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Posted by Floorfiller on Sep-23-2004 03:13:

quote:
Originally posted by Laushinameee
stop switching the subject... filesharing, djing, filesharing... make up your mind.

I made a comment about max graham dj career. Dont respond with some nonsense about filesharing.

And for the record you dont have to be 21 to get into our clubs. And ive been going to them since i was 14.

you seem to have a really short term memory...the two are connected in the discussion...maybe you should start over and reread...

Posted by trancebrat on Sep-23-2004 03:14:

Posted by Tranz on Sep-23-2004 03:14:

quote:
Originally posted by tribu
Youre not serious are you? Whats wrong with bypassing labels and paying the artist directly for their music? with the proliferation of digital music, this seems like a nice alternative.

I know its not currently a reality, but i ask, why not?

I don't know how old you are, or what you know about business, but giving some teenagers access to your newest music, on the internet... is like pissing into the wind. It's not going to work. It's bad enough, when producers give music to a couple close friends in the business, it always winds up getting into the wrong hands. I mean.... think of the life cycle of an mp3. The same day a track could be ripped into an mp3, it could be downloaded thousands of times, within a 24 hr period. It spreads like cancer. Mp3's can be helpful to artists trying to gain recognition, but financially, they can hurt established artists much more. I'm done with this thread... it could go on for days.

Posted by Laushinameee on Sep-23-2004 03:15:

quote:
Originally posted by trancebrat
hahaha! I just noticed that he's only 19! WTF am I even arguing with him for?

if im so young and stupid then why arent you 'owning' me 'hard'. I suspect that I have been listening to and interested in dance music for a lot longer than you. My age has no bearing on this. I can just tell from your attitude that you arent quite clued up as much as you pretend to be.

I cant believe you are even bringing age into this to try and belittle my opinion. Are we forgetting who comes from the country that makes you wait til 21 to get into clubs?

Posted by Floorfiller on Sep-23-2004 03:15:

quote:
Originally posted by trancebrat
hahaha! I just noticed that he's only 19! WTF am I even arguing with him for?

yeah...same here...i got a test tomorrow...i'm done wasting my time here.

Posted by tribu on Sep-23-2004 03:16:

quote:
Originally posted by Wilko
Without labels there is no professional promotion.
People actually buy and own vinyl, which the producer would never be able to fund.

Two reasons why.

Is there a need for professional promotion? Handing out 1 minute samples of your track sounds like decent promotion to me, as well as the current standard of promo cd-rs and top billed DJ's dropping your tune. Now in Max Graham's case, I didnt know he owned a label and thus it wouldnt make much sense, as hed be abandoning his work. But are labels really necessary?

Ok, labels are necessary, but only when youre mass-producing your music in a format like vinyl. But if you're an entry level artist would you rather have your money for your music come to you as a percentage of what the label will make off of you (assuming your song sells well), or come directly to you from your fans. Im probably the odd one out (big suprise there), but Id choose the latter whenever possible.

Posted by Radagast on Sep-23-2004 03:16:

quote:
Originally posted by Floorfiller
it may be...but is there not a difference?

example:

some kid sitting at home smoking weed...some kid out selling it to others. both may be illegal, but who do we care more about? the dealer...

We care about the kid at home, it's just that the task of finding and stopping him and everyone like him is impossible. There are certain things that can and can't be done to search for these people aside from the fact that the task would be insurmountable.

By your logic, it's okay for people to download child porn as long as they use it for personal reasons...

Posted by Laushinameee on Sep-23-2004 03:16:

quote:
Originally posted by Floorfiller
you seem to have a really short term memory...the two are connected in the discussion...maybe you should start over and reread...

filesharing has nothing to do with the comment i made.

Max Graham dj career has gone down the toilet in the UK. This is what I think. Now you can say what you think. Why would you start to type something about filesharing to answer this? I have no idea.

Posted by tribu on Sep-23-2004 03:20:

quote:
Originally posted by Tranz
I don't know how old you are, or what you know about business, but giving some teenagers access to your newest music, on the internet... is like pissing into the wind. It's not going to work. It's bad enough, when producers give music to a couple close friends in the business, it always winds up getting into the wrong hands. I mean.... think of the life cycle of an mp3. The same day a track could be ripped into an mp3, it could be downloaded thousands of times, within a 24 hr period. It spreads like cancer. Mp3's can be helpful to artists trying to gain recognition, but financially, they can hurt established artists much more. I'm done with this thread... it could go on for days.

Im 22, and I know a decent chunk. I know Mp3 proliferation is a problem. I know the quick, widespread effects it can have. But the current system doesnt seem to be working any better. I was just wondering about alternatives. You have sufficiently crushed my hope...

Posted by Wilko on Sep-23-2004 03:20:

quote:
Originally posted by tribu
Is there a need for professional promotion? Handing out 1 minute samples of your track sounds like decent promotion to me, as well as the current standard of promo cd-rs and top billed DJ's dropping your tune. Now in Max Graham's case, I didnt know he owned a label and thus it wouldnt make much sense, as hed be abandoning his work. But are labels really necessary?

Ok, labels are necessary, but only when youre mass-producing your music in a format like vinyl. But if you're an entry level artist would you rather have your money for your music come to you as a percentage of what the label will make off of you (assuming your song sells well), or come directly to you from your fans. Im probably the odd one out (big suprise there), but Id choose the latter whenever possible.

Professional promotion in my history is essential, so in my point of view, there's not much more i really need to say on the matter, because my personal opinion is just that. It's essential!

For most entry level artists and big artists alike, it isn't about the money. But again, that is something that can be argued till the sun goes down. And once again, is off topic for this thread.

Posted by tranceaholic on Sep-23-2004 03:21:

Posted by Swamper on Sep-23-2004 03:22:

Wow, no respect these days. Some of you are actually bitching at Max because he found out about the thread/mix himself? WTF are you smoking?

The problem these days is not so much MP3 but more so the attitude that some people have that they have a right to have EVERYTHING for free no matter who it affects.

(Insert commas as appropriate.)

Posted by Radagast on Sep-23-2004 03:27:

quote:
Originally posted by Swamper
Wow, no respect these days. Some of you are actually bitching at Max because he found out about the thread/mix himself? WTF are you smoking?

The problem these days is not so much MP3 but more so the attitude that some people have that they have a right to have EVERYTHING for free no matter who it affects.

(Insert commas as appropriate.)

You're correct on both accounts. I have no respect for someone who complains about something they did while knowing the consequences of their actions while having had the power to prevent said consequences before they ever occurred. Max well knew that this could have happened before he gave out his unreleased track. He also had the power to keep the track to himself and prevent the track from being illegaly distributed.

And that is a problem. One that banning and complaining won't solve.

Posted by Dmatrox on Sep-23-2004 03:27:

Posted by trancebrat on Sep-23-2004 03:29:

quote:
Originally posted by Laushinameee
if im so young and stupid then why arent you 'owning' me 'hard'. I suspect that I have been listening to and interested in dance music for a lot longer than you. My age has no bearing on this. I can just tell from your attitude that you arent quite clued up as much as you pretend to be.

I cant believe you are even bringing age into this to try and belittle my opinion. Are we forgetting who comes from the country that makes you wait til 21 to get into clubs?

You have been listening to dance music longer than me? Ok. If you want to think that...not that it would matter anyways. I'm not "owning you hard" because you are a nobody to me. Besides, my boyfriend reads these forums. I'm sure he wouldn't give a shit if he read this thread though because he is also a producer and he happens to respect Max Graham almost as much as I do. He would probably support every single thing that I have written since I'm sure he would be just as upset as Max was if some twat ripped one of his tracks and used it to shamelessly promote himself.

I'm not clued up? You know me so well. I don't pretend to be anything. I don't need to prove shit to you. To me you're annoying as hell.

You don't like me and I don't like you. Big freakin deal. I'll use your words..."learn to accept it".

Show some respect to the artist's who's music that you download. You don't have to like them, but why the hell do you have to attack every artist that posts on TA? You and Radagast have some serious issues. I suggest group counseling.

Posted by trancebrat on Sep-23-2004 03:32:

quote:
Originally posted by Radagast
You're correct on both accounts. I have no respect for someone who complains about something they did while knowing the consequences of their actions while having had the power to prevent said consequences before they ever occurred.

And that is a problem. One that banning and complaining won't solve.

It's helping to get the links removed.

Posted by Laushinameee on Sep-23-2004 03:33:

quote:
Originally posted by trancebrat
You have been listening to dance music longer than me? Ok. If you want to think that...not that it would matter anyways. I'm not "owning you hard" because yuo are a nobody to me. Besides, my boyfriend reads these forums. I'm sure he wouldn't give a shit if he read this thread though because he is also a producer and he happens to respect Max Graham almost as much as I do. He would probably support every single thing that I have written since I'm sure he would be just as upset as Max was if some twat ripped one of his tracks and used it to shamelessly promote himself.

I'm not clued up? You know me so well. I don't pretend to be anything. I don't need to prove shit to you. To me you're annoying as hell.

You don't like me and I don't like you. Big freakin deal. I'll use your words..."learn to accept it".

Show some respect to the artist's who's music that you download. You don't have to like them, but why the hell do you have to attack every artist that posts on TA? You and Radagast have some serious issues. I suggest group counseling.

Youre the one with the fucking issues... trying to put yourself in a superior position with comments like that and even something as childish as 'im older than you, what do you know?' or something like that. Whats the point in even saying that when it make you sound about 12?

oops

Like i say, I think you forget what country makes you wait til 21. unlucky

Posted by trancebrat on Sep-23-2004 03:35:

quote:
Originally posted by Laushinameee
Youre the one with the fucking issues... trying to put yourself in a superior position with comments like that and even something as childish as 'im older than you, what do you know?' or something like that. Whats the point in even saying that when it make you sound about 12?

oops

Like i say, I think you forget what country makes you wait til 21. unlucky

I wrote it to piss you off. It worked.

Posted by tranceaholic on Sep-23-2004 03:37:

Posted by Radagast on Sep-23-2004 03:37:

quote:
Originally posted by trancebrat
It's helping to get the links removed.

So the guy will post his mix on other forums and have it up for download on filesharing programs. How is it stopping that?

Posted by Laushinameee on Sep-23-2004 03:37:

quote:
Originally posted by trancebrat
I wrote it to piss you off. It worked.

Its not pissed me off at all, I just want to make sure you know how stupid it made you sound. Dont try and take it back now.

Posted by Laushinameee on Sep-23-2004 03:39:

quote:
Originally posted by tranceaholic
so u r sayin artists shouldnt give out promos? and u r sayin we shouldnt have sets broadcasted ?

Look at a dj like PvD... he was notorious for always holding back stuff he didnt want on the internet from sets that he knew where broadcast. Nothing gets broadcast without the dj permission, so the dj can effectively control which tracks of his/her own get on the net. Youll not find too many Vandit releases on the internet pre release day.

As for promos, if the DJ is sending them out to his colleagues then it wouldnt hurt to write a note saying hold it back from recording until such and such a date.

Posted by Radagast on Sep-23-2004 03:39:

quote:
Originally posted by tranceaholic
so u r sayin artists shouldnt give out promos? and u r sayin we shouldnt have sets broadcasted ?

FOR THE LAST TIME, they can give out as many promos as they want. They're just being stupid when they complain that people are now illegally sharing their track. The power to prevent the illegal distribution of an artists track lies only in the artists hands. Once the track is leaked in any way it is beyond anyone's power to stop.

Posted by trancebrat on Sep-23-2004 03:40:

quote:
Originally posted by Radagast
So the guy will post his mix on other forums and have it up for download on filesharing programs. How is it stopping that?

Blah blah blah

Let me know if you ever decide to post anything positive on TA. I'll be sure to go get a huge bowl of ice cream.

Posted by trancebrat on Sep-23-2004 03:41:

quote:
Originally posted by Laushinameee
Its not pissed me off at all, I just want to make sure you know how stupid it made you sound. Dont try and take it back now.

In comparison to what...your intelligent posts?

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