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LINUX opinions

Who in here has Linux? If so, do you like it better than Windows? I have Windows XP Professional: Corporate Edition FINAL and I think it's a great OS (better than any other Windows I used). I'm planning on getting Linux and am going to have my system set up as a "dual boot" system so, I can have Linux and WinXP on the same system. What I would like to know is, what distribution should I get? There are at least 3 - 4 main distributions and it's tough to decide. Also, which is easiest to install? I never used any other OS besides a Windows OS so, I need something that's EASY and has Graphical User Interfaces (GUI) as well. I've read about the Red Hat, Slackware, Debian, and SUSE dists. I've also heard of Winlinux but, the info on their site's outdated a bit. So, can any of you (who use Linux) give me an insight as to what differences are there between the dists.? ALSO, are there any programmes that are made for Linux that AREN'T out for Windows? All answers will be greatly appreaciated! Thanks in advance! You can ICQ me at 145283256.

Of course somebody will disagree with me, but...
Get Mandrake. It's very very easy to set up and it has a package manager that uses red hat packages (which will ease installation of new programs). But don't expect it to be windoze! First of all the file hierarki is way different, and you won't have that lovely registry to keep clean. Every program will install into it's own directory, and individual users can add programs to their own setup, without files being stored in 117 different places in system dirs. But give it some time and learn to appreciate the strengths that are inherent in linux way of doing things, and pretty soon you'll end up with windows for surfing and gaming, while linux takes care of the more serious side.

Btw.
Red Hat=pretty installation but geared towards people who want to set up their own servers=>more complex.
Suse=about the same, but with less attractive setup. Has more programs supplied with it than red hat.
Debian=true geeks only.

Hope you can use the info

THANKS!

quote:

Originally posted by trancaholic Of course somebody will disagree with me, but... Get Mandrake. It's very very easy to set up and it has a package manager that uses red hat packages (which will ease installation of new programs). But don't expect it to be windoze! First of all the file hierarki is way different, and you won't have that lovely registry to keep clean. Every program will install into it's own directory, and individual users can add programs to their own setup, without files being stored in 117 different places in system dirs. But give it some time and learn to appreciate the strengths that are inherent in linux way of doing things, and pretty soon you'll end up with windows for surfing and gaming, while linux takes care of the more serious side. Btw. Red Hat=pretty installation but geared towards people who want to set up their own servers=>more complex. Suse=about the same, but with less attractive setup. Has more programs supplied with it than red hat. Debian=true geeks only. Hope you can use the info

I can use it! Thanks! I just have to get used to it!

Just noticed the thing about programs for linux not available for win. You might want to get Gimp (which is an image processing program) and xfig which is simply *excellent* for producing vector graphics for your latex-documents or for presentation slides. Also emacs is the text editor to go for - very fast and if LISP-programming doesn't scare you it can do anything.
If I think of other programs I'll give you a shout.


Looking at my previous post - I might come across as a fanatic, which I am not (win has it's strengths), but it's just so rare to see people wanting to try out something unusual that I got carried away.

hmm.. interesting.

i find it funny this thread being right above one about the death of penguins..

anyway, i think linux is cool, open source is the way of the future.

I also plan on installing linux someday.
but will i be able to make it work with my hewlett crappard computer, with integrated video, and a soundcard/modem thing, that is impossible to find drivers for?

somehow i doubt it.

and if i could, will i be able to DJ with it? will i be able to listen to online radio stations with it? surf TA with it?

quote:

Originally posted by RavingLunatic hmm.. interesting. i find it funny this thread being right above one about the death of penguins.. anyway, i think linux is cool, open source is the way of the future. I also plan on installing linux someday. but will i be able to make it work with my hewlett crappard computer, with integrated video, and a soundcard/modem thing, that is impossible to find drivers for? somehow i doubt it. and if i could, will i be able to DJ with it? will i be able to listen to online radio stations with it? surf TA with it?

That's why Windows XP is still the king of OS's. You just can't do certain things with other OS's that you can do with Windows XP. WinXP will be my primary Operating System until another Windows comes out (which is a while) because Windows is known by SO many and has the most compatibility with peripherials, modems, sound cards, graphic cards, game controllers, etc.

As a computer programmer I deal with Unix/Linux on a regular basis, and know quite a bit about it.

However I have to say that it SUCKS, compared to Windows. What especially annoys me is those Linux geeks who have blind fury against Microsoft...

Don't tell me you wouldn't rather use Word, Excel, PowerPoint, IE, Adobe Photoshop, etc. for your daily needs...

Also keep in mind that if you have WinXP installed on something like Sony Vaio, you WON'T be able to use the modem in Linux. That goes for some other hardware items as well.

Fully agree

Alot of Win X Hardware drivers on compensate that for single use and i f u r Dul booting with Linux this may limit the use of things such as your modem, possible some cards as well although there are some geeks out there who write sourc just to over come thses problems the thing is trying to find this

Microsoft products...

quote:

Originally posted by Eugene As a computer programmer I deal with Unix/Linux on a regular basis, and know quite a bit about it. However I have to say that it SUCKS, compared to Windows. What especially annoys me is those Linux geeks who have blind fury against Microsoft... Don't tell me you wouldn't rather use Word, Excel, PowerPoint, IE, Adobe Photoshop, etc. for your daily needs... Also keep in mind that if you have WinXP installed on something like Sony Vaio, you WON'T be able to use the modem in Linux. That goes for some other hardware items as well.

I LOVE those MS products such as Word, Excel, IE, Adobe material, etc.! I know why Linux doesn't work with some modems: Those modems are called "Winmodems". Winmodems are software dependent to run. Linux REQUIRES a physical modem. Even though physical medems are better, how much better is the new 56K, V. 92 standard? Is it worth buying the new modem that use it? What's the speed difference? I'd rather use all Microsoft products like Word, Excel, Adobe..., IE, etc. for my daily needs over ANY other products! I just wanted to experiment with Linux a bit. That's all. Remember, Windows will ALWAYS be my primary OS, NOT any other OS...

quote:

Originally posted by Eugene Don't tell me you wouldn't rather use Word, Excel, PowerPoint, IE, Adobe Photoshop, etc. for your daily needs...

NEVER EVER used any of those except for IE and it drives me fuKCing NUTS with its stupid errors. konquerer is much better.

so far i'm not using linux because i can't get my hard drive space straight and get organized wid all those mp3s. however, i do like it. i'm not using it for 4 reasons only: doesn't support my usb hdd YET, the driver is out there, but has bugs; i'm too lazy to import gozilla downloads to linux download managers; never bothered to figure out how to make my modem automatically reconnect; and audiogalaxy refuses to work. the font display is kinda funky too, but i can exchange that for stability.

what pisses me off about it though, is that M$ windows is so popular, that large companies started writing drivers for linux only a while ago, though it existed long time before that. windows is like that blair witch movie, half-assed and popular because of commercials and promotions. and i'm not talking about xp, i haven't tried it and not going to ever.

Are you insane?!

quote:

Originally posted by TiestoInTheMix NEVER EVER used any of those except for IE and it drives me fuKCing NUTS with its stupid errors. konquerer is much better. so far i'm not using linux because i can't get my hard drive space straight and get organized wid all those mp3s. however, i do like it. i'm not using it for 4 reasons only: doesn't support my usb hdd YET, the driver is out there, but has bugs; i'm too lazy to import gozilla downloads to linux download managers; never bothered to figure out how to make my modem automatically reconnect; and audiogalaxy refuses to work. the font display is kinda funky too, but i can exchange that for stability. what pisses me off about it though, is that M$ windows is so popular, that large companies started writing drivers for linux only a while ago, though it existed long time before that. windows is like that blair witch movie, half-assed and popular because of commercials and promotions. and i'm not talking about xp, i haven't tried it and not going to ever.

Are you NUTS??? Why would'nt you give WinXP a shot? You should give it a go at least once! It's awesome!

quote:

Originally posted by TiestoInTheMix NEVER EVER used any of those except for IE and it drives me fuKCing NUTS with its stupid errors. konquerer is much better. so far i'm not using linux because i can't get my hard drive space straight and get organized wid all those mp3s. however, i do like it. i'm not using it for 4 reasons only: doesn't support my usb hdd YET, the driver is out there, but has bugs; i'm too lazy to import gozilla downloads to linux download managers; never bothered to figure out how to make my modem automatically reconnect; and audiogalaxy refuses to work. the font display is kinda funky too, but i can exchange that for stability. what pisses me off about it though, is that M$ windows is so popular, that large companies started writing drivers for linux only a while ago, though it existed long time before that. windows is like that blair witch movie, half-assed and popular because of commercials and promotions. and i'm not talking about xp, i haven't tried it and not going to ever.

I love you man.

Eugene, basically my computer writing has the form of poster/invitations (QuarkXPress), e-mails(pine) and science reports (LaTeX). I've once used Word for a serious project (due to lobbying from my collegues) and after having seen it crashing *every time* the 7th really huge picture was imported I just about had it. Word is like a huge prettified cow, with bells and whistles you'll never need while being less than impressive when it comes to text-editing abilities: Swapping things around in your documents (while all references is kept intact and sensible), spell checking at the right level and such.
Of the programs you've mentioned only IE and Photoshop (which is basically a mac emulation) are part of my collection.

I'm a bit surprised that you as a linux-programmer can say it sucks. At least the API to the system isn't cluttered with redundancy and ad hoc solutions like the winAPI.

SuSE is PooP

Linux Over Windows .

Linux is Very Very Nice OS if you can get all your printers , USB , graphic cards, etc to work with it, Unfortunatley I have had enough with Linux , This is my story i hope it helps you make up your mind.

One Weekend i went to a mates house , and he had Slackware all running and it looked sweet with the advanced GUI and all the elite hacking tools , so i thought fuck it ill install it.

I went to PC world for a spend an i saw SuSE linux vers 7.1 , it looked really nice on the back of the package , and you know these packages they have all the features like DVD , MPG Power loadsa loadsa tools , so i said Fuck it Ill buy it , Cashing ��� 40 quid spent.

So like every teenager in the world you get home make a brew and put some tunes on and you put in the boot CD expecting an Easy Install like windows 95. First error I got was please
install CD-ROM Drivers , simple enough disk in CD driver modules loaded, step 2 please select partition, now if you have not made a dual partition on your HD then your gonna have to sacrifice windows to make one , I said fuck it ill FDISK windows , and i made a 20GB Linux Partition. 1 hour later I booted up the linux boot cd, once i selected the partition i then had to slect which KERNAL i had to choose , like wtf ? , i selected 2.0.0.0.3 or something, then i got another DOS window , please select packages / configuration options , I must say it had a lot of choice of applications like over 5000 tool and GIMP and all the other sweet tools , once selected I clicked install , 3 hours later im on cd 6 , installation complete. Thank God.

Reboot......lOADING UNIX ......(looking nice !)

then all this green writing comes up like loading module after module , took 3 minutes to get to #ROOT, once there you have to login as root and set up the colours and display for x windows (gui unix shell), now once this had loaded you had to set up all the keyboard , mouse , display , colours , graphics card , adapter , unfortunatley , it kept crashing when selected save settings , and once you turn off unix once with out a proper reboot you get all these DATA BLOCK ERRORS which are a bitch too fix. 5 hours later afte frustation I actually got x windows working , it looked ok but nowt special , i tried to connect to internet , unfortunatley you have to configure you modem , to the very basics , and the ppp conection to the net , i got it to dial but it woudn't load up any webpages , shit or what.
so i had a OS which couldn't connect to net , print or use colours over 256bit , also i had no sound.

Dj RoZZeR's final thought.

Now dont get me wrong , I was probabily doing something wrong but it takes the piss. Please can someone tell me a good unix OS , like slackware , redhat , mandrake etc .

p.s corel linux rules lol

Re: SuSE is PooP

quote:

Originally posted by DJ RozzeR Linux Over Windows . Linux is Very Very Nice OS if you can get all your printers , USB , graphic cards, etc to work with it, Unfortunatley I have had enough with Linux , This is my story i hope it helps you make up your mind. One Weekend i went to a mates house , and he had Slackware all running and it looked sweet with the advanced GUI and all the elite hacking tools , so i thought fuck it ill install it. I went to PC world for a spend an i saw SuSE linux vers 7.1 , it looked really nice on the back of the package , and you know these packages they have all the features like DVD , MPG Power loadsa loadsa tools , so i said Fuck it Ill buy it , Cashing ��� 40 quid spent. So like every teenager in the world you get home make a brew and put some tunes on and you put in the boot CD expecting an Easy Install like windows 95. First error I got was please install CD-ROM Drivers , simple enough disk in CD driver modules loaded, step 2 please select partition, now if you have not made a dual partition on your HD then your gonna have to sacrifice windows to make one , I said fuck it ill FDISK windows , and i made a 20GB Linux Partition. 1 hour later I booted up the linux boot cd, once i selected the partition i then had to slect which KERNAL i had to choose , like wtf ? , i selected 2.0.0.0.3 or something, then i got another DOS window , please select packages / configuration options , I must say it had a lot of choice of applications like over 5000 tool and GIMP and all the other sweet tools , once selected I clicked install , 3 hours later im on cd 6 , installation complete. Thank God. Reboot......lOADING UNIX ......(looking nice !) then all this green writing comes up like loading module after module , took 3 minutes to get to #ROOT, once there you have to login as root and set up the colours and display for x windows (gui unix shell), now once this had loaded you had to set up all the keyboard , mouse , display , colours , graphics card , adapter , unfortunatley , it kept crashing when selected save settings , and once you turn off unix once with out a proper reboot you get all these DATA BLOCK ERRORS which are a bitch too fix. 5 hours later afte frustation I actually got x windows working , it looked ok but nowt special , i tried to connect to internet , unfortunatley you have to configure you modem , to the very basics , and the ppp conection to the net , i got it to dial but it woudn't load up any webpages , shit or what. so i had a OS which couldn't connect to net , print or use colours over 256bit , also i had no sound. Dj RoZZeR's final thought. Now dont get me wrong , I was probabily doing something wrong but it takes the piss. Please can someone tell me a good unix OS , like slackware , redhat , mandrake etc . p.s corel linux rules lol

Damn, that sucks! Ever think about trying "WinLinux" it's basically Linux that's as easy as Windows. It even shows up as an APPLICATION on the START menu! You also can use LILO at the very beginning so, you can have Linux and Windows on the same system. I downloaded WinLinux 2001's free copy that's on their site but, I have a problem: It doesn't seem to be able to create my Startup Diskette. I tried Formatting it, erase (quick), etc. But, no dice... If anyone can help me out here, it would be greatly appreaciated. Also, even though WinLinux really isn't for Windows XP or any other Win NT system, WinXP has this "Compatibility Mode" where you can use programmes made for older Windows systems like Windows 95, 98, ME, NT (4.0 and before), and 2000 (Win 2000 and XP's core is really Win NT 5.0 for 2000 and 5.1 for XP). So, I use the compatibility mode to set it for Windows 98/ME. It still doesn't work! Again, ANY help or any light shed on this subject will be greatly appreciated!

Hey Dj Rozzer, I suggest you get the Redhat distribution. The installation was breeze for me.
I just inserted in the cd in Windows and up came the instalation window. You didn't have to fuck around with any DOS menus and the hardware configuartion was pretty sweet with auto detect.
Even the partitioning process was easy to get through without the use of FDISK.
The cd that I bought came with a little guide on how to set up an internet connection, how to configure your desktop with those window managers and how to set up sound. I am made to believe that all of this is not as complicated as I thought but I have yet to try all of it. The guide actaully had screenshot of Linux in full action, like with all themes sound and everything confirued and working. So I guess it is NOT impossible to set up your hardware and shit. I think you just got to check out your vendor's specs on the parts.

With this discussion on WIN XP, I was wondering if it beats Win 2000. I'm using Win 2000 at the moment and it's running pretty smoothly. Is XP more stabler than 2000 or are they about the same?

Red Hat

I was actually about to switch over to Linux that was until XP showed up. I've been using xp for a while now and have to say that I am completely estactic about xp. I thought win2000 was the best OS i've used but xp beats it hands down. Sure xp has the security issue but I still got to say it's the best OS out there. What bugs me is when people go out and knock XP but never really bother to give it a try

Also ali92 are you sure that you can dual boot with XP and Linux? I don't think that is possible. I could be wrong though. And why would you want to dual boot with xp and Linux? XP is just so stable, I havn't had to reboot in months With windows 98, if i leave my comp on for more than a few days I would eventually have to reboot due to the massive memory leak.

quote:

Originally posted by trancaholic Eugene, basically my computer writing has the form of poster/invitations (QuarkXPress), e-mails(pine) and science reports (LaTeX). I've once used Word for a serious project (due to lobbying from my collegues) and after having seen it crashing *every time* the 7th really huge picture was imported I just about had it. Word is like a huge prettified cow, with bells and whistles you'll never need while being less than impressive when it comes to text-editing abilities: Swapping things around in your documents (while all references is kept intact and sensible), spell checking at the right level and such. Of the programs you've mentioned only IE and Photoshop (which is basically a mac emulation) are part of my collection.

trancaholic, your post really upsets me, because MS-Word is quite possibly the best application ever written. No other program (let alone another word processor) can compete with Word in terms of its smooth operation, conveniences, usability, and POWER. I have never had any problems with it at all, and I've used it heavily on 98/2000/NT.

But what I'd like to discuss is LaTeX. All the professors and many students at my university blindly hate Microsoft and Windows (later I'll give you examples) and, for example, use LaTeX to type formulas. LaTeX is very hard, command-based, and why would you want to use it, when there is Microsoft Equation Editor built into Word that has the SAME power and functionality? It's very visual, convenient, yet truly powerful. Believe me, I've used it often, and exploited many of its features. It is equally powerful as LaTeX - and a pleasure to use.

In their blind hate of all things Microsoft (*just because* it's Microsoft and Windows), people become stupid and narrow-minded. At my university, there are lots of Linux snobs like that (or people who want to be "cool" by dissing MS), and I don't like them.

Want an example? http://www.csee.umbc.edu/~brianb/ This is the page of my university's system-administrator.

P.S. You mention that you use Pine... I've used it before, as well, but switched to Outlook. I needed to be able to easily view graphics, work with attachments, type in a foreign language, etc. For me, the choice was obvious: I switched to something more powerful.

Ok first of all I really don't see what the big issue is with Linux VS MS. I'm an IT Technician specialising in Hardware and they both have their place in a modern role in computing.

1. "Windoze" is not going to be replaced by Linux anytime soon as the consumer lever OS. It's easier to run programs/games/music/etc

2. Linux is going to keep making inroads as a business OS and may even displace the NT 4/5 boxes. It's going to do even better with large corporations simply fed up with MS's ever increasing BS over licencing issues and upgrade paths. (How many companies made the switch from NT4 to NT5 thinking it'd be the last upgrade from MS for a year or two AT LEAST. Woops!

3. More and more tech-savy consumers are going to use Linux at home.

The main reason i don't use Linux is basically because Win XP does everything I need it to do. I want to play Counter-strike, Medal of Honor, Rip MP3's and play them, Run office software, Create music using progs like Cubase & Rebirth and master/remaster using Cool Edit Pro ETC. I want to be able to use Photoshop to edit Images and do Graphic Design and composition with. I don't want to have to learn to use Gimp as i already have spent years mastering PS.

So thats why MS is going to keep most of their market-share in the home. Because Linux hasn't matured enough yet! And until it does things will stay the same

not bad

ok linux is better but harder
windows is not bad but crapper

quote:

Originally posted by Stanza Hey Dj Rozzer, I suggest you get the Redhat distribution. The installation was breeze for me. I just inserted in the cd in Windows and up came the instalation window. You didn't have to fuck around with any DOS menus and the hardware configuartion was pretty sweet with auto detect. Even the partitioning process was easy to get through without the use of FDISK. The cd that I bought came with a little guide on how to set up an internet connection, how to configure your desktop with those window managers and how to set up sound. I am made to believe that all of this is not as complicated as I thought but I have yet to try all of it. The guide actaully had screenshot of Linux in full action, like with all themes sound and everything confirued and working. So I guess it is NOT impossible to set up your hardware and shit. I think you just got to check out your vendor's specs on the parts. With this discussion on WIN XP, I was wondering if it beats Win 2000. I'm using Win 2000 at the moment and it's running pretty smoothly. Is XP more stabler than 2000 or are they about the same?

XP is a bit more stable. It doesn't crash as frequently as other Windows Versions. Windows 2000's core is Windows NT 5.0, while XP's core is NT 5.1. Plus, XP has TONS of bells and whistles that 2000 will never have! XP doesn't even look the same as any other Windows. Also, you can select between NTFS and FAT32 Hard Disk Drive file system types. NTFS is good because it allows up to 4 TB in ONE partition, while with FAT32, you can only have up to (I think) 32 GB in a single partition. It's possible to reach the 32 GB limit with todays large HD drives (like the 100 GB ones!) so, if you have that type of HDD, use NTFS file system. I love WinXP!

WHY NOT???

quote:

Originally posted by Trancewave I was actually about to switch over to Linux that was until XP showed up. I've been using xp for a while now and have to say that I am completely estactic about xp. I thought win2000 was the best OS i've used but xp beats it hands down. Sure xp has the security issue but I still got to say it's the best OS out there. What bugs me is when people go out and knock XP but never really bother to give it a try Also ali92 are you sure that you can dual boot with XP and Linux? I don't think that is possible. I could be wrong though. And why would you want to dual boot with xp and Linux? XP is just so stable, I havn't had to reboot in months With windows 98, if i leave my comp on for more than a few days I would eventually have to reboot due to the massive memory leak.

Why wouldn't it be possible to dual-boot between WinXP and Linux? I know a bloke who has XP running since 2001/11/03! No reboot, power off, Control+ALT+Delete, etc.!!! I just wanted to try Linux out and see what it's like. That's all. It's not like I would abandon the BEST OS ever (WinXP)!

quote:

Originally posted by Eugene trancaholic, your post really upsets me, because MS-Word is quite possibly the best application ever written. No other program (let alone another word processor) can compete with Word in terms of its smooth operation, conveniences, usability, and POWER. I have never had any problems with it at all, and I've used it heavily on 98/2000/NT. But what I'd like to discuss is LaTeX. All the professors and many students at my university blindly hate Microsoft and Windows (later I'll give you examples) and, for example, use LaTeX to type formulas. LaTeX is very hard, command-based, and why would you want to use it, when there is Microsoft Equation Editor built into Word that has the SAME power and functionality? It's very visual, convenient, yet truly powerful. Believe me, I've used it often, and exploited many of its features. It is equally powerful as LaTeX - and a pleasure to use. In their blind hate of all things Microsoft (*just because* it's Microsoft and Windows), people become stupid and narrow-minded. At my university, there are lots of Linux snobs like that (or people who want to be "cool" by dissing MS), and I don't like them. Want an example? http://www.csee.umbc.edu/~brianb/ This is the page of my university's system-administrator. P.S. You mention that you use Pine... I've used it before, as well, but switched to Outlook. I needed to be able to easily view graphics, work with attachments, type in a foreign language, etc. For me, the choice was obvious: I switched to something more powerful.

I can't get to the page! I get a 403 error (Forbidden)!!! MS Word's the best!

I use Win98 SE dual booted with RedHat.
Definately worth it - I need the sheer power of linux for programming, with the program availability of MS Windows.

quote:

Originally posted by DJ_D|ABL0_ I use Win98 SE dual booted with RedHat. Definately worth it - I need the sheer power of linux for programming, with the program availability of MS Windows.

That's exactly what I wanted to do but, with Windows XP! I was speaking to someone yeaterday and he told me that the only way I can do it is if I install Windows XP AFTER the other OS. If this is true, why??? Can't I just install Linux onto another partition on my HDD that I made with Partition Magic?

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