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Help with Trance Mastering

I am done with my album with 10 tracks, now im in the Mastering part. I have tried many softwares like Waves & O-Zone, but still never satisfied with the results. Im producing on Reason 3. I tried the Mastering Suite featured in Reason, but still not satisfied when I compare to other progessional tracks, I feel that my track is a bit "far" or "behind". I uploaded a demo, maybe you can help me when you listen.

Demo mastered with Reason
http://www.crouge.com/track_mastered.mp3


I believe my problem is with the EQUALIZER. maybe the track needs more middle gain? I hope someone can help me with this to finish my last steps & send my CD to the record label.


thank you for support!!!
C-Rouge

why not leave the mastering to the pros? if you're really serious in getting it to the market, you should let the real pro's do the finishing touch then.

well you're right. I agree that a sound engineer must do that part. however I would still love to learn at least a basic mastering OR make it sounds good.

I think you should forget mastering and work on the mixing in the track instead. I suggest that you rework the EQ's of your sounds to seperate them from each other more.

fix it in the mixdown
fix it in the mixdown
fix it in the mixdown
fix it in the mixdown
fix it in the mixdown
fix it in the mixdown
fix it in the mixdown
fix it in the mixdown
fix it in the mixdown
fix it in the mixdown
fix it in the mixdown
fix it in the mixdown
fix it in the mixdown
fix it in the mixdown
fix it in the mixdown

















































ohh btw, did I forget to mention that you should fix it in the mixdown?


okay but seriously talking. If you can't get the mastering right it's one out of two problems. either you're not good enough at mastering (not meant in an unfriendly way, we just can't be good at everything ) or the mixdown isn't good enough. Try to figure out wich one it is first and then the problem will be easy to solve.

I have good monitors, a pair of Alesis. flat studio monitors.

I agree that my problem is with my MIXDOWN. I reseted all my mixer's levels to zero. im right now mixing it again. I hope this will work out now

thanks again!

Re: Help with Trance Mastering

quote:

Originally posted by aliendj I feel that my track is a bit "far" or "behind". I uploaded a demo, maybe you can help me when you listen. Demo mastered with Reason http://www.crouge.com/track_mastered.mp3

For starters, the level isn't very loud, which wouldn't make it all that competitive against other mastered tracks. You can quite safely lower the limiter threshold another 2 or 3 dB to give you a more 'forward' level that way, but ultimately you may want to go back to the mix as others have said too.

quote:

I believe my problem is with the EQUALIZER. maybe the track needs more middle gain?

I do agree you're lacking mids. What I would particularly look at is the extreme treble. It's hard to tell given a 128 kbps MP3, but the treble above ~14 kHz is sounding to be too loud. Especially on the lead synth, you may want to lowpass it off. Give some instruments (e.g. the piano) more boost around 200 Hz - 2 kHz, and balance your levels so the midrange instruments get more level, but less EQ around 7 kHz and above 14 kHz.

What you have here is a very fragile mix on top of a thin, but exposed bass-end. Boost the midrange on any instruments (even the kick could do with more lower mids, and the bass instrument could sound thicker here), and turn their levels up to fill up more of the mixing space. Compression will also get you far in getting a fuller sound.

quote:

Originally posted by LENG why not leave the mastering to the pros? if you're really serious in getting it to the market, you should let the real pro's do the finishing touch then.

Wrong answer

The only way to learn is to do it yourself. Thats just like saying dont play soccer or basketball because where not as good as the pros

quote:

Originally posted by JustinMead Wrong answer The only way to learn is to do it yourself. Thats just like saying dont play soccer or basketball because where not as good as the pros

True. But trying to master a badly mixed track is like playing soccer with a rugby ball: You just can't seem to shoot it in the right direction.

Check out Atlantis-AR on TA. I'm not sure if he is still mastering but you could PM him. He mastered a few of my tracks and he will work with you to get the mixdown to the point where he can take over and work his magic. His prices are awesome too.

quote:

Originally posted by staticblue True. But trying to master a badly mixed track is like playing soccer with a rugby ball: You just can't seem to shoot it in the right direction.

Static Bloo...You're officially cut off!


-1


I still love you though

quote:

Originally posted by staticblue True. But trying to master a badly mixed track is like playing soccer with a rugby ball: You just can't seem to shoot it in the right direction.

Also true, but with a little practice, it can be acheived, like in both cases

quote:

Originally posted by JustinMead Wrong answer The only way to learn is to do it yourself. Thats just like saying dont play soccer or basketball because where not as good as the pros

wrong reply :P

you should read carefully that sentence i wrote earlier. i said "why not..." it's not a must. and if you would read his original post, he didn't mention anything about "learning" either. so, read properly before you counter anyone's post.

Atalntis' reply made me feel something that overall MIDRANGE of my EQ needs gain. I did that, & also some gain for the midrange instruments as he said. it sounds much better!! thank you.

I just have to fix this. the kick & the bass, this is my main problem now! Now when I compare my track to other pro. tracks, I feel my base drum (kick) isnt as powerful as I want. If I give more bass, it is too bassy! when I reduce its bass, it is weak! Im trying to do a powerful, dominant & deep kick.

thank you everyone

usually if you boost the higher frequencies of your bassdrum it feels more punchy. it's not the bass frequency which is responsible for that.

quote:

Originally posted by thecYrus usually if you boost the higher frequencies of your bassdrum it feels more punchy. it's not the bass frequency which is responsible for that.

doesnt the bassline have any say in this equation?

bassline and kick gives the track that 'drive' in my opinion

compress the 2 together

quote:

Originally posted by Magnus Check out Atlantis-AR on TA. I'm not sure if he is still mastering but you could PM him. He mastered a few of my tracks and he will work with you to get the mixdown to the point where he can take over and work his magic. His prices are awesome too.

No, I don't master anymore, but that's why I'm here giving advice.

quote:

Originally posted by aliendj I just have to fix this. the kick & the bass, this is my main problem now! Now when I compare my track to other pro. tracks, I feel my base drum (kick) isnt as powerful as I want. If I give more bass, it is too bassy! when I reduce its bass, it is weak! Im trying to do a powerful, dominant & deep kick.

I wouldn't boost the bass more, as you already have an 'exposed' bass-end, as I mentioned in my first post. What I mean is that you don't have the upper bass needed to support the lower bass, so you just get this weak, boomy sound. Try boosting the kick around 150 Hz to give it more punch, and reducing the click around 10k. Then, run it through a hard compressor to give you that powerful level.

quote:

Originally posted by LENG wrong reply :P you should read carefully that sentence i wrote earlier. i said "why not..." it's not a must. and if you would read his original post, he didn't mention anything about "learning" either. so, read properly before you counter anyone's post.

He also said

"I have tried many softwares like Waves & O-Zone, but still never satisfied with the results."

Sure sounds to me like he wants to learn, why would he have even posted about his mastering, obviously to get help and learn. You dont have to read his text, read his actions. He might not of mentioned learning, but this thread sure implys it

/Leave Thread

quote:

Originally posted by JustinMead He also said "I have tried many softwares like Waves & O-Zone, but still never satisfied with the results." Sure sounds to me like he wants to learn, why would he have even posted about his mastering, obviously to get help and learn. You dont have to read his text, read his actions. He might not of mentioned learning, but this thread sure implys it /Leave Thread

you seem not to get the whole point of it... anyway, if you're assuming what people is trying to say, well then, allow me to assume as well. i assume his main intention is trying to FIND a solution here. of course, he can learn from the solution given should he ask for more details. and i assume you don't really like to digest what people are trying to say either.

Im sorry if I have caused any problem between you...

If you guys believe me, I've spent MONTHS for mastering. im doing everything I can to learn it. tried Waves, Ozone, T-racks, different speakers (JBL, ALESIS...) Now I think hardest part of making a track is the mixing/mastering. Im really tired of trying hard but I won't quit till im done. I've been working on my album for 3 years, so I can not release it as it is, with a bad mixing/mastering.

again thanks to everyone trying to help me with this if you still have more tips. trick, please post!

"and i assume you don't really like to digest what people are trying to say either."




No problem, this convo should of been threw PM's anyway, but half of his posts dont make sense anyways.

A lot of highs is right...I think you need to work on the actually structure, different sounds, adding some atmosphere to it. The mix is overcompressed and yeah the mastering of course isn't all that great. Work on your structure and elements first with absolutely no effects, add effects like delay and eq then work on your mixdown while adding compression and maybe fixing the eq here. Once you've added all your automations by now and think the track is mixed down well, now start on your mastering. The track should sound pretty perfect right now. All you really want to add is some limiting to get it "up front" and then some other effects maybe like stereo wideners, eq on the whole mix, maybe a vintage warmer. Ozone will do a good job. You can even use the presets, they're still pretty amazing if you don't know much about mastering.

Looks like you kind of over eqed the whole sample in my opinion. Seems like there is a huge boost near the highs which becomes piercing to the ears after time. Your sound is crisp but very thin...so if you want it to make it in the pro's world you need to concentrate on that factor of the mixdown. Try not to eq that much. Most people over eq and end up playing catch up later on trying to fix it. Excessive eq/compression causes the instrument/sound to appear unnatural *learned from Derivative* and unpleasant to listen to. What I like to do is to remove all the effects or atleast turn them off and then play with the instrument levels and synthesis. Eq/compress when absolutely necessary. The cleaner your mixdown, the less of a need for mastering.

Here is a new mix & new mastering, what do u think now?

http://www.crouge.com/master2.mp3



thank you

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