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Originally posted by Michael19 GOd doesnt exist, so why is he being brought into this?

most sensible post of the whole thread that and one i totally agree with

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Originally posted by Slylee besides orb u got off the point, i wasn't saying ur wrong for wanting to beat up (or possibly kill) a guy who raped ur mom or sister, i was just agreeing with echo about how u always say one thing, and then completely contradict it sort of..well u contradict what u claim to represent, that's all.

I guess the frustrating thing about bringing up my apparent contradicting personality is what the point of it is. I dont understand how that neccessarily delegitimizes my points. Instead of saying Orbax is a jerk therefore he cant be right, itd probably be more conducive to argue the points.

I was just havin a piss take with M@T cuz I dont know him, and I was laughing, but for the more serious parts of this, its just odd to make a point and then have someone say because of an apparent character trait logic is absent in the words.

Glad youd like something done about something that happened to you though. Id be a little wierded out if someone just stepped away and let the system deal with it.


also I think most of you are forgetting i love law, and want to go to law school. A lot of it is to change the priority systems to be more in line with euro standards. Drugs are a social concern, not a crime, and need treatment. Homeless same thing...we have too many things labeled as "crime" when its a product of our society. The fact that certain crimes get more attention therefore more sentencing is screwed up. Im surprised murder isnt a ticketable offense now because its so infrequently caught. In 10 years all the pot smokers will be lifers and the rapists will be city council members pushing for NAMBLA parades...

Its all screwed up >.<

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Originally posted by Wicked Neo most sensible post of the whole thread that and one i totally agree with

Agreed. religion is only arguable to other religious people. Ultimately a futile argument. I didnt bring it up though, although did feel like defending a certain point of view once it was used

Edit:: Holy crap are you reading Robert Jordan?

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Originally posted by Nou Wow this turned into a fucking stupid thread. *unsubscribes*

we're bored.

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Originally posted by Orbax Agreed. religion is only arguable to other religious people. Ultimately a futile argument. I didnt bring it up though, although did feel like defending a certain point of view once it was used Edit:: Holy crap are you reading Robert Jordan?

religion is my pet hate.
it is the single biggest cause of human suffering since man walked this earth.

and yes i am reading Robert Jordan, the wheel of time series, great stuff and i am on the 3rd book at the mo, The Dragon Reborn

quote:

Originally posted by Wicked Neo religion is my pet hate. it is the single biggest cause of human suffering since man walked this earth.

Speaking as someone who was at one point a sunday school teacher I totally agree. Switching between athiest and weak agnostic just now though really.

moo

lol so this thread totally changed to religion

and cows

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Originally posted by Wicked Neo and yes i am reading Robert Jordan, the wheel of time series, great stuff and i am on the 3rd book at the mo, The Dragon Reborn

dude....wait until Lord Of Chaos ...gets sooooo good. Brilliant series.

I might be going to Miami in a couple of weeks with some of my boys. If you want we can beat the living crap out of him. I guarantee he won't bother her again after that.

Seriously, nothing pisses me off like a man who hits women. Anyone who does that is just an insecure loser. The way to deal with someone like that is to stand up to them and make them fear you.

lol@this thread.



this thread wins hijack of the year so far!


gmoney ur a doll, but i wont be getting THAT involved...like i said, she's cool and i like her, but she's not like dear to me or related to me, and i just don't feel it's my place to do that...besides it would make her not like me, and i don't want that. she's a big girl...i'm just gonna try to guide her in the right direction and hope she follows my lead...if not, well i wont have any hard feelings but i'll feel bad that she'll have to learn the hard way and i'll be there for her when she needs me.

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Originally posted by gmoney Seriously, nothing pisses me off like a man who hits women. Anyone who does that is just an insecure loser. The way to deal with someone like that is to stand up to them and make them fear you.

that's be hilarious

you go to florida with your boyz, chill, get tanked, and then hit up that dude's apartment and kick his ass in the name of TRANCEADDICTS

sho nuff!!!!!!!

DUDE or you could follow him to a bar, get him tanked and attack his butt with a vengeance!


am I the only one who totally wants to do that


im kidding. but shanghai'n him would be hilarious (get someone drunk and send them off on a one way ticket (in old das san fran people got hammered and woke up on boats going to shanghai for slavery @@))

Ok, I am formulating a plan. When were in Miami, were going clubbin'. You get this assclown to come to the club. Then as were leaving we'll take care of him. I am 6'1, 180 and I am the smallest out of all of us.
As I am older now and supposedly more mature I don't get into fights anymore. On the otherhand, I haven't been in a drunken brawl in awhile.Should be exciting. I know alot of lawyers in Miami so I am confident I can get myself out anything. Lets do it.

SCORE

gmoney should video tape it too!

no, enjoy your stay in miami without going to jail


maybe i'll see u around.

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Originally posted by Echo of Silence It is important to be true to your self and to be true to your convictions. But to play God or to assume the role of an all knowing entity? No. Think of all the convicted rapists and murderers in your country who are now being released because DNA tests proved that they weren't the actual rapist, they weren't the actual murderer. Without the system, you or Orbs would have executed justice against these people...? I say to err is human. Even victims can err. And Arbits, I can't argue with you. You know that. So this will be my last post in this thread. I was surprised because to me, you usually are so right and in my opinion, on this one, you are wrong. But, eh, I'm often wrong. So....

The merit of an individual response to a wrong isn't a free license by any means to shoot first and ask questions later, although that may be one's initial inclination. How one comes to a determination of guilt and an appropriate punishment need not be reckless or irrational (although if you put it in the hands of a small group of bozos picked off the street, it's likely to be.) If I didn't think my perceptions were more accurate, and my judgments more just, then I wouldn't think I ought to take matters into my own hands.

In any case as a person who's been on both ends of quite a significant number of harsh beatings I can tell you that I wouldn't prefer to wrongly spend a decade in a cage to wrongly being beaten, unless my injuries resulted in severe handicap or death. Maybe it makes me a weird guy in this day and age, but pain is just... pain, you pick yourself up, try to take a lesson from it, and you move on. But lost time can never be returned. If one is to err to the side of caution, then I'd say a quick, painful beating with a minimal chance of death or disability is the way to go, not the prolonged waste of the accused's time and society's money.

If we started accurately referring to imprisonment as a form of torture, maybe more people would come around to this realization.

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Originally posted by Orbax well, by the Grace and Forgiveness of God, hopefully He wont send me to Hell for defending a rape victim. He also says mind the laws of man as long as they do not go against His Word. Then you get into Old Testament Eye for Eye things vs new testament Turn a Cheek thing. Which is more valid. Id say both, because one is saying there will be equivalent damage, but turn the cheek and let the law deal with it IF the law will deal with it. Rapists get off easssy. Miranda ADMITTED to raping 2 women and got completely off because "he didnt know he couldnt do that" our system is historically flawed and im sure in the religious hierarchy rape SHOULD be more priority than 12 year old girls downloading songs off napster. Then again, im all screwed up apparently Arguing Bible is ultimately futile because all is forgiven when asked. You have to be honest and genuine. I think some people are mixing up LIKING hurting people with hurting them. I stopped boxing years ago because I dont like it. Someone offered me 1000 dollars the other day to take a starling nest out of their house and kill the babies. Not even shitty starling babies would I touch. Im not a fan of it, id much rather get drunk and fuck around. You think I LIKE going up to people and having to deal with that shit. I am a huge fan of not having stress in my life. I dunno, I guess im blind in my hypocracy.

I was only pointing out that it is clearly stated, in the NT (Romans 13), that one should obey the authorities. I would have trouble resisting an attack on some guy that raped someone in my family, but I would know that what I was doing was wrong. Surely salvation is based on grace, but that doesn't mean that we should do things that we know are wrong, on a whim. Not saying I wouldn't do that either, just so you know. As far as the OT vs. NT sidings, I would have to go with the NT, as it's part of the new covenant, whereas the OT is not. But, believe me, I make mistakes all of the time. I just try not to justify/rationalize them. Just confess and move on, you know?

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Originally posted by Slylee WARNING: long post, but if u have the time to read and respond, i appreciate it! ok so recently i met this girl who cocktail waitresses at a local sports bar and we really hit it off. we've only hung out 2 times, but we seem really comfortable with each other already and i can tell we're gonna be good friends. i went to this BBQ at their apt. complex (she lives with her boyfriend) 2 weekends ago and her boyfriend was there with his family and stuff (it was his sister's sweet 16 party), and everyone seemed cool and nice. so anyway, i got a voicemail from her on Saturday and she sounded horrible and sad and she was like, "hey it's me, call me back please i have to tell you something" well it turns out that she and her boyfriend got in a fight around 4 in the morning Saturday morning and he beat her up. she took a cab or bus or something back to georgia (her family lives there) and so now she's in georgia. she doesn't want to stay there and she doesn't have a car or anything either, so basically she's a wreck. i felt really bad for her, and i talked to her for a while on Saturday just basically lecturing her and telling her that there is absolutely no excuse for him to lay a finger on her. i guess he turns into a nasty drunk and he has a drinking problem... so i told her that i would talk to my future roommate to see if he is cool with having another roommate. i mean, if there's 3 of us, we can rent like a house and afford a nicer place, and plus she is really cool and tomboyish, so even though he'd have 2 female roommates, we're not like your typical bitchy, whiny females. i told her we were thinking september as our move in date and she was like, "oh man, that would be awesome, i could save money for the next couple of months, and i have a big screen tv that we can use" bla bla bla so she was totally stoked about it and really grateful that i was offering this. anyway, i talked to my roommate, and didn't give him details, but i was honest about what happened with her (i just said her bf is an asshole and beat her up and she wants to leave him and move out, but she can't afford her own place). he wasn't opposed to it, but he said he'd want to meet her first and stuff obviously. but now that i'm thinking about it, i don't know if it was a good idea. i mean i really want to help her out, but at the same time, i don't want to like go out of my way to get my roommate to agree to this, and then help her get a job (i told her i could hook her up with a job with one of the bf's attorney friends) and then have her go back to him, u know? i know how this shit works, and she's very vulnerable right now because she has no car, and the apt. she lived in was his, etc...so the easy way for her would be to make up with him, you know? i already told her that when she flies back into town (should be soon) to get her clothes and her dog and everything, that i would pick her up from the airport and take her to his place. i doubt he'll pull any shit if i'm there, and i'd like to see him try anyway! hahah anyway, what should i do? i want to help her out, but i don't know. i mean even my roommate was cool with it, but he was like, "man i don't want her psycho ex showing up at our place with drama and i'm gonna have to beat his ass" which is true. it wouldn't be fair to us. i was thinking of just straight up talking to her and just tell her that she needs to make a choice, meaning, she's gonna dump his ass, move on and have her own place with us, and become independant, or she can go back to him. i know i don't have the right to tell her what to do with her life and him, but at the same time, i do have the right to tell her that i'm not going to have some wife beating fucking asshole coming over to our place all the time if she's going to stay in contact with him. it WILL happen again, that's a given...especially if he continues to drink. and i just don't want the drama in my house of her coming home crying to us because he beat her up again u know? it's a tough call for me. input please..

wow.. finally got around to read the story... and i must say you have a good heart for willing to help this girl out.. someone you barely know, what, you hung out with her 2-3 times ? anyway, i think she's in a terrible situation and what youve offered is something ppl can just wish for [in her situation] but at the same time the fact that you barely know this girl comes in the way of things a bit.. shes moving in with you AND your [male]roomate [Three's Company anyone ? heh] and basically gonna have a new life really.. involving you alot obviously... to be optimistic, it cant all work out, you guys can become the best of friends and help getting a better/bigger place rather than something the 2 of you[you & your original roomate] would settle for and happily live after etc etc.. on the other side, say you find out shit about this girl that youre not too fond of, emotional issues, annoying behavior, weird habbits, whatever it might be its something you dont really see when youre just 'haning out' but are things that you see if you live with that person. i really dont know what to tell you as i dont know too much in dept about your surroundings but just be wise when making the decision cuz it is involving 2 other ppl and not just you.. i just weighed out the pros and cons[which you probably know already] so it might look a little more clear. whatever the case i hope it works out and dont forget to get back to us.

Arbiter I'm confused here, are you saying that if someone raped say your sister (since you guys are using the subjective argument method) you'd prefer to give them the easy option of a severe beating (corporal punishment or are you still getting to be the judge?)?

So they get a little beat up for a bit, wake up in morning sore but ok. And your sister? What about her?

Or is it in addition to being locked up? Or should you be allowed to kill them?

ok...i talked to her and now she's already making excuses for him, so i'm really turned off. she went from, "that fucking asshole hasn't even called to see where im at or if i'm ok, bla bla" to..

"yea we talked and i guess a lot more happened than i remembered"

then she went on to tell me how SHE was really wasted and passed out and he had been calling and calling, and then finally when he came home at like 4 in the morning (oh how nice of him to finally come home), there was broken glass on the floor (from her i guess) and he stepped on it and got pissed and BLA BLA BLA...

it was her tone...it was like she was justifying him hitting her...so whatever.

honestly...i thought and thought about it and i dunno...the 3 of us have dogs...hers is a puppy boxer and he will obviously get huge, & and my roommate has a wymreiner (excuse my spelling lol) and then i have my dog (medium sized mutt)...it's going to be pretty damn hard to find a place for rent that will let us have 3 medium to large dogs, and to be honest, i don't want 3 dogs in my house...jesus, it would be a damn zoo.

so yea i dunno..i'm totally still gonna help her get a job n stuff, but i dunno if i want her to move in now...


i really don't want the drama, and i know there will be drama...i think they are just that kind of couple...they love drama and it's just that stereotypical unhealthy relationship like pam and tommy lee. lol

heh

quote:

Originally posted by dj tek heh

i know right...


oh well...i was hoping this wouldn't happen, but in the back of my mind, i figured they would make up, but whatever.


i'm not even worried about how i'm going to tell her nevermind, because i'm sure she'll be telling ME nevermind first!

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Originally posted by Slylee ok...i talked to her and now she's already making excuses for him, so i'm really turned off. she went from, "that fucking asshole hasn't even called to see where im at or if i'm ok, bla bla" to.. "yea we talked and i guess a lot more happened than i remembered" then she went on to tell me how SHE was really wasted and passed out and he had been calling and calling, and then finally when he came home at like 4 in the morning (oh how nice of him to finally come home), there was broken glass on the floor (from her i guess) and he stepped on it and got pissed and BLA BLA BLA... it was her tone...it was like she was justifying him hitting her...so whatever. honestly...i thought and thought about it and i dunno...the 3 of us have dogs...hers is a puppy boxer and he will obviously get huge, & and my roommate has a wymreiner (excuse my spelling lol) and then i have my dog (medium sized mutt)...it's going to be pretty damn hard to find a place for rent that will let us have 3 medium to large dogs, and to be honest, i don't want 3 dogs in my house...jesus, it would be a damn zoo. so yea i dunno..i'm totally still gonna help her get a job n stuff, but i dunno if i want her to move in now... i really don't want the drama, and i know there will be drama...i think they are just that kind of couple...they love drama and it's just that stereotypical unhealthy relationship like pam and tommy lee. lol

sounds like she's joined your Denial Alliance

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