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-- Did Ferry Corsten killed trance?
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quote:

Originally posted by kr00t0n Ralphie B - Massive

That's a good example ????

quote:

Originally posted by Remiks trance is dead, go fuck yourselves. if you need some anal nitrate i can provide that 4 u...otherwise its not one single dj that ruined the scene...it was the whole changing of the "trance sound" and trying to progress it forward...only problem with that is it backfired major, with major jocks trying to experiment with new sounds..only those new sounds werent progressive, its called cheesey bollox. The evolution of the genre which they thought was desperately needed turned it into a commerical laughing stock, with Tijs being dropped out of helicopters to his gigs....and utter shitty albums meant to sell records toward mainstream noobs. THey pretty much sold out the fans and went after the money, mr. tijs exemplifies this better than any other artist out there, bruva manages to do a pepsi commercial, then rake in with his just be/olympic garbage. Same goes for Fairy C. ... bro tried to be a pop-rock star, only he forgot that hes not a rocker but a fucking dj and producer...someone didnt inform him in time and he created rock your body rock. the whole trio, of AvB, Fairy, and TIjs is the equivalent of the fucking Bush cabinet invading Iraq for oil....only these noobs went after the mainstream audience and cashed in off it. Its not hard to cash off idiot americans who just discovered dance music and think that Markus "i lisp" Schulz and AvB are the hottest and best thing that ever happened to music.

Good Post

quote:

Originally posted by Blue Balls That's a good example ????

#

I think so yes

no need to be scared about it, my opinion wont kill you...

quote:

Originally posted by kr00t0n no need to be scared about it, my opinion wont kill you...

quote:

Originally posted by kr00t0n my opinion wont kill you...

it might kill my hearing though

quote:

Originally posted by Blue Balls it might kill my hearing though

Then perhaps you'd quit moaning

how about just not listening to what you dislike, hardly takes a genius to figure that out does it?

quote:

Originally posted by kr00t0n Then perhaps you'd quit moaning how about just not listening to what you dislike, hardly takes a genius to figure that out does it?

I'm just busting your balls. Massive isn't that bad.

quote:

Originally posted by Blue Balls I'm just busting your balls. Massive isn't that bad.

I know, it's just that a long time EDM listener, I hate getting lumped into a category based on the music I like, it's stupid to judge someone in that way.

Some ppl go more overboard than others, but to call someone stupid just because they like epic trance is pretty pathetic...

I guess its 'just an internet forum' at the end of the day, but you dont see me posting about how much such n such must suck coz they like xyz that I dont.

And for the record, as much as I love epic trance, big name djs ala ferry, armin, pvd, etc could vanish off the face of the earth and I owuldnt be fussed, as none of them play what I like

I don't think I have ever been impressed by a big name trance dj, its always the up n comings who tend to wow

quote:

Originally posted by Ishkur Actually, Oakenfold killed trance, but since it was a Dutch trance music node, I felt it'd be proper to put a Dutch guy, less I get a million stupid emails from people wanting to "correct" me that Oakenfold is british.....but the name is really not that important. It could've been Tiesto or Armin, it didn't really matter to me, so long as it was someone prominant and Dutch enough to rile trancecrackers. And from the looks of things, it succeeded. There's a reason why I only cited you guys in the credits. I love you all so much. As for the rest of it.....am I joking? Am I being serious? Or am I being serious about joking? I think that's part of its charm. (oh, and Zombie0915 is the only person in this thread who got it right)

what the!? Zombie0915 right? snowballs in hell? a microsoft program without memory leaks?



maye we should just like what we like and realize that ours is not the only opinion that matters

quote:

Originally posted by Alexan 17 pages*

That depends on your TA profile-settings

so can we finally stop using ishkur's quotes as fodder for our arguments about why one genre is superior to another?

(except for ghetto tech of course, because that is #1!)

quote:

Originally posted by Zombie0915 (except for ghetto tech of course, because that is #1!)

quote:

Originally posted by Zombie0915 (except for ghetto tech of course, because that is #1!)

Indeed.

quote:

Originally posted by Zombie0915 maye we should just like what we like and realize that ours is not the only opinion that matters

But, if that were the case than some people would think the world in flat and others would think its round. Why? Because as you said 'everything is an opinion'

Columbus had an opinion. Bill Gates had an opinion.


Everything begins as an opinion BUT can become fact IF one can prove it logically.

Thus the reason why people on this board debate opinions is to find the truth.

Not every opinion is a fact. But to dismiss all opinions with logical justification is foolish.



Ishkur was able to explain his opinions. People than can logically understand his 'opinions' and than logically try to understand its merits. In the last 17 pages nobody has been able to prove him wrong.

Saying ' You're a Fuckin Asshole' or ' Its an opinion' IS NOT PROVING ANYTHING.


You need to explain. Provide examples. Do research. ETC.


This is the essence of a debate





P.S.


I don't give a shit about who killed trance; that was not the reason why I joined this debate.

No one has yet to disprove the definition that Ishkur gave on the epic trance genre (ex the Ferry Corsten comment). Thus his opinion still remins fact to me. If you don't agree prove me wrong.

so if we realize that musical taste is subjective then science stops working?

I really don't follow that one at all

so you think your musical taste is a fact and that everyone different from your taste is wrong then?

I think I logicaly understand ishkur's opinions, he said it himself, that I was right on page 16(if you dont have anyone on ignore), but I'll just humor you anyway.

First lets start this off in an orderly way, what is this fact that you are arguing for, and what is this logical explanation you have?

ps: I never said 'everything is an opinion', just that one form of music being superior to another is an opinion.

quote:

Originally posted by Blue Balls No one has yet to disprove the definition that Ishkur gave on the epic trance genre (ex the Ferry Corsten comment). Thus his opinion still remins fact to me. If you don't agree prove me wrong.

Hmm. Read my posts starting on page 13.

quote:

Originally posted by SYSTEM-J Classic trance is very simplistic and repetitive. Epic trance actually has more musical merit than classic trance.

Prove it. Give us some examples.

quote:

Originally posted by SYSTEM-J It's ridiculous to assume that all breakdowns are bad, all melodies are pop and that all classic trance was good. A lot of it was absolute shite, just as a lot of modern trance is.

Prove it. Give us some examples.






If you can give proof to your argument than I would agree with you.

quote:

Originally posted by Blue Balls Prove it. Give us some examples. Prove it. Give us some examples. If you can give proof to your argument than I would agree with you.

seen as your so confident why dont you prove it?

quote:

Originally posted by Zombie0915 so if we realize that musical taste is subjective then science stops working?

Categorizing and understanding the history and developement of music can be viewed as a science. With that depth of understanding, the subjective worth of music can, in my opinion, be more accurately attained.



for example,


someone very new to EDM might say ' holy shit mike foyle's sound is awesome because I just think so '


but someone very well versed in EDM might say ' this mike foyle sound is very average based on xyz reasons'





a person new to EDM views the musical subjectively.

a person who is 'educated' in EDM understands music more sciefificly and objectively.



Akin to how a 14th Century farmer would view the world compared to a 14th Century Philospher.

quote:

Originally posted by JakeC seen as your so confident why dont you prove it?

I'll be honest with you.


I don't know shit. I listen to other people. I hear their case and than make a judgement.

but it still al comes back to ones opinion.

one mans cheese is another mans pickle.

ah, the same old "educated people like but they don't like trance" thing.

We've been through this one alot before, I don't care to go into it again. I'll just say that I know many many people who have been in the scene a long time and still enjoy the trance, despite having heard plenty of other styles and having been as educated about EDM as anyone else on here has been.

You might be able to create some correlation between those who know alot about music and those who dislike trance here on TA, but in real life this just doesn't stand up, and even a few of the biggest elitiests on here have admitted that.


Categorizing and understanding the history and developement of music is not science, it is only history. The way music evolves and changes is a funcion of the dominant ideas of both the authors and the listeners in a certain period and place. There is no absolute right and wrong music, just trends fluctuating as time passes.

Lets do the political rock example, the stuff was frigin huge in the 60's, people ran away from home to follow it, to them is was worth quite alot. This was not science, nobody reached an objective conclusion that political rock was a better form of music then the repressive shit from the 50's, they were just pissed off by vietnam/the white man/society etc, so the music sang to them and they called it good.

a similar case can be made for detriot techno, black people, access to technology that they didn't have before, the idea of the furture, etc. Again, not science, but history.

Different sounds have different values to different people, this isn't an absolute objective thing.

quote:

Originally posted by Zombie0915 You might be able to create some correlation between those who know alot about music and those who dislike trance here on TA

more like a correlation not to like 'average' or 'copied' trance.

quote:

Originally posted by Zombie0915 ah, the same old "educated people like but they don't like trance" thing.

You continue to fail to understand the core of my thesis. Epic Dutch Trance is NOT similar to other trance, as Ishkur said. It's a different category with a different feeling.

I have no fucking idea where you got this situation where you have those who like trance vs. those who don't like trance.

well, when I said trance, I meant your epic style, its just too much to type every time, crikey.

I am well aware that epic trance is not all of trance, and assumed you were too.

Despite what you want to think, it is possible to like the epic style without enjoying average or copied music, and many people are out there right now doing this. You really must not get out much if you haven't met any of them, hell I'm in the middle of redneck hell USA and I have met them.

why dont you just state the core of your thesis like I asked

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