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Tony Blair gonna be out?

well, tonight is finally the vote on student fees (which i think the gov will prolly end up winning)

then the hutton inquiry will give us its findings tomorrow. Alot of people think this might be the end for tony blair. What do you lot reckon?

I think if it goes badly with the hutton inquiry, there is gonna need to be some changes. Like getting rid of that lousy **** geoff hoon for a start

blair is a wanker, a smiley faced glory hogging lying ****.

i hope he gets assasinated.

One of the rumours that got banded around by way of positive propaganda whern labour first got back in power was that they were gonna write off current student loans owed. To my knowledge they never commented that it wasn't true either, to get 'the student vote'.

180 anyone?

quote:

Originally posted by magnasoma One of the rumours that got banded around by way of positive propaganda whern labour first got back in power was that they were gonna write off current student loans owed.

I wish they had have done that, but in all honesty it was never gonna happen. So now i have to leave the counrty for good as i have no intentions in putting any more money into this governments pocket.

Blair needs to go

I like Blair! He looks funny!

he is a right bastard. so much shit has happened whilst he has been in power. In their manifesto before the winning general election, they said that they wouldn't touch uni fees. And now he has. The bare faced liar

The tuition system is going to hit Middle England sooooo hard, and its not as if we aren't being hit as it is! To Rich people, this tuition fee thing isn't going to concern them, to the poor its going to help them, and its us who are going to end up out of pocket. I just hope my sister will be able to go to uni when its her turn without a) getting into silly debt, or b) spending even more of my parent's money

quote:

Originally posted by swisstoni I wish they had have done that, but in all honesty it was never gonna happen. So now i have to leave the counrty for good as i have no intentions in putting any more money into this governments pocket. Blair needs to go

leaving the contry is certainly an option, 10yrs working abroad and the student loads are cancelled, or is it 30yrs??

personally i've never liked him, nor the whole gonverment really but thats another story.

I hope this is his downfall

quote:

Originally posted by dj_mdma The tuition system is going to hit Middle England sooooo hard,

i know students tend to drink a fair bit of their loads etc but that is a uni right of passage which the government would fo partaken in if they were of our generation. They come from a lack of exerience on this issue.

I just got caught in the fee sby one yr, they say 1k a yr is nothing, but its fuck loads if you're not living at home trying to eat live and study and pay fees its a ******, i had to take the loan out cover all of those costs reaching a nice sum of �8.5 k + �2.5 overdrafts in 3 yrs

and even if you are living at home (which my older brother did) it cripples the parents when the kids aren't mean to be at home any more, one way or another someone has to pay

and lam you and your folks are in the bad situ, ur course goes on for yrs and years, is it tuition fees each year for you as well?

With debts from such such degrees as medical we're talking �30k+ at the end if not more, what sort of 'government education start in life is that'? not to even start on the repayment rates, which in some cases are so low that you end up paying sumthing like �5 a week, you'll never pay off anything on that


Arrggg now im kinda pissed off fuck witts

yup we're in the bad situation

my parents pay my fees and my travel costs and stuff, which they don't mind cos they want me to get the best start in life, instead of being saddled with debt, they have helped me save money and stuff and by the time i'm out of uni i will almost immediately be able to buy some property.

its not too bad now, they can afford to pay my way at the moment, but when my sis goes to uni, the cost will be 3 times as much...with a bog standard course. if she wants to do medicine, the cost will be up to 20 times as much

although med students do get an NHS bursary to pay the fees in the last 3 yrs of the course, so my parents will only have to pay for another 2 years. The amount they spend on me is tuitions fees (1k) and travel which they give me �40 quid a week for so ten weeks a semester times 2 is 800 pounds and during the exam period about another 120.

quote:

Originally posted by Misty Kitty Arrggg now im kinda pissed off fuck witts

hopefully today and tomorrow will be making blair sit tight and reflect on the chaos at the moment. imo, after the way he handled the doctor kelly incident, a load of those grey, stuffy, arrogant selfish pricks that call themselves politicians / reporters need to go.

And blair is the epitomy of spitting image

out with blair, and in with charles kenerdy!!

no, im serious!

I support the top-up-fees under current circumstances, that is nearly 50% (and rising each year) go on to higher education, unis can't afford to pay for all these courses any more, and a grand a year from students isn't nearly enough to curb the deficit, that's the fact. If the gov. is determined to send 50%+ to uni, they have to either raise taxes or increase fees. The former way (the Lib Dem way) is completely unfair on people / parents who will not / have not/ don't have children going to uni. Charging fees imo in the only fair way, besides we've still got it easy compared to the US, courses at universities there can cost $20,000 per year or more. Some people have commented in this thread that it will be too much of a burden on parents, I can't see how that will be so, seen as they will go from paying �1,100 per year to �0. Sure the parents will probably pay off some of the debt afterwards, however, under the previous system, parents only payed fees if they collectively (or singularly) earned �20,000+ per year, under the new system, the same rule applies still but only if the graduate also earns �15,000+ per year, and at that wage, the weekly contribution is bugger all! Therefore the level of finantial stability that is required for paying off the debt is greater under the new system. But as I said, this is only the solution (imo) under the current circumstances, because.....
...personally I think the answer is to remove the bottom 20% or so of shit pointless money wasting courses that bring in no money to the unis through reseach etc., we don't need 50% going to uni anyway, well less than half of the jobs in the country require a degree anyway, and students doing such courses would have these large debts and a low income to pay them off, because such degrees would be next-to useless. This would ease the financial deficit of unis and would mean no top-up-fees! Best solution if you ask me....

i'm guessin this will bring fees to all N. Ireland uni's too?

i'm from the Irish Republic, and i get my fees pad by the north eastern educational library board, so like.. whill they still be as kind and generous next year?

quote:

Originally posted by eLe_vatE I support the top-up-fees under current circumstances, that is nearly 50% (and rising each year) go on to higher education, unis can't afford to pay for all these courses any more, and a grand a year from students isn't nearly enough to curb the deficit, that's the fact. If the gov. is determined to send 50%+ to uni, they have to either raise taxes or increase fees. The former way (the Lib Dem way) is completely unfair on people / parents who will not / have not/ don't have children going to uni. Charging fees imo in the only fair way, besides we've still got it easy compared to the US, courses at universities there can cost $20,000 per year or more. Some people have commented in this thread that it will be too much of a burden on parents, I can't see how that will be so, seen as they will go from paying �1,100 per year to �0. Sure the parents will probably pay off some of the debt afterwards, however, under the previous system, parents only payed fees if they collectively (or singularly) earned �20,000+ per year, under the new system, the same rule applies still but only if the graduate also earns �15,000+ per year, and at that wage, the weekly contribution is bugger all! Therefore the level of finantial stability that is required for paying off the debt is greater under the new system. But as I said, this is only the solution (imo) under the current circumstances, because..... ...personally I think the answer is to remove the bottom 20% or so of shit pointless money wasting courses that bring in no money to the unis through reseach etc., we don't need 50% going to uni anyway, well less than half of the jobs in the country require a degree anyway, and students doing such courses would have these large debts and a low income to pay them off, because such degrees would be next-to useless. This would ease the financial deficit of unis and would mean no top-up-fees! Best solution if you ask me....

YES!!

someone who agrees with me!!

I can't be arsed to start the debate again (has been going on the GC board) but this is what I think.

quote:

Originally posted by Misty Kitty what sort of 'government education start in life is that'

the education that says we should let every **** who comes off the boat stay in our country for free, get a house, car, cigs, food tokens whatever and not worry about our own citizens who pay for, but to screw them over as much as possible

and also the education that says that miss slag from the local council estate with eight kids by six different fathers gets about 40k a year tax free in benefits.

Know what i say, fuck the immigrants, yeah fair enough it might be bad in their country, but thats not our problem, and we shouldn't have to pay for it, and fuck the single mother, either get some lessons in birth control, or stop being a slag that sleeps around without protection, condoms and pills were made for a reason you know. Instead, concentrate and giving british people a better quality of life, like a free or subsidised education, and give us some fucking tax breaks, you evil, satanic bastard government

Sorry bout the rant, dont really feel any better for it

someone's had a bad day or someone has been living in london far too long.

take the chill pill ricky

chris + harry know the score on TUF's

anyways, think about it, would much rather have blair in power than michael howard, and probably charles kennedy, even if blair had to step down, with gordon brown more than likely in charge, we doin the best with whats available imo.

quote:

Originally posted by swisstoni someone's had a bad day or someone has been living in london far too long. take the chill pill ricky

well, i have deffo been living in london far too long, no doubt about that. I haven't had a bad day, the government is one of the things that REALLY hacks me off though

I need a night out

316 � 311. How close was that!

- Foundation Hospitals
- Top Up Fees

Which part of our democratic welfare state do you want to destroy next?

Edit: To answer the question, lol, anyone who thinks Blair won�t survive this week is na�ve. Of Course he will, unfortunately. The Hutton Inquiry will be a bit of a flop, won�t say anything much at all damning, probably blame the BBC.

fucking fucking fucking bollocks.

won by a mojority of 5, and only because Blair was getting the Scot MP's on his side to vote for A BILL THAT WONT EVEN APPLY IN SCOTLAND

i cannot belive that, and since it was so utterly utterly close, it just shows that Blair is losing grip on the Government.

Now my family is pretty much screwed. When my sis goes to uni, in around 4 years time, fees will probably be 15,000 for three years. Parents who care for their kids will want the kids to be in the least possible amount of debt.

whoever siad that parents AREN'T burdened is a bit silly really. If you want your kids to have a relatively secure future, you need them to go to uni. if you have to pay 3 grand a year, of DISPOSABLE pay, on top of stuff like mortgage payments etc, its gonna hit you a lot. currently my parents have their mortgage to pay, car payments, loan payments for the extensions, and they still manage to send me to uni, without me having to get into debt. For that i'm grateful.

They earn about 55k a year between them before tax. As we earn more than 20k a year, we're not exempt from any concessions in this. i've just lost my train of thought on this matter but i will regain it eventually...

And another thing. For those parents who cant' afford to pay their kids ways to uni, but still earn more than 20k a year between them they are exempt. ffs 20k a year in a household is not a lot. for example if both you're parents worked at tesco's full time as cashiers, they would be above the threshold. Its that easy. You wouldn't be able to live comfortably, as well as having to help your kid go to uni.

And if you get into debt, which will be likely this is what its going to look like.

3k a year student fees
approx 3-4k a year for accomodation fees
around 1k a year for food and stuff
and around 1k a year for entertainment and stuff.

thats almost 10k a year expenditure, with no income of your own. Even if you get a part time job, you cannot work that many hours because of your studys. i work 12 hours a week and thats just about the right balance. i earn 310 pounds a month from that (because ofmy posistion and length of time at Tesco's =6.50 p/h) and if a student did that, they would earn about 3.5k a year from that. If that went towards the expenditure i outlined above they still owe 6.5k a year. over three years, if they don't owe 30k, they owe 20k.

when you get out of uni, money isn't exactly fantastic, even if you've done a high profile course like medicine, law, or finance. Junior doctors start off on 17.5k a year before tax, which is not a lot. Even if you've got a law degree, you don't suddenly become a hot shot solicitor or barrister. The debt will stick around you like a bad smell. And then you are going to want to buy a house or get a car, that requires some sort of capital...how can you do that if all your work mone went to help pay off the current expenditure over the years. Youi could get a massive mortgage, but that is just more and more debt. And when you start earning a reasonable amount of money, you're part of Middle England, and you get the hell taxed out of you to pay for illegal immigrants or low life single mothers who are too fucking bone idle to help themselves.

Life just dandy isn't it!

I too am at uni, but in fairness I would like to suggest that many people on these boards spend more than �1125 a year on dj equipment and vinyl,

How can you argue that paying a similar anunual price for a university education is unfair, when on average graduates earn over �400,000 in their lifetime than someone without a degree.


Just a thought, but lets face it uni is still a damn good investment for some people

i'm not saying its unfair, we should pay some sort of cost towards uni, but uni's should try and secure private funding to help out and stuff.

Uni is a good investment. I hope to become a Doctor, and eventually progress to plastic surgery, and i would love to open a clinic in Richmond, right next to where i live. But my parents are hard pressed to pay for everything, and i live at home as well. By doing that i'm saving them/myself 3.5k.


400,000 over 40 years is only 10 thousand a year, which is what you can get working at Tesco's as a Cashier.

And it also doesn't help if you do a degree that doesn't help you get a job or something. Doing a course like anthropology, classics, and stuff like that..there is a very very tiny job market for that, which i don't think pays very well either...so you will be paying this debt for ages, and then when its time to send YOUR kids to uni, you are hardly going to want the same thing for them (the same debt as you) but alas, you can't help them, as you're still in debt yourself and the cycle goes on.

quote:

Originally posted by Coup out with blair, and in with charles kenerdy!! no, im serious!

charles kennedy is a legend, its a shame the lib dems wont make it into power i reckon they would be the daddys

quote:

Originally posted by dj_mdma and another thing. For those parents who cant' afford to pay their kids ways to uni, but still earn more than 20k a year between them they are exempt. ffs 20k a year in a household is not a lot. for example if both you're parents worked at tesco's full time as cashiers, they would be above the threshold. Its that easy. You wouldn't be able to live comfortably, as well as having to help your kid go to uni.

yeh i think thats a fucking pisstake, my dad was on 32k in his old job and my step mother earned fuck all and we still struggled and he was jsut below the highest taxing barrier for wages!

luckily (funniley enough) he got sacked and had a year of "unemployment" where he was a self employed plumber + electrician (my dad is master of everything) which means i get full loan and my fees paid for my first year at uni which is good.

but what is better now is my dad works in russia as an advisor for a big chromium company and is making like 65k, of which he gets half in cash to avoid tax (bletently from the russian mafia) so now he can support me through uni next year but i wudnt be sure he would of been able to if he was still in his same job and i would of been rate fucked!

quote:

Originally posted by Ste yeh i think thats a fucking pisstake, my dad was on 32k in his old job and my step mother earned fuck all and we still struggled and he was jsut below the highest taxing barrier for wages! luckily (funniley enough) he got sacked and had a year of "unemployment" where he was a self employed plumber + electrician (my dad is master of everything) which means i get full loan and my fees paid for my first year at uni which is good. but what is better now is my dad works in russia as an advisor for a big chromium company and is making like 65k, of which he gets half in cash to avoid tax (bletently from the russian mafia) so now he can support me through uni next year but i wudnt be sure he would of been able to if he was still in his same job and i would of been rate fucked!

it just goes to show how the system is fucked up. i think you get taxed 22% of your wages if you earn between 20-35k and 40% if you earn more that that. and good stuff with your dad getting paid loads in cash

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