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Peace

seems to me in this forum

we have the pro isreali - anti palestinian ppl and
we have the anti isreali - pro palestinian view

why take sides?

violence is pathetic and it takes two sides to create conflict and it continues and continues. Label whoever you wish a terrorist but people need to sit down and solve this issue because how many more innocent lives will be lost?

amen TTA!

unfortunately, i don't see a way out right now. If i were palestinian, and my little brother was killed walking to school by the IDF because some other kids had thrown rocks at a tank earlier, then i would be out for blood of any israeli i could find.

similarly, if my mother had been blown up by a suicide bomber on a bus on her way to go shopping, i'd be out to kill evey palestinian or arab in israel out.

it's easy to sit over here in canda, and say "peace man, just talk it out" but i have great empathy for the situation of the people there.

i mean you see how deep the hate goes

just on this board

it's sad and a very difficult decision

peace is not easy to achieve but I think the negotiators owe it to their people to try to find a solution, so we can stop the violence and the killings so their kids and grandkids can live in peace.

Re: Peace

quote:

Originally posted by torontotrance seems to me in this forum we have the pro isreali - anti palestinian ppl and we have the anti isreali - pro palestinian view why take sides? violence is pathetic and it takes two sides to create conflict and it continues and continues. Label whoever you wish a terrorist but people need to sit down and solve this issue because how many more innocent lives will be lost?

You, my friend, are a true idealist. We need more of you around here! The problem is that people are raised hating their ethnic enemies. When a suicide bomber is in a crowded Tel Aviv street with C4 strapped to his chest, he sees dispicable Jewish filth surrounding him. Similarly, when an IDF soldier is shooting at an armed Palestinian fundamentlist, he sees a dirty animal, and nothing more. The only way to solve this problem would be to teach the kids. I know it sounds corny, but this generation is finished. They aren't changing their views. The world is relying on the children of both sides to resolve this problem in the future.
Also, it's rather east to say that this problem is easily resolved. But when you're in a warzone, that changes.

well its not like arafat and sharon are doing anything to help matters.

quote:

You, my friend, are a true idealist

i think peace can be achieved

ppl think it's not possible but I think it's possible but both sides have to put aside this hatred of each other. My gosh the bloods and crips did it in the 1990's and they hated each other. So I view it's possible but the effort will take all sides to work.

quote:

Originally posted by torontotrance i think peace can be achieved ppl think it's not possible but I think it's possible but both sides have to put aside this hatred of each other. My gosh the bloods and crips did it in the 1990's and they hated each other. So I view it's possible but the effort will take all sides to work.

Dats right, da IDF gotta stop pulling dat punk ass shit in da Palestinians hoodz and vice-versa.

Seriously though, I agree with the statement that this generation is likely beyond hope. This is such a touchy subject. One of the main problems I see is that the extremists from both sides get all of the attention (for obvious reasons). I'm sure most of the Israelies and the Palestinians want to get along, but the hatred just keeps gaining momentum and at this point is next to impossible to stop. Unfortunately, I think that it will take a very terrible event to get both sides to stop and think about what they're doing. Until that happens, IMO, peace will not be achieved.

If the Extremists on the Palestinian side put down their weapons, their would be no death and violence;

If the Extremists on the Israeli side put down their weapons,
their would be no Israel.



















...Think it over one more time!

saw it coming a 1000 miles away

in the end, we all see the light

quote:

why take sides?

Right is right, wrong is wrong.

No-one would say why take sides when talking about the conflict between the blacks and the whites in South Africa in the apartheid era. Everyone on this board would be saying how terrible the Afrikaaners are because of their racism and quite rightly so.

The Israelis are on the whole exactly the same as the afrikaaners, a bunch of nasty racists who use the excuse of past persecution to steal other peoples land and look down on others who are weaker than them. Not all Israelis are like that, I read the web, I see the TV some of them know what is going on is wrong and are trying to be decent, which is very hard for them because they live in a thoroughly racist society where racism is completely institutionalised and whose population has been conditioned to look at arabs as sub-humans. I have read countless statements from top level Israelis and there opinion of the arabs, the "cockroaches" as one famous general called them. What they say on the western media and what they say at home and different.

I have nothing but the utmost contempt for the so-called doctrine of non-violence. Countless times the palestinian leadership has on the whole tried to give the Israelis everything they wanted and where has it gotten them. The palestinian population detest their leaders for being worthless sellouts. The Israelis will give a little bit but really all they give are scraps. And why is that? Because at the end of the day the Israeli citizen is conditioned to think they have an invincible army and they fundamentally hold the arabs in contempt for their weakness. I mean who would respect a people who cant even hold onto their own land.

Negotiations will never work because the Israelis will never remove the settlements, the settlers believe it is either them or us, and they are fully supported by the army. Why do you think they have started to shoot journalists, peace activists, increase the amount of house demolitions. Because they dont want the world media to be there while they slowly and surely ethnically cleanse the palestinians to build their wall and make more room for settlers.

quote:

Originally posted by melech_mike If the Extremists on the Palestinian side put down their weapons, their would be no death and violence; If the Extremists on the Israeli side put down their weapons, their would be no Israel.

and what does that say about Israel?

an outlook like that only promotes violence-

why would Israeli extremists still need weapons if their largest threat to legitimacy now (palestinians) was defenseless? explain|

First of all Rupert, your a write-off!
That last post of yours shows me how 'conditioned' your mind is with propaganda, incitement and hate. You've obviously been reading too many anti-Israel websites, where you don't know what's right and what�s wrong anymore. Please re-read your post; it's ridiculous and is not worth addressing.

And to Biznology:
What does it say about Israel?

That statement, as simple as it is to understand, translates to this:
If the Arab extremists put down their weapons, Israel would have no threat to its security no more and could put down their weapons as well. If the Israeli extremists put down their weapons, Israel would be attacked from every side on the drop of a dime. Total annihilation of the Jew's of Israel is very realistic in a situation like this.

It's not brain surgery. It's common sense.

quote:

Originally posted by rupert Right is right, wrong is wrong. No-one would say why take sides when talking about the conflict between the blacks and the whites in South Africa in the apartheid era. Everyone on this board would be saying how terrible the Afrikaaners are because of their racism and quite rightly so. The Israelis are on the whole exactly the same as the afrikaaners, a bunch of nasty racists who use the excuse of past persecution to steal other peoples land and look down on others who are weaker than them. Not all Israelis are like that, I read the web, I see the TV some of them know what is going on is wrong and are trying to be decent, which is very hard for them because they live in a thoroughly racist society where racism is completely institutionalised and whose population has been conditioned to look at arabs as sub-humans. I have read countless statements from top level Israelis and there opinion of the arabs, the "cockroaches" as one famous general called them. What they say on the western media and what they say at home and different.

Ok so what said proof demonstrates that Israeli society propogates racist mentalities such that they are taught to look at arabs as sub-humans? So far the only racist comments I see are yours in depicting Israeli society as a whole as an institutionalized racist state. But by all means, prove your point. What kind of literature are they teaching in Israeli schools to propogate racism? I hope you have some evidence to actually back up your claim. I'm pretty sure that whatever you come up with would be matched and exceeded by Palestinian society's education system of hatred for Israelis. Just look at the Hamas and PLO charter ... it has never been so well documented.

quote:

I have nothing but the utmost contempt for the so-called doctrine of non-violence. Countless times the palestinian leadership has on the whole tried to give the Israelis everything they wanted and where has it gotten them. The palestinian population detest their leaders for being worthless sellouts. The Israelis will give a little bit but really all they give are scraps. And why is that? Because at the end of the day the Israeli citizen is conditioned to think they have an invincible army and they fundamentally hold the arabs in contempt for their weakness. I mean who would respect a people who cant even hold onto their own land.

Wow ... somebody who actually wants MORE violence in the region.

quote:

Negotiations will never work because the Israelis will never remove the settlements, the settlers believe it is either them or us, and they are fully supported by the army. Why do you think they have started to shoot journalists, peace activists, increase the amount of house demolitions. Because they dont want the world media to be there while they slowly and surely ethnically cleanse the palestinians to build their wall and make more room for settlers.

Part of the road map to peace calls for A) A freeze on all settlements B) Imediate abolishment of illegal settlements, and C) A removal of settlemnets in Palestinian territories after the creation of a palestinian state. This has been accepted by the Israeli parliament and Sharon who himself said that the Occupation must end.

Rupert, wouldn't you agree with me that racism is also well-rooted within the Palestine society and a large part of the Arab and Islam world?

I'm not blind, it terribly pains me to face how much racism there is in Israel. But we are arguing about who caused it, not whether it was caused or not.

And folks, I'm very afraid of relying on the next generation, I'm sceptical towards it almost as much as I am towards the current one... Racism is getting stronger over here, on both sides of the heated fight.

umm, okay, here goes.....
Things that are taught to small children and adults alike do not need to be presented in the form of literature, visual media, etc. Most of these little kids and teenagers on both sides are, obviously, expose to the conflict in Israel. Logically, they will form their own views. People do not need to be taught what to think unless they live in a totalitarian society (i.e. Nazi Germany, Soviet Union). Based on what people see, they will formulate views in which their side is right and the other is wrong. This is a simple theory to comprehend.

In my other post, I said that the present generation is already corrupted. I believe this to be true. I believe that on both sides, the people of this generation (especially those people between 14 and above) have formulated views that will not change. I believe it is vital that the later generations be allowed to forumlate their views based upon not what they see happening, but on the worth of the opposing side.

I know that this post might be hard to comprehend because I'm kinda thinking aloud, I hope you'll be able to get the jist of what I'm trying to say. I just hope that one day both sides will find a fair and solid plan that appeases everyone and puts an end to the violence.

^^^^

So you're basically saying present the facts from all sides and withold the commentary?

quote:

Originally posted by occrider ^^^^ So you're basically saying present the facts from all sides and withold the commentary?

Hey, you're not as dimwitted as I thought!!

awwww.... only ten times.... i had my fingers crossed for more!

quote:

Originally posted by melech_mike awwww.... only ten times.... i had my fingers crossed for more!

Fuck off, I deleted them....

quote:

Originally posted by DrummeRaver86 Hey, you're not as dimwitted as I thought!!

I put on my thinking cap for that one

quote:

Originally posted by occrider I put on my thinking cap for that one

Maybe you could get one for Mike...

quote:

Originally posted by DrummeRaver86 Maybe you could get one for Mike...

No thanks, no need for one.
I already have a brain

quote:

Originally posted by melech_mike No thanks, no need for one. I already have a brain

Really? Because from what I've seen, you really never use it...

quote:

Originally posted by DrummeRaver86 Really? Because from what I've seen, you really never use it...

My brain is telling me that your not wearing your thinking cap -- I'll spare the witty comment for another time.

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