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-- Wonderful means of supporting our troops

Wonderful means of supporting our troops

C'mon, everyone, grab your yellow ribbon stickers and shout that slogan, just like our wonderful Administration!:

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National Guard Troops Denied Benefits After Longest Deployment Of Iraq War Rhonda Erskine, Online Content Producer Last Updated: 10/3/2007 5:32:02 PM MINNEAPOLIS, MN (NBC) -- When they came home from Iraq, 2,600 members of the Minnesota National Guard had been deployed longer than any other ground combat unit. The tour lasted 22 months and had been extended as part of President Bush's surge. 1st Lt. Jon Anderson said he never expected to come home to this: A government refusing to pay education benefits he says he should have earned under the GI bill. "It's pretty much a slap in the face," Anderson said. "I think it was a scheme to save money, personally. I think it was a leadership failure by the senior Washington leadership... once again failing the soldiers."

Why does 1st Lt. Jon Anderson hate America?

Besides, we do have to pay for those Blackwater private co. troops salaries SOMEHOW DAMMIT, don't we?

Suck it up, Jon. Screw your education, bub!

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Anderson's orders, and the orders of 1,161 other Minnesota guard members, were written for 729 days. Had they been written for 730 days, just one day more, the soldiers would receive those benefits to pay for school. "Which would be allowing the soldiers an extra $500 to $800 a month," Anderson said.

Must be a Bush-hater. Besides, if you love America as much as some do in this country, you don't need no stinkin' school!

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That money would help him pay for his master's degree in public administration. It would help Anderson's fellow platoon leader, John Hobot, pay for a degree in law enforcement.

Jesus, man. Why you gotta go gettin' a master's degree, man? Waaaay too far up that school ladder as far as Bush is concerned, buddy.

What, you can't get a job with a Bachelor's or somethin'? You must be a lazy librul, then.

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"I would assume, and I would hope, that when I get back from a deployment of 22 months, my senior leadership in Washington, the leadership that extended us in the first place, would take care of us once we got home," Hobot said. Both Hobot and Anderson believe the Pentagon deliberately wrote orders for 729 days instead of 730. Now, six of Minnesota's members of the House of Representatives have asked the Secretary of the Army to look into it -- So have Senators Amy Klobuchar and Norm Coleman.

Coleman's a traitor. He's recently starting turning his support for our fearless leader's Iraq policies. I didn't think he'd hate America so much too, but I guess he's feeling the heat from that comedian Al Franken librul fella.

So many America haters anymore.

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Klobuchar said the GI money "shouldn't be tied up in red tape," and Coleman said it's "simply irresponsible to deny education benefits to those soldiers who just completed the longest tour of duty of any unit in Iraq." Anderson said the soldiers he oversaw in his platoon expected that money to be here when they come home. "I had 23 guys under my command," Anderson said. "I promised to take care of them. And I'm not going to end taking care of them when this deployment is over, and it's not over until this is solved." The Army did not respond questions Tuesday afternoon. Senators Klobuchar and Coleman released a joint statement saying the Army secretary, Pete Geren, is looking into this personally, and they say Geren asked a review board to expedite its review so the matter could be solved by next semester. Minnesota National Guard spokesman Lt. Col. Kevin Olson said the soldiers are "victims of a significant injustice." NBC http://www.wcsh6.com/news/article.aspx?storyid=71741

I really wish these military men would just stop hating the military and America so much. Those darn libruls must have infiltrated their units too. I mean, who cares how much Blackwater and other private firms are getting, right?:

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According to data provided to the House panel, the average per-day pay to personnel Blackwater hired was $600. According to the schedule of rates, supplies and services attached to the contract, Blackwater charged Regency $1,075 a day for senior managers, $945 a day for middle managers and $815 a day for operators. [�] An unmarried sergeant given Iraq pay and relief from U.S. taxes makes about $83 to $85 a day, given time in service. A married sergeant with children makes about double that, $170 a day. Army Gen. David H. Petraeus, the top U.S. commander in Baghdad overseeing more than 160,000 U.S. troops, makes roughly $180,000 a year, or about $493 a day. That comes out to less than half the fee charged by Blackwater for its senior manager of a 34-man security team. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dy...7093001352.html

Baahh, too many words to read.

Blame it on Bush

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Originally posted by LatinLover Blame it on Bush

I do, along with other folks within the Administration.

Your point?

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Originally posted by MisterOpus1 I do, along with other folks within the Administration. Your point?

.


Hey I have a problem in my city that the drains system are old, they wont do anything about it. Oh well Ill guess ill blame it on Bush

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Originally posted by LatinLover . Hey I have a problem in my city that the drains system are old, they wont do anything about it. Oh well Ill guess ill blame it on Bush

The Bush Administration has sent us to this war and consequently kept us there. The war, as you have certainly agreed with in the past has gone quite badly, much of that is attributed to poor planning (as well as poor understanding of consequences of uprooting a governmental infrastructure and country as a whole from the getgo). As a consequence, we have a SURGE! force meant as a last ditch effort to supposedly salvage any thought of hope of "victory" (never defined by this Adminstration), only to demonstrate nothing shy of a stalling tactic since those troops must be redeployed secondary to their tour time restrictions. The inevitable consequence is ultimately we will be right back to where we started at normal troop levels by the beginning of next summer.

These results have kept this combat unit in Iraq exceptionally longer than any other unit (22 months). Unfortunately, those who were deployed in this unit (i.e. by the the higher ups in the Pentagon, which is ultimately controlled by civilians in this Administration) had been apparently given one day shy of more educational incentives and benefits (729 days versus the 730 day threshold). By no logical rationale can anyone state this was the result of a clerical error on the part of the government.

Are you prepared to make that statement?

So yes, these results are the ineviteable result of the Bush Administration sending us to war and sending in a SURGE! last ditch stall-effort that ultimately deprived this unit's educational benefits while they remained in Iraq longer than any other unit (some 7 months past the maximum 15 month tours now given).

If you disagree, demonstrate it directly in my rationale above. Your false analogy (i.e. your city commission or even possibly your State are responsible for your drains) doesn't help your argument much at all, sorry.

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Originally posted by LatinLover . Hey I have a problem in my city that the drains system are old, they wont do anything about it. Oh well Ill guess ill blame it on Bush

You're laughing?! Here you spout this bullshit about how much you care about the troops, but when faced to an actual injustice faced by our men and women who have dropped everything to go over to Iraq and fight a war on the simple good faith that it might actually have some purpose that no one in their right mind can see, you laugh? Here's an injustice, perpetrated by this Administration that you will stop at nothing to defend, carried out against the men and women you claim to respect in every other thread.

Well here's your line in the sand. Which side are you standing on?

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Originally posted by LatinLover Blame it on Bush

It was the Bush Administrations troop surge that kept those guys there that long you dummy.

You can support your troops by voting for Ron Paul!!! He's recieved the highest amount of military donations out of all the Presidential candidates and for good reason - he wants to BRING THEM HOME!!!

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Originally posted by MisterOpus1 The Bush Administration has sent us to this war and consequently kept us there. The war, as you have certainly agreed with in the past has gone quite badly, much of that is attributed to poor planning (as well as poor understanding of consequences of uprooting a governmental infrastructure and country as a whole from the getgo). As a consequence, we have a SURGE! force meant as a last ditch effort to supposedly salvage any thought of hope of "victory" (never defined by this Adminstration), only to demonstrate nothing shy of a stalling tactic since those troops must be redeployed secondary to their tour time restrictions. The inevitable consequence is ultimately we will be right back to where we started at normal troop levels by the beginning of next summer. These results have kept this combat unit in Iraq exceptionally longer than any other unit (22 months). Unfortunately, those who were deployed in this unit (i.e. by the the higher ups in the Pentagon, which is ultimately controlled by civilians in this Administration) had been apparently given one day shy of more educational incentives and benefits (729 days versus the 730 day threshold). By no logical rationale can anyone state this was the result of a clerical error on the part of the government. Are you prepared to make that statement? So yes, these results are the ineviteable result of the Bush Administration sending us to war and sending in a SURGE! last ditch stall-effort that ultimately deprived this unit's educational benefits while they remained in Iraq longer than any other unit (some 7 months past the maximum 15 month tours now given). If you disagree, demonstrate it directly in my rationale above. Your false analogy (i.e. your city commission or even possibly your State are responsible for your drains) doesn't help your argument much at all, sorry.

From the bottom of my heart is fucked up what has happened to these heroes. They should get the benefits that they were promised, for their humble services to this country.

Although, whats sad about this is that the far lest uses these issues to hammer DIRECTLY to one person, that is Bush. I mean a president cannot manage every single damn department of this country? You know how many departments we have? Yes plenty!

Clearly it is the fault of the Dept that deals with their educational programs and aid. And I hope these issues get resolved promptly! But hey why isnt our elected congress, controlled by the dems, taking a look at these issues and making sure these heroes get the highest attention they deserve? Yes! because that is Bush job! But for someone to say this was a scheme from our president, please!

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Originally posted by Lebezniatnikov Well here's your line in the sand. Which side are you standing on?

In Americas side

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Originally posted by LatinLover From the bottom of my heart is fucked up what has happened to this heroes. They should get the benefits that they were promised, for their humble services to this country.

I'm glad we finally agree on something.

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Although, whats sad about this is that the far lest uses these issues to hammer DIRECTLY to one person, that is Bush.

Whom does the Pentagon answer to? No one? Does the buck stop at the Pentagon only where the chain of command is severed?

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I mean a president cannot manage every single damn department of this country? You know how many departments we have? Yes plenty!

There's only one department that's responsible - the Pentagon and the Department of Defense. Who is in charge of the Dept. of Defense?

Who is in charge of the Secretary of Defense?

Aside of lying about a fucking blowjob, does the buck ever stop with the president for you?

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Clearly it is the fault of the Dept that deals with their educational programs and aid.

That would be the Dept. of Defense. Whom do they ultimately answer to?

Whom sent these troops on extended tours in the first place?

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But for someone to say this was a scheme from our president, please step up the evidence?

Sure:

One day short of extended educational benefits. out of nearly two years of deployment.

The Pentagon is in control of those soldiers and the Dept. of Defense runs the Pentagon by civilian control.

Guess who the Dept. of Defense ultimately answers to?

Guess who decided to keep our troops in Iraq for 22 months and one day shy of extended educational benefits?

Does the buck ever stop with THIS president for you, or do you always have excuses when egg gets thrown on his face?

^^^^^^

Give me a break, not every department in this country is perfect. There are always fucked up shit that happen, that is just how it is! In this situation its a sad one and not an honorable one. But what has congress done to ensure our veterans are well taken care of when they come back home? Because you know well that our president cannot be on top of every single issue this nation faces.

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Originally posted by LatinLover Although, whats sad about this is that the far lest uses these issues to hammer DIRECTLY to one person, that is Bush. I mean a president cannot manage every single damn department of this country? You know how many departments we have? Yes plenty! Clearly it is the fault of the Dept that deals with their educational programs and aid. But for someone to say this was a scheme from our president, please step up the evidence?

Are you shitting me? You're seriously are trying to defend Bush, the Commander in Chief, as you Repubs so frequently point out, by saying that he "can't manage every single damn department of this country?" When a country is at war, what other fucking departments should have a higher priority for his oversight?

Lastly, it's not the fault of the section that deals with their educational programs and aid. The role of that department is to approve or deny claims based on time served. They don't give the orders to these men on how long their service will be. This was a clear budget cutting tool intended to fuck over honorable servicemen. It's nice to see you assholes defending this sort of behavior and Bush's authority, especially after your feigned outrage over the Petraeus ad. If that was like spitting in the soldiers' faces, this is like murdering their parents.

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Originally posted by Groundhog Boy Are you shitting me? You're seriously are trying to defend Bush, the Commander in Chief, as you Repubs so frequently point out, by saying that he "can't manage every single damn department of this country?" When a country is at war, what other fucking departments should have a higher priority for his oversight? Lastly, it's not the fault of the section that deals with their educational programs and aid. The role of that department is to approve or deny claims based on time served. They don't give the orders to these men on how long their service will be. This was a clear budget cutting tool intended to fuck over honorable servicemen. It's nice to see you assholes defending this sort of behavior and Bush's authority, especially after your feigned outrage over the Petraeus ad. If that was like spitting in the soldiers' faces, this is like murdering their parents.

Who says that Im fucking defending Bush I am saying what is our congress doing to ensure our servicemen are getting taken care of when they arrive home? You cant fucking expect one man to intervene and solve this issue, i would like too, but for someone like MisterOpus they use these situations to give a political punch to our president

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Originally posted by LatinLover ^^^^^^ Give me a break, not every department in this country is perfect. There are always fucked up shit that happen, that is just how it is! In this situation its a sad one and not an honorable one. But what has congress done to ensure our veterans are well taken care of when they come back home? Because you know well that our president cannot be on top of every single issue this nation faces.

Oh, so now you're blaming "Congress," AKA, the Democrats, because you're too stupid to realize that they don't really have much of a majority and can't really change much anyhow.

You really are a partisan little weasel. It must be nice to have no allegiance besides the Republican party and never have to think for yourself. I'll call out Democrats for dumb things, like Hillary's $5K baby bonds, but I have yet, even in the easiest of circumstances (like this one), seen you criticize the people who deserve it most, especially on something so egregious.

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Originally posted by LatinLover Who says that Im fucking defending Bush I am saying what is our congress doing to ensure our servicemen are getting taken care of when they arrive home? You cant fucking expect one man to intervene and solve this issue, i would like too, but for someone like MisterOpus they use these situations to give a political punch to our president

The Congress makes the laws requiring X amount of service for Y amount of pay. If the executive, which Bush leads, wants to screw these people out of their money in their orders, that's their fault and nothing can be done by Congress except investigate and oversee, both things that you Republicans whine about and resent. Additionally, they're also after-the-fact solutions which require the soldiers to fight a battle that they shouldn't have to following their military service.

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Originally posted by LatinLover ^^^^^^ Give me a break, not every department in this country is perfect.

Who's asking for perfection? I just want one more day for this unit so they can receive the educational benefits they deserve for being deployed for almost 2 years.

No one's asking for perfection. Just a little bit of accountability and common sense - something that's disturbingly missing over the past 6 years.

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There are always fucked up shit that happen, that is just how it is!

Ahh yes, the ol' "shit happens" routine. I will ask again:

Whom does the Dept. of Defense they ultimately answer to?

Whom sent these troops on extended tours in the first place?

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In this situation its a sad one and not an honorable one.

So hold no one accountable because, well, shit happens?

Are you always this pathetic when disturbing things occur on this President's watch?

Or is he not accountable to what his Dept. of Defense does?

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But what has congress done to ensure our veterans are well taken care of when they come back home? Because you know well that our president cannot be on top of every single issue this nation faces.

Congress appropriates the amount of money given to the Pentagon to pay for the troops and the necessary supplies. The Army wrote those orders initially for 729 days for a reason. That was no accidental mistake on their part, unless you can come up with a viable reason to the coincidence of being one day shy of 730 days.

Which officer, senior cabinet member, or Dept. Secretary signed the orders for this deployment?

Who is ultimately responsible for that signee, the Legislative Branch or the Commander in Chief? Tough one, I know.

Finally, who had the majority in Congress when those orders were signed - the GOP or the Democrats?

Don't get me wrong, I've got my gripes at the hapless, spineless Democratic congressional majority right now, but they are not part of the chain of command who's responsible for this outrage. They may very well have investigations and examine what occurred, and they do control the power of the purse to which they've conceded and given all money that Bush has asked for in this war, but they are ultimately not in the chain.

So whom do you think is in that chain of command? Who is at the top?

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Originally posted by LatinLover Who says that Im fucking defending Bush

When have you not?

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I am saying what is our congress doing to ensure our servicemen are getting taken care of when they arrive home?

As stated previously, they appropriate the money asked for by the Executive Branch who ultimately runs the military (i.e. Dept. of Defense). And they've given any and all money asked of them by Bush and the military (arguably way too much since billions have gone unaccounted for and the private contractors are wholly unaccounted for altogether).

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You cant fucking expect one man to intervene and solve this issue,

You mean the man who's ultimately responsible for the Dept. of Defense who runs the military, the man who's the Commander in Chief (i.e. "Commander Guy"), the man who's the most powerful person in the world in control of the most powerful military our planet has ever seen?

Jesus, that's pathetic.

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i would like too,

No, it's clear you wouldn't.

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but for someone like MisterOpus they use these situations to give a political punch to our president

Bush doesn't need my help. He does quite well punching himself all on his own.

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Originally posted by LatinLover ^^^^^^ Give me a break, not every department in this country is perfect. There are always fucked up shit that happen, that is just how it is! In this situation its a sad one and not an honorable one. But what has congress done to ensure our veterans are well taken care of when they come back home? Because you know well that our president cannot be on top of every single issue this nation faces.

if you ever see me refer to "bush administration apologists", i am referring to people like you.

let's be serious shall we?

forgive me if im wrong, but isnt the national guard a civilian outfit? moving them across the world to a terrorist warzone is highly unusual. hasnt this been a specific component of the bush administration's strategy in their struggle for control of the country?

it is the policy makers that ultimately have to answer for the shitness in their portfolio(s). that is at the very core of how our democracies work (or should work). you can't effect policies in a half-arsed fashion, because government really fucks things up when it does it like that.

i must say when i look back at all the bungles in the bush administration, i much prefer the traditional westminster system of government. i think the american system fvcked things up with their (relatively) untouchable top job. there's no way tony blair or john howard could have survived the mess in iraq had it been their responsibility in the same way it is obviously bush's.

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