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Hardware vs Software

Right, I'm sure this argument has probably cropped up more than a few times on this forum but just out of interest, I wondered what people's opinions on the subject were. The other day I was outbid on Ebay for a Korg MS2000 synth. I had hoped to be able to get it for about �200 but do you lot reckon it's worth spending �200 on a synth that only has 4 voice polophony and 2 voice multitimbrality.

I had considred buying an Access Virus Ti at the begining of the year but used the money for CD decks, so now I'm looking out for an old second Hand Virus B/C or a Roland JP8000, but sometimes I reckon I'm maybe better off spending the money on a softsynth like Cakewalk Rapture or Z3TA+

At the moment, I've got Reason 3, Sonar 5 Producer and NI FM7 and a couple of other soft synth's I just find I'm strugling to use complex soft synth's if I'm using Reason and Sonar cause I've only got a 2.4 Ghz machine, but if I was to buy something like the Korg, your kinda limited in what your gonna be able to do with it anyway so what would you lot do?

I have a Jp8k amongst my hardware, and my last 10 or so productions have been entirely virtual.

make of that what you will

at one point i owned

Virus B
Nord 2
Korg Ms2000
Waldof Q
Waldorf Pulse
Roland SH 101
YAMAHA CS6

i only use software now.

Re: Hardware vs Software

quote:

Originally posted by michael00elder At the moment, I've got Reason 3, Sonar 5 Producer and NI FM7 and a couple of other soft synth's I just find I'm strugling to use complex soft synth's if I'm using Reason and Sonar cause I've only got a 2.4 Ghz machine, but if I was to buy something like the Korg, your kinda limited in what your gonna be able to do with it anyway so what would you lot do?

As long as you can get the soft synths to play live solo, there shouldn't be any problem. You can bounce them to audio, which is basically what you would have to do with hardware synths anyways.
Some people will say hardware sounds better than software. Well, not really, unless you're talking real analogue hardware.
Imo, hardware synths aren't worth the price and hassle.

I got only one statement, if nord is in the name of the hardware you get fucking crush it break it hide it something

even nords are virual really - just virtual on custon hardware - all of the current crop of trance worthey hardware synths are basically a computer running some software.

I went from software to hardware...

From logic + plugs


to
Roland JD 990
Roland Jupiter 6
Oberheim Xpander
Oberheim OB1
Sequential CIrcuits Pro One



And honestly i couldnt be happier, i did not like using a mouse to make music or create sounds. Also i dont like the cold sound of virtual synths. Though most trance music relies on that cold digital sound. Then again i dont make trance nor do i really like trance post 99 soon as those dutch boys started producing it all wetn to shit.

yeah, but no-one is arguing that analog sounds beter than digital are they?

it's current digital hardware synths vs VSTi

you could allways get a master keyboard like the keystation pro 88, that has all the nobs and sliders I've ever needed to control my vstis - I never use the mouse to make sounds.

for me I found hardware sounded too fat and was harder to mix in. I find software is a bit thinner but when you are cutting so much out with EQ , i find it doesn't matter. I find having the synth already in your box so much less of a creativity block. I'm impatient, i like having things right away.

quote:

Originally posted by RichieV for me I found hardware sounded too fat and was harder to mix in. I find software is a bit thinner but when you are cutting so much out with EQ , i find it doesn't matter. I find having the synth already in your box so much less of a creativity block. I'm impatient, i like having things right away.

I try and use a minimal amount of eq if you take the time and find proper sounds. And i totaly agree sometimes analog synths are too fat and crowd a mix .

hey michael00elder, i'm more of a virtual synthesizer instrument guy... i'd suggest you getting v-station, reaktor and rb2k1's ensemble. vstation is pretty cool for making trance leads and basses (tho i have not made any bass patch yet) and rb2k1's supersaw v2 for your supersaw needs. if ya have anymore to spare, pro-53 is another way to go.

I have but one thing to say:

http://www.refx.net/?page=soundshop
check out sounds of the revolution 1 + 2

and the vanguard is dirty cheap

Its fukin Vanguard though

Over time I have grown to hate that synth despite initially liking it enough to buy. The saw and square waveforms alias so much you can hear it. Playing above C6 sounds horrid because of all the aliasing mush at the top end of the mix :\ The filter sucks ass too and it steps.

I think if you are going virtual analogue in software, you cant beat G-Media impOSCar. Most analogue sounding softsynth to my ears. PWM square and sine/triangle waves sound beautiful. The saw isnt bad. The filter sounds beautiful. Its awkward to program at first but its so organic sounding.

each to his own; imho the number of times you should use anything above C6 in a trance track are 0 - would kill peoples ears over a 40k sound system.

vanguard has a unique sound, you just have to use it right; and every synth has it's limitations.

btw - you are right about the imposcar; but it's a different product, it's intention is to emulate.

You dont play anything above C6?!

Man, the stuff I am working on at the moment spans 6 octaves, not including the sub, and I find its fairly common in the music I listen to - to use 6 octaves. How do you get moog leads going without going up past C6?

Playing above C6 absolutely does not destroy your ears or sound crap by default. Only when you have loads of instruments aliasing at the top end. Besides, nobody said you had to play above C6 at ear splitting amplitudes...

each to his own is what I say.

I'm not going to enter a flame war about the relative merits of high octave moog leads - it was intended to prove the point below

It depends upon the sound, and depends upon the mix; as does the aliasing in vanguard.

True but I generally find aliasing to be highly undesirable. It is a type of noise and it is impossible to limit or control in the case of Vanguard. The aliasing definitely killed that synth for me. Once I got onto my Virus B, it just sings in comparison to vanguard in the higher octaves partly because it aliases so much less and the filter is so much better.

Real analogues absolutely scream with pearcing clarity on the upper octaves. I guess I just like that kind of clarity. I know aliasing is a design feature of Vanguard but oof. It just grates me now >___<

Re: Re: Hardware vs Software

quote:

Originally posted by Eldritch As long as you can get the soft synths to play live solo, there shouldn't be any problem. You can bounce them to audio, which is basically what you would have to do with hardware synths anyways. Some people will say hardware sounds better than software. Well, not really, unless you're talking real analogue hardware. Imo, hardware synths aren't worth the price and hassle.

Why would you want to bounce your soft Synths to Audio? and how do you bounce them to audio? i'm using Ableton Live if you know but then I'm not sure what the point of it would be........

Nowadays most software has a freeze function so you don't need to bounce anymore (same thing really).

I have 2 hardware synths, a Novation Nova and a Juno 60, plus lots of software VSTi's.

Re: Hardware vs Software

quote:

Originally posted by michael00elder I'm maybe better off spending the money on a softsynth like Cakewalk Rapture or Z3TA+

As most people have figured out, I like Rapture quite a bit. It is a new synth so not many people know what it can do. If you missed it, I posted some trance style programs for it HERE

You just have to figure out how to program it. I liked some of the presets in Vanguard, but instead of buying Vanguard, I just created similar sounding programs in Rapture. I learned by reverse engineering presets and just experimenting. The lead programmer of Rapture (his name is Rene) often posts in the forum. He is the same guy who developed Z3TA+ as well.

Head over to the Cakewalk Instrument forums. People are posting some really good information and free programs for it.

Take care,
Adam


EDIT: There is a HUGE debate going on over at the Sonar forums about Hardware vs. Software. Here is the link if you are interested: CLICK HERE

Rene is a bit of genius. He makes quality synths and I have no idea how he keeps them CPU friendly. Even zeta+ isnt that bad a hit considering you are pushing 6 filtered oscillators at times...Unfortunately I never got into zeta+ because the demo fades out too often

Traingle 2 is the dogs and is so good, Cakewalk used to make a habit of recommending sonar users to download it.

quote:

Originally posted by Derivative Rene is a bit of genius. He makes quality synths and I have no idea how he keeps them CPU friendly. Even zeta+ isnt that bad a hit considering you are pushing 6 filtered oscillators at times...Unfortunately I never got into zeta+ because the demo fades out too often Traingle 2 is the dogs and is so good, Cakewalk used to make a habit of recommending sonar users to download it.

Oh wow! I forgot I had Triangle 2. It came with my version of Sonar. I had dismissed all the free stuff I got with it in lieu of the ones I bought. Thanks for bringing this back to my attention. I just played with it and you are right, it is good!! I'll have to add some gated CamelSpace effects to make it even better

Take care,
Adam

Both hardware and software are great! and I use both. It is shortsighted to limit yourself either way. Sometimes I am more creative with the board in front of me and sometimes I am more creative mousing around different knobs on screen.

But...

There are some things that hardware can do that software can't. For instance, I can never get the same sound out of software as:

I can runing my Juno-106 through my Pod PRO XT and then to the onxy preamps. This gives me a specific Goldfrapp, Portishead, Boards of candada sound that is only possible by taking a signal, running it through an analog filter then through a processor then through an analog pre-amp.

Or how about the creative possibilities of my AN1x and it's step sequencer and arp going through patches with all my controls there in front of me?

Then there is the Additive synth of my Kawai K5000s which is quite unique and there isn't any additive VSTi's that I'm aware of that could recreate this sound.

Then there is my oberheim Matrix 6R that is phat and silky sounding and has yet to be properly emulated in software.

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