Britain to track motorists by satellite and Issue Tax?

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-- Britain to track motorists by satellite and Issue Tax?

Posted by occrider on Jun-09-2003 17:42:

Britain to track motorists by satellite and Issue Tax?

quote:

Drivers may be taxed per mile
June 9, 2003

THE British government is studying a model to tax motorists country-wide based on the time they spend on the road, according to reports.

Satellites and computers would track motorists in order to bill them for the specific route they take, Minister of Transport Alistair Darling said to the British weekly.

Commuters, school-run parents and motorway users would bear the brunt of a variable system, where charges would be highest for rush-hour travel and for using the most congested roads. Use of motorways in Britain is currently gratis.

While tracking 24 million British motorists by satellite would undoubtedly bring up civil liberty issues, Darling argued that the issue of road tax was unavoidable.

"We have a choice in the next 25 to 30 years," he said.

"Either we build more and more motorways - astronomically expensive, environmentally damaging, and I doubt if we could actually do it - or we take a radically different look at how we manage the system."

Agence France-Presse

http://www.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,4057,6567592^13762,00.html

Doesn't this infringe on civil liberties?

Posted by PeacefulWarrior on Jun-09-2003 18:02:

Posted by Shakka on Jun-09-2003 19:36:

Yeah, I think it does. When you consider that they'd basically have satellite records of every single place you drive, how long you're there, etc. Not to mention that we already pay a gasoline tax which in effect charges those who drive more, so this really sounds like a clever way to try to double down on taxes we already pay. I don't think it'll pass. I sure hope it doesn't.

Funny though, I read a rationale for using the driving tax instead of a gas tax, based on the fact that newer cars are so fuel efficient that the drivers pay "less" in "gas tax", whereas some douchebag soccer mom driving her Suburban XT to and from soccer practice every day would end up paying more in driving taxes. I say Big deal! Get a better car ya dumb beyotch! The corollary would be to say that fuel efficient cars act like a tax credit for environmentally concientious people. Keep driving your gas sucker if you don't want the tax break.

Posted by rizo on Jun-09-2003 20:47:

I believe Oregan (the state north of california) is doing the same. They will not be tracking where you drive to, just how many miles. Kinda like digital odometer with an internet uplink that updates your total miles to a database. But yeah, if its part of a GPS system then theres something fishy about it

Posted by gibbo on Jun-09-2003 21:54:

The way this country is going it won't be long before you won't be able to take a piss without the goverment knowing about it

Posted by Luke Terry on Jun-10-2003 00:22:

this is all panic due to that bbc transport disaster program.

+ if they are stickin a satellite piece a shit on my car i ain't payin 4 it lol

Posted by gibbo on Jun-10-2003 00:26:

quote:
Originally posted by Project T
this is all panic due to that bbc transport disaster program.

+ if they are stickin a satellite piece a shit on my car i ain't payin 4 it lol

too right if they think i'm paying for a satelite dish sticking off my car to tell em where i am their very mistaken

Posted by Alccode on Jun-10-2003 01:09:

Good point occrider!

It's easy to announce today that "Oh only America is messed up, people losing their liberties left and right." We should keep in mind that the reality of the situation is that this is a worldwide phenomenon, in one way or another.

Posted by LiquidX on Jun-10-2003 02:38:

quote:
Originally posted by gibbo
too right if they think i'm paying for a satelite dish sticking off my car to tell em where i am their very mistaken

Well, I dont know if thats the purpose, I remember I once read that this satellite thingys will help find stolen cars, know of where criminals might be, rappers and so on, and besides helping you when caught fuel empty on the middle of nowhere. They wont be tracking everycitizen, its impossible, so it would only be dont in situations as I mentioned, thats what I read that will be implimented on the cars of the future.. or, NOW.

Posted by occrider on Jun-10-2003 03:27:

quote:
Originally posted by LiquidX
Well, I dont know if thats the purpose, I remember I once read that this satellite thingys will help find stolen cars, know of where criminals might be, rappers and so on, and besides helping you when caught fuel empty on the middle of nowhere. They wont be tracking everycitizen, its impossible, so it would only be dont in situations as I mentioned, thats what I read that will be implimented on the cars of the future.. or, NOW.

You're talking about lowjack right? I think that's different than this system. Lowjack only tracks your position once you activate it with the police. This system, if it gets implemented (I really doubt it will), seems like it would track your EVERY movement by satellite for the "sole" purpose of taxing the distances you travel in the car. Makes you wonder why they just don't attach an odometer reading to your car right?

At any rate if it was implemented I'm sure it would start off innocentely enough and then later on it could be adapted for police use to track criminal behaviour. Seems like it would trespass on my right to privacy a little too much.

Posted by Luke Terry on Jun-10-2003 09:58:

i think it's up to the owner whether they want to be tracked or not, and for the petrol thing, that's why mobile phones are useful

Posted by LiquidX on Jun-10-2003 10:45:

Yeah your right Occrider, was just throwing on on what I read about this system that was been discussed about to help track stolen cars and such.

Posted by Shakka on Jun-10-2003 13:39:

I agree with Occrider--if they really wanted to implement something like this, why not just take periodic odometer readings??? No need to watch me drive around the country!

Posted by joeh on Jun-10-2003 13:53:

quote:
Originally posted by Shakka
I agree with Occrider--if they really wanted to implement something like this, why not just take periodic odometer readings??? No need to watch me drive around the country!

Well that would just enourage people to set the odometer back - apparently its very easy thing to do for a mechanic.

The new digital ones are probably impossible compared to the old manual rotary ones.

Posted by Shakka on Jun-10-2003 17:03:

quote:
Originally posted by joeh152
Well that would just enourage people to set the odometer back - apparently its very easy thing to do for a mechanic.

The new digital ones are probably impossible compared to the old manual rotary ones.

Sure, but it's no different than our current tax system. People avoid taxes all the time and the IRS can choose to audit them if they think the person is up to shinanigans. If they think people are winding back their odometers, audit their car service histories. Again, no need to monitor where my car is and at what time. Also, what if I lend my car to someone else? Shouldn't they be responsible for the tax since they're putting the miles on? What if the car gets stolen? Am I supposed to be penalized even more because some dick steals my car and drives it 500 miles across the country?

Posted by Luke Terry on Jun-10-2003 18:20:

quote:
Originally posted by Shakka
I agree with Occrider--if they really wanted to implement something like this, why not just take periodic odometer readings??? No need to watch me drive around the country!

i think the idea is that they want to spy on you because of all the hype and shit with the terrorism kickin about and will just market it off with the positive side like occrider said