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Israel v. Palestinians

I posted a part of this in the chill out thread, and I got a few PMs telling me it is very funny, so I extended it a bit, and post it here. Hope you all enjoy.. It's my work :-)

Just look at the recent Zinni mission.
We are talking about the two sides, just meeting with each other and talking. Lets take a look at their recent discussions via Zinni to find out what each side is doing in preparations to meet and talk with one another:

Israel: Ok, we give up on that 7 days of quiet thing. We understand it is to much to ask for you to just give is simple week of peace... I mean for god's sake Hanukah isn't that long, but yes we understand that you are bloodthirsty and would like to kill us, were still willing to talk to you and try and find some solutions. Will you talk with us now?
Palestinians: No, of course we will kill you while we talk, but get out of Ramallah first before we can talk.
Israel: Ok, we got out of Ramallah, will you talk with us now?
Palestinians: No, you didn't move far enough.. get your tanks umm away farther.
Israel: Ok, we moved out tanks 'umm away farther', Will you talk with us now?
Palestinians: No, now you have to move out of all the Occupied Territories, even though we understand we both have legitimate claims to these territories (they're trying to look diplomatic).
Israel: No! Are you crazy?? You want us to move out and you won't even promise us quiet?
Palestinians: Hmm I see your point, Ok move your tanks out of Bethlehem then.
Israel: Will you stop snipers shooting at Gilo if we do?
Palestinians: No.
Israel: I don't think we want to do it then.. Can't we just talk?
Palestinians: No, move your tanks out of Bethlehem.
Israel: I see what your trying to do! Your trying to get us to leave all of the territories one city at a time.
Palestinians: Ummm no, no were not.. honest.. honest to Allah.
Israel: Really?
Palestinians: No.
(days pass)
Zinni: Ok look Palestinians, Cheney is coming for a visit tomorrow I want a ceasefire immediately!
Palestinians: Are you crazy? We want Israel tommorow! What's your point?
Zinni: The USA will blame you for the failure of these talks if you don't do a ceasefire, and umm it will add Arafat's orginization to that terrorist list thing we have, and umm the Axis of Evil too.... Come on its just a couple of days.. please, pretty please?
Israel: Ya hahaha so there.
Palestinains: Ok, but only for a couple of days... and we don't talk.. just our umm 'security officials'.. ok just they meet? But only if you add us to the Axis of Evil too.. that sounds cool.
Zinni: Ok.
Israel: Oh wait, we won't agree either... uhh uhh.. we want more F16s, and umm financial aid.
Zinni: Shut up Israel.
Israel: Ok.
Palestinians: Hahahaha... will you leave bethlehem now?
Israel: Will you stop terroism?
Palestinians: Why you ask so hard?
Israel: Why you talk like Chinese?
Zinni: Both of you quiet!.. Don't mention China, you already ruined Iraq for us.

...the saga continues...

And still no talks.

hehehehe, i am an evil person and i don't care about world problems. but on the other hand, i don't see how this middle east thing didn't piss anyone off enough yet to use a couple of thermonuclear warheads

exterminate a couple million innocent, suffering women, children, and elderly and a couple of thousand of terrorists and you'll have no problem! jeez, i'm a sick person... gonna go sleep it over...

NO

Yoepus, i really DONT THINK that your post is funny. Besides the intended "funny" side, there is a manipulation of the truth, as you show the israelis as civilized and fair, and you show the palestinians as a bunch of ehhmm, crazy mother******s. I dont know If you hate palestinians or are just a product of the "missinformation" of most western (specially american) press.

Try watching CNN and then do deeper research, and you will see that news distort the truth. In Peru (my country) the corrupt government that was in power till 2000 filled the media with propaganda in such a huge extend that we we dont trust in the media so blindly . It would be better if you start analyzing news with a critical eye too.

For example, do u know who Sharon is?? He was accused of the assasination of 100+ egyptian POW during the �Sinai? war (i think the UN issued a condemn against that).

Both sides in this terrible war have elements that have so much hate in their bloods that they care more in exterminating the other side that about peace and justice. Not only Palestinian as you would think. Dont you remember how this intifada started?? It was provoced by Sharom himself!

...

hey zzleeper this was intended as a joke, lighten up
plus i dont think its right of you to go around accusing people about being missinformed, especially yoepus...
this is meant be a joke if you want to get involved in the poilitical aspect just read up on the thread here: http://www.tranceaddict.com/forums/...?threadid=36992
it might take a a while to read it all, hehe

Re: NO

quote:

Originally posted by zzleeper Yoepus, i really DONT THINK that your post is funny.

Well all are entitled to our opinions, and our freedom of speech. You might not think its funny, others who perhaps know a little more about the conflict do.

quote:

I dont know If you hate palestinians or are just a product of the "missinformation" of most western (specially american) press. Try watching CNN and then do deeper research and you will see that news distort the truth.

Wait! Let me understand this, my opinions are result of blind following of CNN and western press, and to correct these things to find the 'truth' I should go listen to some more CNN and read a book? Ya that really makes sense. You coming from Peru, and knowing how the media manipulates should not be so quick to judge which side is indeed better then other other.. perhaps I actually might have deeply researched this topic and stumbled upon the the truth?

quote:

It would be better if you start analyzing news with a critical eye too.

Sound advice, I would suggest you listen to yourself once in a while.

quote:

For example, do u know who Sharon is??

Yes I do know who he is, and I have not listen to hose unproven, factless emotional appeals to your intelligence. To date he has been unproven of commiting any war crimes or such. And as far as I'm concerned I view every man as free until proven guilty.

quote:

Not only Palestinian as you would think. Dont you remember how this intifada started?? It was provoced by Sharom himself!

Oh no! Sharon vistied the Temple Mount.. shame on him, lets go blow up some school children in buses to show them!

If you actually want to learn about the conflict, learn about it objectively and such, read through the long ass thread at:
http://www.tranceaddict.com/forums/...15&pagenumber=2

Most notably take the time to read through the history notes, so you may finally understand through an objective rationalized view point the truth behind this middle east conflict. It is just the history.

But no seriously.. I didn't post this for you guys to go waring about the Mid East conflict, we already have that thread somewhere else (click link)... Any of you who can take something lightly would enjoy such a serious transcript of the Zinni meeting :-)

Yoepus
Don't be so open-minded that your brains fall out.

Looks like Izzy beat me to the post.. So looking back, ya err what Izzy said!

Yoepus
I don't have a solution but I admire the problem.

Ok Yoepus, u re not dissinformed. As a fact, after reading the other post, it appears that you are very informed, thats why i m wondering where is your self critisism (like, why did Israel soldiers targeted medical personal in the recent incursions, why do Israel gov. likes to turn Palestinian houses to rubbish, etc.. u know my point). U wont get anywhere if you keep trying to defend one side without truly analizing the situation, and realizing that as some guy said in the other post, "it takes two to dance tango". And dont trust history so much, it usually tends to favor the winning side (that is, USA, ISRAEL, etc).


Ps: Why did Sharom, knowing that Zinni was coming, and with the Saudi peace iniciative ready to launch, ordered one of the biggest incursions in years, with thousands of soldiers, hundreds of tanks?? You, (probably) being an israely should realize that his hate against arabs(remember what he told bout arafat) makes him incapable of doing the right steps for peace. Remember that there are extremists not only in the arab world, but in Israel. Remember that it wasnt an arab who killed Yitzhak Rabin, it was an extremist.

We shouldnt be arguing against jews, arabs, chinese, etc.. we should be arguing against extremists, those are the ones that cause most wars, and there can be found on BOTH sides... most times, people care only on the extremists on the opposite side.

Re: Re: NO

quote:

Originally posted by Yoepus Oh no! Sharon vistied the Temple Mount.. shame on him, lets go blow up some school children in buses to show them!

quote:

Mr. Sharon made the visit on September 28 accompanied by over 1,000 Israeli police officers. Although Israelis viewed the visit in an internal political context, Palestinians saw it as highly provocative to them. On the following day, in the same place, a large number of unarmed Palestinian demonstrators and a large Israeli police contingent confronted each other. According to the U.S. Department of State, "Palestinians held large demonstrations and threw stones at police in the vicinity of the Western Wall. Police used rubber-coated metal bullets and live ammunition to disperse the demonstrators, killing 4 persons and injuring about 200."4 According to the GOI, 14 Israeli policemen were injured .... The Sharon visit did not cause the "Al-Aqsa Intifada." But it was poorly timed and the provocative effect should have been foreseen; indeed it was foreseen by those who urged that the visit be prohibited. More significant were the events that followed: the decision of the Israeli police on September 29 to use lethal means against the Palestinian demonstrators; and the subsequent failure, as noted above, of either party to exercise restraint.

---- Mitchell Report.
You are no saints neither.

quote:

Originally posted by zzleeper Ok Yoepus, u re not dissinformed. As a fact, after reading the other post, it appears that you are very informed

Thank you ;-) I know.

quote:

thats why i m wondering where is your self critisism

Their is self critisims, as we have pointed many times in our post on the other thread. And the point I maks is, no we are not Saints. But if you look at the Palestinians, and then you look at the Israelis, you will say that the Israeli's are Saints. Only in comparisions you can say such things.. as we knew men to be imperfect.. however try and show me how the Palestinians are saints.. especially Arafat and his leadership, what good has he ever done for his people?

quote:

(like, why did Israel soldiers targeted medical personal in the recent incursions, why do Israel gov. likes to turn Palestinian houses to rubbish, etc.. u know my point).

If you read indepthly threw the other post you will find my answers. Why do Israeli Soliders target medical personal? Why do they use their hospitals and schools as arm depots and training grounds?

quote:

U wont get anywhere if you keep trying to defend one side without truly analizing the situation, and realizing that as some guy said in the other post, "it takes two to dance tango".

It takes two to dance tango applies only when making peace, unless you blantely conquer your enemy (think USA WWII), it takes two willing sides to dance. On the other hand if we look at war, it only takes one side to wage war, another to defend (again USA WWII, peral harbor.. also Israel 1948, 1973, 1967, 1982, 1956, 1993-2002).

I have analyzed the WHOLE situation, and I try and speak in context of the WHOLE picture. Not some insignificant incident or two.

quote:

And dont trust history so much, it usually tends to favor the winning side (that is, USA, ISRAEL, etc).

Looks like you should not trust the thoughts going into your brain so much. It is true that history has been shifted in many occasions, but the basis of it has always remained fairly accurate. When you go back to Israeli history, and especially modern history it is embaressingly accurate as their are so many sources (from both sides) that will testify to its validity.

quote:

Ps: Why did Sharom, knowing that Zinni was coming, and with the Saudi peace iniciative ready to launch, ordered one of the biggest incursions in years, with thousands of soldiers, hundreds of tanks??

I like how you say "Thousands of soliders, hundreds of tanks", where did you get these numbers? Listenining to the voice of Palestine??
The links you included in the other thread say only a thing like 15 tanks and perhaps a hundred soldiers... I don't think it is so low, it might be, I am just sure its not hundredS and thousandS... as if that would matter anyway, isn't overwhelming force proven to show direct results quicker sparing more lives anyway? (iraq).

Why did Sharon do this? Why did Arafat knowing the same things you stated Sharon knows, not do anything to stop terrorism iminating from his controled areas?? Israel is living with a very noisey neighbor.. if it does not take actions for what it does, Israel just might go over and turn down the noise itself.

quote:

You, (probably) being an israely should realize that his hate against arabs(remember what he told bout arafat) makes him incapable of doing the right steps for peace.

Rabin probably had more hate towards Arafat then Sharon does, he had a reluctancy to shake his hand durning his white house visit, and barely was able to. Rabin was capable of making peace with Arafat, I think Sharon is more then capable then making peace with Arafat.

The question still remains, is Arafat willing to make peace with Sharon?

quote:

Remember that there are extremists not only in the arab world, but in Israel. Remember that it wasnt an arab who killed Yitzhak Rabin, it was an extremist.

Again, you can go check the other posts as I mentioned the whacko less then 1% each country has. However, you should be able to determine that Isreali wackos are the by product of a free society (and they all have their wackos), where as the Palestinian extremist are not only more then the 1% (since I argue that 1% has to go to the real real really wackos.. I mean look what they have to beat...) but they are the by product of incitement, and concentrated abuse and hatered by the Palestinian Regime, which focuses Israel as their scapegoat.

quote:

We shouldnt be arguing against jews, arabs, chinese, etc.. we should be arguing against extremists, those are the ones that cause most wars, and there can be found on BOTH sides... most times, people care only on the extremists on the opposite side.

Shhh! Leave the Chinese out of this, but you are right I am not arguing Jew against Arab, I am arguing Israeli against Palestinian.
I am arguing about the extremist just as you have mentioned, which in this case is 90% Palestinian, 10% Isreali.. Arafat is an extremist, so I argue against him and his rule, further more he has very successfully indocterinated his populace with his believe, making most of them extreme (most those who aren't extreme have already fled his control to safer places in the world).

So their you have it.


And for your other post;
Mitchell sums it up real good their, "The Sharon visit did not cause the 'Al-Aksa Intifada'". I don't know what more you need from such a obviously, out of the way netrual observer. One can conclude using rational thought, that if it was not Sharon who started it, it must mean the Palestinians started it... hmmm.

I can write you a whole essay about the incident, but it is wise to note just one sources to validate this argument, Imad Falugi, the Palestinian Authority Communications Minister (read propoganda minister) admitted, moths after Sharon's visit that the violence had been planned in July, far in advance of Sharon's "provocation". He says "It [the uprising] had been planned since Chairman Arafat's return from Camp David, when he turned the tables on the former US president and rejected the American conditions".

As for the fact that Israelis were injured proves they were threated for their lives, and as far as I'm concerned, if anyone plans on taking my live by force, I am going to put up a fight.. and if I happen to have a gun in my hand, its me before him. Mobs are one of the most terrifying things, I would not be quick to judge how soldiers or police handle themselves in these situations.

Yoepus
"What a stupid conservative, but I repeate myself"

quote:

Originally posted by TiestoInTheMix i don't see how this middle east thing didn't piss anyone off enough yet to use a couple of thermonuclear warheads exterminate a couple million innocent, suffering women, children, and elderly and a couple of thousand of terrorists and you'll have no problem! jeez, i'm a sick person... gonna go sleep it over... [/B]

SICK FOR SURE ......

and yoepus hell yeah ISREALIS ARE "SAINTS" hahahaha

insignificant incidednt or two ?? try 2 million ...

I think these are funny. :P

quote:

Originally posted by Excite

Haha! I agree that's the spirit!

Yoepus
I love that jacket you're wearing. It's obvious you shop at only the finest garage sales.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Excite
[B]I think these are funny. :P

QUOTE]

exactly what i was talking about! someone needs to shoot these guys who create all these problems!

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