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advice to all the people who is into ebay

i have always been aware of the risks at online-shopping, but this is the best way i can get my vinyls, cd's and even some gear (coming from all around the world) mostly from ebay. But this time i got into a fraud. I was looking for a moog prodigy (worldwide shipping) for about a month without success, until i found one of this synths at sale from some guy in china in a one-day listing auction, he had't feedbacks and he registered since late october, but he was selling more items: access virus indigo 2, and some guitars, mics and bass, to me everything seems to be a recording studio clearence, so i thought "it's ok". i won the auction for the moog for $540 USD and because paypal wasn't available (just money grahm and wire-transfer), i contacted this guy for details: account, shipping fee and yadda yadda...(you know).
the bank were i got my account turn out to take about a week to contact the bank in china, and because i hate delays in business, i went from bank to bank looking for somewhere i can make the money transfer in cash. i finally found a bank for my purpose and made the transfer where they told me that it can take 24 to 48 hrs. i sent an email to the guy telling him that the transfer was done together with a scan of the recipt, he answer that he will send the synth as soon as he can check his account. That was the last email that i get from him. i realized that this was a fraud, he's account is down at ebay. It's almost a week since i made the transfer and i already made a request at the bank to track the transfer.
I know that there's a little or no chance to get the money back, but i want to share my experience with all of you, and hopefully u will find it useful.

this is why i always use paypal (since they offer protection and guarantees) and never buy from someone with no feedback, recent registers, or people in developing countries!!!

Hey. Never, ever, ever just send money or a wiretransfer. If paypal is not available, then send a money order or a cashiers check. Those can be tracked and canceled and are usually pretty secure ways of transferring money. Lesson learned I hope .

Cheers,
Zac

Well, I'm sorry to hear you got ripped off and I don't mean to rub it in, but this should teach you a few valuable lessons about eBay:

1. Never agree to money orders, wire transfers, or any method of payment that isn't traceable.

2. Don't buy expensive items from people with no feedback or negative feedback.

3. Take extra care when buying from people in countries with shady governments who are known for lax fraud/bootleg laws (China would be the very first that comes to mind). Really, I just wouldn't buy from any places other than the U.S., Canada, and U.K.

4. Have the same attitude toward eBay as you'd have toward any other type of financial transaction: don't be na�ve, make sure you know what you're getting, and make sure you know who you're getting it from. Don't make assumptions; ask questions.

5. If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is.

i got a jp8000 from italy with a guy that hadnt sold anything before (he had 100% feedback as a buyer). and he actually did a few mistakes which costed about 2 weeks but i got it for 410$. now if i hadnt bought it from him i would prob have to buy it from uk or germany for atleast 600 euros + alot more shipping to greece..

i mean its ok to take risks cuz thats where the good deals are, but make sure you can undo the payment in case something goes wrong.

quote:

Originally posted by DigiNut 5. If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is.

I learned this the hard way. Fortunately, the guy was caught and I got my money back(the cops told me the FBI was involved and this guy had done more fraudulent stuff). It was a stolen Ebay account and it had alot of good feedback as a seller. It was before paypal and Ebay merged so paypal was alot less available back then from sellers and I trusted using a cashiers check(which made it easy for the cops to trace).

It was a nord lead 3 for a few hundred dollars less than all the other auctions (and about $700 cheaper than the store), and the guy was very good about being friendly and believable. He even had a home address that I looked up online and could see the owner matched who he said he was, so I sent the check there. It turns out he had convinced this lady to let him use her address for his "business" and he would give her a cut of the profits. The guy wasn't smart because he listed the same nord lead 3 auction as soon as I had told him I sent the money. I asked him about it and all of a sudden he was sketchy. I told the cops before he had even gotten the check.

He emailed me a few weeks later and the subject said "congratulations" with no content. I tried to reply and the email account had been seized by the law!!

I've bought over $3,500 (US) worth of stuff from eBay (Audio equipment + video equipment). I've never had any problems but I guess I'm just lucky! Then again, I usually settle for deals that aren't as good for the sake of the condition of the item. I also never buy unless they have multiple pictures of the item from multiple angles.

thanks guys

my personal situation is that in my country (Mexico) there's only few options for synths. so i buy everything from outside, and in ebay, Mexico is not usually available as an option so i got to look for worldwide shipping (even if the item is in the US) and that leaves me with a few options. But anyway next time i'll buy just with paypal and i'll request more photos.

the first thing that i got from ebay was another synth, and i remember that the seller seemed to be unsure to deal with me 'cause at that time my feedback was none.

more suggestions?

quote:

Hey. Never, ever, ever just send money or a wiretransfer.

This has to be repeated. NEVER shop online via cash transfer. You do not get a receipt and there is no proof of transaction.

If some guy on ebay only accepts money transfers or specifically requests that you transer via a certain bank (i.e. Western Union, which is fake) then you will probably get ripped off. Ignore them.

Only buy via traceable and recorded payment methods. Credit card is a good one since transactions can be traced and reversed and you get a receipt of transaction (dont use your debit card).

Paypal is quite good because on purchases over a certain amount, ebay will compensate you if you are a victim of fraud (although in really expensive purchases, you wont get the full amount back so be careful with your bidding). You also get a receipt of transaction and it is traceable.

Also, to save yourself the trouble do what I do - ignore zero/negative feedback and low feedback sellers. Even if they sell stuff cheaper than some of the high feedback sellers, I generally regard the extra dough as worth it for the peace of mind.

if you are using pay pal , you have nothing to worry about


in fact it is safer to buy from ebay now than it is to sell
as strange as that sounds

the same thisng happened to me usinh sonicstate to buy a Nord Modular...I wated to send the guy money via paypal but he insisted on western Union...now it was nice and cheap at teh time so I was excited....I was pretty stupid in onlinbe buying and didn't do much of it at teh time. There were somany things that should have told me it was bogus...his country he put thathe was from was Hawaii and when I sent him teh money he said ti send to russa?? I was like what?? Then every emial he sent me had some sort of different version of his name...I finnaly figured it out and it was Yuri Cursco or something like that...he was russin....anyway i finnaly cought him about 10 months later when I was looking for a TB303...I saw an add for a TB for $300 and I was liek what?? so I emailed the guy with a different e-mail addy and figured it was that bastard again. So I contacted Sonicstate adn thet found that he had 4 different accounts registered and was scamming people left right and center.

Anyway...I lost $300...but now I'm more carefull and I have bought over $8,000 of shit from ebay and sonicstate

id say the best piece of advise is to do research out of ebay. some sellers love to big up their items with fancy figures like 'how much its worth new' 'signal to noise ratios' is another thing.. and 'power ratings' of speakers is a a good example..

i always type the item into google and check retail prices and official figures...

I can't believe anyone buying something for cash off ebay, for more than $100 and in a different country would expect to receive their goods.

If it's more than $100 then you be a fool not to use paypal.

quote:

Originally posted by qiushiming this is why i always use paypal (since they offer protection and guarantees) and never buy from someone with no feedback, recent registers, or people in developing countries!!!

since when as china been a developing country ?? and that's a racist view on life.

if people in so called 'developing countries' are so under-developed, how they managing to scam people on ebay

So, u think this type of scam wouldn't happen in your own country ??
The world economy is built on scams and would collapse if they didn't exist....banks...cough...cough

At the end of the day it all boils down to trust and luck on ebay............you live and learn

DigiNut's points are right on. There is nothing more I could really add other than I've been using Ebay since 1998, having bought and sold hundreds of items, and never once been ripped off. You just have to use your head and be smart about it. I'm sorry that happened to you though.

Never had any problems, but I only bought on registered users with feedback. A lot of stuff came from germany. Mostly friendly and quick delivery.

quote:

Originally posted by Bedlam-UK I can't believe anyone buying something for cash off ebay, for more than $100 and in a different country would expect to receive their goods. If it's more than $100 then you be a fool not to use paypal.

yes it's crazy i admitt it. i trusted because i have done it before with success, this is the first time things turnout this way. but that was a lesson to myself.

the money is lost (and i'm through it) i started this topic because i know that unfortunately there must be more people doing the same.

i think ebay must restrict to the members with non or low feedback to sell/buy in a small amout of money, until they have some trustable feedback to avoid this situation.

If I were you, I'll try to become friends with someone who lives in the US, once you're sure that your new US friend is a reliable guy, you'd just explain your situation to him and then ask him for the favor.
All your equip would be ship out to his house, and as soon as he gets it, he will ship it to Mexico.

It doesn't get safer than that.

quote:

Originally posted by DigiNut Take extra care when buying from people in countries with shady governments who are known for lax fraud/bootleg laws (China would be the very first that comes to mind). Really, I just wouldn't buy from any places other than the U.S., Canada, and U.K.

wtf? so norway isnt a good enough country to deal with? we're like one of the richest in the world lol :P and btw, why china? when i think of a country known for fraud Nigeria is the first country that comes to mind..

NIGERIAN 419 SCAMMER!

I will never forget foker on 419eater.com, the guy who managed to persuade his scamming contact to piss into a kitty litter and take a photo of it in exchange for sex.

But he wasnt nigerian - he looked hispanic...

foker was a sick sick man.

quote:

Originally posted by dj_alfi wtf? so norway isnt a good enough country to deal with? we're like one of the richest in the world lol :P and btw, why china? when i think of a country known for fraud Nigeria is the first country that comes to mind..

If you're in Europe it's probably fine - I wouldn't do it living in Canada or the U.S. It's got nothing to do with economy or industry - people need to look at it from a legal perspective, i.e. how easy is it for people to scam you from certain countries and what recourse is available if they do.

And yes, Nigeria and other West African countries are some of the worst for scams in general, but we're talking specifically about eBay here. China and Korea are huge for eBay scams (bootlegging capitals of the world... haha).

Some auctions just scream "faud". I'd rather pay few extra dollars to deal with an established seller. Some red flags should have went off right away:

- 1 Day auction listing
- No traceable payment method available
- Seller with no feedback
- Hate to stereotype but... CHINA!

I was looking for Elka Synthex on ebay and found 2 genuine sellers alongside with 4 FAKES!!! One seller (from china) did not even bother to change description or pictures from valid auction!!!! There's even one there now. Search "Elka Synthex" and see fraud in action.

ON a flip side, I wouldn't even sell to buyers in certain countries (again, China comes to mind). Why? High number of incidents involving Credit Card fraud. Paypal will very quickly take away the money it deposited in your account when CC fraud is involved. Your options? NOne. OH, and for those that think that PayPal is safe - think again. To this day, I lost about $1500 to paypal's "buyer protection" (or lack there of) scam.

How? Simple. I buy and pay for the item via PayPal. Seller sends defective item. I contact seller, he says - send it back for full refund. I send it back, seller doesn't refund my money or respond to emails. I launch paypal claim, they come back with "we were able to recover $3.24 from his account - there you go, case closed". No repeat attempts to recover my money, no further options, there you go, good night. Scenario #2. I purchase an item again from different seller, receive DOA item. Seller cannot be reached. Paypal claim is filed. Paypal comes back "Sorry, but our protection does not cover item condition or operability. Case closed, have a great day".

Still convinced paypal is on your side???? If your answer is yes - read some more eye-opening accounts of Paypal justice system on www.paypalsucks.com . I chose not to deal with paypal, where possible because of how useless it is when it comes to risky situation. Make no mistakes - Paypal is not a "risk absorbing" mechanism. It is just as vulnerable to fraud as any other method - so, CAVEAT EMPTOR...

O YEA, there's another "paypal trick" - gotta love that one. Buy an item from seller who insists on Paypal. I send the money, because of the amount sent (over $3K) - paypal automaticaly freezes seller's account to review validity of transaction. Now, both of us are sitting and waiting for paypal to verify that it is a legitimate transaction for TWO WEEKS!!!!!!!! He then says he got an email saying he needs to ship it to me, send proof of shipment, and I have to confirm that I got it before he gets his money. 3 WEEKS from auction end seller finally gets money and I get my item. And this is all originating/ending in US. He should have opted for check/M.0. or bank transfer.

PayPal is by far the shittiest company next to ebay. ow wait.. .they are both owned by the same company!!! no wonder. I can't wait for Google to launch auction site to kick ebay off its perch FFS!

quote:

Originally posted by qiushiming this is why i always use paypal (since they offer protection and guarantees)

This is true but they take forever to do anything. Different departments don't seem to liase with one another so you have to repeat yourself endlessly via email and over the phone to get anything done. Most of the technical support staff are useless and unhelpful. Oh, and I haven't spoken to a single person who's first language is English.

quote:

Originally posted by emc^2 PayPal is by far the shittiest company next to ebay. ow wait.. .they are both owned by the same company!!! no wonder.

Ditto

quote:

Originally posted by Aquascape This is true but they take forever to do anything. Different departments don't seem to liase with one another so you have to repeat yourself endlessly via email and over the phone to get anything done. Most of the technical support staff are useless and unhelpful. Oh, and I haven't spoken to a single person who's first language is English. Ditto

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