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-- DJ's, Unreleased Tracks, and the "I'm more connected than you" debate...

DJ's, Unreleased Tracks, and the "I'm more connected than you" debate...

Just pondering some issues I've been having with some members of the disc jockey community while I'm at work this miserable (Rain/Fog soaked) Sunday Morning...

Unreleased Tracks. Lots of people have got them whether they're bootlegs from HTFR or other sketchy record stores, given to you by a friend of a friend, maybe you know the producer, or you're somehow otherwise connected in the industry. It's always fun to have tracks that aren't out there yet for everyone to have. But what bothers me is how SOME (not all) DJ's act regarding their unreleased gems.

Case in point, last year, WMC, I had the opportunity to meet a fairly well known DJ **hint: currently running somewhere in the DJ Lists top 30 ** (Edit: BTW, who doesn't meet fairly well known DJ's at WMC, eh?) Got to talking, and over the course of the next month or two I was definitely hooked up with a few really solid tracks that I'd wanted for a while, but were either unreleased or not going to be released, definitely real cool, and in the cases of the tracks that did eventually become relased, I DID buy the release once available. Basically he was just glad that someone else was as stoked about these tracks as he was.

Now the converse...

I seem to meet/glad hand a fair number of moderate sized DJ's, maybe they're more on the production side of things, or are just a "Rising Star" ( ), but in any event, these are guys who aren't really up there, at least yet, but are somewhat making a splash in the scene right now, with potential to go far. But in general, when I meet these types of fellows it's completely the opposite. It's like the attitude is "I've got to hoard my tracks away from the light of day, no one else must hear them unless me, Armin, Markus, Ferry, Sasha, or any other HUGE DJ plays them out live." And at the same time, they can't stop telling you about how many phat unreleased tracks they have that they're going to spin at this show, or on this set, or blah blah blah blah blah...

So here's what i'm wondering, what accounts for the difference in attitudes? Is it the "dog eat dog" nature of DJ'ing that provides for this? Maybe I'm over thinking it and some DJ's are just assholes, just like some people are assholes, but it definitely gets tired hearding "Dude, I've got so many unreleased tracks to play out, maybe I'll let you hear em."

I guess maybe I just want my high quality versions of "Halcyon" and "Only when I lose Myself" (LA Remix) too

Peace, Cheers,

RJT

Goldenscan - Only With You <-- i so want this record! only dj's have it.

It's kinda like rich people and really rich people.


Rich people will show off how rich they are. Really rich people just don't care.

Basicly big name DJ's know what they are, newbie "big" names are still finding thier feet and still feel the need to impress to become a true big name.

well...look at you trying to mooch off of other people for records...what's that all about?


i mean if they offer them to you...that's awesome, but i don't think its so bad if they are keeping them exclusive until release...i don't see anything wrong with that...maybe they don't want to jeopardize the release by leaking it out there...obviously big names are gonna get their stuff out there no matter what, but for someone that is still in the process of rising...nothing is really certain...

I've found that it boils down to networking, and that the 'dog eat dog' atttitude you're referring to is only a problem with immature producers who use the internet as their primary medium to create a buzz about their tracks. I've received promos simply by doing favors (writing an article to publish, charting a track, etc) or writing a couple of nice emails. I haven'treally witnessed too much of producer hoarding, but maybe thats because I'm on a pretty friendly basis with everyone I get promos from.

A lot of that attitude is understandable though. Lets say you're a new producer and you have produced a track everyone is telling you is hot. Of course you're not going to give it out to any joe blow whos kissing your ass...

Just my 2 cents

Re: DJ's, Unreleased Tracks, and the "I'm more connected than you" debate...

quote:

Originally posted by rturn214 I seem to meet/glad hand a fair number of moderate sized DJ's, maybe they're more on the production side of things, or are just a "Rising Star" ( ), but in any event, these are guys who aren't really up there, at least yet, but are somewhat making a splash in the scene right now, with potential to go far. But in general, when I meet these types of fellows it's completely the opposite. It's like the attitude is "I've got to hoard my tracks away from the light of day, no one else must hear them unless me, Armin, Markus, Ferry, Sasha, or any other HUGE DJ plays them out live." And at the same time, they can't stop telling you about how many phat unreleased tracks they have that they're going to spin at this show, or on this set, or blah blah blah blah blah...

Haha, don't think that went over everyone's head.

As far as the little debate goes tho, I'm really neutral. On one hand I can understand wanting to keep your shit safe, but on the other hand, if you're gonna then go and brag about it I reserve the right to kick you in the throat. I hate people like that. Regarding my tracks tho, my loyalties lie in producing, so I'll hand my tracks off to anyone who wants them. More than anything I love to hear that other people like my tunes. On that note, go check out my new tune!

quote:

Originally posted by Floorfiller well...look at you trying to mooch off of other people for records...what's that all about?

Thoroughly missed the point.

-1 for you

quote:

Originally posted by Max Thomson A lot of that attitude is understandable though. Lets say you're a new producer and you have produced a track everyone is telling you is hot. Of course you're not going to give it out to any joe blow whos kissing your ass... Just my 2 cents

OK, I gotcha on that one, it does make a certain degree of sense to me. However I guess I still find myself a little put off by certain DJ's who find their way into copies of the new hot track from well established producers and then proceed to fit the mold Dervish so nicely laid out for us above

And one quick note, just b/c I already see the issues brewing around this: I don't just want free tracks, nor do I have this inferiority complex regarding my inability to attain certain tracks I just figured some of you other guys out there working on your sets may also have experience similar things out and about.

I think a lot of it could come down to the producers themselves and not just the DJ's who've got the tracks. I guess the best way I can sum it up, is if I got to meet Armin, and got the balls to ask him for some unreleased shit somehow (Let's just say it came up ) or for some reason felt it was OK to ask, and he said "Sorry M8, I can't, producer would kill me." That would make total sense to me, however, I highly doubt he would proceed to tell me how he's just going to drop that record here, there, and everywhere, and how cool it is that he's got it and like 5 other people, and so that somehow validates him as a great DJ as opposed to what he does on the decks (Everyone should pretty much recognize this is NOT a true statement, just meant to illustrate).

I don't know if that helps illustrate my point any, maybe it's just more convoluted now, and in the end it doesn't even really matter. But thanks to those of you who've shed some light on areas of this argument I may not have recognized b4...

DJs who brag about having promo tracks are hilarious. if you care to spend the time, you can find so so so many tracks that no one on your dance floor will ever have heard before and will love. Plus I don't really know of any club goers that sit there and keep track of how many unreleased promos a DJ drops in a set. 99% of the people there just don't care. As long as your set makes them want to dance, the release status of your songs shouldn;t matter.

a lot of these djs spend ages hunting down new music and it's this that makes their sets original, can you really blame them for not wanting to lose this originality which is what sets them aside from other djs in the first place?

i personally play quite a lot of unsigned material at the moment simply because a lot of it (if you look in the right places) is better than most of the crap getting released... and as much as i want other people to hear this music, i will still never give out a copy of a track which isn't mine as it just isn't my place to do so - it's illegal in fact. in giving me a copy, the unsigned producer is putting trust in me and, if nothing else, if i break this then the chances are they're not going to give me any more of their tunes!

if someone asks me about one of these tracks then i'm usually happy to give them information about the producer and how they can contact them if they want to try and blag a copy themselves, although i'm often weary as, although they must be really happy that people like their work, i don't really think that a lot of producers want to be hastled for copies of there music, particularly if they think it may get signed, as this could put the signing in jeopardy.

if you add to this that a lot of the big names probably get asked for copies of the tracks they play by many people at every gig, you'll understand that it might not be so easy to be just as helpful to absolutely everyone

and there are certain things a dj might not want other people to have at all - a lot of PvD's edits will never get into the hands of anyone else as they're what make his set unique. similarly i've got a few bootlegs and edits i've made which i don't give out to others for similar reasons, and also because i think there are so many remixes out there that it can completely kill a song (both the original and the remix) if everyone starts playing it

that's what i think anyway...

quote:

Originally posted by Stu Cox a lot of these djs spend ages hunting down new music and it's this that makes their sets original, can you really blame them for not wanting to lose this originality which is what sets them aside from other djs in the first place? i personally play quite a lot of unsigned material at the moment simply because a lot of it (if you look in the right places) is better than most of the crap getting released... and as much as i want other people to hear this music, i will still never give out a copy of a track which isn't mine as it just isn't my place to do so - it's illegal in fact. in giving me a copy, the unsigned producer is putting trust in me and, if nothing else, if i break this then the chances are they're not going to give me any more of their tunes!

Agreed, there is a lot of crap getting released at the moment.

The other thing is that you have to take a step back and see what is actually happening. Maybe these guys aren't intentionally bragging about the tunes but may just actually be genuinely excited about the fact that they are actually living their dream and have a chance of making it.

As Stu says, it's a lot of work tracking down the tunes that are going to define you to your public, you may not feel inclined to give away too many secrets... let's face it, you are the competition. Maybe not today but someday.

The guys that play out will hopefully back me up on this. You get an awful lot of people come up to you and try to hassle you for guestlists, promos, tracklistings and a whole manner of other stuff and although it's a natural part of what we do it can get really tiresome especially if it's the second gig you have played that night or you had a bad day prior to this.
When people experience this they label you as an arrogant asshole or just totally uninterested in your public and that isn't always the case and is very often unfair.

I have from time to time given away a promo if I had more than one copy of it (if it was sent to me) but I would never do this with a demo that came straight from a producer unless he expressed that this is what he wanted me to do.
Let's look at the flipside of this for a moment. Ok, so us DJs can get a bad name amongst the punters which in some cases is understandable as some DJs behave really badly. The flip side is to see how some of the punters behave towards us. On the most part the public are great but sometimes you get some real dicks.

Be happy that the DJ is even telling you what he is dropping as some DJs wont even give you that.

Cheers
Nem

quote:

Originally posted by Stu Cox - if someone asks me about one of these tracks then i'm usually happy to give them information about the producer and how they can contact them if they want to try and blag a copy themselves, although i'm often weary as, although they must be really happy that people like their work, i don't really think that a lot of producers want to be hastled for copies of there music, particularly if they think it may get signed, as this could put the signing in jeopardy. - and there are certain things a dj might not want other people to have at all - a lot of PvD's edits will never get into the hands of anyone else as they're what make his set unique. similarly i've got a few bootlegs and edits i've made which i don't give out to others for similar reasons, and also because i think there are so many remixes out there that it can completely kill a song (both the original and the remix) if everyone starts playing it that's what i think anyway...

Those two points right there are pretty much what I was looking for. I'm not just asking for the latest/most exlcusive tracks out there, and I definitely can tell the difference between a DJ being excited about his tracks and straight up bragging/arrogance.

In regards to the first point, I think that's easily the most class way a DJ can deal with a situation like that. And in as far as the second point, I think that's probably a situation where I don't think I'd even want a track like that. Personal reworks ARE what make a DJ's style in this day and age, and if you don't produce at least some of your own stuff to create your unique sound you're in trouble.

Thanks to all of you guys out there making legit points regarding this. I still most definitely have some issues with the DJ's out there who are most definitely the braggards of the bunch, but in general I think we've pretty much covered the different angles this covers.

Just wanted to say thanks to those of you who replied seriously to this thread, you definitely helped open my eyes to a world of situations where circumstances are different and therefore require different actions...

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