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Our antiquated liquor laws

If i were premier this is how id overhaul our repressive liquor laws:

- lower the age to 18. How can we justify allowing people to vote, drive, and go to war but not allow them to have a beer and a smoke? Pretty stupid in my opinion

- allow for private sale of liquor. I wouldnt sell off government liquor stores but id definately allow for some competition. Id also allow private companies to import whatever brand was in demand as long as proper duty was paid. Right now we have the government of Ontario deciding which brands can and cannot be sold. Pretty communist if you ask me.

- eliminating last call. Why do we still have last call? It baffles the mind. Last call was meant to get people home in time so that they could go to church the next day. Currently last call is the last relic of control that prohibitionists such as MADD have to hold onto. The sad part is that last call actually ENCOURAGES drunk driving and binge drinking. Get rid of it!

-Allow people to consume alcohol in public. If somebody is drinking beer or pop in public and gets rowdy then deal with the rowdyness. Whats the diff if a guy just had a beer on the sidewalk and is drunk or if he had a beer in a pub or house and is drunk? I think restricting people's activities is the wrong way to deal with this.

- lower the blood alcohol limit to .05 . Why? because .08 is too much and you should not really be driving at all if you had anything. Having said that, public transportation in places like Toronto should be stepped up on weekend nights so that there are alternatives to get around.

- Increase RIDE spotchecks all year round. Drinking and driving has no excuse. Enough said

- shift the onus onto the individual instead of the establishment if found in a club underage. Underagers know they shouldnt be there and if they lied/scammed/or fake ID'd their way into a club it isnt nec the club's fault. However it's ALWAYS the fault of the underager because they know better. Id put more money into undercover policing for underage drinkers and the drinkers or parents (since they are minors)would be charged, not the club. Lets put responsibilty back where it belongs. ON THE PERPETRATOR

here here!

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Originally posted by tha_broad here here!

Thats "+1" to you missy!

LOL

gah, so much for bein different!

quote:

Originally posted by tha_broad gah, so much for bein different!

Different baaaaaad





MUST








BE







LIKE






EVERYONE ELSE

AGREED!

the first step and biggest step needs to be deregulation. LCBO + beer store is a joke.

if only everyone here who agreed with this were voters. Then politicians would have to listen and do something (or at least make promises and then break them)

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 - eliminating last call. Why do we still have last call? It baffles the mind. Last call was meant to get people home in time so that they could go to church the next day. Currently last call is the last relic of control that prohibitionists such as MADD have to hold onto. The sad part is that last call actually ENCOURAGES drunk driving and binge drinking. Get rid of it!

When I was in the UK last they were trying to abolish last call in order to curb all the drunks all going home at the same time, creating fights in the streets, and generally being rowdy.

Re: Our antiquated liquor laws

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 The sad part is that last call actually ENCOURAGES drunk driving and binge drinking. Get rid of it!

Not only binge drinking, but drug use too. A lot people stay at clubs until 6am, especially when headliners don't come on until 4am. Some people feel the need to have a buzz the entire time they are at the club, and in most cases getting drugs is easier and cheaper than drinking. So I say abolish last call, and create a ceiling for drink prices!

Excellent suggestions all around!!!



Too bad they won't be implemented by the Lieberals. Reason: alcohol is forbidden in Islam, and they are pandering to the Muslim vote. Just wait until Sharia law is implemented...

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Originally posted by ShadoWolf Excellent suggestions all around!!! Too bad they won't be implemented by the Lieberals. Reason: alcohol is forbidden in Islam, and they are pandering to the Muslim vote. Just wait until Sharia law is implemented...

i dont quite think that is the reason. I think it's more because these laws have been around for so long that people think they are necissary when in fact they arent.

Also the federal liberals have nothing to do with booze laws.

agree,alcohol in blood alredy been lowered to 0.1 last summer.

but this country is all about restrictions,yet we look up to our neighbour and i can say the life out there is not that easy,its just us standing doggy style for a long time.

yet everyone whine about strict rules - noone will do anything.

agreed. people never actually do anything. In fact most people under 30 dont even vote! Its sad.

If people 18-30 voted and had these concerns then politicians would actually have to listen. Instead you get the senior citizens voting so politicians will let 5 of them cancel things like wakestock even though it attracts 40,000 young people. Why? Because those 40,000 young people dont care to vote or stand up for anything.

The only thing youth cares about if they care at all are way out ideas such as stopping globalization or other idealist visions. We should stop protesting george bush and start protesting those unsexy issues that impact our daily life.

true! well our mass-media "plays" the leading role in decision-making for voting and for issues that come up. starting from "building of bridge" and shortage of the doctors...

dont even listen to the mass media. They are full of shit. They have gone from reporting the news to manipulating how you think about the news.

If not building a bridge to the airport tp appease a few island whiners is really a huge toronto issue then toronto must be utopia.

Wow Jay, I actually agree with everything you said in this post.

Actually, I don't support privatization of liquor sales. Besides the fact that people always want to debate with the government and opt for the alternative for spite, I don't see any reason why to privatize it? LCBO's are clean, friendly, and organized - why fuck with a good thing? As if Canada does not already exhibit a multitude of America's commercial characteristics like "drive thru", walmarts, etc. Do we really need to have shady convenience stores selling liquor into the wee hours of the night?

The only reason I would support private sales is because LCBO has had serious problems managing and utilizing the proceeds from their liquor sales. As a key source or government revenue, it is critical issue how the money is spent.

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Originally posted by cap Actually, I don't support privatization of liquor sales. Besides the fact that people always want to debate with the government and opt for the alternative for spite, I don't see any reason why to privatize it? LCBO's are clean, friendly, and organized - why fuck with a good thing? As if Canada does not already exhibit a multitude of America's commercial characteristics like "drive thru", walmarts, etc. Do we really need to have shady convenience stores selling liquor into the wee hours of the night? The only reason I would support private sales is because LCBO has had serious problems managing and utilizing the proceeds from their liquor sales. As a key source or government revenue, it is critical issue how the money is spent.

I dont want privatization of the LCBO either. I want some competition for them. Big difference. I think busting the monopoly would be a good thing. Not to mention that it wouldnt take that much out of government revenue because what they dont mention when reporting all those juicy numbers is that most of what the LCBO makes is in taxes which would still be collected at private stores.

I agree w this post/thread.

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 I dont want privatization of the LCBO either. I want some competition for them. Big difference. I think busting the monopoly would be a good thing. Not to mention that it wouldnt take that much out of government revenue because what they dont mention when reporting all those juicy numbers is that most of what the LCBO makes is in taxes which would still be collected at private stores.

The purpose of competition is to force a companies to strive to beat each other, which, in turn causes companies to improve prices, service, etc.

But LCBO's prices are already on very strict profit margins. How much cheaper do you think other stores could charge for booze?

LCBO's service is good; the stores are clean, organized and always carry speciality beverages based on respected reviews and tasters.

The LCBO IS A monopoly, but sanctioned and benevolent. The LCBO is not like Microsoft or something...

I suppose it wouldn't hurt to add a few more stores selling alcohol just for availability sake, but I really worry about turning into America with drive-thru booze sales and convenience stores stocked with 40's of Lucky Force 10 next to the sprite.

cap, I fully agree...there's little benefit to anyone (government or consumers) to privatizing LCBO or the Beer Store. I'm fine with relaxing liquor laws...but why should we deregulate and sell off profitable government operations? Sure, a lot of that revenue is tax...but let's not kid ourselves here, there's a shitload of profit there too. I'm fine with that going into our coffers instead of some guy's pocket.

My main disagreement with Jayx1...while I *definitely* do think that more responsibility needs to be put onto individuals, I don't feel that shifting any responsibility away from proprietors is beneficial at all.

If someone is clearly wasted, they should be cut off...does the bar/club have to follow the person around and make sure their friends don't buy them a drink? no. I don't think there should be unconditional liability for proprietors, but in being licensed to serve alcohol, a drug, I don't have a problem with them being forced to serve it in a responsible manner as well. Profit motivation needs to be kept in check a little...the last thing we need are wait staff saying "aw come on, why not have one more" instead of cutting someone off

things you learn from reading this thread. ive only been to western canada and never futher than thunder bay but i cant believe that the government has a molopoly on the sale of liquor. over here the government has laws that alow them to control who sells it so we dont have corner shops selling it but hey there is alot of competition. i personally work at a liqour store and with the competition you can easily pick up things cheap. also we dont have a limit on whats to be sold we can stock anything we want as long as the people want it and it sells.

i agree that their should be some sort of controlled competition brought in.

just a question out of curiousity. whats the average price of products like vodka, bourbon, 24 of a full strength beer. etc in ontario. cheers

There's an interesting letter to the editor in the Star today (granted from a source biased toward the sale of the LCBO).

It mentions that one of the benefits of introducing private sales of liquor (not necessarily the complete dismantling of the LCBO) is greater product selection.

Apparently the LCBO offers some 13,000 or so items whereas in Alberta, some 21,000 items / varieties are available.

As for the comment "Do we really need to have shady convenience stores selling liquor into the wee hours of the night?", is society any worse off in places like Alberta or Quebec where this practice is permitted? I for one don't hear of any stories of exceptional numbers of drunkards roaming the streets in the wee hours as a result of increased availability any more than what already occurs here.

quote:

Originally posted by cap The purpose of competition is to force a companies to strive to beat each other, which, in turn causes companies to improve prices, service, etc. But LCBO's prices are already on very strict profit margins. How much cheaper do you think other stores could charge for booze? LCBO's service is good; the stores are clean, organized and always carry speciality beverages based on respected reviews and tasters. The LCBO IS A monopoly, but sanctioned and benevolent. The LCBO is not like Microsoft or something... I suppose it wouldn't hurt to add a few more stores selling alcohol just for availability sake, but I really worry about turning into America with drive-thru booze sales and convenience stores stocked with 40's of Lucky Force 10 next to the sprite.

Right and thats why when i go to the US or alberta prices are cheaper? There is nothing wrong with competition. Imagine if the government ran every other store without competition. What if the government decided which brands of clothes would be sold in Ontario? Thats the way it is with booze. There are all kinds of brands that are actually illegal in Ontario because the government has decided not to stock them. Thats why we need private outlets.

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