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-- Lowlife MP3 illegal downloaders!!!!
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Originally posted by smoorhs maybe if you would send out more copies people would not have to download! it's not the filesharers fault you make this great fucking track and they become obsessed with it.

some tracks r released like 3 month after u hear it on ASOT or live in a set..who wants to wait all that..look at second sun- the spell its almost too fucken years already..all those cryin about downloading...i bet if downloading absolutely stopped for a year or two u will be begging for it again..andy bagg to tell u the truth if there was no downloading i bet u not a single person in the US or canada would no who u r or ur label..meaning alot less sales..i gurantee you will not survive much without the internet.

Andy's right, the rights belong to him and genix. Rip groups need to go and they know who they are, it's time we got rid of them. They are flooding the scene with every promo on earth. My question always was how the people who rip the tracks sleep at night, I mean you are techincally doing something illegal. Yes filesharing is inevitable and yes I would not be heavily in the EDM scene without mp3's but they served their purpose and outlived it long ago. MP3's might be the future but I'm sick of artists having their stuff leaked on the net, they pay for it, they should get to control it. People can always say get it cheap and I'll buy, that's an lame excuse imo. Speaking as someone who gets promos, I respect the artists and labels who make and put out the stuff. It's their stuff, they effectively own it and you can cry all you want about how's it is unfair but that's true. I will say that compilations are getting better now, well some are at least. If an artist trusts you not to leak it out, then you respect that. I've always thought that some A list dj rips tracks and I still think of that to a degree because so many leaks are happening and I reckon it's an A list dj or their manager. The scene will die, if you people don't support it, buy CDs, buy vinyls and go see gigs. It's the rip groups fault about new promo albums coming out with this is a (insert label name here) promo all over hte songs. Which is a disgrace, I rather hear the full thing but I understand that labels have to resort to this now because of lamers in the scene, it's sad how mp3's have degenerated into what they are now.

quote:

Originally posted by Subey A long, well thought-out post

Word! That was the best post on the mp3 issue that i have ever read to date. Not only did you discuss the current situation, but you also suggested a SOLUTION to the problem - a solution that i whole-heartedly agree with.

Kudos to you!

this is the most sensible thread ever. i am amazed there arent any flaming on any of the 15 pages!

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Originally posted by extepan this is the most sensible thread ever. i am amazed there arent any flaming on any of the 15 pages!

15 pages? lol. Time to make the switch man.

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Originally posted by bagguley In response to the point about the money.. this is not about the artist who made the track... they are not putting �100's into pressing / mastering / promoting etc etc.. it's us.. the small record labels who do it. Andy

I don't know what exactly you tried to say here but if I understood you right you're just as bad as robber barron. Artists who made the track spent thousands of dollars on equipment, thousands of hours on mastering the equipment and producing the track, and you're the poor soul who got cut out of your profits? Hey, I hear you - you don't make money, artist doesn't make money... it's all understood. But at the same time to say that you're out of money and imply that artist isn't is just ignorant.

Dude, I have invested over $20,000 into my studio and have yet to see a dime from it. I don't have any expectation of making a penny from my music and that's why it wouldn't bother me if someone took my track and distributed it.

I personaly favor the concept of tipping for music. If people like my tunes and decide to pay for it - great. I don't expect to make a living making music. If you or anyone else for that matter enters this highly-competitive arena with an expectation to become a sensation, another Paul Van Dyk or Oakie or whatnot, they need a serious reality check.

You chose this work to make your living knowing damn well that you're not exempt from all the risks the big boys face. They only have deeper pockets and can sustain a lot more damage.

Sorry if I sound like an ass but that's my opinion.

quote:

Originally posted by Frase The fact of the matter is that if it werent for the labels you wouldnt hear the tunes today. They provide the medium it comes out on. Do yourself a favour, do a little more research into the logistics and come back and present your opinion with some common sense and some intelligence. Because you lack both currently.

Medium? So labels are the ways for me to get my music burned on to a CD? What about slapping the label on the CD, who do I need to use for that?

quote:

My question always was how the people who rip the tracks sleep at night, I mean you are techincally doing something illegal.

don't be pathetic... do you or have you ever downloaded an illegal mp3? (unless you live on south pole, i'm pretty sure about your answer). now, do you sleep good at night?

the rip groups are not to blame. they always were and always will be, and nobody can do a single fucking thing about that in the nearest future. a label that blames rip groups is the one which cannot adjust its business processes and finds it easier to blame for its losses on someone else.

Yesssss!

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Originally posted by BigTongue I've been a member on tranceaddict since day one... i remember before they even had a forum here this site was just a small mp3 site, offering trance tracks... I find it Ironic mp3 bashers are trying to spread the word about anti mp3, and promoting their record label, on a site that for over a year dealt with pretty much just mp3 downloads....

THANK YOU!!!!

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Lowlife MP3 illegal downloaders!!!!

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Originally posted by nrjizer There's not always a free listen. Maybe for you, in London, which was pretty much ground zero when this whole rave thing started. You've got Radio 1, and probably no shortage of vinyl shops. It's ignorant to assume that everyone has some legal means to preview a track before they buy it. There hasn't been a CD store with a listening post around here for at least 10 years. Not to mention their selection consists of 95% dime-a-dozen protools compiliations and recycled Ibiza anthem CDs. EDM got zero radio and TV exposure. There wasn't a vinyl shop anywhere close - I didn't even own a turntable.

I'm sorry to say this, but where do you live ? (Just a joke) I take your point that facilities are not the same everywhere but now you do have the option of hearing a tune before you decide to buy it.

MP3 is now the driving force in internet development. The internet advances around content on the net. It's simply another medium for entertainment.

Re: Everyone has missed the point...

quote:

Originally posted by Subey The issue here for a lot of people isn't that filesharing is free. We are not idiots. We like the music, and we want to support the people who make it. The issue is access. Look say people are raving about song X. How do I get to hear it? Well I can try and track it down in a liveset. Scan the liveset for wherever the song is located and then listen to it. If I want to listen to it again because it was interesting, then I have to hunt around for the start of it etc. Now let's assume after a couple of listens I decide that this song is worthy of ownership. I WANT TO GIVE YOU MONEY. What can I do? Option 1: Wait X months for it to appear on vinyl. Option 2: Wait X months for it to appear on a cd compilation. Yes in 1510-1995 a compilation or vinyl was a legitimate way of distributing music BUT I hate to break it to all you vinyl/cd lovers out there... PHYSICAL DISTRIBUTION OF MUSIC SUCKS! If I want a cd then honestly I can handle the 50 cents and 2 minutes it takes to make one on my computer... Its the age of bits and bytes, and as filesharing so obviously proves INTERNET DISTRIBUTION is the ONLY option. ANY, I repeat ANY attempt to compete with Internet Distribution with some form of PHYSICAL distribution is ludicrous. If you don't agree with that then get out of the thread, cause that very fact is the reason this thread exists! *** If you want my business. And i'm very willing to spend a couple hundred bucks a year on music then this is one suggestion as to how to get it. 1) You offer every song immediately for FREE in 96kps format... the second its released on promo. If people are talking about a song, then there is absolutely no reason why I should have to find it in a live set, or wait till the next episode of ASOT is on in the hopes its played. That's dinosaur thinking. You have a song that is supposed to be good, then let me listen to it without any hassles. There is no reason why I should have to jump through any hoops to try your product. 2) You offer every song immediately for a FAIR PRICE in a high bit rate (pop songs go for .99 cents as a comparison) the second its released on promo. Again, why should I have to wait any time to give you money once your music is out there? How do I benefit by being forced to only hear your music on the radio? Or by being forced to wait 6 months and buy it with 9 other songs I could care less about. That's dinosaur logic. I've tasted your product. I like what I've tasted so let me buy the damned thing. 3) You do 1 and 2 at one convenient website where I don't have to worry about hunting around between different labels trying to figure out who is offering the song and who isn't. *** That's the only logical solution. Your competing with ACCESS and PRICE. Physical distribution will NEVER compete with access so its pointless to look for solutions there, and by definition physical distribution costs more than digital so its a lose lose proposition. Ignore that logic at your own peril...

It comes down to the old point.....

I want a Ford Mustang GT40 but i have to wait 3-6 months before its released in the UK.

So because i dont want to wait, im going to go out and steal the nearest one i can find.

See, your theory works on paper, but the majority of people are impatient. Their has to promotion of the track and hype. Hence the delay in hearing it to it being available to purchase.

The problem here ISNT the labels, its the mp3 groups who think the whole scene revolves around them, with their so called 'releases' thinking that themselves are their own record label.

When people realise that the problem lies not with the record labels, but with the filesharing & release groups then maybe people will start to agree more and work with labels.

Once this problem goes you might see a change in the way music is released by labels, maybe even quicker release dates from when you hear this. But this is down to DJ's overkilling the track more to the label itself handing out the promos

Re: Re: Everyone has missed the point...

quote:

Originally posted by Frase I want a Ford Mustang GT40 but i have to wait 3-6 months before its released in the UK. So because i dont want to wait, im going to go out and steal the nearest one i can find.

Lol
i made the same analogy but with an E class AMG merc a few pages back

Re: Re: Everyone has missed the point...

quote:

Originally posted by Frase It comes down to the old point..... I want a Ford Mustang GT40 but i have to wait 3-6 months before its released in the UK.

There is no such vehicle as a Ford Mustang GT40. There are the original Ford GT40 Race Cars (The 289 powered Mark I, 427 powered Mark II and the 427 powered Mark IV with extensive body modifications), the original GT40 Road Cars (the 289 powered Mark III) and the soon to be produced Ford GT powered by a blown 5.4L DOHC version of Fords modular V8.

The Mustang has nothing to do with the GT40. The only time GT40 is used in reference to a Mustang is when you talk about a specific type of aftermarket cast iron cylinder heads for five-oh powered Fox Body ('79-93) Mustangs called well... GT40 cylinder heads.

quote:

Originally posted by tranceaholic you could look at it as a good thing tooo... look how many people have in the post by nell in his screen shot..i am sure some of em are leechers and some of em are djs who would by the vinyl and recommend it to others, where if it wasnt spread nobody will know it and hence buy it. take me for example, i hear the track from the hub and i go oh cool, this track would be good in a gig or whatever and buy it. but if it wasnt for the hub, how the hell will i know about it? if it is a quality track you shouldnt have anything to worry about..if it is crap and u dont want people to know then thats another story.

a dj, friend of mine does just that. I usually get him the promo's in mp3 he plays them for a while and then buys the vinyl when its finally out. some he doesn't because he simply didn't like them but if you think about its those that he wouldn't have bought in the first place. I agree that not everyone is as responsible but there are a lot of dj's out there like him. maybe its not exactly legal but in my opinion it is ethical. the only benefit he gets is to experiment with tracks before he could buy them.

Re: Re: Re: Everyone has missed the point...

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Originally posted by bruddahmanmatt There is no such vehicle as a Ford Mustang GT40. There are the original Ford GT40 Race Cars (The 289 powered Mark I, 427 powered Mark II and the 427 powered Mark IV with extensive body modifications), the original GT40 Road Cars (the 289 powered Mark III) and the soon to be produced Ford GT powered by a blown 5.4L DOHC version of Fords modular V8. The Mustang has nothing to do with the GT40. The only time GT40 is used in reference to a Mustang is when you talk about a specific type of aftermarket cast iron cylinder heads for five-oh powered Fox Body ('79-93) Mustangs called well... GT40 cylinder heads.

FFS Ok Smart Arse, I was using the car as an example. Apologies for adding the word mustang.

oh this also goes for the movies too..

movies premiere in cinema's in the US a month before the rest of the world can watch them. whats the effect of this? piracy!

here you get bombarded with movie trailers and "the making of" shows for months before you can finally go see for yourself while at the same time people in another part of the world can enjoy them.

then you see the studios wondering how their movie got on the internet the day after its premiere. I'd rather go pay 5 quid and watch the damn thing than wait 3 days to get it downloaded at a mediocre quality but guess what? I am not given the option to pay for it.

right or wrong.. this is how things are.

With a weekly radio show on Ministry of Sound, All A&B have to do is play thier promos on the air to get recognition by the general public. They ask for emails while they are on so that they can get opinion about what they are playing. I see no better position to be in to promote your own stuff...

I do not like to fileshare,
I will not download any pair,
I do not like green eggs and ham,
I do not like them,
Sam I am.

*bows*

Fank you, fank you!!!

are you f*cking kidding me?

Are you f*cking kidding me. You couldn't afford to buy this much exposure unless you were one of the larger labels. Now, your getting it for free.

Nothing lasts for ever. The business model the recording industry has used for the last hundred years is extinct. Accept it. As a business owner, you now have to find ways to take advantage of what is happening.

Re: Re: Re: Everyone has missed the point...

quote:

Originally posted by bruddahmanmatt There is no such vehicle as a Ford Mustang GT40. There are the original Ford GT40 Race Cars (The 289 powered Mark I, 427 powered Mark II and the 427 powered Mark IV with extensive body modifications), the original GT40 Road Cars (the 289 powered Mark III) and the soon to be produced Ford GT powered by a blown 5.4L DOHC version of Fords modular V8. The Mustang has nothing to do with the GT40. The only time GT40 is used in reference to a Mustang is when you talk about a specific type of aftermarket cast iron cylinder heads for five-oh powered Fox Body ('79-93) Mustangs called well... GT40 cylinder heads.

speaking of cars...

i just purchased a 1967 Ford Mustang Fastback 289 A-Code with original recently rebuilt engine...

still has owners manual and service books... and its RUST free!

w00t


carry on

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Simcut

Forgot to mention before, you must remember that not all "mp3 downloaders" have no intentions of buying the song(s) on vinyl.

I agree with Simcut. Depending on the part of the world you live some people have access to most new tunes with lots of clubs and a multitude of vinyl stores and to pick and choose which ones to buy after lots of airing. Down here in Oz, we don't have that luxury. In Sydney only one radio station plays Trance and then only three hours a week. Only two stores in Sydney stock decent Trance vinyls and you have to be there at "sparrows fart" to grab what you can before they sell out of some records. For me, since around 1999-2000, the net and mp3s have been a godsend in allowing me to listen and choose what I buy from mainly online stores. I bought around 100 vinyl each year and all were bought only after listening to an mp3. The last twelve months or so has seen a crackdown on mp3 sharing and sent lots of ftp owners running for cover. Personally I have found it extremely difficult to find upfront mp3s for some time now. Interestingly, this year I have bought only 12 records as opposed to last year's 93. I'm a bedroom DJ and I just won't spend my hard earned on records on speck and potentially throw them in a crate forever after only playing them once if I don't like them. I'm not saying that this justifies file sharing but for me it's a kind of free advertising for the copyright owner who eventually gets a benefit if I take up the offer. And I've done that lots since 1999. I figure around $8,000 worth easily. And I don't need a 192 kbps mp3 version either. I bought so many Airbase tunes after listening to lo-fi samples. Maybe lo-fi mp3s could be an option. Anyways, since Christmas I have spent only 200 bux plus postage on vinyl and play my oldies more and more (kinda nice). But there has to be a message there somewhere. Oh yeah, I'm on a mission to buy every record from Oakey's '99 Essential Mix from Space Ibiza and I only got to hear this from an mp3. I know stealing mp3s is illegal but if anyone has done anything as trivial as copying a magazine on the company photocopier I don't believe it's fair for them to criticize anyone else duplicating copyrighted material.

Happy belated birthday Cameron you bastard!

and hello Mike mate :-)

Re: Re: Everyone has missed the point...

quote:

Originally posted by Frase It comes down to the old point..... I want a Ford Mustang GT40 but i have to wait 3-6 months before its released in the UK. So because i dont want to wait, im going to go out and steal the nearest one i can find. See, your theory works on paper, but the majority of people are impatient. Their has to promotion of the track and hype. Hence the delay in hearing it to it being available to purchase. The problem here ISNT the labels, its the mp3 groups who think the whole scene revolves around them, with their so called 'releases' thinking that themselves are their own record label. When people realise that the problem lies not with the record labels, but with the filesharing & release groups then maybe people will start to agree more and work with labels. Once this problem goes you might see a change in the way music is released by labels, maybe even quicker release dates from when you hear this. But this is down to DJ's overkilling the track more to the label itself handing out the promos

dude ur car analogy sucks..first of all if the car isnt out yet then almost nobody will have it so how can u " steal it "..or do they send out car promos now..u cant compare stealing a car to downloading an mp3..if it was easy to steal cars as it is to download a track there would be a hell of alot of stolen cars..it is not a matter of integrity it is a matter of convinience.

quote:

Originally posted by keithos27 Aren't there legal consequences for braodcasting/playing music you do not legally own as a DJ? -Keith

Not really...see.... radio stations, TV stations, clubs etc, are paying royalties to MPRS, so DJs can play any track there.

Regards

Yiannis
Kuffdam and Plant

quote:

Aren't there legal consequences for braodcasting/playing music you do not legally own as a DJ? -Keith

Yes there are.
Places like clubs, bars and radio etc all pay a licence.
One of the terms of this licence is you are not allowed to play illegal material or material you do not own a legitimate copy of. Many dj contracts also state this.
not to mention random checks. In the uk , the PRS (performing rights society) make random checks on your discs- happened to me most recently last thursday.
promo cds and cdrs sent to you are still copyrighted and have the same legal implications

You know on your records it says ' not for unauthorised public performance/broadcast etc'? Thats covered by the licence, as well as loads of other things which give you the right of authorised public performance in that licensed venue.

quote:

Originally posted by Radagast So much for doing it for the sake of art. All he cares about are the dollar signs.

Well.... I'd gladly produce just for the ..fun of it and for the sake of art...but unfortunately....Steinberg, Propellerheads, Native Instruments, Korg, Roland, Novation and some companies more.... wouldn't see my points and..charged us for our hard and software!

If you think we are getting rich by this...forget it! We are just braking eaven....we do this in our free time, and trust me when I say, we do it, just because we love producing...nothing more than that!

respects

Yiannis

Kuffdam and Plant

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