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Iraq Study Group Report

Here it is in all 160 pages of its glory if anyone wants to read it. You can get it from www.usip.org.

You're gay if you click this link--just kidding

Enjoy!

http://www.compfused.com/directlink/4271/

I dutifully await Occrider's review of this document!

quote:

Originally posted by Yoepus I dutifully await Occrider's review of this document!

lazy bastard

We want a condensed, Reader Digest version with executive summary!

wonder how short that is?

i'm watching Larry King [aka The Man] and dusty nuts, whatever his old name is (not Baker) says, "we wanted to draft something thats achievable"?

wtf is that?

quote:

Originally posted by Yoepus I dutifully await Occrider's review of this document!

Heh ... no. Reminds of a work project I was just offered. I was offered a fairly demanding job by someone of influence in my company and assuming I was successful, I would be offered a guaranteed promotion. Long story short, I rejected the offer because I knew the project was destined for disaster no matter how much effort I put into it. In other words, I want nothing to do with the ISG.

Why hasnt been that much talk about this report? While others do respond to other stupid threads

Well.. To begin this is nothing new to Bush, this report didnt open, enlighten or teach anything new to the current Bush admin. These proposals had been thought through from our DoD.

Bush in my opinion, expected something different from this report. What I think, is that Bush wanted to leave these recommendations as a last resort to have a new approach to Iraq and Intl policy in the Middle East. Clearly, sitting down with Syria and Iran makes the Bush admin uncomfortable because of the role they are playing with many militias, with their sponsoring and support. Clearly this is one of the biggest obstacles that our DoD has faced since WWII.

If we take this approach recommended by the study group, to sit down with Syria and Iran, not only has the US be committed but also these nations need to show commitment to solve this crisis that Iraq is facing. Do you guys really think that this can be accomplished with Syria and Iran?

Plus, If the US wants Iran to fully positively collaborate the US must change their stance with the nuclear program Iran is initiating

Now these last two years Bush has to work on how he is going to go down in history. Now imo is to late in time to say "oops my bad we fucked up" clearly the invasion of Iraq was a military success but we never were fully prepared for an insurgency, or not at all.

quote:

Originally posted by LatinLover Why hasnt been that much talk about this report? While others do respond to other stupid threads Well.. To begin this is nothing new to Bush, this report didnt open, enlighten or teach anything new to the current Bush admin. These proposals had been thought through from our DoD. Bush in my opinion, expected something different from this report. What I think, is that Bush wanted to leave these recommendations as a last resort to have a new approach to Iraq and Intl policy in the Middle East. Clearly, sitting down with Syria and Iran makes the Bush admin uncomfortable because of the role they are playing with many militias, with their sponsoring and support. Clearly this is one of the biggest obstacles that our DoD has faced since WWII. If we take this approach recommended by the study group, to sit down with Syria and Iran, not only has the US be committed but also these nations need to show commitment to solve this crisis that Iraq is facing. Do you guys really think that this can be accomplished with Syria and Iran? Plus, If the US wants Iran to fully positively collaborate the US must change their stance with the nuclear program Iran is initiating Now these last two years Bush has to work on how he is going to go down in history. Now imo is to late in time to say "oops my bad we fucked up" clearly the invasion of Iraq was a military success but we never were fully prepared for an insurgency, or not at all.

Beside Guantanamo & Abu Ghraib

From Page 9 of the ISG report:

quote:

The state of the Iraqi police is substantially worse than that of the Iraqi Army. The Iraqi Police Service currently numbers roughly 135,000 and is responsible for local policing. It has neither the training nor legal authority to conduct criminal investigations, nor the firepower to take on organized crime, insurgents, or militias.

Swell. Guess that's why the Iraqi PM feels this way about the U.S. training tactics:

quote:

�What have they done so far in training the army and the police?� the president said during a news conference here. �What they have done is move from failure to failure.� http://www.nytimes.com/2006/12/10/w...artner=homepage

Clap louder.

Got any suggestions or just more complaints?

quote:

Originally posted by Shakka Got any suggestions or just more complaints?

Sure - A, B, and C all seem to increase the violence, increase our troop death toll, increase the Iraqi citizen death toll, and continue right towards a civil war.

Plan D which is what Baker tiptoed around a bit, what most on the Democratic side are saying and an increasing number of Republicans are starting to say is simple - get the fuck out. We can argue the tactics of this and it very well may be a worthwhile argument - when, how, what numbers stay and where they should be placed in redeployment, and so on.

At this point I see no viable other option. Even if we were to get Iran and Syria involved, what the fuck would they do for us? Iran's power on the Shiite majority is duly noted, but I doubt they want to intervene in this mess at present. Besides, the Shiites are the majority with greater numbers of people and greater influence. Iran has already won no matter the outcome.

I'd love to see nothing more than this fuck of a mess finally stabilize, but the reality of things speak much louder.

And finally, I might have a few other suggestions to make as well, but they're really quite irrelevant given who really owns this war, doesn't it? What suggestions does this Administration have? What suggestions do the Republicans (and yes, some of the dipshit Dems. who went along with it) have? It's your boy's mess. You guys got us into this shithole. Don't knock me or the anti-Iraq war folks for complaining - you guys wanted regime change. YOU wanted to invade Saddam and direct our attention away from al Qaeda and bin Laden. YOU guys convinced us all there were WMDs pointed at our heads and that we needed to do something about this "grave and gathering" and "imminent" danger. YOU Republicans and Bush supporters got us into this shit, now YOU help us get the fuck out.

Pretty please?

The Islamic State Of Iraq Responds To The Baker-Hamilton Report And America�s Failure

quote:

In The Name Of Allah The Most Gracious The Most Merciful All praise be to Allah, The Cherisher and Sustainer of the worlds. Peace and prayer be upon our prophet, Muhammad, his family, and his companions. Allah said: � They question thee (O Muhammad) with regard to warfare in the sacred month. Say: Warfare therein is a great (transgression), but to turn (men) from the way of Allah, and to disbelieve in Him and in the Inviolable Place of Worship, and to expel His people thence, is greater with Allah; for persecution is worse than killing. And they will not cease from fighting against you till they have made you renegades from your religion, if they can. And whoever becomes a renegade and dies in his disbelief: such are they whose works have fallen both in the world and the Hereafter. Such are rightful owners of the Fire; they will abide therein.� Quran 2:217 The military leaders of the Crusader allied forces have realized the necessity of withdrawing from the quagmire they put themselves into four years ago because of the stupidity and recklessness of their governments. After the US policy in Iraq reached a dead end after the Bush administration realized too late that achieving victory in Iraq was impossibility as is establishing a democratic state in Iraq serving as a model for the large Middle East led by Israel. After all these dreams dissipated, all praise and gratitude be to Allah, the politicians in the Crusaders clutches stopped talking about victory or defeat in the war. All they talk and dream about now is only one thing; not allowing the true Mujahideen and the Muslims to reap the fruits of this blessed jihad. Furthermore, the recommendations that form the basis of the "Baker-Hamilton Report� are the same as the Sykes-Picot agreement that was implemented a century ago. The Sykes-Picot agreement was a measure adapted to divide the Ottoman Caliphate and to surround it with secular countries loyal to the Crusaders and their occupied countries. The Baker-Hamilton Report intends to confirm this division and to make sure that Muslims do not alter the Sykes-Picot borders in their jihad. Sadly some Muslims, mainly raised on inaccurate knowledge from their scholars, still dream of a Sykes Picot's Iraq; a secular national Iraq, not the Islamic Iraq. From their views, there is no Islamic Iraq that is not part of the larger state. Their ultimate goal is to attain a united Iraq and a united Arab world!! But creating a Caliphate on Islamic land and working towards uniting Muslims from China to Spain does not cross their mind! On the contrary, they may even reject it, because it opposes their national orientation which is adopted by some of Muslims without knowing it. These deficiencies in thinking are not limited to public Muslims, but even among some groups raising the flag of jihad, and that is what the US administration is counting on today. Previous Crusaders colonialist countries have succeeded in making "patriots and nationalists" from the fruits of Islamic revolutions such as in Libya, and Algeria. When will the nation learn these lessons and benefit from the lessons of history? This is why you see the US administration today, after they failed by counting on the traitors from the tribes and those who claim to be Sunnis in the political process, counting on people with limited views to thwart at any cost the establishment of the Islamic state following the steps of Caliphate. With that in mind, all our Mujahideen brothers should be aware of their maneuvers and gimmicks, and not be up for grabs to the Crusader enemy. And they should not enable the climbers and opportunists from collecting their blessed fruits from the jihad. The blood of martyrs is entrusted in the necks of Mujahideen... Oh Allah, defeat the USL (United States Losers) and its allies and make them. along with their equipment, booty for the Muslims, Oh Allah destroy them� Oh Allah, the sky is yours, the earth is yours and the sea is yours, Oh Allah, force their planes from the skies, destroy all their forces on the land and sink all their ships on the sea� Oh Allah, retaliate upon them and afflict them like you did Pharaoh and his nation. Oh Allah, afflict their country with floods, make them poor, hungry, and small. Oh Allah defeat them, destroy them, for You are the All Strong, the All Mighty. Allahu Akbar! �Honor, power and glory belong to Allah, to his messenger, and to the believers, but the hypocrites know not.� Information Ministry The Islamic State of Iraq 19 Dzulquidah 1427 December 10, 2006

quote:

Originally posted by Shakka Got any suggestions or just more complaints?

This question was directed at Opus, but I'll be blunt as to why I refuse to comment on the ISG report. Simply put, I have no suggestions, only more complaints. Why? Because management fucked things up so much that we've reached a turning point that we cannot recover from. According to Bloomberg, we're spending $8 billion a month and we have absolutely nothing to show for it ... no indications to mitigate this figure. No tangible justification to demonstrate the progress we're making by budgetary adjustments. Why is that if we're progressing? People love to talk about accomplishments but when it comes to actually quantifying their accomplishments in tangible dollar figures they start speaking another language altogether.

I'll never understand the argument you're making with this statement. You're acknowledging the failures of the policies your leaders subscribe to, otherwise why ask for alternative suggestions, yet you critcize complaints directed against said policies until someone comes up with a better solution? This is all very Yossarian to me.

quote:

Originally posted by occrider This question was directed at Opus, but I'll be blunt as to why I refuse to comment on the ISG report. Simply put, I have no suggestions, only more complaints. Why? Because management fucked things up so much that we've reached a turning point that we cannot recover from. According to Bloomberg, we're spending $8 billion a month and we have absolutely nothing to show for it ... no indications to mitigate this figure. No tangible justification to demonstrate the progress we're making by budgetary adjustments. Why is that if we're progressing? People love to talk about accomplishments but when it comes to actually quantifying their accomplishments in tangible dollar figures they start speaking another language altogether. I'll never understand the argument you're making with this statement. You're acknowledging the failures of the policies your leaders subscribe to, otherwise why ask for alternative suggestions, yet you critcize complaints directed against said policies until someone comes up with a better solution? This is all very Yossarian to me.

so Opus doesn't care enough about Iraq, Iraqis or the Greater Middle East to put forward any ideas but tear down others that try and Occrider is pissed because his margins aren't up to snuff (IOW there's not enough cheese on his end of the bargain) typical ugly Americans. the Liberal and the Libertarian. no wonder these two ideologies are converging.

quote:

Originally posted by erdega The Islamic State Of Iraq Responds To The Baker-Hamilton Report And America�s Failure

all praise and gratitude to Allah, those that wish to defile his believers in his name to spite the crusader.

you sick f**k.

quote:

Originally posted by erdega The Islamic State Of Iraq Responds To The Baker-Hamilton Report And America�s Failure

Oh this little toerag is back again for another beating.
Listen if youre going to post Al-Qaeda rhetoric at least get it right and not ad-lib your own personal bits on the bottom...

http://www.kavkazcenter.com/eng/con...1/02/6220.shtml

...why?
Because you look like an idiot.

Calm the hell down everyone.

Re: Iraq Study Group Report

quote:

Originally posted by Shakka Here it is in all 160 pages of its glory if anyone wants to read it. You can get it from www.usip.org. You're gay if you click this link--just kidding Enjoy!

Anyone know if there's a summary of this anywhere? I don't have the time rightnow (finals week).

quote:

Originally posted by Q5echo so Opus doesn't care enough about Iraq, Iraqis or the Greater Middle East to put forward any ideas but tear down others that try and Occrider is pissed because his margins aren't up to snuff (IOW there's not enough cheese on his end of the bargain) typical ugly Americans. the Liberal and the Libertarian. no wonder these two ideologies are converging.

Well I must apologize if my invade-and-conquer neocon-like attitude towards the world has been kept in check ever since that darn WMD-not-found keeps getting in the way with my "sensibilities", but I would like to direct your attention back to my previous post as I offered a solution (albeit a general one) as well as a bit of advice to you boys and those wonderful 101st Fighting Keyboard brigade soldiers on your side whenever you are scurrying around begging for solutions:

quote:

Sure - A, B, and C all seem to increase the violence, increase our troop death toll, increase the Iraqi citizen death toll, and continue right towards a civil war. Plan D which is what Baker tiptoed around a bit, what most on the Democratic side are saying and an increasing number of Republicans are starting to say is simple - get the fuck out. We can argue the tactics of this and it very well may be a worthwhile argument - when, how, what numbers stay and where they should be placed in redeployment, and so on. At this point I see no viable other option. Even if we were to get Iran and Syria involved, what the fuck would they do for us? Iran's power on the Shiite majority is duly noted, but I doubt they want to intervene in this mess at present. Besides, the Shiites are the majority with greater numbers of people and greater influence. Iran has already won no matter the outcome. I'd love to see nothing more than this fuck of a mess finally stabilize, but the reality of things speak much louder. And finally, I might have a few other suggestions to make as well, but they're really quite irrelevant given who really owns this war, doesn't it? What suggestions does this Administration have? What suggestions do the Republicans (and yes, some of the dipshit Dems. who went along with it) have? It's your boy's mess. You guys got us into this shithole. Don't knock me or the anti-Iraq war folks for complaining - you guys wanted regime change. YOU wanted to invade Saddam and direct our attention away from al Qaeda and bin Laden. YOU guys convinced us all there were WMDs pointed at our heads and that we needed to do something about this "grave and gathering" and "imminent" danger. YOU Republicans and Bush supporters got us into this shit, now YOU help us get the fuck out.

quote:

Originally posted by occrider I'll never understand the argument you're making with this statement. You're acknowledging the failures of the policies your leaders subscribe to, otherwise why ask for alternative suggestions, yet you critcize complaints directed against said policies until someone comes up with a better solution? This is all very Yossarian to me.

Because it is no argument and nothing to understand, rather it was just a sarcastic jab at my buddy Opus!

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