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-- The Secret Government (1987)
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The Secret Government (1987)
http://www.pbs.org/now/transcript/t..._secretgov.html
IMO, our country is in desperate need of a new Church Committee
"that [surveillance] capability at any time could be turned around on the American people and no American would have any privacy left, such [is] the capability to monitor everything: telephone conversations, telegrams, it doesn't matter. There would be no place to hide. If this government ever became a tyranny, if a dictator ever took charge in this country, the technological capacity that the intelligence community has given the government could enable it to impose total tyranny, and there would be no way to fight back, because the most careful effort to combine together in resistance to the government, no matter how privately it was done, is within the reach of the government to know. Such is the capability of this technology (...)
I don't want to see this country ever go across the bridge. I know the capacity that is there to make tyranny total in America, and we must see to it that this agency [NSA] and all agencies that possess this technology operate within the law and under proper supervision, so that we never cross over that abyss. That is the abyss from which there is no return."
- Senator Frank Church (D-Idaho), 1975
There is a huge difference between having the ability and using that ability.
Sure it's scary that they CAN but I wouldn't be too worried about them monitoring you 24/7 unless there was good reason.
(is there? 
)
For example, my company can scan all my emails, surfing habits, etc. if they want but that doesn't mean they're going to.
In cases of national security or eminent attack, if they have a suspect that could take out 5 city blocks with a suitcase nuke, I think I'd probably kick my paraniod side to the curb and let the authorities do their job at that point...
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| Originally posted by Fir3start3r There is a huge difference between having the ability and using that ability. Sure it's scary that they CAN but I wouldn't be too worried about them monitoring you 24/7 unless there was good reason. (is there? )For example, my company can scan all my emails, surfing habits, etc. if they want but that doesn't mean they're going to. In cases of national security or eminent attack, if they have a suspect that could take out 5 city blocks with a suitcase nuke, I think I'd probably kick my paraniod side to the curb and let the authorities do their job at that point... |
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| Originally posted by infinity HiGH Jeff, have you read about the newly released CIA documents? I think that's a clear indication that the government and the various agencies can and will spy on people for no good reason. |
Wow.
I guess you guys are fucked then lol 
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| Originally posted by Fir3start3r Wow. I guess you guys are fucked then lol |
I'm shakin' in my boots...
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| Originally posted by Fir3start3r I'm shakin' in my boots... |
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| Originally posted by Fir3start3r I'm shakin' in my boots... |
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| Originally posted by hardcore trancer If this scenario is not a scary thought then I dont know what is.It is funny how people like you bitch and moan about freedom and human rights in other countries but when it comes to your own country you have no problem with it. |
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| Concern about being a victim of terrorism influences a person�s strength of agreement that national security should have priority over civil liberties. This could lead to stronger reactions by the community should people begin to feel more threatened by possible acts of terrorism... |
It's all about gradually getting the people to accept the new form of socialism that they have planned for the world under their one world government.
Booga Booga is right.
Socialism? Since when is socialism evil? It is a lot better then fascism.
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| Originally posted by metalgearsolid Socialism? Since when is socialism evil? It is a lot better then fascism. |
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| Originally posted by Trancer-X Well, to be more precise, they want to combine elements of socialism and capitalism together under the blanket of fascism. So yeah, that's not for me. |
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| Originally posted by metalgearsolid And what would be the best form of government? |
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| "To destroy this invisible Government, to dissolve the unholy alliance between corrupt business and corrupt politics is the first task of the statesmanship of the day." - 1912 Progressive Party Platform, attributed to Theodore Roosevelt http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progre...tes%2C_1912%29p |
wait a second I still don't get it. Who is the secret government? How can you tell how do you know?
| quote: |
| Originally posted by metalgearsolid wait a second I still don't get it. Who is the secret government? How can you tell how do you know? |
Total Information Awareness (now either defunct of black budget)
ANYONE WHO deliberately set out to invent a government program with the specific aim of terrifying the Orwell-reading public could hardly have improved on the Information Awareness Office. Tucked away in the outer reaches of the Defense Department, brandishing an eerie and cryptic logo -- an all-seeing eye atop a pyramid and the slogan "Scientia Est Potentia" ("Knowledge Is Power") -- the office is headed by retired Rear Adm. John M. Poindexter, the Reagan administration official who was convicted in the wake of the Iran-contra scandal of five felony counts of lying to Congress, destroying official documents and obstructing the congressional inquiry into the affair. Not surprisingly, there have already been some fast-breathing reactions to recently published information about the office, including allegations that it is funded by the Homeland Security Bill (it isn't) and that Adm. Poindexter has compiled a computer dossier on every American (he hasn't, or not yet).
In fact, the program is still a research project of the Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency (DARPA), the high-tech innovators who helped create the Internet -- and who claim that this project is equally benign. Among other things, the Information Awareness Office is trying to find ways of better identifying potentially dangerous people by using video cameras and biometrics, and of processing large amounts of data from different sources so as to predict and prevent terrorist attacks (the "Total Information Awareness System"). Police tracking the Washington sniper suspects might, for example, have caught them more quickly with the help of a computer program that could simultaneously search their motel records, their immigration and police histories, and the traffic violations tied to their Chevrolet Caprice.
Yet, given both the context and the content of the program, DARPA should hardly have been surprised by the bad publicity. For however revolutionary and innovative it may be, this is not neutral technology, and the potential for abuse is enormous. If information that once took five people a week to find will now take one person 15 minutes to find, then instant -- and instantly updatable -- computer dossiers on everyone really do cease to be science fiction. If computers can learn to identify a person through a video camera, then constant surveillance of society becomes possible, too. Because the legal system designed to protect privacy has yet to catch up with this technology, Congress needs to take a direct interest in this project, and the defense secretary should appoint an outside committee to oversee it before it proceeds. Privacy concerns need to be built into the technology from the beginning -- if the public decides, after being fully acquainted with the possibilities, that it is to be built at all.
Finally, everyone involved might also want to consider whether Adm. Poindexter is the best person to direct this extremely sensitive project. Though his criminal convictions were overturned on appeal, his record of lying to Congress hardly makes him an ideal protector of the legal system, and his conduct of Iran-contra hardly makes him an advertisement for government competence. Even his choice of logo calls into question his tact and taste. Adm. Poindexter's presence on this project, the lack of clear public information about it and the absence of any real oversight already indicate a serious lapse of judgment.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/w...anguage=printer
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Trancer-X, you know, its really good to have you back in regular force on this forum ;-)
I definitely feel a lot safer now
LAW OF THE LAND
Bush grants presidency extraordinary powers
Directive for emergencies apparently gives authority without congressional oversight
Posted: May 23, 2007
1:00 a.m. Eastern
President Bush has signed a directive granting extraordinary powers to the office of the president in the event of a declared national emergency, apparently without congressional approval or oversight.
The "National Security and Homeland Security Presidential Directive" was signed May 9, notes Jerome R. Corsi in a WND column.
It was issued with the dual designation of NSPD-51, as a National Security Presidential Directive, and HSPD-20, as a Homeland Security Presidential Directive.
The directive establishes under the office of the president a new national continuity coordinator whose job is to make plans for "National Essential Functions" of all federal, state, local, territorial and tribal governments, as well as private sector organizations to continue functioning under the president's directives in the event of a national emergency.
"Catastrophic emergency" is loosely defined as "any incident, regardless of location, that results in extraordinary levels of mass casualties, damage, or disruption severely affecting the U.S. population, infrastructure, environment, economy, or government functions."
Corsi says the president can assume the power to direct any and all government and business activities until the emergency is declared over.
The directive says the assistant to the president for Homeland Security and Counterterrorism, currently Frances Fragos Townsend, would be designated as the national continuity coordinator.
Corsi says the directive makes no attempt to reconcile the powers created for the national continuity coordinator with the National Emergency Act, which requires that such proclamation "shall immediately be transmitted to the Congress and published in the Federal Register."
A Congressional Research Service study notes the National Emergency Act sets up Congress as a balance empowered to "modify, rescind, or render dormant" such emergency authority if Congress believes the president has acted inappropriately.
But the new directive appears to supersede the National Emergency Act by creating the new position of national continuity coordinator without any specific act of Congress authorizing the position, Corsi says.
The directive also makes no reference to Congress and its language appears to negate any requirement that the president submit to Congress a determination that a national emergency exists.
It suggests instead that the powers of the directive can be implemented without any congressional approval or oversight.
Homeland Security spokesman Russ Knocke affirmed to Corsi the Homeland Security Department would implement the requirements of the order under Townsend's direction.
The White House declined to comment on the directive.
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/a...RTICLE_ID=55825
I wonder how long before people start posting detailed accounts of how George Bush is gonna blow up a city with an nuke and then use this to make himself dictator of the USA.
Re: I definitely feel a lot safer now
| quote: |
| Originally posted by Trancer-X LAW OF THE LAND Bush grants presidency extraordinary powers Directive for emergencies apparently gives authority without congressional oversight Posted: May 23, 2007 1:00 a.m. Eastern President Bush has signed a directive granting extraordinary powers to the office of the president in the event of a declared national emergency, apparently without congressional approval or oversight. The "National Security and Homeland Security Presidential Directive" was signed May 9, notes Jerome R. Corsi in a WND column. It was issued with the dual designation of NSPD-51, as a National Security Presidential Directive, and HSPD-20, as a Homeland Security Presidential Directive. The directive establishes under the office of the president a new national continuity coordinator whose job is to make plans for "National Essential Functions" of all federal, state, local, territorial and tribal governments, as well as private sector organizations to continue functioning under the president's directives in the event of a national emergency. "Catastrophic emergency" is loosely defined as "any incident, regardless of location, that results in extraordinary levels of mass casualties, damage, or disruption severely affecting the U.S. population, infrastructure, environment, economy, or government functions." Corsi says the president can assume the power to direct any and all government and business activities until the emergency is declared over. The directive says the assistant to the president for Homeland Security and Counterterrorism, currently Frances Fragos Townsend, would be designated as the national continuity coordinator. Corsi says the directive makes no attempt to reconcile the powers created for the national continuity coordinator with the National Emergency Act, which requires that such proclamation "shall immediately be transmitted to the Congress and published in the Federal Register." A Congressional Research Service study notes the National Emergency Act sets up Congress as a balance empowered to "modify, rescind, or render dormant" such emergency authority if Congress believes the president has acted inappropriately. But the new directive appears to supersede the National Emergency Act by creating the new position of national continuity coordinator without any specific act of Congress authorizing the position, Corsi says. The directive also makes no reference to Congress and its language appears to negate any requirement that the president submit to Congress a determination that a national emergency exists. It suggests instead that the powers of the directive can be implemented without any congressional approval or oversight. Homeland Security spokesman Russ Knocke affirmed to Corsi the Homeland Security Department would implement the requirements of the order under Townsend's direction. The White House declined to comment on the directive. http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/a...RTICLE_ID=55825 |
Re: Re: I definitely feel a lot safer now
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| Originally posted by DJ Shibby Not a credible source. |
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| Originally posted by Trancer-X A Constitutional Republic like the one that we used to enjoy before they began gradually incorporating so many Socialist elements, making it too much of a welfare state for my liking. |
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