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War crimes caught on video

This pilot should be ashamed...The crowd is obviously not an enemy force. They don't travel in big groups like this...

Re: War crimes caught on video

quote:

Originally posted by Capitalizt They don't travel in big groups like this...

in Falludja 2004 they did.

the JTAC designated (illuminated) the group. if he saw a group of civilians and purposely designated them knowing they were non-combatants then that is his crime not the pilot's. that would be highly unlikely because JTACs don't work alone they work in squads or larger.

Watch that video again...Between the time the pilot noticed them and the time he got authorization to bomb them was less than 5 seconds..

There is no way he could tell they were a hostile force. They were probably running from another area being bombed.

I've clearly stated "No Graphic Videos", and even though I assume this video is not that graphic, the lack of content in the first post makes me wonder whether this thread has any point at all.

Sure, this is a war crime caught on tape... but shouldn't this be part of a discussion?

edit: Blimey, I've never seen anyone fix their sig this fast

Pretty informative if you ask me.

quote:

Originally posted by digitul punk Pretty informative if you ask me.

The video is informative - but it lacks a context, that's what I'm saying.

quote:

Originally posted by Capitalizt Watch that video again...Between the time the pilot noticed them and the time he got authorization to bomb them was less than 5 seconds.. There is no way he could tell they were a hostile force.

i saw the vid in 2004.

you are right, the pilot cannot tell. he's busy flying a plane. the pilot flys over a certain vicinity after loitering in the op-area led there by his ground base that is in COMMs with the JTAC. once in the vicinity. all he has to do after he gets a visual of the target is release the ordinance. sometimes he doesn't even get a visual, it may be obscured for one reason or another but you don't really need a pilot visual for JDAM or laser guided weapon. the JTAC on the ground gets makes the visual and he's normally within unaided visual distance (limited by the power and line of sight of his laser designator) the JTAC "designates" the target with a laser and the bomb just finds the laser.

quote:

Originally posted by Lira The video is informative - but it lacks a context, that's what I'm saying.

No it doesn't, it's a good example of how the US forces deliberately targets civilians. How is that lacking in content?

quote:

Originally posted by shaolin_Z No it doesn't, it's a good example of how the US forces deliberately targets civilians. How is that lacking in content?

why would we risk targeting civilians? we can't even stack naked Muslim pyramids without catching a world of shit.

quote:

Originally posted by Q5echo why would we risk targeting civilians? we can't even stack naked Muslim pyramids without catching a world of shit.

Why would we not? There's a virtual silence of these issues in the corporate owmen mainstream media, and war crimes are generally covered by human rights groups that don't get any airtime. Why would we be using depleted uranium that will have and already have had severe birth defects on, many fatal, on thousands of new born Iraqi children?

quote:

Originally posted by shaolin_Z No it doesn't, it's a good example of how the US forces deliberately targets civilians. How is that lacking in content?

I was not saying the video lacks content - rather, the post in which the video is embedded does (reason why I later said it lacked context).

quote:

Originally posted by shaolin_Z Why would we not? There's a virtual silence of these issues in the corporate owmen mainstream media, and war crimes are generally covered by human rights groups that don't get any airtime. Why would we be using depleted uranium that will have and already have had severe birth defects on, many fatal, on thousands of new born Iraqi children?

easy on the imagination dude. it's killing your logic.

quote:

Originally posted by Q5echo easy on the imagination dude. it's killing your logic.

Your blatant lies or ignorance are killing your credibility. Acutally no, you have none to begin with so nevermind.

quote:

Originally posted by shaolin_Z Your blatant lies or ignorance are killing your credibility. Acutally no, you have none to begin with so nevermind.

I don't think we can accuse the pilot of murdering innocents on purpose...and it is certainly not the policy of the US government to target civilians (If that were the goal, there would be nobody left alive in Iraq). But we certainly can consider behavior like this to be careless and negligent. I really hope we aren't conducting routine operations this way. If that's the case, Jihadist recruitment should continue to skyrocket and the situation will get even worse than it is today.

quote:

Originally posted by Capitalizt and it is certainly not the policy of the US government to target civilians (If that were the goal, there would be nobody left alive in Iraq).

right. of course it's not.

quote:

But we certainly can consider behavior like this to be careless and negligent.

it isn't. i never said it was.

a strike like that is thouroughly calculated and coordinated and authorized using at least a dozen pairs of eyes focused through some of the most sophisticated and intelligent war fighting personel and hardware on the planet. thats how we do it, and it works well enough.

quote:

I really hope we aren't conducting routine operations this way.

we are daily.

quote:

If that's the case, Jihadist recruitment should continue to skyrocket and the situation will get even worse than it is today.

thats why we only try to kill Jihadis like the ones you saw in Fallujah on the video.

quote:

Originally posted by Q5echo easy on the imagination dude. it's killing your logic.

Man, I told you. It's his depression that are killing his logic.

Yea, I've seen this video before. Made me want to become a pilot

quote:

Originally posted by Q5echo easy on the imagination dude. it's killing your logic.

Man, I told you. It's his depression that are killing his logic.

Yea, I've seen this video before. Made me want to become a pilot

quote:

Originally posted by Capitalizt But we certainly can consider behavior like this to be careless and negligent. I really hope we aren't conducting routine operations this way. If that's the case, Jihadist recruitment should continue to skyrocket and the situation will get even worse than it is today.

That's exactly whats happening, killing of innocent civilians. Ever wondered why terrorism is on the rise? This, has been going on for years now.


http://www.iraqbodycount.org/

Those numbers mean something.

I don't blame the pilot here.
Obviously there was a president set and instructions given before this event even occurred; how else could one explain that kind of snap decision?
The pilot did follow protocol...

quote:

Originally posted by Fir3start3r I don't blame the pilot here. Obviously there was a president set and instructions given before this event even occurred; how else could one explain that kind of snap decision? The pilot did follow protocol...

Do you mean precedent?



MrS

quote:

Originally posted by MrSquirrel Do you mean precedent? MrS

Yea that...sorry...eating and typing...not really spell checking

The video does not explain what the tactical situation was on the ground.
The F16 was flying in support of ground troops. The question remains, what was the happening on the ground? Are Coalition troops under fire? Are there reports of insurgents around the area? Large mobs of anti Coalition Iraqis?

We don't know, cuz the video didn't tell.

I agree that by looking at the video itself, it looks pretty bad. But we don't have all the information to make an accurate judgement.

on the comment about pilot saying 'Oh dude'. He's getting an adrenaline rush and be all excited. People say weird shit under those circumstances.

quote:

Originally posted by Capitalizt This pilot should be ashamed...The crowd is obviously not an enemy force. They don't travel in big groups like this...

Are you sure about that? An angry mob with Ak47s undisciplined and clueless could be walking like that

quote:

Originally posted by Q5echo thats why we only try to kill Jihadis like the ones you saw in Fallujah on the video.

jihadists (terrorists) are everywhere.......

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