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Does Racism Exist In All Of Us?

A moment of honesty, if I may.
I would like to appologize in advance to anyone I might offend with this post, it is not my intention.


I was wondering... Does true Humanizm truely exist? Is there anyone truely "Pure" of racism?

I would demonstrate:

As a person, I sometimes run into situations where I intuitively have a racist or inhuman thuough in my mind, which might relate, for example, to Black people being primitive, to the Palestinian people people being truely inferior and so on and so forth.

A moment after, I (Metaphorically) slap myself and tell myself it is ofcourse untrue, that humans are all equal and deserve the same treatment from me. I would act accordingly.

So I raise a few questions I'd like to get some opinions of:

-Is anything wrong with me?
-Is this a common case?
-Does that mean I am not truely a humanist?
-Does one ever have a chance of shaking of influeces that might have affected him since his infant stages, printing in his mind values he would later learn to despise?


Penny for your thoughts

hmm.. now where did I leave that ten foot pole...





btw the french are inferior there is no doubt in my mind

I think it's natural for the human mind to categorize things. It's certainly natural for the human mind to pick out differences among things. Augmented by society and culture, you attach beliefs and stigmas to these differences.

I would say that it's unnatural for a human mind to be completely devoid of racial thought. But that doesn't make you a racist.

I would say yes. Simply because although we might not cognitively be "racist" (although I think racist is the incorrect term to use), I believe that many of us are instinctually prejudiced to form preconceived notions (or rather preconceived wariness/caution) when it comes to groups of people we are not familiar with.

I don't really believe in "race". There is no genetic evidence of such a trait, nor is there any other objective standard by which to classify individuals into "races." Hence, racial categorizations are devoid of meaning. If you realize this, it should be easy to (and perhaps difficult not to) recognize "racist" propositions as non sequitur.

I don't think there is anything wrong with you, and the phenomenon you describe is likely quite prevalent. Since you recognize the fallacy in these thoughts, I don't see how it would disqualify you from being a humanist.

The last question is a bit more interesting:

quote:

-Does one ever have a chance of shaking of influeces that might have affected him since his infant stages, printing in his mind values he would later learn to despise?

The short answer: yes. Nietzsche was raised by fanatically Lutheran parents but went on to be one of the most notorious atheists in history. It's obviously difficult, but the hardest step is actually realizing how misguided those values are.

I'm not even convinced you have a problem of that nature, however. The mere act of considering some proposition does not mean you are predisposed to believe that that proposition is true. I consider race-based propositions all the time, but it never even occurs to me that they could be true because I know the underlying concept is absurd. It seems rather like being asdfist, whereby you are prejudiced against people with certain asdf.

As a result, I wouldn't say that racism exists in all of us because I don't believe I possess it myself. Personally, before I start feeling prejudiced against someone I need a reason. Race cannot be a reason, since I have no objective way to ascertain their race if in fact such a thing did exist.

Biologically I believe we are in fact imprinted with some degree of instinctual "racism." I don't believe it to be on a conscious level of hating other "races," but on a subconscious level of being cautious of those that are different. Throughout nature there is a tendency at every level, from immune system reaction to a bear defending her cubs, to either attack or be extremely weary of what we do not consider "self." I believe that his carries over to humans in the form of an almost intrinsic "uneasiness" by even the most racially aware individuals around those that do not share a set of common physical traits and social identities.

I do however think that our society continues to emphasize our differences on a "racial" level. From affirmative action to hate crime laws, for better or worse, we continue to play upon our phenotypical differences.

If you want to find a perfect example of the "natural" segregation that we find ourselves performing, look at a college campus. Even though a college community I believe has the best hope of a completely homogeneous mixture of the races, I have never found this to be the case. Although you will find this mixture on a more academic level, outside the classroom, blacks associate with blacks, Asians with Asians, whites with whites, etc. Although as I said before, our culture and society does play a part in this segregation, I also believe it to be a function of our biology. We are more comfortable around people that are the most closely related to "self."

The human being is so varied in innumerable categories that we tend to identify with what is obviously more familiar to us based on our experiences from the day we were born.

I'm originally from South America but would be identified today as African-American and yet have a different experience and background than what many blacks in the U.S. can identify with. Hence I'm into trance, strong interest in different cultures and languages along with travel, etc.

I am the ultimate humanist as best as is possible. I try to respect others no matter how different and if they are cool then we can chill, if not oh well. I myself still tend to prejudge people such as when I see German rappers and yet I am not a fan of most hip-hop today. See we all tend to be judgemental, it's only human the key is to be able to move pass that.

I'm an equal opportunity racist. I hate everyone

I'd agree with the most and say that there is some inherent racism in all of us. We always tend to generalize things, it makes life easier because it's practically impossible to examine every single item in existance as a stand-alone entitiy. For example, if someone throws a knife at you, you'll instinctively generalize it's a harmful steel sharp knife and duck, although in reality it may be a plastic imitation. Same goes for people, we all generalize that nazis are evil, slovenians are assholes and that kind of stuff, even if it is not always true.

Btw, nice to see you back.

quote:

Originally posted by DrUg_Tit0 Btw, nice to see you back.

Thanks Someone must've switched the "Standby" button on the back of my head again

I have that problem with blacks although I'm married to an Asian.
Go figure....


[[[smoke]]]

I think almost everyone has been racist in at least one moment of their life. Some then learn to be tolerant yet some do not...

I dont buy it.

To say that racism is somehow 'in the blood' is very dubious. 'Self-interest' however is in the blood and self-interest or its expression is expressed collectively through race, ethnicity or state.

Children arent racists it is something that is taught.

The best and easiest way to determine "the haves" from the "have nots" is by race and sex. In other words racism and sexism are at root economic judgements and the perpetuation of it although not admitted is economic.

Underlying ALL ethnic conflicts are economic agendas. Of course people dont ever admit that. Leaders like to think that they are decent and selfless so actions taken which are at core indecent and selfish (such as stealing anothers land or enslaving others)have to be framed both to convince onceself and others that it isnt so bad.

Therefore racism gets promoted by the politicians as a justification for their actions and becomes incorporated and permeated into the culture just as economic inequality becomes entrenched in a racist society.

No one wants to give up what they have even if what they have gained is illegitimate so racist beliefs once established as legitimate by the ruling elite becomes extremely difficult to eradicate. Racism is not the state of nature, selfishness is. And racism is a justification for selfish behaviour. But it is not necessary to racist in order to be selfish.

Good topic....

But heres a question...Do you know the first evidence of racism on paper?

quote:

Originally posted by sufee_b Good topic.... But heres a question...Do you know the first evidence of racism on paper?

Black ink on a white piece of paper, crumpled up and dropped in a sandbox by some slanty eyed Asian computer programmer?

well this is an interesting topic.

-Is anything wrong with me?

I wouldnt say so. I think its a natural tendency being brought up in a society where race is still an issue and black slavery was abolished not too long ago.

-Is this a common case?

?

-Does that mean I am not truely a humanist?

Try not to focus on race. Dont stereotype and dont judge others by the way they look. Judge them by who they are as an individual.

-Does one ever have a chance of shaking off influeces that might have affected him since his infant stages, printing in his mind values he would later learn to despise?


Yea, sure why not. You are who you are by your 1. genetics, 2. environment. So your influences from environment can be changed.

quote:

Originally posted by Shakka Black ink on a white piece of paper, crumpled up and dropped in a sandbox by some slanty eyed Asian computer programmer?

without actually knowing you, it is hard to say.

Personally, i hate being politically correct all the time.
I make fun of everyone equally. The thing with me is, i won't say something about someone that i don't have the guts to say it to their face.

Taking a Jap class right now, and the whole class is pretty much diverse. We make fun of each other all the time and it is all fun and giggles. We figure it is good to make fun, and not take the whole race thing to serious.
Latino, by the way, but i like to consider my self much more thant just that.

We are all more alike than we are different. my .02

-dreamer

There is no such thing as race as someone said before.

But their are such things as evolution. Some people veiw different kinds of people to be more evolved than others.

Neitzche and Darwin listed sub-saharan Africans as the lowest humans can get in evolution. And they listed Germanics(Germans, Dutch, English, Danes, Norweigens and Swedes) and all their decensdantes as the most evolved people.

These are people who have shaped are lives today. I would not call myself a racist for believing in these thoughts. But you have to look at history and see that Sub-saharan Africans have not contributed to any advancement in human kind. Personally I blame them for destroying the Egyptian Civilization.

This is not hatred but I don't think that foreign aid, and blaming europeans for all of africa's problems are solutions to the African problem either.

quote:

Originally posted by TranceMessiah There is no such thing as race as someone said before.

Well, all dogs are dogs, but there still are retrievers, huskies and all other varieties. Race is not an absolute term, but it can be somewhat of a guideline.

quote:

But their are such things as evolution. Some people veiw different kinds of people to be more evolved than others.

Yes, but that doesn't have much to do with race.

quote:

Neitzche and Darwin listed sub-saharan Africans as the lowest humans can get in evolution. And they listed Germanics(Germans, Dutch, English, Danes, Norweigens and Swedes) and all their decensdantes as the most evolved people.

Darwin and Nietzche??? AFAIK, Darwin had not drawn any such conclusions, and neither did Nietzche, although his works were later misinterpreted by the nazis in order to make it seem that way.

quote:

These are people who have shaped are lives today.

Along with romans, greeks, babylonians, egyptians, mongols, slavs, chinese, indians...it's more likely a pure coincidence. Up until 1000 years ago, germanic nations were among the least developed in the world.

quote:

I would not call myself a racist for believing in these thoughts. But you have to look at history and see that Sub-saharan Africans have not contributed to any advancement in human kind.

Agreed, but that doesn't count as a proof of their genetic inferiority. Take for example Poland and Moldavia. They're both genetically the same people, yet Poland has contributed more to the civilization development. Not to mention that Poland is a prosperous EU country, while Moldavia is a 3rd world one.

quote:

Personally I blame them for destroying the Egyptian Civilization.

Erm, last thing I remember is that it was the romans who destroyed Egypt in 525BC.

quote:

This is not hatred but I don't think that foreign aid, and blaming europeans for all of africa's problems are solutions to the African problem either.

Definitely not blaming europeans, personally I think those countries were much better off under colonial rule. But foreign aid is the only way those countries can be reshaped into semi-modern nations.

Fact: Australians are more highly evolved than New Zealanders.

Darwim and Neitzche are known racists. Fredrick Neitzche's teachings are used by Neo-facist all over western europe. Where have you been the last 5 years.I'm not saying that I agree with this, but both say that europeans are superior.

Egypt 525 BC what are you taking about? After conquest by Alexander the Great in 332 Egypt was permantly under foreign rule.

Decline of Egypt was due to Nubian kingdom of Kush which conqured Egypt in 712BC, Egypt was never able to regain streght after that. Nubians were origianlly slaves of the Egyptians, but due to power gained by the Semites in politics in Egypt, Nubians were givin eqaul rights in Egypt and eventually stabbed Egypt in the back.

Germans were a new people they just migrated to europe from the black sea region due to flooding a few hundred years before Rome was established. Modern europeans came from the black sea region. And were also pushed west due to Nomadic Turkish invasions.

Let me ask you one question who do you think looks more like the human ancestors a sub-saharan African or a German?

Oh ya and Polish and Moldavians are not the same. Moldavians are Romani notice the resemblince in flags between the two countries, they speak Romanian and are Romanian orthodox. Poland is made up of Germans, Balts and Slavs not at all close to Moldavians, and the language is hardly similar.

nietzsche regarded most humans as herd animals, is this racism? No. You may aswell brand him as a misanthropist.

www.friesian.com/nietzsch.htm

Read please.

Listen to this qoute by Nietzsch "the negro represents and earlier phase in human development", So am I wrong know for calling him a racist?

Technically speaking, both Nietzsche and Darwin were correct when classifying Africans and evolutionary precursors of so-called European "Caucasians." It's a simple matter of examining the genome of both individuals. Every chromosome has dangling telomeres that are very often not reproduced during meiosis. After several hundred generations, parts of these coding areas are lost. The loss of pigment, the loss of lactose allergy and the loss of natural histamine immunity are all traceable to these lost telomeres. I'm not about to say one is better or higher than the other, but in terms of pure evolutionary history, blacks did come before whites.

Another topic completely, but many of the mechanisms that Darwin uses to explain natural selection have been proven false, such as limited resource competition and his population growth models. However we still preach Darwin as the evolutionary truth sayer. Hopefully in the next generation the real driving forces behind evolution will be taught to all science students, not just those in upper level biology classes at major universities. Teaching Darwin as the absolute truth is teaching old science. You want to know what the only two "driving" forces in evolution are? Heterochrony and luck.

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