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Question about "studio" headphones

I am just about to buy some Studio headphones as I am unable to have monitors up loudly at all . So I'm going to invest in a decent pair of cans, but I have a few questions that I wouldn't mind finding out the answers to:

1. I am looking at the AKG K240 DF, but was really wondering what the following paragraph really means (especially the bit about non-anechoic surfaces):

The K 240 DF follows the criteria specified by the Institute of Radio Technology (IRT) in Munich for a "diffuse field" equalization curve that provides headphone listeners with the sound pattern, characteristic of a room with reflective, non-anechoic surfaces. Each K 240 DF is rigorously tested to assure strict adherence to the IRT standards for frequency response, channel separation and sensitivity.

2. I am also considering the Beyerdynamic DT990 Pro's as well. And my question regarding these is about the frequency response, which is 5Hz - 35Khz. Would this make any difference to monitoring/mixing as we usually cut anything below 20-30Hz and anything above sort of 20Khz anyhow. BTW the AKG's freq response is 15 Hz to 20,000 Hz.

PC

I doubt either of them has a flat frequency response at the real low frequencies. I own the AKG ones and they definately don't go all the way down to 15hz (They seem to drop off at 40-50Hz). I think it's hard to mix bass on any headphone, that's why I got monitors. The AKG phones are very revealing in the mid frequencies, and they're very comfortable. I highly recommend them.

yes mixing basses is hard on headphones, because you need to feel them

i have beyer dt 770 pro, really good, but i cant create a song with headphones only

I Have had the DT 990 for like 6 months now. I had the samE dilemma as you have, but i chose the DT cus it had a deeper sound. I can mix a track with these wihout any problem. You also have a nice control of the stereo widh and bass mixing the bottom ends. You can both hear and feel the low end, though not all the way to 5hz , but around 30 you can still hear how the bassline works with the kick low ends.

Cheers
C

Re: Question about "studio" headphones

quote:

Originally posted by paulc_dj 1. I am looking at the AKG K240 DF, but was really wondering what the following paragraph really means (especially the bit about non-anechoic surfaces): The K 240 DF follows the criteria specified by the Institute of Radio Technology (IRT) in Munich for a "diffuse field" equalization curve that provides headphone listeners with the sound pattern, characteristic of a room with reflective, non-anechoic surfaces. Each K 240 DF is rigorously tested to assure strict adherence to the IRT standards for frequency response, channel separation and sensitivity.

It means they are the best headphones you can buy. Seriously, you should take all marketing speak will a fair amount of salt.

quote:

2. I am also considering the Beyerdynamic DT990 Pro's as well. And my question regarding these is about the frequency response, which is 5Hz - 35Khz. Would this make any difference to monitoring/mixing as we usually cut anything below 20-30Hz and anything above sort of 20Khz anyhow. BTW the AKG's freq response is 15 Hz to 20,000 Hz.

Frequency response that goes up to 35 kHz is rubbish, because you won't hear so high pitched sounds. Don't buy your headphones based on that kind of fake credentials. As for the lowend, I doubt they go down to 15 Hz, but it doesn't hurt to have phones that have a deep bass extension because you need to hear if there's any rumble there. My cheapo Sennheiser HD200s (about 80 euros) reproduce surprisingly low, up to 30 Hz or so; I can clearly hear (or feel) the difference when use a highpass EQ to eliminate the extremely low freqs. That said, you should always use monitors for final mixing & mastering.

I agree with what people said here.
I got the AKG-240S. they are great but when comeing to basses you can't do it right with headphones.
To be honest it might sound stupid but I think that if headphones would have gotten that low the sound would be rather annoying...listening to 20-80hz when they are basicly sitting on your ears would give you a headache in less then 30 mins of constent work. not to mention that you can't feel the vibe of those freq's in your body and then you lost most of their meaning.

Re: Question about "studio" headphones

quote:

Originally posted by paulc_dj The K 240 DF follows the criteria specified by the Institute of Radio Technology (IRT) in Munich for a "diffuse field" equalization curve that provides headphone listeners with the sound pattern, characteristic of a room with reflective, non-anechoic surfaces. Each K 240 DF is rigorously tested to assure strict adherence to the IRT standards for frequency response, channel separation and sensitivity.

It's a bunch of BS, really. But marketing BS aside, I own them and will swear by them. They don't colour the sound like all the other headphones I tried, which is perfect for production, and the curve is as close to flat as headphones generally get.

Of course they won't help you much for sub-bass, but all headphones suck for that, period.

Just make sure if one thing if you get the 240DF - they're a high-impedance model so you need a receiver or amp to get decent volume out of them. If you plan on plugging them directly into your sound card, get the low-impedance model, which I think is just called the K240 Studio.

Re: Re: Question about "studio" headphones

quote:

Originally posted by DigiNut [COLOR=#99CCEE]It's a bunch of BS, really. But marketing BS aside, I own them and will swear by them. They don't colour the sound like all the other headphones I tried, which is perfect for production, and the curve is as close to flat as headphones generally get. COLOR]

Actually this is BS.

Microphones have different frequency responses in different recording situations. Extremas are "free field", where sound source is straight in axis with the mic and no reflections from walls ect. are present and "diffuse field" where soundwaves hit mic from any angle.

"Free field" is the standard sound and needs no correction. "Diffuse field" headphones do color the sound to compensate for the coloring the mic in the diffuse field did to the sound.

Re: Re: Question about "studio" headphones

quote:

Originally posted by DigiNut It's a bunch of BS, really. But marketing BS aside, I own them and will swear by them. They don't colour the sound like all the other headphones I tried, which is perfect for production, and the curve is as close to flat as headphones generally get. Of course they won't help you much for sub-bass, but all headphones suck for that, period. Just make sure if one thing if you get the 240DF - they're a high-impedance model so you need a receiver or amp to get decent volume out of them. If you plan on plugging them directly into your sound card, get the low-impedance model, which I think is just called the K240 Studio.

If we are in the subject, what's the real differnce (in sound) between the DF and the S?
and yea the K240S is 55Ohm, the K240M needs a preamp and the DF remains the question I opened this replay about.

Re: Re: Re: Question about "studio" headphones

quote:

Originally posted by 3rd Signal If we are in the subject, what's the real differnce (in sound) between the DF and the S?

There isn't one, other than the impedance. Higher impedance is better for noise reduction but the amount of noise probably isn't significant enough for anyone to really notice or care. The K240DF was first made many years ago when low-noise technology wasn't so widely available - now it is, so AKG tends to market the Studio now (in fact they may have discontinued the DF).

AFAIK, the headphones are exactly the same in every respect except for the impedance.

i cant stand using headphones for producing, never worked for me, cause the output is too flat.. whereas using a walkman, minidisc etc. will boost the bass to a level which im used too, so producing with headphones always fooles me of the bass.

Thanks DigiNut! =)

quote:

Originally posted by Subtle i cant stand using headphones for producing, never worked for me, cause the output is too flat.. whereas using a walkman, minidisc etc. will boost the bass to a level which im used too, so producing with headphones always fooles me of the bass.

Subtle, imo if you want to mix right with headphones you need to do all the mixing with headphones only, you can't do the mix with headphones then fix it according to the speakers, you'll get cought in a never ending loop.
Once you get used to the headphones sound you'll be able to notice the things you need, it might take a few shity tracks till you get it, but lots of listening and trying will get you to it, just a matter of getting used to it.
Though I bought the AKG-240S I tend not to use them only if I need, I have too many bad experinces with headphones and software bugs (believe me...ouch...) and when it gets to my hearing noting will get in the way...I'd rather wait a bit and listen the day after...but then again if I know it's safe and I'm in the middle of something but can't play loud then I'll go to the headphones, finish up - without! - any mixing adjustments.
That's my way of working around.

I've just moved in to a new flat and gonna need to headphones so looks like I'll go for a pair of the AKG K240S Studio Headphones
then!

Found em at 79.99 .here if anyones interested but I'll prob check on ebay b4 I buy.

Getting by really great here with a set of DT990s but would never trust them for mastering or eqing just like any set of cans, if anything they are good for playing sounds and working on arrangements without annoying everyone, if you do get dt990s be warned after a while you forget you have them on and get up to do something and yank your head or the cable off

Would these be good for DJing as well? Or do you want to look for something different when it comes to that?

quote:

Originally posted by david.michael Would these be good for DJing as well? Or do you want to look for something different when it comes to that?

Prolly not. the 240 series is semi-opened...so you'll notice problems when trying to mix (you'll hear the outside noise).
It's better not to combain studio and dj hp's...I don't believe there is a pair of good studio headphones which are closed (and don't say HD-25 cause they suck for mixing, only an idiot will say "they got Studio written on the box so they are for studio" and I heard that before). will give you a headache after like 30 min's and prolly won't show the bass right.
That's my opinion.

quote:

Originally posted by david.michael Would these be good for DJing as well? Or do you want to look for something different when it comes to that?

As a rule, headphones which are good for DJing are not good for production, and vice versa. Good DJ headphones aim to minimize unpleasant sounds so you don't go deaf or get a splitting headache after an hour; good production headphones aim for an accurate reproduction of the sound so you can hear every unpleasant detail and fix it.

By "unpleasant" I'm generally talking about screeching highs, overcompressed bass, that sort of thing. DJ headphones are supposed to make any track sound as good as possible, no matter how crappy it really is, which is exactly what you don't want for production.

quote:

Originally posted by daeus I've just moved in to a new flat and gonna need to headphones so looks like I'll go for a pair of the AKG K240S Studio Headphones then! Found em at 79.99 .here if anyones interested but I'll prob check on ebay b4 I buy.

You should go for the 271's, only �10 higher.

Closed type, hmmmmm

I just got DT 250 yesterday.
any views ?
I m also planning to get M-Audio's Audiophile 2496 for it, will work ehh ?

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