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-- Afghan suicide bomber kills own family
Afghan suicide bomber kills own family
Very pathetic. Taliban havn't gone anywhere, Al-Qaeda is at pre-war operational levels, and the Afghan poppy production is at record highs. THe War on Terror is going so so swell ain't it?
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http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071015..._as/afghanistan
Afghan suicide bomber kills own family
By AMIR SHAH, Associated Press Writer 2 hours, 41 minutes ago
KABUL, Afghanistan - A mother who tried to stop her son from carrying out a suicide bomb attack triggered an explosion in the family's home in southern Afghanistan that killed the would-be bomber, his mother and three siblings, police said Monday.
The would-be bomber had been studying at a madrassa, or religious school, in Pakistan, and when he returned to his home in Uruzgan province over the weekend announced that he planned to carry out a suicide attack, Interior Ministry spokesman Zemeri Bashary said.
Surviving family members told police that the suicide vest exploded during a struggle between the mother and her son, said Juma Gul Himat, Uruzgan's police chief. The man's brother and two sisters were also killed.
Family members said the would-be bomber gave his family $3,600 before telling them he intended to carry out the attack, Himat said.
Bashary said the explosion happened on Sunday, but Himat said it occurred on Monday morning. It was not clear why the two accounts differed.
In a second accidental explosion, another would-be bomber died Friday in Paktika province after he identified himself to police and began taking off his bomb vest, Bashary said.
The bomber said he changed his mind and was aborting the suicide mission because he saw people praying in a mosque. But he accidentally triggered a blast as he slipped off the vest that killed only himself, Bashary said.
The U.S. military, meanwhile, said it had looked into allegations that soldiers had desecrated the Quran during a raid on a home in the eastern province of Kunar and found no evidence of wrongdoing. The allegations had outraged villagers, who met with the governor, provincial leaders and U.S. military commanders on Sunday.
Kunar deputy provincial governor Noor Mohammad Khan said American soldiers raided the home of Mullah Zarbaz on Saturday, arresting him and three others. Villagers claimed that soldiers ripped, knifed and burned a Quran during the raid, allegations that led to an angry demonstration, Khan said.
But Maj. Chris Belcher, a spokesman for the U.S.-led coalition, which oversees Special Forces soldiers who usually carry out nighttime raids, said the allegations had been investigated and were found to be baseless.
"We looked into it. There was no desecration of the Quran or any religious symbol by U.S. forces," Belcher said. "Had a soldier desecrated it, we would take action."
In the latest violence, Taliban militants ambushed a NATO patrol in central Afghanistan on Sunday, leaving about a dozen soldiers wounded, a NATO official said. The troops called for an airstrike on the militants in Wardak province, but there were no reports of casualties, said the official, who spoke on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to speak on the matter.
The official did not identify the nationality of the wounded troops. Most of the troops in Wardak province, which borders the capital of Kabul, are Turkish.
In an interview with Australian Broadcasting Corp., President Hamid Karzai said Afghanistan has suffered "the law of unintended consequences" because of the war in Iraq.
"We did suffer by movements of people, by movements of extremist ideology, by transfer of knowledge by extremists to one another," Karzai said in the interview, which was broadcast Monday. "There is no doubt that al-Qaida is linked all across the world."
Karzai said he knew "with confidence" that al-Qaida leader Osama bin Laden and Taliban chief Mullah Omar were not in Afghanistan. But he said he did not have "precise information" on where they were. Afghan officials say the two are hiding in Pakistan.
The top U.N. envoy in Afghanistan, meanwhile, urged countries contributing troops to the NATO force not to "wobble" in their commitments to fight the Taliban and help counter a campaign of intimidation, abduction and killing by government opponents.
Tom Koenigs said at the United Nations in New York that while the Afghan national army will have 47,000 troops at the end of the year, and hopefully 70,000 by the end of 2008, "numbers are not a measure of capability" and NATO remains the most capable force to defend the government against a tough insurgency.
Insurgent violence in Afghanistan is at its highest level since U.S. forces invaded the country in 2001 to oust the hard-line Islamic Taliban rulers, who harbored al-Qaida leaders blamed for planning the attacks in the United States on Sept. 11, 2001.
The focus of the violence has been in Afghanistan's southern and eastern provinces, but the insurgents are increasingly using Iraq-style tactics, such as roadside bombs, suicide attacks and kidnappings to hit foreign and Afghan targets around the country.
Probably because pharmaceutical companies need massive quantities of poppy for production of medicines.
I'd guess that at least a quarter of all medication is opioid related.
and yet women are now allowed to go to school and to work. if you don't think that's worth anything then please elaborate why.
Re: Afghan suicide bomber kills own family
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| Originally posted by Krypton Very pathetic. Taliban havn't gone anywhere, Al-Qaeda is at pre-war operational levels, and the Afghan poppy production is at record highs. THe War on Terror is going so so swell ain't it? -------------------------------------------------------- |
a would-be teenage jihadist kills his own parents when they try to convince him how wrong it is. another accidentally kills himself when he has a revelation as to how wrong it is.
then for some reason we have Krypton to submit this as evidence to the rest of us how we're the ones who have the problem.
not Al Queera. not the Taliban. not Krypton. we, the ones who recognize the perverse fraud that is 21st century jihad, have the problem. sad.
the Taliban has resorted to tactics in which two years ago they would have deemed unholy or immoral or cowardly. but for some reason Krypton, at a moments notice, will use it to his political worldview's advantage and say to other Americans "you have the problem", not me. not Krypton.
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| Originally posted by Q5echo a would-be teenage jihadist kills his own parents when they try to convince him how wrong it is. another accidentally kills himself when he has a revelation as to how wrong it is. then for some reason we have Krypton to submit this as evidence to the rest of us how we're the ones who have the problem. not Al Queera. not the Taliban. not Krypton. we, the ones who recognize the perverse fraud that is 21st century jihad, have the problem. sad. the Taliban has resorted to tactics in which two years ago they would have deemed unholy or immoral or cowardly. but for some reason Krypton, at a moments notice, will use it to his political worldview's advantage and say to other Americans "you have the problem", not me. not Krypton. |
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| Originally posted by Trancer-X I think that it's more of a human problem. |
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| Originally posted by Q5echo then you would have to agree that it requires, at the very least, a human solution. |
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| Originally posted by Trancer-X If you mean diplomacy, yeah. |
thats exactly what i was thinking when some dickless piece of sh*t blew up another few hundred people at an Embassy of ours in a country that only presented itself as a soft target and nothing more. these are cowards.
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| Originally posted by Q5echo right, diplomacy. thats exactly what i was thinking when some dickless piece of sh*t blew up another few hundred people at an Embassy of ours |
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| Originally posted by Trancer-X Who GAVE THEM the bombs? Who MADE the bombs? |
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| Originally posted by Q5echo your mom? i don't know |
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| Originally posted by Trancer-X And if it's dickless for them to kill themselves for the cause that they (are brainwashed to) believe in, what is it considered to be when our side uses the stroke of a pen to send thousands to their deaths. Valiant? |
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| Originally posted by Trancer-X Don't strain yourself by trying to come up with a witty reply. Your other brain cell might not be able to handle this cruel world if it were orphaned. |
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| Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN and yet women are now allowed to go to school and to work. if you don't think that's worth anything then please elaborate why. |
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BTW, how does this article highlight your point? (if you had any) |
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| a would-be teenage jihadist kills his own parents when they try to convince him how wrong it is. another accidentally kills himself when he has a revelation as to how wrong it is. then for some reason we have Krypton to submit this as evidence to the rest of us how we're the ones who have the problem. not Al Queera. not the Taliban. not Krypton. we, the ones who recognize the perverse fraud that is 21st century jihad, have the problem. sad. the Taliban has resorted to tactics in which two years ago they would have deemed unholy or immoral or cowardly. but for some reason Krypton, at a moments notice, will use it to his political worldview's advantage and say to other Americans "you have the problem", not me. not Krypton. |
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| Originally posted by Krypton Um, you have teenagers wanting to be suicide bombers. How do you stop this? By bombing and killing? Sure hasn't worked for the 6 years we've been trying has it? |
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Are we the fucking daddy of the world???????????????????? Leave them alone, and they won't be volunteering in droves to be suicide bombers!! It's common sense!! |
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| Originally posted by EvilTree Hearts and minds ring a bell? Education? Good governance? Creating a viable economy? |
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| There will always be few wackos who're just nuts, but generally you give people opportunity to work for a decent wage without having to fear survival, they usually get a long well with others. |
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| This dude was getting paid by Taliban to be a suicide bomber. What would be the odds that this guy be a suicide bomber if he was making a decent living? Desperation, hopelessness fueled by religious anger turns out suicide bombers. |
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| (And other reports seems to suggest that a lot of suicide bombers are not Afghan in origin but foreigners) |
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| leave Afghanistan alone? I guess you're not much of an advocate of human rights, among other things that the left profess to uphold. |
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| Originally posted by Krypton Hearts and minds? LOL... So are we going to invade Pakistan so we can shut down their madrassas? Because that's where these teenagers are coming from... |
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It's not about hearts and minds. Are you going to pursuade very independent people to accept NATO in their ancient lands? I don't think so. Their pretext is foreign occupation, always will be. |
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Can you really pay a suicide bomber? Would you blow yourself up for money? They blow themselves up because they believe they are going to heaven. They do it because they think its honorable. Who are they targeting. Foreign occupiers. That is their stated mission, to expel foreign occupiers. It's been like that in 1960's Vietnam, was like that in 1980's afghanistan, and its their stated purpose in Iraq today. |
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Perhaps in Iraq, but not in Afghanistan. And again, what is their stated purpose? Expelling foreign occupation. |
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They have the right of self-determination, to develop their own institutions however they see fit, regardless of how a foreigner like you or me views it. Freedom is fought for by the people who obtain it, not by foreign powers. Just think for a second. If their stated purpose is to expel the foreign occupier (has been for centuries), why not stop being the foreign occupier. You'll have almost no suicide bombers... No foreigner has ever tamed afghanistan or Iraq, or Iran... The British tried in the 1800's to conquer Afghanistan from India, and got beat. They took over Iranian oil in 1906 and the Iranians chose to nationalize in the 1950's... Why do we have to be a sugar daddy in every civil war in third world countries... |
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| Originally posted by EvilTree Yeah, it's a flawed plan right now because Pakis aren't doing much to shut down those madrassas. |
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| NATO isn't going to be permanent presence in Afghanistan. Hard for you to believe, but NATO nations are there to help democratically elected Afghan goverment be able to govern Afghanistan. At least that's what the vaunted UN Resolutions said. Exactly what benefit does NATO get from permanent occupation of Afghanistan? |
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| They blow themselves up so that their destitute family gets paid. Few thousand bucks aren't much to us, certainly not worth killing yourself for, but for these people who have pretty much nothing, it's a shitload of money. Family is very important to these people. It's not foreign occupation |
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| There is right and there is wrong. Many of Taliban practices are wrong. Hence why we take a stand whenever Nazis and Rwanda genocide happens. Taliban haven't done anything remotely those loonies have done, but Taliban are just as evil as the Nazis and Rwandans who committed genocide. |
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| Really, you think these people are fighting for freedom as we understand it? |
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| Once we, as citizens of this earth stop caring about each other, humanity will go down the shits. Yes, it's an imperfect world and we always don't do the right things, but once we stop give a damn about the avg Afghans who just want to live and enjoy the basic freedoms and rights we take for granted, then humanity is doomed. |
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| BTW, Afghan National Army is the guys doing most of the fighting against the Taliban. NATO is there a lot of time in support role. |
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| Oh, and Taliban and people who don't like NATO is a minority. Considering how few the numbers NATO has, if Taliban had anything close to strong enough support, wouldn't you think they'd have formented a strong enough insurgency to force NATO out of Afghanistan like they did against the Soviets? |
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| Originally posted by Krypton Of course its a flawed plan. Aren't you alarmed how we have gone to war on flawed plans? Legally and strategically flawed?? |
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The point is, these people will not accept foreign occupiers in their land, and NATO is the main occupying force. Don't get me wrong, their intentions may be good, but strategically, occupying the land, no matter how good the intentions are will result in more jihad fatwas, suicide bombings, and insurgencies. |
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Have you studied fundamentalist islam? They do not fight jihad for their families. They fight jihad against percieved enemies of islam, which they very much view foreign occupiers of muslim lands, as enemies of islam. It is about foreign occupation. That is why they fight. That is why they blow themselves up. They believe they will go to heaven because they martyred themselves killing "enemies of islam". You may not view yourself or your army as an enemy of islam, but they very much hold that view. |
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Um, what gives you right to tell foreigners how to run their country? Unless Afghanistan under the Taliban began invading their neighbors, thus violating other country's sovereignty, then we will have had a justified excuse to invade them. |
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| I'm very sorry for the people of Afghanistan that they have to live under that tyranny, but it is them who have to decide who rules them, not foreigners. |
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Yes, they fight for freedom, but NOT as we understand it. They fight for the freedom of self-determination, to run the country however they want. That is something the western powers don't have the right to do. |
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You should care when countries violate each others sovereignty or self-determination. You should not be going about the world preaching how people should run their own countries. That is not our role in this world. Nobody said to stop caring. But what I'm saying is stop the interventionism. Help them help themselves. Don't go in their claiming to be liberators and choosing their government for them... |
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What? Source? Sorry, but the 50,000 afghan soldiers of the army are barely trained... Wow, man you might want to be checking your sources. It's the Americans, Canadians, Dutch, and British who are doing most of the fighting, with ANA help, but hardly as operational for you to say they are doing most of the fighting. |
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| What you haven't heard, perhaps, is that the vast majority of the casualties and injuries in this civil war are Afghan. Mentored and supported by Canadian officers. The Afghans are in the forefront of every combat operation in the south and 85% of the casualties treated for war injuries at Kandahar Air Field, the main coalition base in the south, are Afghan army or Afghan police |
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| Originally posted by EvilTree ? Legally? lol. Do I really need to go over arguments that's been gone over gazillions of times? Strategically? I don't think anyone really anticipated that the Taliban could regroup after the beating they got in 2001-02, and this counterinsurgency thing is still something NATO is learning about. |
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| These people are the minority. Seems that a lot of Afghans, at least in Kandahar province, want the Canadians to stay. http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen...fa-08671c172e51 |
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| That's only part of the reason. Like I said, it takes a lot for a guy to willing to kill himself for a cause, and the fact is that a lot of suicide bombers are destitute and their family need the money. That few thousand bucks may be that extra incentive for them to blow themselves for the jihad. |
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| Not that you can do much of a study on this, but I really doubt that you'd get many people willing to blow themselves up without the extra cash. Just how many suicide bombing events happen? For someone in a holy cause, there sure aren't that many taking a run at NATO with a bomb strapped onto them. |
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| Ok. Fine. I'll address the Taliban thing. Osama had bases in Afghanistan. Taliban won't give up Osama. Osama blew up WTC. I guess for you, nations giving aid and comfort to your enemy shouldn't be punished? |
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| Yeah. They decided by having a free vote and electing Karzai and rejecting Taliban rule in most of Afghanistan, except some provinces in the South and the North. (Or are you going to claim that internationally monitored election was all rigged?) |
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| I see. So you think every tribal group in Afghanistan should have a free for all? Regardless of innocent casualties and total ruination of Afghanistan, again? |
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| Wow dude. You just said you're willing to watch whenever one group decide to ethinically cleanse others for example. You just said you won't do much when people oppress each other, violate human rights. |
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| Like I said, so when the next Hitler comes to power and he starts killing people for fun, you're going to sit still and not demand something to be done. |
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| http://ottawasun.com/News/Afghan/20...576954-sun.html I quote Not definite fact, however, this suggests that the Afghans aren't sitting back and letting NATO do all the heavy work. They are getting dirty and taking the fight to the Taliban Barely trained? I agree that ANA is nowhere near ready to take on the full burden, but some units are getting good training and equipment and development of NCO corp is coming along so hopefully in future, ANA can take even greater role. Last I hear, ANA is starting to develop an airforce so that should be interesting. |
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| Originally posted by Krypton Have you studied fundamentalist islam? They do not fight jihad for their families. |
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| Originally posted by Q5echo i think i found my new Krypton quote-of-the-week!!!!!!! |
Life is keeping me busy atm, but I just came across these two articles
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/serv...al_gam_mostview
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Poll shows Afghans want NATO troops to stay ALAN FREEMAN October 18, 2007 at 8:34 PM EDT OTTAWA � A strong majority of Afghans approve of the presence of NATO-led troops in their country, including from Canada, and want the foreign soldiers to remain to fight the Taliban and support reconstruction efforts. In a public opinion poll of Afghans conducted by Environics Research on behalf of The Globe and Mail, the CBC and La Presse, respondents expressed optimism about the future, strong support for the government of President Hamid Karzai and appreciation for the work being done by NATO countries in improving security. In Kandahar, where the Taliban is stronger and violence more pervasive, support for the foreign troops was weaker, but respondents still want the soldiers to stay. According to the survey, conducted in person across the country between Sept. 17 and 24 with a representative sample of 1,578 men and women, 60 per cent said that the presence of foreigners in the country was a good thing. Only 16 per cent said it was a bad thing, while 22 per cent said it was equally good and bad. In Kandahar, where the Canadians are centred, Environics added to the number of respondents and asked a series of special questions; there, 61 per cent said the foreign presence was good while 23 per cent responded that it was a �bad thing.� While a majority of Canadians oppose the military mission in Afghanistan and are anxious to see it end in February, 2009, if not sooner, Afghans are considerably more sanguine about the NATO presence and want it to continue. Nationally, 64 per cent of respondents said they believe the foreigners have made a lot of progress or some progress in the fight against the Taliban. In Kandahar, where the insurgency is still raging, 58 per cent still say the foreigners are doing a good job fighting the Taliban. When asked about the future of the foreign soldiers, only 14 per cent said they should leave right away while 11 per cent said they should leave within a year. Another 27 per cent said the troops should stay between two and five years but the biggest group by far�43 per cent�thought the foreign military presence should last ``however long it takes to defeat the Taliban and restore order.� In Kandahar, the heart of the Taliban movement, there was less enthusiasm for the foreign presence with 32 per cent saying the soldiers should leave right away or within a year, but 18 per cent said the Canadian and other foreigners should stay for two to five years and 31 per cent for as long as it takes to defeat the Taliban. The survey pointed to a general sense of optimism in the country with 60 per cent of the national sample and 61 per cent in Kandahar saying they were better off than five years ago. When it comes to the status of women, 73 per cent of respondents nationally said that the women are better off now than they were in 2002. �It's the first poll ever done by a Canadian organization (in Afghanistan) and the first one that has asked about the Canadian mission and has focused on Kandahar,� said Keith Neuman, group vice president at Environics. When it comes to Canada's presence in the country, it has a relatively high profile, ranking fourth in public awareness after the United States, Germany and the United Kingdom. Asked which foreign countries are present in Afghanistan with soldiers, aid workers and businessmen, 95 per cent named the U.S., Germany 63 per cent, Britain 52 per cent and Canada 46 per cent. But virtually no Afghans are apparently aware that Canadian soldiers are involved in fighting the Taliban. Asked which foreign counties are involved in battling the Taliban, 89 per cent of Afghans mentioned the United States and none mentioned Canada. Even in Kandahar, 90 per cent said the U.S. was fighting the Taliban while only 2 per cent identified Canada. On the other hand, 25 per cent of respondents in Kandahar said that Canada was providing reconstruction assistance, compared with 27 per cent for Britain and 28 per cent for Germany. Yet when the question was asked differently, awareness of the Canadian role was higher. When respondents in Kandahar were asked what the main purpose of the Canadian presence was in the province, 47 per cent responded that the main goal was to fight the Taliban, while 16 per mentioned reconstruction and 10 per cent answered that Canada was there to support the Karzai government. Mr. Neuman said that because the U.S. has by far the most troops in the country, respondents immediately identified American forces as the major fighters against the Taliban but in Kandahar, awareness of the Canadian presence was high and their role was well-regarded, particularly when it comes to reconstruction work. Support for the Taliban also was surprisingly low, with only 14 per cent of respondents nationally said they had very positive or somewhat positive views of the Taliban. In Kandahar, those positives rose to 20 per cent. Respondents also were overwhelmingly opposed to suicide bombings, with 71 per cent nationally saying they were never justified. Despite the enmity towards the Taliban, 74 per cent said they supported negotiations between the Karzai government and Taliban representatives as a way of reducing conflict. In Kandahar, support for talks jumped to 85 per cent. |
http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2007/...fghan-poll.html
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51% of Afghans feeling good about country's direction: poll Last Updated: Thursday, October 18, 2007 | 6:05 PM ET CBC News A new poll of nearly 1,600 Afghans shows the majority feel safer than they did five years ago, and approve of the direction their country is taking, thanks to the presence of international security forces from countries such as Canada. Results from the Environics Research poll, conducted in partnership with the CBC, show 60 per cent of Afghans surveyed believe the presence of foreign troops has been good for their country. As well, 51 per cent said they feel their country is headed in the right direction, compared to 28 per cent who responded that it's headed in the wrong direction. The remaining interviewees saw no change or didn't know. Most Afghans said they believe their lives are better than they were five years ago, citing increased security, as well as better roads and schools because of reconstruction efforts. Those who feel they are worse off say they don't feel safe in the face of continuing violence. "There's no consensus. It's not everyone [who] has a positive view," said Keith Neuman of Environics. "But more often than not, people feel that things are better than they were." Continue Article The Ottawa-based research company oversaw the Sept. 17-24 survey of 1,578 Afghans, whom pollsters from the Afghan Centre for Social and Opinion Research interviewed in their homes throughout the country's 34 provinces. The results have a margin of error of 2.5 per cent, 19 times out of 20, except in Kandahar, where the smaller sample size leads to a 5.9 per cent margin of error. Support for troops to stay Among the poll's other results: * Forty-three per cent of all Afghans surveyed say that foreign troops should stay as long as it takes to get the job done. Only about 15 per cent of all Afghans surveyed want foreign troops to leave their country immediately, and the rest want time limits. * In the troubled southern province of Kandahar, where the former Taliban government has its roots and where the vast majority of Canadian troops are based, only 31 per cent of respondents want to see foreign troops stick around until stability is restored. In comparison, 32 per cent of those asked would like to see the troops gone within a year, and many had no opinion at all. * A full 60 per cent of those surveyed in Kandahar have a somewhat or very positive attitude toward Canada's soldiers. Those with a negative opinion cite civilian casualties and the fact that they see the soldiers as infidels. Janice Stein is director of the Munk Centre for International Studies at the University of Toronto, another of the poll's sponsors. She sees grounds for optimism in the results. "I think Afghans are asking for continued assistance," she said. "They are asking for a continued foreign presence in the short term. They are asking for help in order to avoid a return of the Taliban to Afghanistan. These are the fundamental messages that come out of this poll." U.S. cited as chief source of troops When asked who is responsible for fighting the Taliban, an overwhelming majority named the United States. Even in the south of the country, where Canadian forces have lost most of the 71 soldiers who have died in the country so far, 90 per cent of Afghans polled believe it is the United States that is trying to protect them. On the bright side, when it comes to reconstruction, Afghans named Canada as one of the top countries trying to help rebuild Kandahar. "Here are the Canadians in Afghanistan, seen as the people building civil society, helping reconstruction, helping to train, helping to build a democracy so that some day we can leave," says Michael Adams of Environics. "It's interesting � even our military are seen in that role there, rather than in the role of fighting the Taliban." Some NATO countries, such as the Netherlands and Germany, have been debating whether to pull their troops out of Afghanistan. But despite political opposition within Canada, Prime Minister Stephen Harper has made his position clear: He wants Canadian troops to stay in the country until at least 2011. High marks for Karzai On another front, Afghan President Hamid Karzai and his government received approval ratings other world leaders can only dream of. More than 70 per cent of Afghans surveyed said they think Karzai is doing a good job. In his home province of Kandahar, the positive reviews jump to 77 per cent. That's significant because Karzai is often seen from the outside as a weak leader who, among other criticisms, hasn't managed to clean up corruption in his own governmental ranks. "I think what people forget is there is a lot of challenges in this country," Arif Lalani, Canada's ambassador to Afghanistan, pointed out in an interview. "But there's a lot of progress [too], and the Afghans that I see, see the change and he's the face of the Afghan government. So it wouldn't surprise me that they still have faith in him." |
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