the statements he made (and thanks for the link, but i did find an orginal too) reflect a complicity, not an orchestration. he is questioning whether the administration allowed it to happen, not engineered the attacks.
There is no difference.
They killed thousands of their own innocent people either way.
It's never been about about if they did it themselves or just had a hand in it, when it boils down they should be persecuted like the rest. They are in their position in the first place to stop these massacres.
Robert Baer the ex CIA agent has a hell of a lot more credentials (20 years) to speak on the matter then someone with some childish avatar of a video game character.
Posted by pkcRAISTLIN on Nov-07-2007 01:30:
quote:
Originally posted by culorut
There is no difference.
i agree, but there is from a specifics point of view. i have only ever contended there werent bombs in the towers. SO much of the conspiracy stuff revolves around that, which is what i debate.
quote:
It's never been about about if they did it themselves or just had a hand in it, when it boils down they should be persecuted like the rest. They are in their position in the first place to stop these massacres.
very true, but nobody is arguing that perpetrators shouldnt be persecuted. we merely disagree on who is responsible.
quote:
Robert Baer the ex CIA agent has a hell of a lot more credentials (20 years) to speak on the matter then someone with some childish avatar of a video game character.
he isnt a video game character, but thanks for trying. yes, he does have more credentials to talk on the matter, yet with all those credentials and experience he hasn't unearthed any actual evidence. im still waiting for him to do so.
Posted by shaolin_Z on Nov-09-2007 22:15:
@ Trancer-X: The 9-11 "truth movement" is full of cointelpro and frindge loonies (David Shayler and James Fetzer come to mind immediately). I don't think it's going anywhere and has already been succesfully sabotaged and marginalized, which is one reason why I stopped wasting my time with this. Alex Jones is another gatekeeper. Technically, 9-11 wasn't an inside job at all... if you want me to explain that one I can do it via PM, most posters here don't have the balls or intellectual sincerity to handle it.
Posted by Trancer-X on Nov-09-2007 23:07:
quote:
Originally posted by shaolin_Z
@ Trancer-X: The 9-11 "truth movement" is full of cointelpro and frindge loonies (David Shayler and James Fetzer come to mind immediately). I don't think it's going anywhere and has already been succesfully sabotaged and marginalized, which is one reason why I stopped wasting my time with this. Alex Jones is another gatekeeper. Technically, 9-11 wasn't an inside job at all... if you want me to explain that one I can do it via PM, most posters here don't have the balls or intellectual sincerity to handle it.
Of course it is. I wouldn't expect anything less from them.
The path to the truth is definitely a lot harder to follow when it's set up to look like a hall of mirrors.
Although I don't want to sound condescending (it's too late for that) but most of the posters here also seem to lack the intellectual curiosity that's required to dig any further than the offical government reports or corporate press clippings - all of which only tell you what they want you to believe.
Posted by pkcRAISTLIN on Nov-10-2007 04:22:
quote:
Originally posted by shaolin_Z
Technically, 9-11 wasn't an inside job at all... if you want me to explain that one I can do it via PM, most posters here don't have the balls or intellectual sincerity to handle it.
oh please. and you wonder why people take issue with your attitude! see, ive never wondered why people have issues with mine
what a bunch of arrogant twaddle. anytime you want to provide me with a "macro" story for the events as they (more or less) unfolded on 9/11 that doesn't reek of naivete or one that makes no sense whatsoever, then im all ears mate Posted by shaolin_Z on Nov-10-2007 04:59:
quote:
Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
oh please. and you wonder why people take issue with your attitude! see, ive never wondered why people have issues with mine
what a bunch of arrogant twaddle. anytime you want to provide me with a "macro" story for the events as they (more or less) unfolded on 9/11 that doesn't reek of naivete or one that makes no sense whatsoever, then im all ears mate
You just love this thread don't you? Posted by Trancer-X on Nov-10-2007 09:52:
thread contributers...
quote:
Originally posted by shaolin_Z
You just love this thread don't you?
Side by side comparisons of controlled demolitions.
Posted by Q5echo on Nov-11-2007 01:44:
quote:
Originally posted by culorut
Side by side comparisons of controlled demolitions.
wow thats sooooo convincing.
if i video taped two guys standing next to each other, and shot one in the head with a pistol and the other had an brain anuerism they'd fall in a similar fashion as well. why? b/c they are two guys just standing there.
in addition, the south tower falling should be obvious to you that it fails at the point of impact. the north tower does the same. coincedence? no.
Posted by Q5echo on Nov-11-2007 01:49:
quote:
Originally posted by culorut
There is no difference.
They killed thousands of their own innocent people either way.
It's never been about about if they did it themselves or just had a hand in it, when it boils down they should be persecuted like the rest. They are in their position in the first place to stop these massacres.
Robert Baer also said "it was al-Qaeda that started it all by switching course and deciding to slaughter civilians in Manhattan and Bali."
Posted by Omega_M on Nov-11-2007 01:51:
quote:
Originally posted by culorut
Side by side comparisons of controlled demolitions.
Compare the footage of the WTC fall with the footage of another sky scrapper falling under "natural circumstances". Then you will be better able to judge whether the fall was "natural" or controlled through demolition.
You assume the WTC fell through a controlled demolition and compare it with another controlled demolition. In this process, you neglect to see the dynamics of how a sky scrapper may fall under "natural circumstances". It may very well fall in a way that is consistent with the WTC fall. Thoughts ?
Posted by eROs.au on Nov-11-2007 03:15:
quote:
Originally posted by Q5echo
wow thats sooooo convincing.
if i video taped two guys standing next to each other, and shot one in the head with a pistol and the other had an brain anuerism they'd fall in a similar fashion as well. why? b/c they are two guys just standing there.
in addition, the south tower falling should be obvious to you that it fails at the point of impact. the north tower does the same. coincedence? no.
Apparently, they planted explosives where they knew the planes would crash.
Posted by Q5echo on Nov-11-2007 04:54:
quote:
Originally posted by eROs.au
Apparently, they planted explosives where they knew the planes would crash.
him and everyone else that has posted that "similar demolitioned buildings" crap should be immediately called out for flagrant failure of basic cognitive reasoning skills. IOW just not that smart.
why anyone with half a brain would use that as a basis for 9/11 conspiracies is beyond me.
please world, give us intelligent sheople to debate this crap for once.Posted by pkcRAISTLIN on Nov-11-2007 05:19:
the dumbest thing about that video is that the collapses are not at all alike. they are completely different failures.
the biggest force in a controlled demolition? GRAVITY. this is why those demolitions in the video show the buildings collapsing from the bottom up. the collapses of WTCs 1&2 occurred top => down, the complete opposite of a CD. the floors above the impact broke off in a chunk and road the floors below it all the way down.
in a building that was designed with most of its supporting steel in the outside VERTICAL frame of the building, NOT in a grid design horizontally i still don't understand why some people find this possibility so hard to entertain? especially the really fantastic notions that they accept with little or no skepticism.
Posted by Omega_M on Nov-13-2007 20:38:
This is how you do a real controlled demolition. With fire works and all...and in the night.
Now compare this with the fall of the twin towers.
Posted by culorut on Nov-14-2007 01:47:
I sense hostility in the very few which are left who still believe in the bullshit official story.
Either this or they finally bothered to look at the present poll results.
Posted by pkcRAISTLIN on Nov-14-2007 01:54:
quote:
Originally posted by culorut
Either this or they finally bothered to look at the present poll results.
you still haven't explained why you care what a poll on TA says?
perhaps you should submit it as evidence to the US government to get a new investigation happening? Posted by culorut on Nov-14-2007 02:19:
quote:
Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
you still haven't explained why you care what a poll on TA says?
perhaps you should submit it as evidence to the US government to get a new investigation happening?
Find a poll which shows otherwise then. Wait I asked this ages ago and none of you have never produced one.
Yes you are a huge minority just like this poll shows here in TA.
Posted by pkcRAISTLIN on Nov-14-2007 02:24:
quote:
Originally posted by culorut
Find a poll which shows otherwise then. Wait I asked this ages ago and none of you have never produced one.
Yes you are a huge minority just like this poll shows here in TA.
you're still not getting the point. i don't care what any poll says. the only pre-requisite for voting in this poll is the ability to use the internet. so why would i (or anyone else, including yourself) give two shits what the poll says?
the only people that produce these polls are the 911 troofers, none of the rest of us care.
even if we were a "huge minority" (you simply do not have ANY evidence to suggest that, try taking a quantitative research methods course ) then im still not caring. most of the people in the world are absolute cretins and their responses to a poll such as this mean absolutely zero.
but hey, it sure must keep your spirits up whilst you search frantically for a scientifically-validated study that supports your crazy ideas. good hunting internet detective! Posted by culorut on Nov-14-2007 02:47:
quote:
most of the people in the world are absolute cretins and their responses to a poll such as this mean absolutely zero.
Maybe it's just you that's not as bright as everyone else on this planet. Ever stop and think of that one jimbo?
I can see why you are so upset though, I spent some time reading back into this thread and you where awarded for a paper you wrote on 9/11 in school. It must suck knowing that you based your paper on lies and now you have to face the music.
Posted by Krypton on Nov-14-2007 02:53:
quote:
Originally posted by culorut
Maybe it's just you that's not as bright as everyone else on this planet. Ever stop and think of that one jimbo?
I can see why you are so upset though, I spent some time reading back into this thread and you where awarded for a paper you wrote on 9/11 in school. It must suck knowing that you based your paper on lies and now you have to face the music.
Where is the verifiable, falsifiable, undeniable evidence? I'm dying to know whether the conspiracy is true..
The towers appear to begin their collapse in the area where the fires were burning. If there was a controlled demolition, the buildings would have fallen from the bottom up.
Didn't bin Laden claim responsibility anyways? Why would the US government team up with bin Laden to blow it's own economic heart up..??
Posted by pkcRAISTLIN on Nov-14-2007 04:18:
quote:
Originally posted by culorut
Maybe it's just you that's not as bright as everyone else on this planet. Ever stop and think of that one jimbo?
haha, not even for a second.
quote:
I can see why you are so upset though, I spent some time reading back into this thread and you where awarded for a paper you wrote on 9/11 in school. It must suck knowing that you based your paper on lies and now you have to face the music.
you've misunderstood something; i did hons in terrorism & modern conflict, i didn't write a paper on 9/11 because i was already part through my thesis before the attacks the guy i shared the polsci study with was doing a paper on islamic extremism at the time, and had to re-write much of his paper unlucky.
i only cared about 9/11 from the standpoint i do now since i started watching the conspiracy videos, which whilst appearing amateurish, also made seemingly strong arguments.
but after seeing the way in which the troofers love to twist and bend quotes or evidence, it became painfully clear that most of the "accepted" 9/11 theories are not supported by the evidence, and create far more questions/problems than they answer.
i only care about 9/11 (in this context) because of all the nonsense people like you carry on with, and the blatant bias with which you approach your "truth finding". perhaps if you had received more formal education you might appreciate the difference between say, a bunch of teenagers with video software, and those that are acknowledged by their peers for their contribution to science.
Posted by staticblue on Nov-14-2007 10:32:
Re: Do you believe there is a U.S. government cover-up surrounding 9/11?
quote:
Originally posted by ogvh5150
Yes or No
yes.
Posted by XaNaX on Nov-14-2007 16:11:
quote:
Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
i still don't understand why some people find this possibility so hard to entertain? especially the really fantastic notions that they accept with little or no skepticism.
Because some people have put so much stock into their conspiracy theories that they stick by them even in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary thinking that they will somehow save face by not having to say "I was wrong". But in reality all it does is make them look even more clueless.
Posted by colonelcrisp on Nov-14-2007 16:42:
quote:
Originally posted by culorut
I sense hostility in the very few which are left who still believe in the bullshit official story.
Either this or they finally bothered to look at the present poll results.
see, ive never wondered why people have issues with mine 
unlucky.