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-- The state of EDM in nightlife
The state of EDM in nightlife
Over the past decade, I've seen a massive change in the state of EDM and it's role in nightlife. Dance music has had a ton of ups and downs and through it all I've supported and loved it but lately, I have to admit I'm losing faith in it.
Dance music just doesn't appeal to the masses. That's why clubs are dropping it from their weekly rotations. And whether anyone cares to admit it or not, nightclubs are a business that need to make money here in NY to survive. That's why you hear hip hop everywhere you go, including clubs like Crobar, Spirit, Avalon, and yes even Pacha.
I recall a day where electronica acts like Prodigy, The Chemical Brothers, BT, Daft Punk, and Underworld pushed EDM and the dance music into the mainstream. People flocked to clubs to "experience" dance music through a huge sound system and even MTV picked up on it's appeal. But it seems those days have long passed and hip hop continues to pick up steam and has asserted itself as the dominant sound in clubs today.
I've seen this coming for a long time. My first residency in 1999 was at a small lounge in Boston playing deep soulful house to a packed room. By 2001 with business dwindling, the managers asked me to play a hip hop set, just to see if it would pick things up. In two months time my deep house lounge had turned into a full on hip hop dance club. It got so big that the promoters moved me into a much bigger venue and the place was still packed. It was to the point where I was playing 4 hip hop nights a week and my friday night gig, Embassy, which was attached to Avalon in Boston, made more money on some nights than Avalon! Needless to say, if anyone could see this coming, it was me. Eventually, I caught a break with the opening of Avalon in NYC, a new residency, and a renewed sense of hope that dance music was still going strong here in NY.
Whenever a new club opens up, there's generally a buzz around the venue for 1-2 years before something new opens up. What seems to have happened here in NYC was that there were 3 large EDM clubs (Spirt, Avalon, and Crobar) all opening within a short time and seriously competing with one another for a shrinking audience of EDM fans. It was only a matter of time before each venue had to try something new, including hip hop on their main floors. To me, there's nothing more depressing than hearing some annoying hip hop DJ giving "shout outs to all my ladies out there" over a huge club sound system. It makes me wanna vomit. But in my opinion, the state of NYC nightlife has hit rockbottom and it has me wondering if dance music will ever reign supreme in the clubs again.
It's a vicious cycle that dance music is in right now. In order for it to flourish, it has to be experienced over a huge sound system in order to attain it's full effect. Hearing "For an Angel" on the radio is nothing like walking into a club and experiencing it with a thunderous bassline. But with less and less clubs playing it, less and less people are experiencing it. It has lost so much of it's mainstream appeal and the younger generation that is so heavily influenced by the radio and MTV just aren't exposed to it. EDM is steadily losing it's fan base and it isn't being replenished by a younger generation.
Last week, I attended a small venue (that shall remain nameless) that was playing hip hop to very diverse crowd. There wasn't much dancing going on so the DJ decided to become a bit more adventurous and decided to drop a few well known EDM tracks. Bad idea. People were looking at him as if he just shot a puppy. This is the state EDM is in right now.....
I've got so much more to say on this matter but I'll spare you. If you're read this far, I thank and applaud you.
i def. feel you and i feel the same way somewhat, but it just comes down to this. if you REALLY love EDM and know the true potential of it, you'll represent it no matter what. majority of the music has turned generic because of countless ppl wanting to make music without the proper passion and knowledge, BUT the electronic genre as a whole has just gotten too huge, which means there are plenty of good music if you dedicate yourself to find it.
this subject is too deep for me to even continue but all i wanna say is that the negativity will always appear greater than the positive and its up to us to push the quality forward.
Pvd Tiesto and Oaky are now listened to by a wider audience then at the peak of trance in the late 90's. What this tells us is obvious. Big djs are garnering more fans while the little guys are losing ground. I know that when I got into the scene during that 90s there was alot more quality being released from record labels.
Right around when those college punks released napster the edm scene in NY had hit its peak. Twilo very diversified. They had there magazine, mid week parties and even a national talent search for new upcoming djs. It was truly positive and forward thinking on there part. If they had just kept their operation tighter in the club who knows where the scene (in ny) would be today?
I know for a fact that artist do not invest as much into there productions as opposed to 7 or 10 years ago. They release these washed out simple tunes that sound like every other song. Most of the music lacks depth and character or it goes absolutely no where. They release the song get it played by the top 5 djs then get to open for one of them down the line.CLICK ME FOR EXAMPLE) The main source of revenue for artist is Dj gigs.
We have way to many dj's spinning other peoples music and not enough talent out there on the production side of things.
Re: The state of EDM in nightlife
| quote: |
| Originally posted by DJ Eddie Lee Over the past decade, I've seen a massive change in the state of EDM and it's role in nightlife. Dance music has had a ton of ups and downs and through it all I've supported and loved it but lately, I have to admit I'm losing faith in it. Dance music just doesn't appeal to the masses. That's why clubs are dropping it from their weekly rotations. And whether anyone cares to admit it or not, nightclubs are a business that need to make money here in NY to survive. That's why you hear hip hop everywhere you go, including clubs like Crobar, Spirit, Avalon, and yes even Pacha. I recall a day where electronica acts like Prodigy, The Chemical Brothers, BT, Daft Punk, and Underworld pushed EDM and the dance music into the mainstream. People flocked to clubs to "experience" dance music through a huge sound system and even MTV picked up on it's appeal. But it seems those days have long passed and hip hop continues to pick up steam and has asserted itself as the dominant sound in clubs today. I've seen this coming for a long time. My first residency in 1999 was at a small lounge in Boston playing deep soulful house to a packed room. By 2001 with business dwindling, the managers asked me to play a hip hop set, just to see if it would pick things up. In two months time my deep house lounge had turned into a full on hip hop dance club. It got so big that the promoters moved me into a much bigger venue and the place was still packed. It was to the point where I was playing 4 hip hop nights a week and my friday night gig, Embassy, which was attached to Avalon in Boston, made more money on some nights than Avalon! Needless to say, if anyone could see this coming, it was me. Eventually, I caught a break with the opening of Avalon in NYC, a new residency, and a renewed sense of hope that dance music was still going strong here in NY. Whenever a new club opens up, there's generally a buzz around the venue for 1-2 years before something new opens up. What seems to have happened here in NYC was that there were 3 large EDM clubs (Spirt, Avalon, and Crobar) all opening within a short time and seriously competing with one another for a shrinking audience of EDM fans. It was only a matter of time before each venue had to try something new, including hip hop on their main floors. To me, there's nothing more depressing than hearing some annoying hip hop DJ giving "shout outs to all my ladies out there" over a huge club sound system. It makes me wanna vomit. But in my opinion, the state of NYC nightlife has hit rockbottom and it has me wondering if dance music will ever reign supreme in the clubs again. It's a vicious cycle that dance music is in right now. In order for it to flourish, it has to be experienced over a huge sound system in order to attain it's full effect. Hearing "For an Angel" on the radio is nothing like walking into a club and experiencing it with a thunderous bassline. But with less and less clubs playing it, less and less people are experiencing it. It has lost so much of it's mainstream appeal and the younger generation that is so heavily influenced by the radio and MTV just aren't exposed to it. EDM is steadily losing it's fan base and it isn't being replenished by a younger generation. Last week, I attended a small venue (that shall remain nameless) that was playing hip hop to very diverse crowd. There wasn't much dancing going on so the DJ decided to become a bit more adventurous and decided to drop a few well known EDM tracks. Bad idea. People were looking at him as if he just shot a puppy. This is the state EDM is in right now..... I've got so much more to say on this matter but I'll spare you. If you're read this far, I thank and applaud you. |
| quote: |
| Originally posted by dj tek which means there are plenty of good music if you dedicate yourself to find it. |
| quote: |
| Originally posted by dj tek this subject is too deep for me to even continue but all i wanna say is that the negativity will always appear greater than the positive and its up to us to push the quality forward. |
I believe it will flourish again one day and in a much bigger sense then it has before. I have honestly met a lot of people who enjoy the music but don't get a chance to experience it out in a club because they are under age. I believe once these people reach 21, they will go out of their way to listen to it. It is just up to the people who run the parties to promote it well and get everyone out.
Its very surpising to me when I go work in the mall and strike up a convo with people on "What are you doing this weekend?" and when I tell them Im going out to listen to trance they are like "No way I love trance!" But it sucks when they find out its 21+ and they cant go. Hip Hop is just easier to advertise because its everywhere and you dont necessarily need to go to a club to listen to it. But when you do go out to one, it is usually there. For EDM, its either you listen to it on your own time, or you have to go out to a club but the problem is, its always 21+ to get in one.
I suppose the last thing I can say is, share it with as many people as you can. Because I have found out that even to those who dismiss it early generally open up to it and in the end fall in love with the music. From personal experience, I had to bring a friend to NYC to see someone like Armin or PvD so they can see the music in its full potential and to see how the crowd really reacts to the dj and the music and that is what gets them. They finally have something to relate the music to.
its at a lull right now i believe music genres come in cycles and right now this is edms time how ever the best thing to do is an i hate to make it sound buisness like promote it to ppl u see in the street ppl u dont know that well whether it be at the mall, co workers, friends of friends its not only the job of djs/producers an the like but its also ppl like u me an the next edm enthusiast thats the only way that it'll cut into this strong hold that Crop (crappy pop music) and Crap (crap hip hop) also hold producers an djs accountable for what is being brought to the audiences ... just my two cents to this topic on a late rainy nite...
jay
| quote: |
| Originally posted by phuzzyfish12 its at a lull right now. i believe music genres come in cycles and right now this is edms time how ever the best thing to do is an i hate to make it sound buisness like promote it. to ppl u see in the street ppl u dont know that well whether it be at the mall, co workers, friends of friends its. not only the job of djs/producers an the like but. its also ppl like u me an the next edm enthusiast thats the only way that it'll cut into this strong hold that. Crop (crappy pop music) and Crap (crap hip hop) also hold producers an djs accountable for what is being brought to the.audiences ... just my two cents to this topic on a late rainy nite... jay |
is it different in europe?
| quote: |
| Originally posted by dj tek i def. feel you and i feel the same way somewhat, but it just comes down to this. if you REALLY love EDM and know the true potential of it, you'll represent it no matter what. majority of the music has turned generic because of countless ppl wanting to make music without the proper passion and knowledge, BUT the electronic genre as a whole has just gotten too huge, which means there are plenty of good music if you dedicate yourself to find it. this subject is too deep for me to even continue but all i wanna say is that the negativity will always appear greater than the positive and its up to us to push the quality forward. |
i hate the state of today's music in general mostly in the US for some reason its the same bullshyt over and over, theres rarely anything amazing or ground breaking these days. But yea its just makes me sad to hear that EDM is not as big as it used to b couple years back.
everything happens in waves.... disco music was huge in the 70s... then died out and what came along? 80s synth-driven music, which died out and gave way to the beginnings of the dark house we know today... im not an EDM historian but its common sense that were at the bottom of that wave right now (and with parties at Pacha and Crobar being packed for the most part, and Central Park and Tobacco Warehouse parties flourishing still, and Armin and PVD and Tiesto getting 2 nights @ Crobar and selling out both)... its not TOO bad considering were at the bottom of that wave... it will only get better... 2 years ago, what was minimal, what was electro but some Brooklyn loft party music... new music comes, new crowds get captivated, and a new scene emerges, its how it works, and sorry to say but the old scene goes down into oblivion, with claims that nothing will ever be as good as that scene once was, even when the sound progresses and the crowds seem younger and younger, to these people, nothing will be good as that old house music, or those old parties.... yes, i see a decline in quality of lineups from Avalon of 2003 to 2006 (oh yeah).... but if u step back, it is sorta quite the same then as it is now (yes, i do miss some DJs like Marco V and Mauro Picotto and Chris Liebing who were @ Avalon very often but just try to see my point)... with the fall of Spirit came Pacha (especially now that Made Events is a big presence there) and with the fall of Avalon came Crobar's supremacy over the scene in New York (in my opinion) as far as the numbers it pulls and the consistency over the years, and quality of the parties.... not only that but theres plenty of options for a clubgoer to go to... like u said, it used to be Avalon vs Spirit vs Crobar and that was that... now you can see the DJs you want at a few more venues, smaller in size but just as fun im sure.... its more like Crobar vs Pacha vs Sullivan Room (i like its lineups now better than 3 years ago) vs Love (these last two, by far, the opposite of superclubs but a nice alternative that wasnt there before).... guess theres nothing more to say other than i hope u see my point, even though i do a gree with u that i miss some of the Avalon lineups of the past
| quote: |
| Originally posted by ledgemaster is it different in europe? |
Re: Re: The state of EDM in nightlife
| quote: |
| Originally posted by pyro264jb Its sad Someone finally post a good thread only a few take the time to read it. Oh and for those who could care less about eddies comments Go back to your pointless threads and have a nice day |
Re: Re: Re: The state of EDM in nightlife
| quote: |
| Originally posted by djinnom blah blah. This thread is just as pointless as every other thread. I swear, every edm forum i've been to I see someone post something like "the scene is dead" or "why can't it be like it used to". Well y'know what? We all need to wake up and smell the coffee. It WON'T be like it used to. It never will. You all sound like a bunch of ppl who still love elvis and are desperately awaiting his comeback. It aint happening. The best way to use your energy is to push the envelope FORWARD..not backwards. Quit digging up these thoughts from 10 years ago and look ahead for the next 10 years. History is just that, history. Bitchin' about it doesn't do anything. |
m a r a d o n a
the issue is thatalent is a rare commodity in
every profession and artists are not an exception
thus for a party to grow entrepreneurship and
imagination are paramount lastly i must add
there is a surplus of magnificentracks ready
for any true pioneer to have as a repertoire
;)
Every genre of music has its day and moves on. Sure, disco was good in the 70's. Every club played it. Small clubs, large clubs, and everything in between. The "vibe" was probably pretty good too. Then it became mainstream and it ruined it all. In the 80's, people talked about bringing the "good times" back and created threads like this, although not on forums but probably on some bbs or partyline. But did disco come back? No.
| quote: |
| Originally posted by djinnom Every genre of music has its day and moves on. Sure, disco was good in the 70's. Every club played it. Small clubs, large clubs, and everything in between. The "vibe" was probably pretty good too. Then it became mainstream and it ruined it all. In the 80's, people talked about bringing the "good times" back and created threads like this, although not on forums but probably on some bbs or partyline. But did disco come back? No. |
its still around
I agree with you 100%
I hate when i see lil kids wearing thug rapper clothes and acting all black. You hear hip hop everywhere, and its getting worse. America is turning into HIP HOP America.
It is so widespread that everybody is starting to accept it.
I fucking hate it.
I agree with a few of your points, like EDM is much more exciting when experienced in a club as opposed to on the radio, and that its losing its mainsteam appeal because MTV caters to a mostly hip-hop playlist/promoting. If the suits dont want the masses to listen to it, i guess its popularity is bound to dwindle. As long as I can go out to clubs and enjoy EDM with others who actually enjoy it, i'll be happy. 
| quote: |
| Originally posted by SebG I agree with you 100% I hate when i see lil kids wearing thug rapper clothes and acting all black. |
all the top 40 is played repetitively , as in you can hear the same song on the radio 3 times with in the same hour on the same station......this brain washing which offers no alternative choices, which is brought on by producers and record companies paying off radio stations to play their music...if you remember the lawsuit vs bmg or whatever. the world is fucked but as long as you stay true to what you love it will survive
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