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Mastering / Tweaking your demo's

ok. I've tried searching around but i havent really found that answer that i'm looking for. Here it goes..
I know a few people who record their demo's then master or tweak or do whatever they do with software on a computer. I mean is it really necessary or advisable to master your demo's ? What needs to be done ? as in tweak the eq's ? remove remove noise ?

As for me, i just hit the record button, finish the recording, boost the gain(i record at a low volume),then export the wave file when i'm done.

What about the rest of you guys ?

I usually adjust any clipping in soundforge, with the volume envelopes, and level it out as best as possible...then just save as 192.

I know theres ways in cubase and shit to compress it and do most of that automatically I think...I dunno...Boomer worked some magic on my last mix...

lol

peak is ur friend

Don't normalize.

It will flatten your demo and make it very dull in my experience.

If you have a ghetto system like me, remove all the white noise, clicks and pops, then wavehammer

i usually run my mixes through the Waves L2 plugin to get them as loud as possible without clipping.

quote:

Originally posted by Xtracktor If you have a ghetto system like me, remove all the white noise, clicks and pops, then wavehammer

mmm explain ?

just gain the recording so its as loud as possible and apply a bit of compression. not much tho cos if the tracks are professional they should be comped perfectly to start with and you ll end up over comping.

i often boost the bass a little before applying compression. it seams to give the mix more oomph if done right and with the right comp settings. you need to search how to use a compressor if your gonna make it work right.

right now, i'm just going from dj mixer to mini-disc recorder. it's fine for now.

i have a tc unity card on my O2R that i could use for mastering, but neither of dat's feel like working... so i haven't bothered plugging in the O2R into the chain just to record into mini disc. i've tried it, and i wasn't really happy w/it. it wasn't so much the sound, i was unhappy w/the trouble i went thru to hook everything/ setting the levels, yadda-yadda... just to record on a mini-disc.

yeah im having this problem too...

my dj demo tends to sound softer at the start and gets louder progressively... at some pt it might clip. Compression on the demo does help..

BUT i got a question,

if you try to make every track in ur whole mix sound relatively at the same volume level without much dynamic changes... wouldnt it sound dull?

ie. volume changes in the demo kinda can induce percieve changes in energy level.

quote:

Originally posted by Felix.Hoo yeah im having this problem too... my dj demo tends to sound softer at the start and gets louder progressively... at some pt it might clip. Compression on the demo does help.. BUT i got a question, if you try to make every track in ur whole mix sound relatively at the same volume level without much dynamic changes... wouldnt it sound dull? ie. volume changes in the demo kinda can induce percieve changes in energy level.

You need to keep your gain structure tighter. You shouldn't use conpression or any other type of effect on a mix because you were pushing the gain higher towards the end. Just redo the mix and keep in mind not to push your gains as you progress. The only thing I can really reccomend is to put a little bit of compression using something like the L2 in Waves to put just a little bit more of a polish over the top but it should be barely noticeable. IMHO mix sets don't need mastering, or they shouldn't.

Songs have their own dynamics you don't need to create your own dynamics by mismatching gain levels. This is also why you don't overdo the compression or normalize demos because it will sap the dynamic range of your mix.

I've never mastered/tweaked my demos. :-/

quote:

Originally posted by Allied Nations Don't normalize. It will flatten your demo and make it very dull in my experience.

actually my poofy-haired friend

normalizing will boost or lower the gain of the audio

compression will flatten and make it dull and lifeless

people try to use compression to make the recording seem louder when you're really reducing the dynamic range of the audio

and think about how compressed and mastered the songs should be by the time you get them and play them

when mastering your mix, all you should need to do is normalize to bring the recording up to volume and maybe eq to brighten up the high end and fill out the low end

quote:

Originally posted by idoru I've never mastered/tweaked my demos. :-/

quote:

Originally posted by Allied Nations Don't normalize. It will flatten your demo and make it very dull in my experience.

I haven't either Idoru for the simple reason that Allied Nations has already pointed out.

This is why you learn an easy skill known as adjusting your gain/volume leveling. As a rule of thumb of you should never play a track in the RED. Always keep it in the GREEN and you'll be fine. On your mixer it should look something like this:

DUH!

quote:

Originally posted by stevieboy32808 I haven't either Idoru for the simple reason that Allied Nations has already pointed out. This is why you learn an easy skill known as adjusting your gain/volume leveling. As a rule of thumb of you should never play a track in the RED. Always keep it in the GREEN and you'll be fine. On your mixer it should look something like this: DUH!

Exactly. As long as you know what you're doing (I'm not calling anyone dumb here ) then you shouldn't have to master it at all.

I try to keep the levels tight around -5db peak
and then apply compression with the settings of
3:1 Compression Ratio and -15db Threshold Level
Attack at 1ms and Release at 500ms

This does not seem to flatten the tracks too much, but
brings out some punch (not pumping) and energy without
making the tracks sound dull. Compression also tends to
bring out the beatmatching and mixing mistakes. I use it often
to listen to my beatmatching inperfections. But compressing
the mix at the above setting fixes tracks leveling mistakes.
For example when the first track is ok and the second track
comes in quieter. Compression also brings up the pops and that
warm analog sizzlle sound of vinyl records.

how does it sound? do you hear the pads get louder during a breakdown, the get softer when the kick/bass comes back?

me, when i record, i aim for -1db-0db area mid mix right off the bat. so when one song is playing it's probably in the -2db-0db area. w/those settings the comp will not be very subtle. since you aim for -5db the compressor won't be as aggressive.

when i used to master my mixes, when aiming for 0db while recording, i would use something between 1.5:1-2:1 starting to kick in at -1db, or -2db. i used to want something very subtle to keep the mix under control. but i stoped doing that a long time ago. i've been using my recorders long enough to know how hard i can push them before they start popping. i just ended up preffering getting the full dynamics of each song, than to give my mix a "sound". not that having a "sound" is wrong... i just force my self to do my absolute best to nail everything down according to my specs while recording because i'm too lazy play w/settings, then record. i'm definately too lazy to bother w/having to comeback later and re-eq a mix after it's been recorded. or do any kind of tweek, really...

I'm confused... Doesn't normalizing simply adjust the relative volume of all parts of the track to a "normal" level?

I need to boost the volume on a demo right now, and usually that's the route I'd go, but I don't want to lose any sound quality...

quote:

Originally posted by Allied Nations Don't normalize. It will flatten your demo and make it very dull in my experience.

I havent noticed that...

What are you recording through?

Ive been doing that when I bring it down to a reasonable size. My mixes are at least a 1gig in size before dithering/normalizing to a CD size.

I've never tweaked a mix that I recorded..

As Zild and a couple of others have said, tracks have their own dynamics and are mastered by their producers. So when you mix a set, you shouldn't need to master your recording. Gains should be kept more or less constant throughout your set, no bullshit about starting soft and getting louder to build energy.

Normalising the recording once you are done is the only step that may need to be taken. Usually the way you'll do this with software (such as soundforge) is the average gain of the entire recording is calculated, and say it is -17db, then you normalise the recording to a standard level (I use -16db as soundforge presets recommend for music). This means that the gain for the whole recording is upped by 1db. Likewise if your recording averages -20db, the gain will be increased by 4db to -16db.

Compression is bad news. What you are doing is you are adjusting the gains depending on frequency, so that in the high end there is little if any change in gain, but the lower the frequency, the bigger the gain boost. This 'fattens' up the low end to make things louder without making the high end too loud to tolerate. In other words, you are reducing the dynamic range of the audio signal, which means you are losing fidelity. Screw that. If you really suck at EQing during a set, then do some EQing on the recording itself.

quote:

Originally posted by Rememberence_ As Zild and a couple of others have said, tracks have their own dynamics and are mastered by their producers. So when you mix a set, you shouldn't need to master your recording. Gains should be kept more or less constant throughout your set, no bullshit about starting soft and getting louder to build energy. --- Compression is bad news. What you are doing is you are adjusting the gains depending on frequency, so that in the high end there is little if any change in gain, but the lower the frequency, the bigger the gain boost. This 'fattens' up the low end to make things louder without making the high end too loud to tolerate. In other words, you are reducing the dynamic range of the audio signal, which means you are losing fidelity. Screw that. If you really suck at EQing during a set, then do some EQing on the recording itself.

i'm not arguing w/what you are saying... but at the same time, a lot depends on how the dj want's to present the final product (the mix) to his/her audience.

there IS a tastefull way to master a dj mix. how or if it is done is simply a matter of choice/philosophy/concept.

using a compressor isn't really bad news per-say. everything has to do w/how it is set. i always used it to control a stray peak here and there. nothing noticeable. especially not to the average ear, on an average bookshelf system, or average car stereo. if you use it discreetly a slight loss of fidelity is worth it. especially, when trying to save yourself from having to re-record a mix when you're 68min into it because you popped the recorder. (-digital distortion)

There is no real right and wrong but normalizing is quiet important for any mix in my opinion because basically (as many have already said numerous times) it just makes the mix as loud as possible without clipping (or whatever you set) or actualy changing the audio.
Depending on what the mix is you could even add effects if you want. I remember i added some effects/filters/cuts etc to a mix because i dont have an efx processor and it actualy turned out alirght.

Personally I wouldn't normalize anything. Saps your dynamics.

quote:

Originally posted by sr126 i'm not arguing w/what you are saying... but at the same time, a lot depends on how the dj want's to present the final product (the mix) to his/her audience. there IS a tastefull way to master a dj mix. how or if it is done is simply a matter of choice/philosophy/concept. using a compressor isn't really bad news per-say. everything has to do w/how it is set. i always used it to control a stray peak here and there. nothing noticeable. especially not to the average ear, on an average bookshelf system, or average car stereo. if you use it discreetly a slight loss of fidelity is worth it. especially, when trying to save yourself from having to re-record a mix when you're 68min into it because you popped the recorder. (-digital distortion)

Good points, well said. I should have said I was refering to a particular application of compression.

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