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-- Do you believe there is a U.S. government cover-up surrounding 9/11?
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was it thermite, or...
** Dr Judy Wood, suing on behalf of the United States of America and demanding a Trial by Jury, has evidence that Directed Energy Weapons were a causal factor in the destruction of the World Trade Center:
http://drjudywood.com/articles/NIST/Qui_Tam_Wood.html
Docket No. 1:07-cv-03314-GBD
Title: Dr. Judy Wood ex rel. USA vs. Applied Research Associates, Inc. et al.
Venue: United States District Court, Southern District of New York
Judge: George B. Daniels
| quote: |
| Originally posted by {b.s.e.} http://www.ae911truth.org/twintowers.php it's THERMATE  |
but i DO like the way in which you nicely side-stepped the question, because we both know that the pulverization of concrete is completely irrelevant to the nature/cause of the collapses. | quote: |
Originally posted by {b.s.e.}  that contain more information that i could relay to you in a post or three. if none of that convinces you, then there is no longer any point in discussing this topic. |
Um, if the towers were demolished, they would have fallen from the bottom up. Not the top down..
The Pseudo-Science of the '9/11 Truth' Movement
By Edmund Standing
In recent months, a number of high (and not so high) profile celebrities have publicly offered support to conspiracy theories regarding the September 11th 2001 attacks on the World Trade Center. Central to the claims of many who embrace notions of 9/11 as an 'inside job' is that credible scientific research by mainstream scientists supports this position. In this article, I shall briefly look at two qualified academic scientists who hold that the 9/11 attacks were orchestrated by a cabal of scheming neo-conservatives in Washington DC. The picture that emerges is not one of mainstream scientists whose research is trustworthy and should be urgently addressed. Instead, we find purveyors of extreme and fact-free conspiracy theories, scientists who appear to have little regard for the scientific method, and who mirror in every way the pseudo-scholars found in other fringe 'research' areas such as 'Creation Science'.
Dr Steven E. Jones
Steven Jones is a retired Professor of Physics. His retirement from his post at Brigham Young University followed a period in which the university placed him on paid leave due to controversy over his claims of a 9/11 conspiracy involving the 'controlled demolition' of the World Trade Center's twin towers. Brigham Young University is owned by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (Mormon Church) and run under its 'Church Educational System', and Jones is a committed Mormon. Throughout his career, Jones' main area of academic interest has been 'alternative energies', including the widely discredited 'Cold Fusion'. However, in addition to this, he has also been keenly involved in Archaeometry 'research', the entire aim of which has been to give an academic sheen to the claims of the Book of Mormon. Jones is 'scientific advisor' to the Ancient Historical Research Foundation, a pseudo-scholarly body that produces research on ancient American cultures and peoples such as Native Americans, Aztecs, and Mayans. The central purpose of this work is to support the Book of Mormon's absurd 'historical' claims, and, with this aim, Jones has engaged in a search for evidence of 'pre-Columbian' horse remains in North America. In addition to this, he has also published a risible paper in which he claims to have found evidence in ancient Mayan artwork 'proving' the Book of Mormon's claims regarding Jesus visiting America. The article, entitled 'Behold My Hands: Evidence for Christ's Visit in Ancient America', concludes:
These discoveries have provided me a deeper appreciation for the reality of the resurrection of Jesus and of His visit to "other sheep" who heard His voice and saw His wounded hands as did Thomas. My hope is that these new insights will encourage you to seriously consider the Book of Mormon, Another Testament of Christ. Why don't you start reading right away?
Having spent his career swimming in the murky of waters of religiously inspired pseudo-scholarship and dubious 'scientific' fringe areas, Jones has in recent years turned his attention to the attacks of September 11th 2001, and now claims to have evidence proving WTC towers 1 & 2 were brought down in a 'controlled demolition'. For Jones, the 9/11 attacks were an 'inside job', orchestrated by 'neo-conservatives' to justify the occupation of oil-rich Arab countries, inflate military spending and expand Israel. Indeed, Jones has confidently asserted that 'by God, we're going to get to the bottom of this'. Rather than seeking to have his 'research' published in credible, peer reviewed academic journals, Jones simply started his own. The online 'Journal of 9/11 Studies' seeks 'to provide evidence-based, peer-reviewed research that furthers the cause of truth and justice'. As such, it largely publishes articles focusing on the supposed 'controlled demolition' of the twin towers, but has also included a variety of sociological and political pieces, including a desperate article which claims that it is psychological blocks, as opposed to a complete lack of evidence, that stops more people subscribing to 9/11 conspiracy theories. In common with 'journals' set up by Creationist outfits, the claim that the journal is 'peer-reviewed' turns out to be misleading at best. Of course, if one's peers are all Creationists or conspiracy theorists, then one's articles may indeed be peer reviewed, but this peer review process is hardly likely to challenge any of the extreme and unscientifically supported claims to be found in those articles. Indeed, a statistical summary of the 'journal''s output has revealed that 'fourteen of the 43 papers, or nearly a third of the papers accepted by the editors, are written by the editors themselves' and that 'of the original 43 papers, the numbers of papers written by someone with a PhD in a science, who is not one of the editors of the journal themselves, and who is not merely rebutting another previously held conspiracy theory comes out to a grand total of... 4, or a mere 9%' . But what of the quality of the research? Aside from the fact it is so dubious that the authors do not dare submit it to credible, mainstream journals, it often contains errors that are simply embarassing. For example, Jones has attempted to buttress his claim that he has found proof that cutting charges were used to 'demolish' the twin towers by pointing to an image supposedly showing molten metal glowing at Ground Zero. A quick search by the conspiracy debunker Pat Curley revealed the source of the glow to be nothing more nefarious than a high-powered portable light.
Jones, then, is a man who believes in the mythology of Mormonism, whose last academic post was at a 'university' that institutionally subscribes to this same mythology, a man who has an interest in fringe science, who associates with a 'research foundation' devoted to archaeological 'anomalies', and who claims to have found evidence proving Jesus visited America. Adding to this career of idiocy, he now edits a journal promoting totally unscientific theories about the 9/11 Islamist terrorist attacks, and heads another crackpot 'research' group called 'Scholars for 9/11 Truth & Justice' (a group, which, unsurprisingly, he co-founded).
Dr Judy Wood
From 1999 to 2006, Wood was an Assistant Professor in the Mechanical Engineering Department at Clemson University in Clemson, South Carolina, and the majority of her academic work has been in the field of materials testing. So far so good, but then comes her 9/11 'research'. Wood claims that she 'started to question the events of 9/11 on that same day when what she saw and heard on television was contradictory and appeared to violate the laws of physics'. Despite the fact that no major scientific body believes the World Trade Center building collapses pose any questions related to the laws of physics, Wood clearly knows something they don't. For Wood, the WTC collapses constitute a 'New Hiroshima'. While some conspiracists go so far as claiming that the World Trade Center was demolished using 'mini-nukes' and that 9/11 was a 'nuclear demolition', for Wood, the 'New Hiroshima' was carried out using 'directed energy weapons'.
As with most 9/11 conspiracy theorists, Wood has drawn her conclusions based on highly contentious interpretations of photo and video evidence of the events of September 11th. By carrying out a highly selective analysis of these images, Wood has concluded that the WTC structures became 'dustified' during the collapses. She claims that there is a 'lack of suffient debris' to corroborate the 'official story' of the towers collapsing due to their structural integrity being fatally compromised by a weakening of the steel due to the extreme heat produced by fires following the plane crashes. Consequently, according to Wood, all the evidence points to the WTC buildings having been destroyed by 'Star Wars beams', and she is promoting this claim in tandem with Dr Morgan Reynolds, a former White House chief economist (2001-2) who believes no planes were used on 9/11 and all video evidence of planes is fake and shows little more than 'cartoons'.
In making her case, Wood employs a dazzling array of neologisms and pseudo-scientific terms and concepts. She refers to various 9/11 phenomena using terminology such as 'jelly beams' and 'jellification', 'Alkaseltzer', 'Shaving Cream', 'toasting', 'Fuzzyblobs', 'Fuzzballs, 'Cheetos', 'fuming into nanohaze', 'fuming rust', 'lathering up', 'Silly String', and 'dustification'. Wood's work is so absurd that even fellow 9/11 conspiracy theorists are able to see it for the lunacy that it is, and mainstream debunkers have no trouble dispensing with her claims either.
Despite this, Wood is a respected member of another 9/11 research group, 'Scholars for 9/11 Truth', which announces itself as 'a non-partisan association of faculty, students, and scholars, in fields as diverse as history, science, military affairs, psychology, and philosophy, dedicated to exposing falsehoods and to revealing truths behind 9/11'. The group was founded by Professor (of Philosophy) James Fetzer, a man whose academic oeuvre includes 3 books advocating JFK conspiracy theories, and who co-edits another online 'journal', 'Assassination Research - Journal for the Advanced Study of the Death of JFK'.
In common with other 9/11 conspiracy theorists, Wood embraces numerous pseudo-scientific and paranoia-induced and inducing beliefs. She shares Steven Jones' interest in 'Cold Fusion', although, according to Wood, Jones 'sabotaged cold fusion and he is sabotaging the truth about 9/11'.
Conclusion
Contrary to the claims that 9/11 conspiracy theories are backed by 'real science' and 'real scientists', the picture that actually emerges is remarkably similar to other fringe movements such as Creationism, Intelligent Design, and Holocaust Revisionism: academics making extraordinary claims without the extraordinary evidence required to back them up, selective use of evidence, an obsession with alleged 'anomalies', allegations of 'cover-ups', claims that their 'research' is being suppressed by 'the establishment', persecution complexes, the setting up of self-serving and self-referential 'journals' and 'scholarly' groups, infighting, egotism, and paranoia.
In reality, there is no more evidence for the claim that 9/11 was an 'inside job' than there is that God created the world in six days, that the Holocaust never happened, that Jesus walked in America, or that an angel dictated the Qur'an to Muhammad. These are faith based positions, and to attempt to claim there are credible 'scientific' reasons for embracing conspiracies about the September 11th attacks is an insult both to real science and to the memory of those who died on that day.
Edmund Standing holds a BA in Theology & Religious Studies and an MA in Critical & Cultural Theory. His other articles on this website can be found in the articles archive.
http://www.butterfliesandwheels.com...int.php?num=320
Dr Judy Wood is the only scientist doing real research on the WTC destruction. See her site for the actual evidence: http://drjudywood.com
| quote: |
| Originally posted by CB_Brooklyn Dr Judy Wood is the only scientist doing real research on the WTC destruction. See her site for the actual evidence: http://drjudywood.com |
South Tower collapsing at point and direction of impact. the top half falls intact.
it was hit second but falls first because of where the impact was relative to the rest of the upper floors and sheer mass.
North tower collapsing at point of impact, on and into the rest of itself.
notice the remaining column of steel exoskeleton after the rest of the mass settles below it.
| quote: |
| Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN im unsure whether this is an alt playing silly buggers or whether there are people out there really this stupid? so i'll ask you (like ive asked all of your retarded ilk) where is judy's peer-reviewed paper? |
wow, i'd never seen the exo skeleton shot before, thanks for posting Q5! 
| quote: |
Don't you have a brain? How about looking at the evidence for yourself instead of relying on someone you don't even know? Where is this "peer review" supposed to come from anyway? The 9/11 attacks, the 9/11 cover up, and the 9/11 "truth movement" were orchestrated by people associated with directed energy weapons and the media: 9/11 Directed Energy Weapon / TV-Fakery Suppression Timeline http://www.checktheevidence.co.uk/c...d=151&Itemid=60 |
| quote: |
| Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN wow, i'd never seen the exo skeleton shot before, thanks for posting Q5! haha, im sorry. you are clearly taking the piss. good show. |
judy wood smokes too much crack, i'm beginning to think
Supposing that Building 7 was brought down by controlled demolition. Doesn't the fact that the Twin Towers came down in such a different fashion prove that they were not destroyed by controlled demolition?
Controlled demolitions can be engineered in many different ways. Normally, the purpose of a controlled demolition is to remove a structure while avoiding damage to adjacent structures, and to do so economically. Typically, a tall building is demolished by placing thousands of cutter charges adjacent to columns throughout the building, then detonating them in a precise order, starting with interior structures, and progressing outward and upward. Destroying the interior columns allows unsupported weight to pull the exterior inward, and destroying the building from the ground up allows the weight of the building to be harnessed to do much of the destruction. The result is an implosion, producing a vertical collapse and a consolidated rubble pile.
The objective of controlled demolition applied to the Twin Towers was the decidedly different one of producing collapses that could be explained as having been caused by the aircraft crashes and fire damage. Hence, the destruction was started around the crash zones and then moved downward.
There are many red flags in the official story of September 11th that passed right by the vast majority of people. Not the least is that the official story was so quick to emerge. Within hours of the attack Osama bin Laden was presented as the prime suspect. His picture was repeatedly shown on TV alongside images of the devastation in Lower Manhattan, a technique known as Pavlovian conditioning. A list of most of the hijackers was presented within a day of the attack. Mohammed Atta was presented as the ringleader within hours. The curious building "collapses" in Manhattan were immediately claimed to be inevitable. The "case closed" technical paper about the building collapses was published on September 13th, two days after the attack.
Some of the other red flags include:
The hijacked flights all flew long routes taking them far from their targets exposing them to certain interception given standard operating procedures.
The towering infernos were said to burn with the heat of nuclear power plants, despite sooty black smoke and few visible flames.
The building collapses were presented as inevitable, even though such behavior was unheard of in steel structures.
Flight 93 was confidently portrayed as a crash due to a struggle, despite strong evidence it was shot down.
An extensive paper trail of the hijackers was found within hours of the attack, even though the same people had supposedly eluded authorities for years.
The same hijackers who pulled off aerobatic maneuvers with large jets were flight school flunkies who had never flown jets.
The FBI claimed that the passport from one of Flight 11's hijackers was found blocks from the towers (when the only other parts of the jetliner that penetrated the tower were a few pieces of landing gear).
Several hijackers turned up alive after the attack.
1000 bodies vanished at Ground Zero, despite DNA identification procedures that could identify individuals from small fragments of bodies.
Flight 77 crashed into Wedge 1 of the Pentagon -- the one portion of the building that was sparsely occupied due to undergoing renovations, which included blast-hardening of the exterior walls.
The supposedly fanatically devout Muslim hijackers were fond of strip bars.
The hijackers, we were told, were extreme Islamic fundamentalists, driven by their religious fervor to make the ultimate sacrifice. Their religious extremism was also used, if mostly subconsciously, to help explain their improbable string of successes in first taking over four aircraft with primitive weapons, and then piloting three of them to their intended targets with astonishing precision, (precision all the more surprising given their inexperience as pilots). We know that athletes can achieve incredible feats through discipline, practice, and endurance. In a similar way, it's easy to imagine that the hijackers suceeded against nearly impossible odds through rigorous discipline borne of their religious conviction.
Yet some of these hijackers had used credit cards to pay for drinks and lap dances at a topless bar the night before, according to the FBI. 1 There are also reports of hijackers leaving copies of the Koran behind, once at a bar, and once in a rental car -- surprising behavior for devout Muslims.
The alleged hijackers did many things that seemed calculated to establish their identities -- which in several cases were apparently stolen identities.
_______
Resurrected Hijackers
Suicide Hijackers Identified by the FBI Proclaim Their Innocence
Of the 19 identities assigned by the FBI to the alleged suicide hijackers of the four commandeered jetliners, at least six have been disputed. The FBI's September 14, 2001 press release identifying the suspects included names and, in some cases, other personal details. 1 The FBI's September 27, 2001 press release included color photographs for each of the 19 suspects. 2
Reports
A handful of reports, most from one to two weeks after the attack, identified at least six men living in the middle east whose names -- and in some cases other identifying details -- matched those on the FBI's list.
Abdulaziz Alomari
Abdulaziz Alomari was identified by the FBI as the hijacker who accompanied Mohamed Atta from the connecting flight from Portland and helped him hijack and pilot Flight 11 into the North Tower. Abdulaziz told the London-based Asharq Al-Awsat newspaper: "The name [listed by the FBI] is my name and the birth date is the same as mine, but I am not the one who bombed the World Trade Center in New York." 3 Saudi Embassy officials in Washington defended the innocence of Alomari, saying that his passport was stolen in 1996 and that he had reported the theft to the police. 4
Saeed Alghamdi
Saeed Alghamdi, a Saudi Airlines pilot, was identified by the FBI of being a hijacker of Flight 93, which crashed in Pennsylvania. Alghamdi was "shocked and furious" to learn this three days after the attack, noting that his name, place of residence, date of birth, and occupation matched those described by the FBI. "You cannot imagine what it is like to be described as a terrorist - and a dead man - when you are innocent and alive," said Alghamdi, who considered legal action against the FBI. 5
Salem Al-Hamzi
Al-Hamzi was identified by the FBI as one of the hijackers of Flight 77, thought to have crashed into the Pentagon. Al-Hamzi said: "I have never been to the United States and have not been out of Saudi Arabia in the past two years." 6
Ahmed Al-Nami
Al-Nami was identified by the FBI as one of the hijackers of Flight 93. Al-Nami said: "I'm still alive, as you can see. I was shocked to see my name mentioned by the American Justice Department. I had never even heard of Pennsylvania where the plane I was supposed to have hijacked." 7
Waleed Alshehri
Waleed Alshehri, a Saudi Arabian pilot, was identified by the FBI as one of the hijackers of Flight 11. Alshehri turned up in Morocco after the attack where he contacted both the Saudi and American authorities to tell them he was not involved in the attack. 8 9
Abdulrahman al-Omari
Abdulrahman al-Omari, a Saudi Airlines pilot, was identified by the FBI as one of the hijackers of Flight 11. After learning this, he visited the US consulate in Jeddah to demand an explanation. 10
Ameer and Adnan Bukhari
Ameer and Adnan Bukhari were named by CNN as suspected hijackers of Flight 175, the jetliner which crashed into the South Tower, in an article dated 9/13/01. In a correction, CNN stated that Ameer Bukhari died in a small plane crash in Florida, and that Adnan was still alive in Florida, having passed a polygraph test to confirm his innocence. 11
Basically, it comes down to who you want to believe.
http://911research.wtc7.net/disinfo...ladinvideo.html
another dissection of the FAKE Bin Laden vid.
i'm quite over all this. RAISTLIN, you're a rude mis-mannered fellow. good luck with life.
| quote: |
| Originally posted by {b.s.e.} i'm quite over all this. RAISTLIN, you're a rude mis-mannered fellow. good luck with life. |
| quote: |
| Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN anybody that favours ludicrous conspiracy theory, pseudo-science and youtube videos over real evidence and expert analysis deserves to be ridiculed and mocked. why you think your retarded notions are deserving of anything else is quite beyond me. |
| quote: |
| Originally posted by {b.s.e.} heh, fuck off, bud. There's enough evidence to subtantiate skepticism about the general, "accepted theory". hundreds of professionals have spoken out, all over the world. |
| quote: |
| Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN No, there isnt. 10 characteristics of conspiracy theorists 6. Inability to tell good evidence from bad. Conspiracy theorists have no place for peer-review, for scientific knowledge, for the respectability of sources. The fact that a claim has been made by anybody, anywhere, is enough for them to reproduce it and demand that the questions it raises be answered, as if intellectual enquiry were a matter of responding to every rumour. While they do this, of course, they will claim to have "open minds" and abuse the sceptics for apparently lacking same. |
| quote: |
| Originally posted by {b.s.e.} though you seem quite consumed. |
| quote: |
| Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN we all have our pet hates. intellectual dishonesty, those that deliberately misrepresent themselves or evidence, liars, and "internet detectives" all give me the right shits. |
| quote: |
| Originally posted by {b.s.e.} i must confess, my pet hate is religion. |
Im sick of arguing with the CT bands. i can argue till im blue in the face and still not get any common sense across to these people. the biggest problem is, they lack the ability to be objective in their research. ie: they see a similarity (in their opinion) between a controlled implosion and the WTC collapse, they then search for evidence to prove this theory correct, without giving consideration to evidence that disproves it. They are notorious for misquoting people or taking testimony or comments out of context. Moreover, they have never even bothered to come up with a coherent and complete counter thesis as to the cause of the collapse, just more hypothetical theories supported by weak and baseless "evidence" generated by looking at videos and janitor testimonials...
I would probably give more credit to the whole truth movement if they showed any respect for scientific method and produced a propper couter thesis for peer review by acknowledged and accredited field experts and professionals instead of relying on web polls and producing useless and fallacious videos a la "loose change" or "zeitgeist".
these completely baseless claims of "flamable concrete" or "focused energy devices" do nothing but make the claimants or believers look like complete idiots.
| quote: |
| Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN and a valiant aim that is! so why embrace the more alternative issues that are generally discarded by the majority of those "in the know"? why are all the great "truths" hidden behind layers of lies and webs of deceit? don't you find that just a tiny bit juvenile? a bit tv show? there seem to be so many on this forum that go blindly against the consensus no matter what. go and look how the creationists argue intelligent design, and you'll see a lot of similarity with how 911 conspiracy theorists argue controlled demolition |
| quote: |
| Originally posted by colonelcrisp ... "loose change" or "zeitgeist". these completely baseless claims of "flamable concrete" or "focused energy devices" do nothing but make the claimants or believers look like complete idiots. |
Nader supports new independent inquiry into 9-11
PETER�S NEW YORK, April 14, 2008--Ralph Nader, the consumer activist and independent presidential candidate, seems to think that the report of the commission assigned to investigate the events of 9-11 should not be the last word.
"There are unanswered questions in the 9-11 investigation, and they should be answered," Nader said at a recent address at the National Constitution Center in Philadelphia. "How do you go from plausibility to evidence? You have a more independent inquiry."
On the morning of September 11, 2001, airliners collided with each of the twin towers of New York City�s World Trade Center, after which they and a third nearby office building mysteriously collapsed. Other incidents on the same day at the Pentagon and in a field in Pennsylvania were also attributed to aircraft collisions. All were pitched by the government as the result of a terrorist conspiracy, although it is widely believed that the government may have played a direct role in orchestrating the events.
After public cries for an investigation, President George Bush and Congress deputized the 9-11 Commission, which issued its report in 2004. While the report was praised by some, critics contended that it was not much more than a government whitewash.
On another topic, Nader had kind words to say for presidential candidate, Ron Paul.
"Ron Paul is very good on foreign policy," he said. "He's a refreshing voice."
Nader also praised Paul for his outspoken opposition to the aggressive U.S. stance against Iran and the so-called �war-on-drugs.�
Paul is vying with John McCain for the Republican presidential nomination.
Nader�s remarks were made on April 4, and aired on C-SPAN today.
http://www.petersnewyork.com/NADER.htm
Heh. +1
I still am positively convinced that the tape released by the Bush admin. is fake.
I'd like a link to prove without doubt that they are indeed true.
plzthx
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dls5JTD-uG0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dls5JTD-uG0
i don't know if those embed's are working
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