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Virtual DJ.. cheater's software.. yes or no?

I just came across the VirtualDJ website. I was reading its features and I thought that this seems to take the human out of DJing. Why not just press play on your mp3 player and let that be that?

It says, "Breakthrough BeatLock engine: your tracks will always stay on time. Create great mixes faster than ever!" Who is the DJ you or the computer. This takes away an important ability eveyone who wants to DJ must learn. I have much more respect for the people who can dj greatly without the use of these programs.

I have never used the product so perhaps I don't understand the product fully. But it seems like this would take away our mixing abilities and leave us with just song selection.

Anyone agree? Disagree? Or use this?

i used it once...hehe

i mixed sitted on the chair...i just select the track and then just play it together with the other one switching the crossfader

even i gave some of this mixes to some friends...and they said...."you're awesome...flawless mixing"...i was like

quote:

Originally posted by Palladium i used it once...hehe i mixed sitted on the chair...i just select the track and then just play it together with the other one switching the crossfader even i gave some of this mixes to some friends...and they said...."you're awesome...flawless mixing"...i was like

hahaha

This software is made for those out there who dont want to buy all the equipment associated with djing properly. Its for those who simply wanna create the illusion that they are djing. Its not like your gonna see PVD using it for his next set so dont worry about it 'taking over'

ERrr... this is the software i use...

u guys are a bit quick to judge....

any Dj software is exactly that. Even thouhg i use this program (hooked up to a mixer), I'm still learning to mix without any of the help in the program, simple becasue it's not always accurate. besides, i find i can beatmatch better than the program itself, once i've set the BPM right, simple because it's not 100% accurate... A lot of the BPM that comes up on some tracks is about 1 or 2 beats off, and i do it manually... I find better results when i do it manually anyways...

Besides, try beatlocking RnB... lol.. won't happen....

quote:

Originally posted by Armada_hk This software is made for those out there who dont want to buy all the equipment associated with djing properly. Its for those who simply wanna create the illusion that they are djing. Its not like your gonna see PVD using it for his next set so dont worry about it 'taking over'

yeah, n00bs, i think PVD and sasha have already switched to using software alongside real decks....

Re: Virtual DJ.. cheater's software.. yes or no?

If this software is anything like Traktor, it will require a fair bit of work to be able to use it smoothly, and it will end up costing about the same as decks and a mixer. All manufacturers like to make exaggerated claims about their their product.

If it is similar to Traktor, if you put in the time you will reduce the work of beatmatching, which is a low-level mechanical skill. You can use that free time to work the mixer EQ, pick the best tracks from a very large collection, read the crowd etc - the more creative parts of the job.

Should a carpenter build a house without power tools, just because that's the way they did it 80 years ago? Should your airliner captain never use the auto-pilot on his plane, just because the Wright Brothers never had one?

quote:

Originally posted by djHollen It says, "Breakthrough BeatLock engine: your tracks will always stay on time. Create great mixes faster than ever!" Who is the DJ you or the computer. This takes away an important ability eveyone who wants to DJ must learn. I have much more respect for the people who can dj greatly without the use of these programs. I have never used the product so perhaps I don't understand the product fully. But it seems like this would take away our mixing abilities and leave us with just song selection. Anyone agree? Disagree? Or use this?

Re: Re: Virtual DJ.. cheater's software.. yes or no?

quote:

Originally posted by tvmann If this software is anything like Traktor, it will require a fair bit of work to be able to use it smoothly, and it will end up costing about the same as decks and a mixer. All manufacturers like to make exaggerated claims about their their product. If it is similar to Traktor, if you put in the time you will reduce the work of beatmatching, which is a low-level mechanical skill. You can use that free time to work the mixer EQ, pick the best tracks from a very large collection, read the crowd etc - the more creative parts of the job. Should a carpenter build a house without power tools, just because that's the way they did it 80 years ago? Should your airliner captain never use the auto-pilot on his plane, just because the Wright Brothers never had one?

in the same fashion, then why would i go out to see a DJ if his mixing will be 100% flawless each time because a computer is helping him? i might as well just buy the program myself, stay home, and mix the tracks i want to listen to. or buy studio made mix CDs, because thats what the live performance will sound like.

when i go out, im out to listen to music. now trust me, if when i see Frank Lorber rip it up for 8 hours and not have 1/100th of a beat out place, i knew he was using a computer, then i woudn't have as much respect for him or as much admiration for the set.

THIS IS what a DJ does. take that away, and we are just glorified jukeboxes. and don't use Sasha as an argument, because he proved he was one of the most flawless mixers ever back when he was vinyl/CD and what he does today is quite far from pressing the sync button and then pressing play.

its just like traktor and traktor does the same thing, execpt this is better because they have skins that hide all that beatmatching crap.

have you guys even used the damn thing?

Re: Re: Re: Virtual DJ.. cheater's software.. yes or no?

quote:

Originally posted by Inertia ... we are just glorified jukeboxes.

I've always believed that.

Some are more glorified than others. At the bottom of the barrel would be the pro DJs in small towns who yell at people to buy another drink and then throw on an old top-40 clubs CD. At the top is someone famous from Europe, waving his hands in the air, and people pay $50 to get in. Both DJs fill a purpose, and if they swapped gigs both would fail miserably.

I just take my laptop to parties and everyone has fun. There is an ex-vinyl man who uses Traktor in New York at the Roxy and everyone has fun there too, except he makes the other DJs nervous.

stop judging a person for the medium they chose to play their music...

everyone judges b/c you don't use a tt, or because u use software...it's EDM - technology advances so a lot more people will get into it, that's how the industry is able to run and you guys to get your vinyl, songs or equipment cheaper because there is more demand...which in terms means more units sold therefore price can be dropped and become more affordable...

a 15 year old does not have the finances to buy tt's or cdjs so they might want to give it a shot...a program like virtual dj gives them the opportunity to see if they like the idea of mixing...chose songs, and cut, bring in, fade out...whatever...

first if you get away from beatmatching and see the beauty of mixing and want to go forward you'll have to go back and beatmatch and learn it...
once you know how a perfect beatmatch sounds, you will be able to adjust and make small changes to your cdjs or tts in order to get that perfect beatmatch b/c your ear is trained to hear it...there are a lot of advantages to this program for a beginner...it doesn't turn them into the next sasha, oakie or paul...but gives them a taste and then they'll go out and support the industry by buying equipment, songs...etc

now i use this program, partially because i can't afford to buy cdjs yet...it's a very useful program...and you can play with a variety of things....test to see if a song goes well after another, and understand some more basics...
i don't on the other hand use the beatlock option because it's not always correct, but find the auto beat match as soon as you drop the track a good tool...saves time..

second at a house party, when you don't have equipment...it's a nice tool to use and keep the party going instead of stoping after each song to insert another cd in...

gives more freedom to house parties and allows noobs to try it out...why do you guys have to judge and call it useless...it's a great tool to introduce you to what it means to mix...

on the other side i wouldn't want a club dj to use his computer and no equipment, because if you wnat to play out i find it necesarry that u must know how to use either tt's or cdj's...either or or both...

quote:

Originally posted by alligator that's how the industry is able to run and you guys to get your vinyl, songs or equipment cheaper because there is more demand...which in terms means more units sold therefore price can be dropped and become more affordable...

I dont know for sure... but prices for vinyl arent dropping for me.

quote:

Originally posted by alligator a 15 year old does not have the finances to buy tt's or cdjs so they might want to give it a shot...a program like virtual dj gives them the opportunity to see if they like the idea of mixing...chose songs, and cut, bring in, fade out...whatever...

Good point. I agree.

quote:

Originally posted by alligator on the other side i wouldn't want a club dj to use his computer and no equipment, because if you wnat to play out i find it necesarry that u must know how to use either tt's or cdj's...either or or both...

This is more of the point I was getting at with posting this thread.

what is the definition of the word cheater?
someone who leads you to believe something that is not true

universaly - A dj's mission is to bring different types and genres of melodies via various electronical devices in an venue.

so in end if you use a software like ableton or final scratch and you are acheving your goal - then I dont see any reason to call you cheater

quote:

Originally posted by gorex what is the definition of the word cheater? someone who leads you to believe something that is not true universaly - A dj's mission is to bring different types and genres of melodies via various electronical devices in an venue. so in end if you use a software like ableton or final scratch and you are acheving your goal - then I dont see any reason to call you cheater

semantics.. but still your point is noted. i agree but i have more respect for the djs that do it without the help of computer programs... i guess cuz im working so hard at finessing these talents myself.

quote:

Originally posted by djHollen This is more of the point I was getting at with posting this thread.

yes, but you also must accept that a starting kid must first know if he liks it, is it worth it and is it what he expected before he buys the equipment...

and as far as for a club, we also pay to see the guy do some work...therefore yes using a computer to beat match and transition between songs is not what we pay to go to a club for...

but i sitll wouldn't call a person that uses virtual dj for his pleasure and house parties a cheater...

IMO this is the best way if you are a complete n00b to mixing (like i was). You can learn how tracks go together (phrase matching) without worrying about beatmatching.

If it wasn't for traktor i dont think i would have progressed as far as i have, i would have lost patience trying to learn to beatmatch, phrasematch and eq all at the same time would have been too much

Re: Re: Virtual DJ.. cheater's software.. yes or no?

[QUOTE]Originally posted by tvmann
If this software is anything like Traktor, it will require a fair bit of work to be able to use it smoothly, and it will end up costing about the same as decks and a mixer. All manufacturers like to make exaggerated claims about their their product.

If it is similar to Traktor, if you put in the time you will reduce the work of beatmatching, which is a low-level mechanical skill. You can use that free time to work the mixer EQ, pick the best tracks from a very large collection, read the crowd etc - the more creative parts of the job.

Should a carpenter build a house without power tools, just because that's the way they did it 80 years ago? Should your airliner captain never use the auto-pilot on his plane, just because the Wright Brothers never had one? [/ QUOTE][COLOR=yellow][COLOR=yellow][COLOR=yellow][COLOR=yellow][COLOR=yellow][COLOR=yellow][COLOR=yel
low][COLOR=yellow]




SIRrrrr....

I salute you...

Re: Re: Virtual DJ.. cheater's software.. yes or no?

quote:

Originally posted by tvmann Should a carpenter build a house without power tools, just because that's the way they did it 80 years ago? Should your airliner captain never use the auto-pilot on his plane, just because the Wright Brothers never had one?

No, they shoudln't. And thats why djs use new types of decks/mixers. And why some djs use CD TTs rather than vinyls, or SSL/FS etc. They STILL do the SAME work, however the technology to carry out that work has changed.

However, a carpenter doesn't use a machine that cuts and puts all the pieces of wood together, and let him come along and just bang the nails in and take the credit.






What a piss poor analogy

I'll say it once, adn i'll say it again....

Djing is like being a drafting.... it's a dying artform...

quote:

Originally posted by Abhay I'll say it once, adn i'll say it again.... Djing is like being a drafting.... it's a dying artform...

Especially with you. j/k (apparently that means I'm joking, I've never used it before)






And you want to kill it even more by letting a computer do half the job?

Re: Virtual DJ.. cheater's software.. yes or no?

quote:

Originally posted by djHollen I have never used the product so perhaps I don't understand the product fully. But it seems like this would take away our mixing abilities and leave us with just song selection.

do you feel threatened by the PC or something? beatmatching is a technical skill, computers are devices of technology...

and no digital algorithm will match beats the way a talented DJ can. go try it for yourself.

big whoop.

how about : - knowing wich tracks really sound awesome together and
when to throw them in.

(mixing intros over outros is easy. for trance this is quite necessary because of the long stretched song structures, but for other styles it's possible to mix the songs really fast after each other and not wait for the outro.)

- adding effects at the right time
- realtime sampling of songs so you can use them later
on in your mix
- proper equalising
- use of accapella's at the right time
- looping certain parts of a track a the right time and combining it with other loops to remix live.
- song selection, buildup and crowd reading
- anyon can feel free to add stuff...


my point is that beatmatching is just a technical skill. the things I mentioned above are all part of the creative proces of DJing and you still need them, even if you use a computer.

greetz

+1 you are exactly right. Beatmatching is just a low-level skill that is a small part of DJing and there are more important skills that are required. NOOBs think that once they can beatmatch, that's about all there is, they put a lot of time into learning it, and that's all they know how to do, so they try to argue that's it's some kind of artform. If beatmatching was so special, a computer could not help you do it.

Essentially all you are doing when you're beatmatching is accurately calculating the BPMs of 2 tracks and compensating for the difference. I go through a BPM calculation procedure with Traktor when I load in tracks from a new CD (or vinyl or BeatPort download), it takes me about a half hour of manual work per CD to do it right. That's work that the regular DJ does not do. Once it's done, the BPM vaue is saved and I don't need to do this again for those tracks. I still need to make small adjustments when I mix bacause many tracks have some drift and my BPM calculation may be off a smidgeon.

The regular DJ must go through the drudge work of calculating the BPM, or beatmatching, every time he mixes. The smarter people will write down the BPM to make it easier next time and to classify their tracks, just like is done with Traktor.

quote:

Originally posted by Jelle how about : - knowing wich tracks really sound awesome together and when to throw them in. (mixing intros over outros is easy. for trance this is quite necessary because of the long stretched song structures, but for other styles it's possible to mix the songs really fast after each other and not wait for the outro.) - adding effects at the right time - realtime sampling of songs so you can use them later on in your mix - proper equalising - use of accapella's at the right time - looping certain parts of a track a the right time and combining it with other loops to remix live. - song selection, buildup and crowd reading - anyon can feel free to add stuff... my point is that beatmatching is just a technical skill. the things I mentioned above are all part of the creative proces of DJing and you still need them, even if you use a computer. greetz

quote:

Originally posted by Jelle (mixing intros over outros is easy. for trance this is quite necessary because of the long stretched song structures, but for other styles it's possible to mix the songs really fast after each other and not wait for the outro.) greetz

I'd fall asleep if I waited for outtros.. i'm usually building up the next track by the first big breakdown

quote:

Originally posted by alligator yes, but you also must accept that a starting kid must first know if he liks it, is it worth it and is it what he expected before he buys the equipment... and as far as for a club, we also pay to see the guy do some work...therefore yes using a computer to beat match and transition between songs is not what we pay to go to a club for... but i sitll wouldn't call a person that uses virtual dj for his pleasure and house parties a cheater...

i agree. i already accepted this point on page 1.

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