TranceAddict Forums (www.tranceaddict.com/forums)
- Political Discussion / Debate
-- Pelosi says she'll press on with Armenian 'genocide' resolution

Pelosi says she'll press on with Armenian 'genocide' resolution

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- House Speaker Nancy Pelosi said Sunday that she intends to move ahead with a vote on a resolution that labels the deaths of more than a million Armenians during World War I as genocide.

The resolution has strained U.S. relations with Turkey and drawn criticism from the Bush administration.

"This resolution is one that is consistent with what our government has always said about ... what happened at that time," Pelosi said on ABC's "This Week."

When asked about criticism that it could harm relations with Turkey -- a key ally in the war in Iraq and a fellow member of NATO -- Pelosi said, "There's never been a good time," adding that it is important to pass the resolution now "because many of the survivors are very old."

"When I came to Congress 20 years ago, it wasn't the right time because of the Soviet Union. Then that fell, and then it wasn't the right time because of the Gulf War One. And then it wasn't the right time because of overflights of Iraq. And now it's not the right time because of Gulf War Two.

"And, again, the survivors of the Armenian genocide are not going to be with us."

But White House Spokesman Tony Fratto said bringing the resolution to a vote "may do grave harm to U.S.-Turkish relations and to U.S. interests in Europe and the Middle East."

Turkey's top general warned Sunday that ties with the United States will be irreversibly damaged if Congress passes the resolution, The Associated Press reported.

Turkey has recalled its ambassador from Washington for consultations and warned of cuts in logistical support to the United States over the issue. The recall is only for a limited period of time, said a U.S. State Department official who talked to the ambassador.

"If this resolution [that] passed in the committee passes the House as well, our military ties with the U.S. will never be the same again," Gen. Yasar Buyukanit told the daily Milliyet newspaper, according to AP

The House Foreign Affairs Committee voted 27-21 Wednesday to approve the nonbinding measure, which declares the deportation of nearly 2 million Armenians from the Ottoman Empire between 1915 and 1923 was "systematic" and "deliberate," amounting to "genocide." The deportations led to the deaths of an estimated 1.5 million people.

But Sunday, Pelosi stood by her previous assertion that the measure would be taken to a full vote if it passed the committee.

Newly installed chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, Adm. Michael Mullen, tried to calm tensions by phoning his Turkish counterpart shortly after Wednesday's vote.

Mullen told Gen. Yasar Buyukanit, Turkey's chief of staff, that the Pentagon is working hard to inform Congress of what the military implications might be if the Turks were to respond by cutting off U.S. access to the air base at Incirlik in Turkey.

Seventy percent of U.S. air cargo bound for Iraq passes over or through Turkey.

The Armenian government and Armenians around the world, including many Armenian-Americans, have been pressing for international support for their contention that Armenians were the victims of genocide at the hands of the Ottoman Turks.

The Ottoman Empire disintegrated in 1923, replaced by the modern republic of Turkey, where the Armenian issue remains sensitive. Turks reject the genocide label, insisting there was no organized campaign against the Armenians and that many Turks also died in the chaos and violence of the period.

Though predominantly Muslim, Turkey, which borders both Europe and Iraq, is secular and pro-Western. In addition to its membership in NATO, Ankara is also seeking to become a member of the European Union.

Speaking later on ABC's "This Week," Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell denounced the House committee's vote -- despite agreeing with the assertion that the killings amounted to genocide.

"I think it's a really bad idea for the Congress to be condemning what happened 100 years ago," the Kentucky Republican said Sunday. "We all know it happened. There's a genocide museum, actually, in Armenia to commemorate what happened.

"But I don't think the Congress passing this resolution is a good idea at any point. But particularly not a good idea when Turkey is cooperating with us in many ways, which ensures greater safety for our soldiers."

Republican Sen. Lindsay Graham echoed those comments on CNN's Late Edition.

"I'm not worried about World War I. ... I'm worried about what I think is World War III, a war against extremists, and Iraq is the central battle front and Turkey has been a very good ally," Graham said Sunday.

"We've had problems with Turkey, but the problem that Turkey has with the northern part of Iraq, if you think it is bad now, let the country fail."

urkey has engaged in ongoing cross-border skirmishes with rebels from the Kurdistan Workers Party, or PKK, which launches raids from northern Iraq. The recent killings of Turkish soldiers brought the conflict to a boiling point, and Turkey's parliament may consider a motion to approve cross-border incursions into northern Iraq as early as this week. Video Watch how the rebels are straining U.S.-Turkish relations �

The United States and the EU have designated the PKK a terrorist organization. The U.S. State Department has urged Iraq to crack down on the PKK, though some Turkish officials have said Washington has failed to take decisive action

SOURCE

I mean here you have Pelosi trying to tangle up our relationship with our allies What else can we expect from this Congress?

quote:

Originally posted by LatinLover I mean here you have Pelosi trying to tangle up our relationship with our allies What else can we expect from this Congress?

I bet if she was Republican, you wouldn't be saying that. But since she's "far-left", I guess its bad...

How important are these kinds of acknowledgments?

The genocide resolution though is counter-productive to today's diplomatic situation. The US hardly has the right to be judging other nation's pasts when its own past is so shady in coups, weapons sales, and support for oppressive dictatorships. Besides that, is Congress retarded!? They must want Turkey to invade the Kurdish northern Iraq.

I think the US should judge itself before it goes out judging other nation's.

Firstly, I agree that from a tactical standpoint this is just a bad decision. No need to go around rustling feathers, specially considering Turkey is a key player in the war efforts ( as retarded as they can be ). On another note, I think this applies only to this particular event. I.e. I do not agree with Latin that this type of tactic from Congress is wrong in general, but only in this specific situation. Why? Because there is absolutely no benefit. Only Pelosi is actively trying to increase the difficulty of sustaining the war, which is completely possible, I do not see the point of pressing on on this issue. On the other side, if she is just making life more difficult for old Dubya then it is an ethical dilemma that you guys in the states must face. I.e., is this type of boycotting acceptable?

quote:

Originally posted by venomX specially considering Turkey is a key player in the war efforts

I think you've stumbled across the key to the puzzle. If the US loses airbase rights in Turkey, that severely hampers the ability to conduct the War in Iraq and makes the case for withdrawal all that much stronger.

That said, I still think Congress is acting brashly and Turkey needs to get over themselves.

quote:

Originally posted by Krypton The genocide resolution though is counter-productive to today's diplomatic situation. The US hardly has the right to be judging other nation's pasts when its own past is so shady in coups, weapons sales, and support for oppressive dictatorships. Besides that, is Congress retarded!? They must want Turkey to invade the Kurdish northern Iraq. I think the US should judge itself before it goes out judging other nation's.

This is one of those catch 22 situations where you're damned if you do and you're damned if you don't.

I somewhat agree with Krypton on this matter.
Besides, it's not like America's past with native Americans was all that rosy.
I suppose the so-called difference is that America has acknowledged much of its past faults, but then again so has Turkey. Turkey just doesn't want to classify all those killing as genocide, but rather as a legitimate war.
America in time of war dropped a couple of nuclear bombs on Japan. Now granted I support America's action since it was a war, America was trying to avoid massive American soldier casualties fighting the Japanese, and the Japanse did side with shitler, but hey we did kill a lot of innocent Japanese people in the process.
These facts though aren't hidden in America. We are taught in history classes about the Indians trail of tears, and about Japanese concentration camps.
What does Turkey teach its children in regards to the events that happened almost a century ago? And are Americas ills any excuse for turkey to conceal its own dark past?

The situation with Armenia tiday is complicated, as is the situation with the Turks. Anytime you have natural re$ource$ located in such areas, well that just complicates matters even further, now doesnt it?

quote:

Originally posted by Lebezniatnikov I think you've stumbled across the key to the puzzle. If the US loses airbase rights in Turkey, that severely hampers the ability to conduct the War in Iraq and makes the case for withdrawal all that much stronger. That said, I still think Congress is acting brashly and Turkey needs to get over themselves.

Correct

I don't like it at all.

Even if the Democrats are using this resolution as a tactic to hamper the Republican war effort in Iraq (and possibly Iran), there is no denying the amount of damage that is done by driving Turkey further away.

By all acounts Turkey is a bit of a model country, it's the closest thing to an Islamic Western country that there is and for this reason it should be helped.

I tend to agree with eROs.au, how important is this? Dose the technical lable of "genocide" bring anything to anybody? Especially now, couldn't it wait until some of the fighting dies down in the middle east?

I mean lets look at the facts here, do you think Pelosi really cares about what happened to those people? Come on. I mean this is a clear sign that the Democratic led congress wants to limit the efforts of our president to continue with the war. How childish is that! Congress dosent care if we are victorious, they just want to put a stop to this war. How sad that our congress in such difficult times is divided

I agree with the member that said that American learns from is past. Also, here we doing hide any of our actions like in other countries. Its interesting I have a Japanese friend that told me in Japan they taught him about WWII but they didnt mention Pearl Harbor

quote:

Originally posted by LatinLover How sad that our congress in such difficult times is divided

Agreed.

Hopefully the radical conservative sensationalist element of our government eventually finds a dusty tomb in the list of mistakes we learn from.

quote:

Originally posted by Lebezniatnikov I think you've stumbled across the key to the puzzle. If the US loses airbase rights in Turkey, that severely hampers the ability to conduct the War in Iraq and makes the case for withdrawal all that much stronger. That said, I still think Congress is acting brashly and Turkey needs to get over themselves.

Correct.

Pelosi is actually doing what the people who voted the democrats into congress to do (and I am very impressed they came up with such a creative method, in the face of great barriers from the bullshittery of the neocon political blockade), though in a round-a-bout way:

Trying to put a stop to this illegal war.

Fuck pansying to the idea of preventing a "divided congress". They're growing some balls and taking action, and I respect that. Furthermore, the republicans didn't give anyone a chance to pursue any agenda besides their own when they had the majority, so I hope to see a political war of sorts take place, and as much as I don't like the democrats, at least they didn't manage to destroy our country, its success, and its image.

Pay back's a bitch, I guess.

I think Turkey has a lot to lose from this as well. As a country actively vying for EU membership, any strong reactions to a non-binding, paper tiger resolution would only show that it's not ready to act rationally and become a fuly-functional EU member.

Furthermore, the trade with US comprises one of the major revenue streams for Turkey and this could also put some damper on the counter-reaction.

Worst case scenario, I'm sure Bushy can call his homeboys in the "House of Saud" to let him 'crash on their couch for a bit, when angry mustachioed Turkey girlfriend decides she no longer wants to play "stinky finger" with US. It's not ideal, but sometimes you just have to show your b*tch who's in charge.

Powered by: vBulletin
Copyright © 2000-2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.