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-- Need drum loop and bassline review...

Need drum loop and bassline review...

Something I cobbled together last couple days... made the drum loop yesterday and slapped together the basslines today...

Newbie here so I'm hoping for opinions on what needs to be improved...

[[ LINK REMOVED ]]
<--2.5 meg wav sample

Thanks for any help

edit: had wrong file uploaded, fixed now.

edit2: revised loop (27 aug)

http://www.speedyshare.com/650184425.html

It sounds nice, does the job. When it started I thought the bass note was going to be a "pad stab" type effect (I love language and trying to explain sounds), not a continuous sound. I personally would experiment with making the bass notes a bit shorter, and letting the reverb carry the end of the note to the start of the next one. Then get a nice low bass underneath it...

But hey, we all have our own production tendencies and preferences! It sounds fine the way it is.

aight, ill give it a try if only for the experience and seeing what that does... it does have a sub bass runnin through it though its barely audible (as it should be i suppose). thanks for the input

edit:

here is a sample of the subbass, it has an lfo modulating the pitch, dunno if i need that there... i think i kept it there because the audible bass had it, anyways...

http://www.speedyshare.com/488468195.html

Hmm, I can't pick out the sub bass at all in the original version, even knowing what it's supposed to sound like. I don't know what other producers do, but my lowest bass (which produces all the sub frequencies) still goes nicely into the audible range. I mean, you feel it plenty, but it's still audible if you cut out the sub frequencies.

I'd be interested to know - how many producers put in sounds which are purely felt? I know sometimes I've been to clubs and the subs are going ballistic, but the venue's too loud to really pick out sounds properly. It wouldn't surprise me if there's some pure sub work going on.

ill play around with the EQ and raise the sub bass an octave and see what that does... at the moment i have everything above 400hz ish cut off completely

your kick and basses need sidchained and eq'd to fit in with each other, at the min they sound terrible together! kinda fighting with each other....

quote:

Originally posted by jey your kick and basses need sidchained and eq'd to fit in with each other, at the min they sound terrible together! kinda fighting with each other....

At the time of that rendering both basslines were sidechained using GAC-1... I suppose I could decrease the threshold and give them a harder knee, but I wasn't really sure I liked the harder pumping sound that came out... it sounded kinda delayed, like the basslines were trying to catch up with the track... but prob just need to play around with the attack and release settings...

Also, both basslines and the kick have a notch filter at around 300 hz, and the kick and subbass are either completely cut off or significantly reduced in the higher frequencies...

If you are hearing conflict, I suppose that would be in the sub-300 hz range but given that all three naturally live there, I'm not sure what I can do other than the sidechain to make them mix better together, but I'll play around and see what I can do.

quote:

Originally posted by ClearVision At the time of that rendering both basslines were sidechained using GAC-1... I suppose I could decrease the threshold and give them a harder knee, but I wasn't really sure I liked the harder pumping sound that came out... it sounded kinda delayed, like the basslines were trying to catch up with the track...

This is why you use a seperate kick track to trigger the sidechain and put it slightly ahead of the real kick

quote:

Originally posted by mysticalninja This is why you use a seperate kick track to trigger the sidechain and put it slightly ahead of the real kick

Ahhh, I got half of that... I'll move it up a bit then

quote:

Originally posted by derail I'd be interested to know - how many producers put in sounds which are purely felt?

easy answer: No-one, simply because about 90% mastering engineers will tell you that they cut anything below 50 hz, some below 40, but generally that's it

Hmm, I can't see evidence of extreme cuts when I run frequency analyses of mastered trance tracks through Wavelab. Depending on the artist and overall vibe they have going on, that 0Hz-43Hz region ranges from extremely high to quite subdued. I generally aim to get my tracks towards the "quite subdued" region in the subs, just so I know the subs aren't going to go nuts on speakers which go down that low. But I don't high pass filter the sub bass and try to remove those frequencies completely. I've been to five mastering engineers so far and none of them removed the subs. Where did you get your figure of 90% from? Why do all the trance tracks I've analysed still have healthy levels in the subs?

I don't do any work which is pure subs though. I'll sometimes use a bass which doesn't really go up past 100-120Hz, but that's about as low as I'll go.

i would usually high pass my subbass to 38hz anythin lower than that is just rumbling noise, not needed.

u must be sidechaining wrong because i doesnt need to be extreme, it can be finely set just to duck enough for the kick to breath, atm the kick is squashing the subbass! can clearly be heard!

put on ur fav producers releases and then ask yourself how urs sounds!

not bein cheeky but thats what id do b4 post for comments.....

quote:

Originally posted by derail Hmm, I can't see evidence of extreme cuts when I run frequency analyses of mastered trance tracks through Wavelab. Depending on the artist and overall vibe they have going on, that 0Hz-43Hz region ranges from extremely high to quite subdued. I generally aim to get my tracks towards the "quite subdued" region in the subs, just so I know the subs aren't going to go nuts on speakers which go down that low. But I don't high pass filter the sub bass and try to remove those frequencies completely. I've been to five mastering engineers so far and none of them removed the subs. Where did you get your figure of 90% from? Why do all the trance tracks I've analysed still have healthy levels in the subs? I don't do any work which is pure subs though. I'll sometimes use a bass which doesn't really go up past 100-120Hz, but that's about as low as I'll go.

errm, sorry for being not clear, I mean that most high pass there...which means there is still something going, but definitely not too much...also the inaudible sub-bass makes it harder to reach higher volumes, that's the reason why most engineers tend to highpass...that's all...ask anyone else, if you don't believe me

thanks for additional tips, seems like simple enough solutions so i will give the ma try.

My monitors are a pair of Ultrasone DJ1 Pros... maybe I am not hearing the quashing very well?

edit: Did a couple things... gave the basslines and kicks a steeper high pass filter at around 40 hz, and also made the sidechain input to the basslines a bit advanced compared to the actual kicks.

http://www.speedyshare.com/650184425.html

Yes, excessive sub bass definitely will hold back the overall apparent loudness of a track. But it doesn't have to be restrained too greatly to be able to push everything else up to maximal levels.

I'm sorry, when I read "they cut anything below 50 hz, some below 40" I didn't think you meant a gentle slope highpass filter, I thought you were talking they cut anything below those frequencies.

I'm still interested as to how you got your figure of 90% - mastering engineers in my experience don't set up high pass filters automatically, without listening to whether or not the track needs that processing. They may even boost that region if the artist brings in reference CDs which have much higher sub levels than their own track.

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