

welcome to 2000 years ago Rtard.

you clearly think you are god if you believe you could EVER have ANY conception of objectivity in your miniscule mind.

and lol people who think differently are broken. like Einstein or Galileo?

i seriously hope that you're kind of delusional extremism is exclusive to a very very small group in the world... Otherwise we are all fucked.

sixfour - if you put as much effort into your music as you do your bullshitting you'd be an awesome producer

Meh.

"Subjective Facts" is almost as stupid as "Subjective Logic" Even stupider, people who say Logic is not intuitive.

quote:

Originally posted by sixofour.604 The fact that everyone says there is..is proof that there is. That is the proof--->--->---> "everyone says it sounds different." <---<---<---<--- If everyone says it sounds different, and it does infact sound different, then guess what, it becomes an objective FACT that it sounds different.

If everyone told you shit tasted good would you taste it?

quote:

Originally posted by sixofour.604 The fact that everyone says there is..is proof that there is. That is the proof--->--->---> "everyone says it sounds different." <---<---<---<--- If everyone says it sounds different, and it does infact sound different, then guess what, it becomes an objective FACT that it sounds different. Infact, you don't even need witnesses, you just have to listen, if something sounds different, then something sounds different. If I listen to Black Sun Empire - Arrakis, and then I listen to Bruno Fergani - Combined Forces, I can tell they are different songs, because I just listened to them and heard it, I don't need to go into a lab and do hundreds of tests to "prove" they are different...I don't have to do that because i'm not a douche like you who likes to nitpick little issues for no reason at all. Also, there is no such thing as subjective facts. A subject fact would mean something is a fact based on someones point of view. but facts are objective, that means they are facts without requireing someones point of view. Ableton sounds different by default, YOU have already admited it does because of dithering and warp settings. Your argument is dead, defeated and gone, you agreeed with our side, even further you gave a REASON why ableton sounds different... Why now, are you still saying there is no difference?

Once again good job at attempting to twist my words to your benefit. I said all daw's have differences in sound; not ableton. This subtle difference is therefore unprovable because it exists in EVERY SINGLE FUCKING DAW. That's why I told you to prove it; because it is unprovable.

You love to argue unprovables; and i'll tell you why. In your sick twisted mind you are so unhappy with yourself; the direction of your own life, and your accomplishment/perceived worth to society that you wait around and actually try to find things that are unprovable so that you can engage the other side of the opinion in a supposed match of debate. It's so obvious, anyone can see it. The problem is, you choose things like evolution and daw artifacting as your means of proving your worth; and well, simply...you lose every fight before you even start.

And to support your madness in this situation you speak of "if everyone believes it; well it has to be true". You yourself just got done proclaiming how fucking stupid everyone aside from yourself is; yet then you choose to agree with the deductions these said illegitimate minds came up with? LOL

quote:

Originally posted by sixofour.604 The fact that everyone says there is..is proof that there is. That is the proof--->--->---> "everyone says it sounds different." <---<---<---<--- If everyone says it sounds different, and it does infact sound different, then guess what, it becomes an objective FACT that it sounds different. Infact, you don't even need witnesses, you just have to listen, if something sounds different, then something sounds different.

Everybody believed the Earth was flat. It's not.
Everybody believed the universe revolved around the Earth. It doesn't.
Everybody believes you're an idiot. You ar....ah no wait shit, that one's right.

quote:

Originally posted by mfitterer1 I said all daw's have differences in sound; not ableton.

But all DAWs are not different in sound, only Ableton is. Every single other daw, with the defautl settings will black my original amen break sample EXACTLY the same, to the bit. Ableton however, with all default settings, does not play the sample the same.

You already agreed with me, why are you still arguing?

----

As for everyone bashing me on the "everyone says its true, so it must be" bit.... Why do you believe Antarctica exists? You only know antarctica exists because others have told you it does. Even if you think you have went there, everyone around you could have simply lied, and taken you to alaska. So by your logic, antarctica may or may not exist, because the only evidence you personally have for it, is word of mouth. Yet you accept that antarctica exists simply because everyone says it does. Any video you could have seen could have been detroit on a snowy day. And everyone has the capability to lie. But, judgeing by human nature, its unlikely everyone who has ever mentioned antarctica has lied about its existance. but, nope, you guys don't accept word of mouth, so you can't objectivly say its a fact that antarctica exists.

quote:

Originally posted by sixofour.604 As for everyone bashing me on the "everyone says its true, so it must be" bit.... Why do you believe Antarctica exists? You only know antarctica exists because others have told you it does. Even if you think you have went there, everyone around you could have simply lied, and taken you to alaska. So by your logic, antarctica may or may not exist, because the only evidence you personally have for it, is word of mouth. Yet you accept that antarctica exists simply because everyone says it does.

Yeah, that's exactly the same.

Oh lordy this just gets better

quote:

Originally posted by sixofour.604 As for everyone bashing me on the "everyone says its true, so it must be" bit.... Why do you believe Antarctica exists? You only know antarctica exists because others have told you it does. Even if you think you have went there, everyone around you could have simply lied, and taken you to alaska. So by your logic, antarctica may or may not exist, because the only evidence you personally have for it, is word of mouth. Yet you accept that antarctica exists simply because everyone says it does. Any video you could have seen could have been detroit on a snowy day. And everyone has the capability to lie. But, judgeing by human nature, its unlikely everyone who has ever mentioned antarctica has lied about its existance. but, nope, you guys don't accept word of mouth, so you can't objectivly say its a fact that antarctica exists.

objectivity isn't permanent, that was the point that both myself and fledz made. You can claim to "Know" objective truths (saying we breath oxygen), but the reality of it it can only be relative to the time at which you're saying it (world was believed to be flat, earth the centre of the universe etc), which makes it subjective anyway.

you seem to be confusing empirical research with objective knowledge also.
we never said anything about 'x says y so y is true', we said that so-called objective truths are NOT permanent, making them, by their very nature NOT objective.

quote:

Originally posted by sixofour.604 But all DAWs are not different in sound, only Ableton is. Every single other daw, with the defautl settings will black my original amen break sample EXACTLY the same, to the bit. Ableton however, with all default settings, does not play the sample the same. You already agreed with me, why are you still arguing?

Read this abelton 6 v cubase sx 3.1 test

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Joined: Fri Jan 07, 2005 11:46 pm Posts: 6872 Location: Seattle Ok, I modified the test. This time, I rendered all tracks in my loop as seperate audio files. That way I'd be working with the exact same files in both programs, and no plug ins would be involved. Then, I dragged these audio files into both a new Live Session, and new Cubase Project. All settings were equal and the defaults. Rendered in both apps into 24/44.2 mixdowns. The mixdown were then compared in SX with one tracks polarity reversed again. This time the result was total silence. Nothign showing on inspector either, they cancelled completely. Tried my rewire experiment too, same results, total cancellation when compared to either the SX or Live render. I won't post the files unless someone really wants to hear them No need as there's nothing to hear. Ok, so any sound differences aren't down to the mix bus, so it must just be the fact you need to use warping in Live to work, or maybe Live's plug ins? Hmmm, interesting again...."

What happens is, people dont know how to use a program properly. They dont get the desired results they are looking for, so, of course they blame the program, in this case, Live.
Then they go bitching on any forum that will listen, spreading their shit around cos they suck and it cant be their fault, its Ableton's fault of course!
And thats how you have so much shit floating around on the net about Live's "bad sound"

hopefully you can understand this 604

I've got Live 7 and I'm getting Cubase 5 in about a week. I can replicate that experiment and I bet I'll get the same result. Yet Troll604 will somehow still hear a difference.

i wonder what this forum would be like if thier was only one daw ever made?

quote:

Originally posted by Fledz I've got Live 7 and I'm getting Cubase 5 in about a week. I can replicate that experiment and I bet I'll get the same result. Yet Troll604 will somehow still hear a difference.

but it's literally IMPOSSIBLE for him to hear anything except the truth of the test, since there's no subjectivity... do the test and you will prove that antarctica exists!

The cake is a lie.

quote:

Originally posted by owien i wonder what this forum would be like if thier was only one daw ever made?

Very boring.

We'd all be making music.

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