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-- How is this percussion made?

How is this percussion made?

Last couple of days i tried to figuring out this drumtrack.

http://members.lycos.nl/eendducky/drumloop.mp3


In the beginning i thought it was

K---K---K---K
----C-------C
--RR--RR--RR-

K=kick
C=Clap
R=Rimshot

But when i tried it myself the rimshot didnt sounded as it should be.

So know i think it maybe can archieved with lot of delay on the rimshot and have it like this:

K---K---K---K
----C-------C
--R---R---R--

I would appreciate it if someone could say if im right and if not could you please help me how to make this.

Thx in advance!

Also i would like to know how exactly that rimshot can be made.

you were right the first time but the 2nd rimshot is a little quieter than the 1st one. To get the rim to sound like that, the producer used FX.. eqing primarily..

Sounds more like a snare than a clap but with getting the rims in the right spot, if they aren't fitting quite right, you might need to adjust the shuffle.

quote:

Originally posted by alanzo you were right the first time but the 2nd rimshot is a little quieter than the 1st one. To get the rim to sound like that, the producer used FX.. eqing primarily..

But it doesnt mather how the original rimshot sample sounds?
And i think i have to cut it verry low am i right?

quote:

Sounds more like a snare than a clap but with getting the rims in the right spot, if they aren't fitting quite right, you might need to adjust the shuffle.

So snare with lots of reverb and after that trying to fit the rims in it.But what about the shuffle what does it do?

------------------------------------------------------

I've made 2 examples in the way i thought how it should be made i will post it in the weekend.

where can i actually get the sound of rimshot?

bren-f's sample pack has a few..

quote:

Originally posted by BIKKEL So snare with lots of reverb and after that trying to fit the rims in it.But what about the shuffle what does it do?

Yeah, snare with reverb.

Shuffle makes the percussion just a little out of position i guess. It's kinda hard to explain, but it alters the ryhtem of the drum machine. It is only available on internal sequencers, not in host sequencers. Most drum machines with an internal sequencer will have it.

Re: How is this percussion made?

quote:

Originally posted by BIKKEL Last couple of days i tried to figuring out this drumtrack. http://members.lycos.nl/eendducky/drumloop.mp3 In the beginning i thought it was K---K---K---K ----C-------C --RR--RR--RR-

this is the pattern used here, but the second rimshot was a bit quieter.
Maybe the pattern was even something like
k---k---k---k---
----c-------c---
rrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

you can do it in more than one way; personally, i would play the rimshots at different velocity - if the beat is heavily compressed (10 or more dB of gain reduction) the first one would go at velocity 100, and the second one at velocity 5 to 10. if the compression is not that hard, it might be 100 and 40,50. experiment. the
velocities, along with the timing, are the key to a good groove.

then, the velocities for the first four rimshots would be:
50-15-100-60

and, of course, you can use delay as an insert on a rimshot channel, set to a single echo - to me, this is a complete waste of channels and resources most of the time.

quote:

Originally posted by alanzo bren-f's sample pack has a few..

thanks alot
Rem i had d/l his stuff.

quote:

Originally posted by hey cheggy Yeah, snare with reverb. Shuffle makes the percussion just a little out of position i guess. It's kinda hard to explain, but it alters the ryhtem of the drum machine. It is only available on internal sequencers, not in host sequencers. Most drum machines with an internal sequencer will have it.

cubase has pretty powerful quantize options, available both as menu options or as a midi plugin which changes the timings of midi notes in real time - shuffle being one of them. btw, the randomize function simply kicks ass.

shuffle makes the beats out of positions, but not all of them.
for instance, you have 4 16ths playing closed hats.

cccc

lets assume that time difference between each one of them is 100 our time units (milliseconds, frames, something. whatever).

100-100-100-100

the pattern is 400 units long. with a pretty hard shuffle it will be something like:

60-140-60-140

as you can see, the second and fourth hat are played a little before than they would if rigidly quantized. this is all very nicely graphically laid out in the quantize setup menu in cubase. hope it helps.

Re: Re: How is this percussion made?

quote:

Originally posted by h.vox this is the pattern used here, but the second rimshot was a bit quieter. Maybe the pattern was even something like k---k---k---k--- ----c-------c--- rrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr you can do it in more than one way; personally, i would play the rimshots at different velocity - if the beat is heavily compressed (10 or more dB of gain reduction) the first one would go at velocity 100, and the second one at velocity 5 to 10. if the compression is not that hard, it might be 100 and 40,50. experiment. the velocities, along with the timing, are the key to a good groove. then, the velocities for the first four rimshots would be: 50-15-100-60 and, of course, you can use delay as an insert on a rimshot channel, set to a single echo - to me, this is a complete waste of channels and resources most of the time.

But if you do the rimshot like your example isnt the rimshot going to fast?

Ill will try to ecperiment with the shuffle option in reason.
One last question about the compressor is het better to compressor everyting at once or kick snare together - hihats together and percusiion with rimshot together?

Re: Re: Re: How is this percussion made?

quote:

Originally posted by BIKKEL But if you do the rimshot like your example isnt the rimshot going to fast?

not really, because the velocity of the 2nd rim is really low. experiment - it has to be near the threshold of hearing, just to add some roll to the beat.

quote:

Ill will try to ecperiment with the shuffle option in reason. One last question about the compressor is het better to compressor everyting at once or kick snare together - hihats together and percusiion with rimshot together?

never compress just kick and snare together - when the snare plays along with the kick, the kick will be softer, and i dont think you want that. you can get away with it when you compress the whole beat, however. experiment. i know it is a bit harder to practice compressing in reason, but that's the only way.

Re: Re: Re: Re: How is this percussion made?

quote:

Originally posted by h.vox not really, because the velocity of the 2nd rim is really low. experiment - it has to be near the threshold of hearing, just to add some roll to the beat. never compress just kick and snare together - when the snare plays along with the kick, the kick will be softer, and i dont think you want that. you can get away with it when you compress the whole beat, however. experiment. i know it is a bit harder to practice compressing in reason, but that's the only way.

Mostly with i compress the whole beat i get the feeling thats its not beloing together especially with the hihats so i thought maybe i had to compress them together(the hihats)!

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: How is this percussion made?

quote:

Originally posted by BIKKEL Mostly with i compress the whole beat i get the feeling thats its not beloing together especially with the hihats so i thought maybe i had to compress them together(the hihats)!

rather try to eq the hats, for starters put a highpass filter at 4000 hz, and add some very short (50 msec or so) reverb. then you may try to compress the hats, but i wouldn't suggest using more than 6 dB gain reduction. at least not for start.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: How is this percussion made?

quote:

Originally posted by h.vox rather try to eq the hats, for starters put a highpass filter at 4000 hz, and add some very short (50 msec or so) reverb. then you may try to compress the hats, but i wouldn't suggest using more than 6 dB gain reduction. at least not for start.

SO just compressing the whole beat

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: How is this percussion made?

I tried to eq the rimshot but still dont get close to that sound, so is there someone who knows around which frequicy i must eq to get that rimshot effect?

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