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-- Did the Jews steal Christmas? (...and i used to like Bill O'Reilly)
Did the Jews steal Christmas? (...and i used to like Bill O'Reilly)
Did the Jews steal Christmas?
By M.J. Rosenberg December 23, 2004
It's hard to believe but there is a movement among elements of the extreme right to attack American Jews for "taking Christ out of Christmas." These ugly manifestations are filling the talk radio air waves and far-right websites.
But the most alarming attacks are coming from Bill O'Reilly at Fox News, the most widely watched political commentator on cable. His latest crusade is against the trend toward wishing people "Happy Holidays "rather than "Merry Christmas." His outrage was spurred by the Macy's department store which is now using the religiously neutral term.
And he's been going on and on about it, with little effort to disguise who he considers guilty. Things came to a head when a Jewish caller said that he was concerned not so much about Christmas but about people at his college trying "to convert me to Christianity."
Here is O'Reilly's response -- heard by his millions of viewers: "All right. Well, what I'm tellin' you, is I think you're takin' it too seriously. You have a predominantly Christian nation. You have a federal holiday based on the philosopher Jesus. And you don't wanna hear about it? Come on -- if you are really offended, you gotta go to Israel then. I mean because we live in a country founded on Judeo -- and that's your guys' -- Christian, that's my guys' philosophy. But overwhelmingly, America is Christian. And the holiday is a federal holiday honoring the philosopher Jesus. So, you don't wanna hear about it? Impossible. And that is an affront to the majority. You know, the majority can be insulted, too. And that's what this anti-Christmas thing is all about."
Abraham Foxman of the ADL responded with a letter and press release telling O'Reilly that his remarks play "into one of the oldest anti-Semitic canards about Jews, that they are not full citizens of a country and are not entitled to all of the rights afforded to the majority. The notion that religious minorities have no place in a Christian America and should leave may be acceptable for extremists, but it is unacceptable coming from a popular and respected media commentator."
That didn't stop O'Reilly. He told his viewers that Foxman is a "nut" and that the ADL is "a militant organization" -- which could, if "used" by secularists, cause a "backlash against Jewish Americans" which O'Reilly pledges "to make sure doesn't happen" (thanks, Bill!). Now Congresswoman Nita Lowey (D-NY) has joined Foxman and is circulating a letter to Fox demanding an apology from O'Reilly and is working to get her fellow House members to join her. No doubt, O'Reilly will have some choice things to say about Lowey who, of course, does not celebrate Christmas either.
And it's not just O'Reilly and Fox. On MSNBC last week William Donahue of the Catholic League insisted, "Hollywood is controlled by secular Jews who hate Christianity in general and Catholicism in particular. It's not a secret, OK? They like to see the public square without nativity scenes." Other pundits who have addressed the supposed anti-Christmas onslaught include Tony Snow, Morton Kondracke and Fred Barnes.
Perhaps the most cynical reaction to the whole affair comes from Charles Krauthammer who, in today's Washington Post , ridicules Jews -- and other non-Christians who are bothered by the erosion of the separation of church and state -- for displaying "profound ungenerosity toward a majority of fellow citizens who have shown such generosity of spirit toward minority religions."
This from a guy, so sensitive on Jewish matters, that he smears as hostile to Jews anyone who, say, states that Israel would be better off without the West Bank and Gaza or that Palestinians are as entitled to the same basic human rights as the rest of us. But anti-semitism from his ideological allies offends him not at all.
The hypocrisy is mind-numbing, but so is the idea that the O'Reillys and Krauthammers are so blind to just where their idea of American Jews as a tolerated minority could lead.
Foxman and Lowey deserve credit for taking on this issue. And so does the website MediaMatters which not only reports on what bigots are up to but allows you to watch or listen to the actual clips you were fortunate enough to miss when they first aired.
The bottom line is that this whole issue is a fake. No serious Christian is bothered by a Macy's clerk who wishes him "Happy Holidays" rather than "Merry Christmas" just as no serious Jew is offended by being wished a "Merry Christmas." The O'Reillys and others of his ilk are simply using one of the two holiest days on the Christian calendar to drive wedges between Americans. And that should offend us all.
Well if its got the ADL nutters wound up then thats funny at least...
But anyway, I think this is merely one of those 'PC gone mad' issues
Over here, its not the Jews that stole xmas, but the Muslims
People have to be PC nowadays for some reason and that means nothing that may offend minorities
What people dont realise is these minorities couldn't give two shits about whether summat is xmas or not (in fact all the Muslims I know celebrate xmas too, have a dinner or something, and maybe Jews in America do too, they get a few days off afterall so they might as well get into the spirit of things!)
Its actually white/christian people that decide such and such a council wont have a nativity scene, not angry Jews/Muslims demanding they take them down!
I think somebody should ask that O'Rielly guy if he's ever heard any Jews complaining about everyone else celebrating xmas...!
Also is Kwannza real? From what I can tell it is a B.S. holiday started in the 1960s by some Black Panther group.
| quote: |
| Originally posted by Reverend_Trance Also is Kwannza real? From what I can tell it is a B.S. holiday started in the 1960s by some Black Panther group. |
I think the funniest thing about this is that you actually liked O'Riley.
i with smiley - its PC gone to far... i have no problem telling people merry xmas neither do i get offended if someone says it to me, thier intentions are good. george, does this mean you agree along with me and Orielly? 
btw it reminds me of the movie "The Hebrew Hammer" anyone see it? a few good laughs in there.
Speaking as a Jew who lived in Israel for 13 years and then moved to Canada, I have to say that Hannukah is really not that big a deal. I'm pretty sure the North American jews tried to make it a bit more like christmass so their kids wouldn't feel left out. I never got gifts for Hannukah in israel, noone that I know did.
However, it should still be recognized as a holiday, since it is a religious one, and that would be part of our right to practice our religion.
So in conclusion, religion is crap and people should abolish it.
| quote: |
| Originally posted by razmataz I think the funniest thing about this is that you actually liked O'Riley. |
| quote: |
| Originally posted by Izzy i with smiley - its PC gone to far... i have no problem telling people merry xmas neither do i get offended if someone says it to me, thier intentions are good. george, does this mean you agree along with me and Orielly? btw it reminds me of the movie "The Hebrew Hammer" anyone see it? a few good laughs in there. |
I agree with my recently-moved-to-Palestine friend, Georgey.
Just like Mr. Rosenburg said:
| quote: |
The bottom line is that this whole issue is a fake. No serious Christian is bothered by a Macy's clerk who wishes him "Happy Holidays" rather than "Merry Christmas" just as no serious Jew is offended by being wished a "Merry Christmas." The O'Reillys and others of his ilk are simply using one of the two holiest days on the Christian calendar to drive wedges between Americans. And that should offend us all. |
I also find it amazing that you actually liked O'Reilly.
who cares, the christians stole it off the Son of Isis
seriously - how boring is monotheism 
That's right, B.S. fuckign article who the fuck would get offended specially in NYC where there are about 1/3 Jews 1/3 Christians and 1/3 muslims and such. Anyway GO NEW YEARS 
P.S. Hebrew Hammer was the funniest shit I've seen in my life.
I had a deep philosophical debate with a friend of mine about this very subject. It occured to us that people at university repeatedly confronted us with aggressive greetings ranging from the basic, abstract "Merry Christmas" to advanced, specific ones such as "Merry Xmas with little stress. I hope Santa brings you something fine this year. All the best to you and your family". It should be noted that we are Jewish, which made me ponder about the most adequate response to such verbal attacks.
I could be politically correct and avoiding any conflict by simply saying "thanks! to you too!"
I might go even further and fake Christian identity by responding "yeah, finally its coming, about time after all those stressful weeks. I expect high benefits from the good ol' fatty this year, too. Benn a good child!"
Or I could coldly say "Sorry, I'm Jewish, try again."
It gets even more complicated because many Christians here are unaware that Jews are NOT celebrating this holiday (which seems funny cause this is more or less the ONE big thing that seperates us). Which means that I would have to go on and carefully explain why we do not do so. Which I did last week. Which ended up in a shocking partly-naive-partly-intolerant-but-mainly-dumb answer: "But you live in Austria, Europe. Why don't you celebrate like everybody? It's nice to buy gifts for your loved ones, I dont understand you!".
I didn't know religion is geographically defined. And if the exchange of presents is the main stimulator, why don't you guys do it just-for-fun throughout the year?
Anyway, the most ironic thing about this whole affair is that the very greeting that sparked the whole debate was said to me by a girl, which I found out later, was Jewish as well, obviously not aware of my Jewish heritage, either.
And as if that was not enough of irony for you: Upon asking her how she would react when people wished her merry x-mas, she looked at me, all bewildered and asked: "What? You don't celebrate? Our family does, despite everything. It's a nice tradition."
Having said all that, I capitulate and wish the whole forum, regardless of religion, ethnicity etc....
Merry Fucking X-mas (yes, Im too late), Happy Hanuka (yes, Im too late) and a Happy New Year 2005!
jeez people getting pissed off because someone says merry christmas..what are they meant to do..interview you first or something..
O'Reilly isn't an anti-semite, I understand what he's saying, but as usual he can't express himself properly because he is a FUCKING IDIOT! 
He has won my Troll of the Year Award for 3 years running. Last person to win that award before O'Reilly was Al Gore... 
Well it seems for the most part we all agree....
Yoepus... i dont think you understood why i posted this article.
Not because i have a problem with people wishing me a Merry Christmas... not at all.
The only reason i posted this is because Bill O'R. decided to blame the minorities (specifically the jews of america) for the Political correctness of this holiday terminology.
And since we all agree that Bill' O'R is a fuckup for making such comments I'm sure we're all going o email FOX in regards to this issue. We shall join the masses in demanding a public apology to every minority in America who Bill has offended with his comments.
We will sit with our popcorn and wait till the old man says SORRY!
| quote: |
| Originally posted by dj_ilan_yosef Well it seems for the most part we all agree.... Yoepus... i dont think you understood why i posted this article. Not because i have a problem with people wishing me a Merry Christmas... not at all. The only reason i posted this is because Bill O'R. decided to blame the minorities (specifically the jews of america) for the Political correctness of this holiday terminology. And since we all agree that Bill' O'R is a fuckup for making such comments I'm sure we're all going o email FOX in regards to this issue. We shall join the masses in demanding a public apology to every minority in America who Bill has offended with his comments. We will sit with our popcorn and wait till the old man says SORRY! |
You think O'Reilly will talk about the secularists and Jews' War on Easter today?
I didn't realize how much of a wonderful Christian O'Reilly truly is here! I hope he starts this Easter defense immediately!
Sound the alarms Faux!
Religion sucks da cock... it sucks large
O'Reilly is a douchebag, what do you expect?
The Jews didn't steal christmas, the christians stole christmas. It's highly convenient that the council of Nicea choose December 25th as Jesus's birth especially since it competes with the major pagain holiday, Natalis Solis Invicti.
you only need to go around my local shopping mall to find out who stole christmas..
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