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-- EU 15 to EU 25
EU 15 to EU 25
This next Saturday 1st of May the European Union will have 10 new members. What are in your opinion the advantages and disadvantages of this new ampliation?� Discuss.
Some facts of the new ten members(2002):
____________Population (milions)_____GDP (bilion �)_____GDP p/c �
Poland ................. 38.2 .................... 363 ................ 9500
Czech Republic ........ 10.2 ................. 146.9 ................ 14400
Hungary ............... 10.2 ................... 138.2 ................ 13600
Slovakia .............. 5.4 .................... 61.3 ................. 11400
Slovenia .............. 2.0 .................... 35.3 ................. 17700
Lithuania .............. 3.5 .................... 34.3 ................. 9400
Latvia ................. 2.4 .................... 19.9 ................. 8500
Cyprus ................ 0.8 .................... 14 ................... 17400
Estonia ............... 1.4 .................... 13.5 ................. 10000
Malta ................. 0.4 .................... 4.6 .................. 11700
EU 15 ................. 378.4 .................. 9166.5 ............... 24010
Acceding 10 ........... 74.3 ................... 831 .................. 11150
EU 25 ................. 452.7 .................. 9997.5 ............... 21910
i think it's great for the new countries. i also hope that this will bring a new agriculture policy, since it seem hard to keep the old sucky one. and perhaps also a new decision system, cause now it will be even slower with so many countries who want to have their opinion.
but i'm all for this, it will be a great development for the eastern countries and also good for europe as a whole.
St_Andrew: i hope so 
Personally I think it's a rather unwise decision to let the new members in before the agreement is made upon the EU constitution. Bringing in 10 additional members will make the project far more difficult.
Besides, who the hell let those damn slovenians in 5 years before Croatia?!!! Bastards!!
Do you guys haze?
.....hmm scared about it but well now it's done ....just think about how messy will be the meetings ....it was hard to agree at 15 but at 25 it gonna be worse ....and to you know who 
sorry about last nite got a lot of probs with my computer but we'll discuss about all this later 
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| Originally posted by St_Andrew i also hope that this will bring a new agriculture policy, since it seem hard to keep the old sucky one. |
mainly with POland.
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| Originally posted by UnBracKo I'm scared about that mainly with POland.I explain... in Poland the share of agriculture as percentage of gross added value is too low: 3.1*. But the problem is that in Poland many ppl work in the country, the percentage of agriculture workers is 19.6* out of the total. Conclusion: an inefficient sector. And what does it mean?� Well they are a medium-big country and easely they can demmand things to the E.U. so for sure they will demmand subsidies for their agriculture sector and it means less money for Spain, Ireland, Greece, Portugal... traditional recipient countries. Just a note, the E.U.'s agriculture subsidies are the most high out of all the subsidies they give. We have to wait but we will have many problems with this topic (Agriculture - Poland) edit: (*) year 2002 |
The simple fact is that in Western society, we have a higher cost of living and agriculture just can not cut it. In the United States here things are just as bad. In my state, North Dakota, the number one producer of our income is agriculture (mainly in durum wheat). Our subsidies just for our state reach nearly 1.3 billion dollars a year for only 655,000 people in this region.
Well the only thing that can be done for agriculture is to diversify into more profitable cash crops (soybeans, tobacco, cattle, etc) or reduce production causing prices to increase. (Cutting food production helped the US get out of the Great Depression of the 1930s)
Heh, seems like trance is kinda popular in North Dakota these days...You're the 3rd person that's been living there and is visiting these forums. What town are you from?
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| Originally posted by DrUg_Tit0 Besides, who the hell let those damn slovenians in 5 years before Croatia?!!! Bastards!! |
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| Originally posted by DrUg_Tit0 Heh, seems like trance is kinda popular in North Dakota these days...You're the 3rd person that's been living there and is visiting these forums. What town are you from? |
The expansion of the EU is just following the trend of globalisation on a continental scale. Due to matters I won't divulge into in this post, today's worker cares little for his nationality and more for his income, widening the EU means people can ply their trade in 24 other countries with no hassle.
It also means that the EU should progress quicker in economic and social policy while reducing expenditure on what sould be less essential policies such as defense.
It also hopefully follows the strength in numbers adage, with 25 countires under one common banner, Europe should have the strength financially, industrially and militarily to stand up as an equal to America & rising powers such as China & India.
Obiously the disadvantages are massive change in European policy will be needed from the outset, the bureacracy will go through the roof & it will be much harder to push through any major policy on the fact 25 countries have to agree with it.
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| Originally posted by Dupz lol, if it's going to take 5 years for hrvatska to get into the EU imagine how long it'll take us poor serbs to get in.. hehe, we just fight to much to worry about this EU business, true?... |
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| Originally posted by Reverend_Trance Well, I bet those other two people from ND were my friends who introduced me to trance. I am from Fargo. |
If Poland joining forces the EU to reform the CAP then I'm all for it. Summat stupid like 50% of the entire EU budget is spent on CAP! Just think what we could achieve with that extra money?! Add that to the fact that farmers are my second most hated profession, second only to bus drivers/train conductors.
One major problem we are likely to encounter is voting and efficiency in the main bodies. I think QMV needs to replace unianimous voting in all areas for the EU to have a chance at moving forward
I don't know a whole lot about European politics and the growth of the EU, but I was just curious if the Euro will be cheaper or more expensive to buy now with American or Canadian currency with the addition of 10 more countries??
ok, so I just rapidly read "all" the posts in this thread, and I saw the word 'agriculture' a couple times. I just have to add that: In Sweden we have a strange way of looking at agriculture. Swedish want Swedish food (probably because we have pretty strict rules about agriculture), but they laugh att "those stupid farmers", and it's not accepted to work with anything that has something to do with agriculture. kinda stupid, and here we don't pay farmers anything either. kinda sad...
fucked up world, ain't it?
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| Originally posted by CraveTheRave I don't know a whole lot about European politics and the growth of the EU, but I was just curious if the Euro will be cheaper or more expensive to buy now with American or Canadian currency with the addition of 10 more countries?? |
| quote: |
| Originally posted by hyped_Lp ok, so I just rapidly read "all" the posts in this thread, and I saw the word 'agriculture' a couple times. I just have to add that: In Sweden we have a strange way of looking at agriculture. Swedish want Swedish food (probably because we have pretty strict rules about agriculture), but they laugh att "those stupid farmers", and it's not accepted to work with anything that has something to do with agriculture. kinda stupid, and here we don't pay farmers anything either. kinda sad... fucked up world, ain't it? |
| quote: |
| Originally posted by CraveTheRave I don't know a whole lot about European politics and the growth of the EU, but I was just curious if the Euro will be cheaper or more expensive to buy now with American or Canadian currency with the addition of 10 more countries?? |
The interesting thing about the new members is that they bring a whole new dynamic to the EU - the populations of eastern Europe aren't as "gung ho" about the Union as the core states. I wonder what effect this will have on future policies. It seems to me that the "two-speed" EU has already become a reality, and that it can only continue to be this way for quite some time. Britain's vote on the European constitution could further exacerbate the situation if they vote "no." You'll have the French and the Germans who want to move forward, and a whole bunch other states that say, "wait a minute here, we didn't sign on for this."
As an American, I support a broad EU as an economic market. I think the expansion is a good thing. Open policies, market reforms, etc. will spur growth and bind nations into peaceful relations. I get a little jittery, however, when I see Brussels eurocrats making policies about which they have little understanding, particularly reforms which strike at the heart of cultural and social issues. It concerns me even more when I see the slow pace at which the Union is democratizing. When there are multiple levels of bureaucrats, it's difficult to hold someone accountable for an idiotic policy. It can leave many people to wonder, who holds the power?
Here are some pictures from Poland yesterday. Their "no EU" rally was quite large. The last picture is interesting, since when it comes to the Soviets, I think the Poles have a pretty good idea of what they're talking about.
I paretly agree with you, EU is doing to much it really shouldn't mind at all. also eu don't do things that it really should do.
what i think the problem is that the decission making system with the minister council really sucks. what EU needs is a federal government, elected by the people of the EU. that would speed up the whole process in the EU and make it dare to do things that perhaps not all countries like...
and as for poland comparing EU with sovjet, i can in a way understand them, they have been under opression from a state for a long time, and now they will just join another "opressor", of course you cannot compare the two of them, but it's just the thing that they are not totally independent anymore. i understand them, but i don't agree with them, and also, there was a lot of pro EU rallies in those countries and they all voted in favor of EU with a great majority.
Let the suspicions begin - http://news.scotsman.com/latest.cfm?id=2868127
After the Flag Waving ... Eu's 25 Prepare for New Reality
Cheers were still ringing out across the Continent today as the 10 new EU member countries celebrated the dawn of their second day inside the gates the Europe.
Signalling the way forward, Prime Minister Tony Blair was meeting the European Council President, Irish premier Bertie Ahern, to discuss the future of the constitution.
But in the shadows of the 25 flags which were raised together for the first time yesterday to mark the historic occasion, British camps remained bitterly divided over the newly-enlarged bloc.
Fears that the UK will become a target for thousands of immigrants from the impoverished East European states weighed heavily on the minds of many.
Lurking behind the welcoming smiles were concerns at inevitable wrangling over the new constitution, especially in light of the Prime Minister�s dramatic U-turn over holding a referendum on the treaty.
On the other side of the coin was a united Britain happy to join its contemporaries in throwing open the gates of the European Union for 10 somewhat economically frail countries.
Their inhabitants know they are not in the front rank in terms of work, pay, education, social benefits and standard of living.
The 10 nations � Poland, Hungary, the Czech Republic, Slovakia, Slovenia, Lithuania, Latvia, Estonia, Cyprus and Malta � officially became members after midnight on Friday in central Europe.
Hundreds of Eastern Europeans started to head to British shores by bus, boat and plane the moment their countries officially joined the EU.
Mr Blair, who has made allies among the 10 so-called �accession� countries, was determined to put on a brave face, insisting the expansion was �good news for Europe and good news for Britain�.
�People are bound to be worried because this is a big change in Europe. Instead of 15 countries you have 25,� he said. �But I think our duty is to try and point out to people that these concerns can be exaggerated and we can overcome them.
�Now that is not to say we don�t still have to take the measures to deal with the concerns � which is why we have taken the measures we have about benefits and social housing and so on.
�But ultimately this will be to the benefit of our country as well as these new countries. It is a good thing in terms of our security, it is a good thing in terms of our trade and our commerce and our jobs.�
Refusing to be swayed by any doubts over his merry-go-round of decisions concerning a referendum on the constitution Mr Blair said it was �vital� that the UK remains in its �rightful place at the centre of European decision-making�.
He said: �The important thing for Britain is always to maintain our position at the centre of decision-making so we have the influence over the decisions that affect us.�
He joined fellow European Union leaders last night in a show of unity as they celebrated the group�s historic expansion at a ceremonial summit in Dublin.
Mr Ahern, as current European Council President and host, was quick to back the Prime Minister in celebrating the dramatic and historic expansion of the EU and wished the 10 new members �a hundred, thousand welcomes�.
But ripples of tension were already starting to surface between the leaders themselves.
British �prejudice� against immigrants from the new EU countries was condemned by the President of the European Parliament � Ireland�s Pat Cox.
He said at the Dublin summit that he was �sickened� by some coverage in the UK of the historic enlargement from 15 to 25 members.
He dismissed fears of the enlargement�s impact as �a very British question� and added: �We must be evidence led and not prejudice led.�
French President Jacques Chirac was said to be particularly angry over Mr Blair�s dramatic change of heart over a referendum as the switch puts him under pressure to hold his own poll.
However, Mr Ahern, who has set a June deadline for finalising the Constitution, swept concerns under the rug and said he hoped an agreement will be struck as soon as possible.
---------- Intriguing stuff indeed, this was the funniest part "Hundreds of Eastern Europeans started to head to British shores by bus, boat and plane the moment their countries officially joined the EU" I wonder what the Brits on here make of this.
I give the EU 10 years till it falls apart. Unless Brussels realizes that this is a trading block and that they have no bussiness in the cultural and social affairs of any other countries.
I also don't think France, Germany and Netherlands will be able to shell out more cash for infrastructure in the east, their already running 3% budget defeciets.
In the up coming referendums I'm saying that the UK, Netherlands, Denmark and Poland will all reject the EU constitution.
Enough of Brussels trying to run are countries, this will spread nationalism even more in europe as if all these bloody African immigrants aren't causing it to increase already.
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