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Drugs in the UK clubbing scene

No matter how great their love of dance music, I don't think many people in the UK would deny how paramount drugs are to the atmosphere at a club. You may not do them yourself but you would be plain wrong if you thought it wouldn't be going off if a good 50% (probably more) of people there weren't high as a kite. This is defiantly the case in the main clubs I have been in anyway - Crasher, Gods, Passion, Opera House etc

Since trance is my musical preference, I will only comment on this scene, even though I am sure it is applicable to others as well, but especially trance because of the strong link with ecstasy that it has always had.

Basically - and feel free to correct me if any of my information is incomplete - the quality of ecstasy has decreased dramatically in the past 6 months. I have heard that this is because of a couple of things:

1. A few of the main producers of ecstasy in the UK have been busted
2. The strong emergence of piperazine's such as BZP, TFMPP and MCPP, and the ease at which people can get hold of them and pressing equipment.

This is actually a bit of a nightmare. I seldom take drugs anymore, but I have a friend who is very clued up, and has testing kits etc, so knows when a batch is dodgy. He has found that nearly all of the stuff that�s been knocking around lately is not really MDMA - its the abovementioned piperazines. For anyone who doesn't know, they basically act the same in that they make your brain release loads of serration, which makes you high. However it�s nowhere near as good, and the comedown is absolutely awful. You can't sleep and you will feel as rough as a dog. A lot of people feel a bit ropey when they are up as well.

Anyway, the problem dawned on me when I was at Gatecrasher Magna on boxing day in Rotherham. This was by all accounts an amazing night, in an amazing venue, with an amazing line-up, and all the DJ's performed exceptionally. However, the atmosphere wasn't quite the same as I've seen in the past - or even at the previous magna a few months ago. When I started going clubbing in early 2004, whenever you looked around people were obviously high, but they were all smiling. People would come up to you in the toilets and say 'this is amazing...what a quality night' etc etc - You got all of that 'Human Traffic' banter.

At my night at Magna on the other hand - looking around at the crowd I could tell that about the usual amount of people were on something, but their facial expressions were quite different. People just looked messy, and no one was really going for it. It was obvious that it wasn't MDMA that the majority of people were doing. Absolutely nobody had anything to say apart from 'where's Armin?', since he was a few minutes late, and some people weren�t smashed enough to enjoy what they didn't know (namely John 00 Fleming, who was actually brilliant).

The problem is that unfortunately, a lot of clubbers just want to have a good time and are not particularly obsessed by trance (or insert other genre) - they listen casually and have a limited lifespan on the dance floor as it is. There will have been people at Magna who will have dropped for the first time and gone home thinking 'That was not as good as its cracked up to be', and the horrific comedown that they experienced may have been enough to put them off going again. The amount of people that had such an amazing night that their love of clubbing blossomed from there will have been significantly reduced (in part because the atmosphere simply wasn�t there towards the end too). Then there are the people who are getting on a bit and not so clued up about what�s in their pills, who will just think 'I'm too old for this....not as good as it used to be...starting to make me feel rough...' and will begin to disappear from clubland.

I think this is actually a pretty serious issue to be honest. I would like to think that people go clubbing because the music is good, but the fact is that for many people getting battered is the real reason its fun. If pills continue to be crap, I think numbers will drop and the likes of Godskitchen will struggle to afford their stunning venues. And are the big DJ's going to play for less money, or in shitty little clubs? Probably not quite as frequently.

What are your opinions? Do you think its something to worry about? I personally will be absolutely gutted if this issue causes the UK trance scene to go tits up...

I'm appalled by the fact that you base your opinions about people's enjoyment of the night solely on the quality of their drugs.

I'd really love it if drugs were to fuck off from the club scene entirely, then only the people who really enjoy the music would be there, not wankers who enjoy arps and fat kick drums when they are off their nut, and listen to pop music during the day.

Though I must admit, as you said, drugs (vs alcohol only) can add a significant amount of atmosphere to events . On the other hand, when a particularly strong batch goes around, they seem to do the opposite - everyone gets involved in whacked-out conversations about utter crap with one another and ignores the music altogether.

I think it would be more accurate to say the 90% of people are on drugs at trance events, not 50%.

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Originally posted by Beat Blog I'm appalled by the fact that you base your opinions about people's enjoyment of the night solely on the quality of their drugs. I'd really love it if drugs were to fuck off from the club scene entirely, then only the people who really enjoy the music would be there, not wankers who enjoy arps and fat kick drums when they are off their nut, and listen to pop music during the day.

You clearly haven�t paid any attention to the way I have expressed that its 'most people'. Of course the music is what makes a night good - but are you seriously trying to deny that some people wouldn't go if there weren�t drugs around? You live in Melbourne so perhaps it's different at your end. I doubt it though.

Any your ideal of losing drugs so that only people who were really serious about the music were at nights is great until the reality that clubs lose money due to empty dancefloors and shut down kicks in.

Please don't be appalled by my post � that�s a very strong emotion to have about someone�s casual observation

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Originally posted by JonDC You clearly haven�t paid any attention to the way I have expressed that its 'most people'. Of course the music is what makes a night good - but are you seriously trying to deny that some people wouldn't go if there weren�t drugs around? You live in Melbourne so perhaps it's different at your end. I doubt it though.

Some people?

Without drugs, crowds of 20,000 would be reduced to 5,000, and the events would last for 4 hours, rather than 8 or 12. People would leave after a few hours, too tired or lazy to go on. The "stadium rave" as we know it would be dead. As you said, clubs would also start shutting their doors.

I think this would actually be great. Huge, stadium raves are fun, but imagine if instead of having twenty shit clubs in town, you had two quality ones playing top-notch music all the time. The crowd would become so much more intimate and connected, just like back when clubs like Wigan Casino and Paradise Garage were open, it was like a family, you knew everyone in the place, every week!

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Originally posted by Beat Blog Some people? Without drugs, crowds of 20,000 would be reduced to 5,000, and the events would last for 4 hours, rather than 8 or 12. People would leave after a few hours, too tired or lazy to go on. The "stadium rave" as we know it would be dead. As you said, clubs would also start shutting their doors. I think this would actually be great. Huge, stadium raves are fun, but imagine if instead of having twenty shit clubs in town, you had two quality ones playing top-notch music all the time. The crowd would become so much more intimate and connected, just like back when clubs like Wigan Casino and Paradise Garage were open, it was like a family, you knew everyone in the place, every week!

I can see your point, but I'm still not really talking about the stadium 'tiesto in concert' raves - even the normal sized, 1.5 thousand people clubs will be affected. I think its important to have a decent venue with a big sound system and lazors and good DJ's who demand high wages - it definatly adds to the night, and if numbers dropped massivly, clubs wouldnt be able to afford that sort of thing.

I'd agree that the emergance of niche nights would be pretty cool, but I would miss the superclubs

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Originally posted by JonDC I can see your point, but I'm still not really talking about the stadium 'tiesto in concert' raves - even the normal sized, 1.5 thousand people clubs will be affected. I think its important to have a decent venue with a big sound system and lazors and good DJ's who demand high wages - it definatly adds to the night, and if numbers dropped massivly, clubs wouldnt be able to afford that sort of thing. I'd agree that the emergance of niche nights would be pretty cool, but I would miss the superclubs

I'd miss superclubs too, I like them.

However, have you ever been to see a classic or cult DJs where a lot of the crowd is sober? The atmosphere can be amazing, because sober people cheer and go more nuts than drugged people, who tend to get lost in their own little worlds.

From what I've heard, the quality of E has been shit for years now. I don't think it's a particularly new "problem".

ferry corsten shit on tiesto here in atlanta. although the actual DJ and music played where a big part, all the people at tiesto where sketch as fuck and trashy. at ferry it was at a nice venue and all the people were sober or drunk. no E = a much better time.

i dnt take drugs but in the clubs over here 90% would be taking them and dont have a clue about proper edm,all think scott project and lisa lashes r the best djs 2 grace the decks.if drugs were takin away no1 would go 2 clubs.ive no problem with ppl taking drugs and it would be the end of a dance scene over here if they were taken away

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Originally posted by SYSTEM-J From what I've heard, the quality of E has been shit for years now. I don't think it's a particularly new "problem".

that's why i stopped dropping tabs, pills just aren't what they used to be

Ive noticed that since the summer alot of clubs in Belfast have simply 'dried up'. And with this, there is a more tense atmosphere which is so noticeable.

As pills are crap these days, get yourself some pure MDMA

cor version ?

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Originally posted by The_G0dfather cor version ?

everyone has aids

quote:

Originally posted by SYSTEM-J From what I've heard, the quality of E has been shit for years now. I don't think it's a particularly new "problem".

From what I've heard, people have been saying this since E came to exist in clubs. Nostalgia and all that...

In any case, from these descriptions I think a more likely problem is that the age of superclubs is waning - and it's about bloody time. They have been bleeding clubbers dry with insanely high prices on virtually everything, since otherwise they won't be able to cover the absurd fees of the big shot DJ egos they think they have to book in order to keep on pulling in the punters. They've had their comeuppance waiting for them.

Dance music is no longer the great draw it used to be at the end of the 90s. Clubs are no longer just for those who are really into the music and know 90% of the names on the flyer. People just go out to get wasted. Why spend three or four times the normal amount on a big glitzy affair with the same old DJs from the top of the DJ Mag poll when you can get equally wasted by simply forking over 10 quid at the smaller venue next door anyway?

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Originally posted by Zombikiller As pills are crap these days, get yourself some pure MDMA

And powder can be cut with shit aswell i would like to know how 'pure' the stuff your buying really is

ive been taking E and going to clubs since 1994. my have times changed. mdma back then, was much better than mdma now. it was much speedier and made you much more hyper. if you took one in the car on the way to the club, but got stuck in traffic, and your pill kicked in, it would be PHYSICALLY IMPOSSIBLE to sit still and shut up. you simply had to stick your head out the window and scream "woo!" at the top of your lungs. it would be 73 degrees faranheit sitting in a car and you would be sweating and have the shakes and go pale. no dancing, no physical activity, just sitting in normal temps and you would sweat. if you did not have any water around, you would throw up, guaranteed. E nowadays, doesn't do that, even if you take a bunch. the touchy feely sexy part is stronger, but with less of the energy. somewhere around 2001 is when these sleepy E pills started showing up. i remember then because it was a gamble when purchasing, you never knew if it was going to be a sleepy E or a speedy E. then the speedy ones just got more rare until finally they were (and are to this day) extinct. the music changed from that point on, the faster bpm stuff became less popular and continues that trend today. from reading on erowid and a few books they recommend, turns out there is not just one type of mdma, there is actually atleast 3 different isomers or isotopes of mdma and it was described exactly that some of these versions vary in how amphetamine-like they are (amphetamine = speed).

i dont need E when i go out, im sure most are the same way in that you can easily have just as good a time drinking. alcohol kind of re-lives the E experience a bit in that you're in a better more sociable mood. so the good mood from drinking definitely helps atmosphere too. the key is good music.

quote:

I'd really love it if drugs were to fuck off from the club scene entirely, then only the people who really enjoy the music would be there, not wankers who enjoy arps and fat kick drums when they are off their nut, and listen to pop music during the day.

yea.

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Originally posted by Sand Leaper From what I've heard, people have been saying this since E came to exist in clubs. Nostalgia and all that...

I have read articles about what they cut the MDMA up with these days, and the whole history of the drug. I don't think it's just a case of mass nostalgia, although inevitably that's part of it. It's doubtless been a progressive process too, which is why it's an old complaint.

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Originally posted by Sand Leaper From what I've heard, people have been saying this since E came to exist in clubs. Nostalgia and all that... In any case, from these descriptions I think a more likely problem is that the age of superclubs is waning - and it's about bloody time. They have been bleeding clubbers dry with insanely high prices on virtually everything, since otherwise they won't be able to cover the absurd fees of the big shot DJ egos they think they have to book in order to keep on pulling in the punters. They've had their comeuppance waiting for them. Dance music is no longer the great draw it used to be at the end of the 90s. Clubs are no longer just for those who are really into the music and know 90% of the names on the flyer. People just go out to get wasted. Why spend three or four times the normal amount on a big glitzy affair with the same old DJs from the top of the DJ Mag poll when you can get equally wasted by simply forking over 10 quid at the smaller venue next door anyway?

I personally do not agree with this atall. My original post said that clubbers generally like to get wasted to have a good night, but you are saying that the nature of the superclub makes no odds atall. I mean you seem to be implying that clubbers tend to be serial bash-head junkies, which isn't true. The vast majority are casual users, who will grow out of it in a couple of years, and who are impresed by the decor of the main-arena club. They wouldnt be satisfied with the shit-hole next door just because they were smashed; they wouldn't get smashed at the shit-hole next door.

As for the comment that superclubs are extortionate and are getting their comeuppance, again I disagree. It's a shame that seeing a superstar DJ isn't quite as cheap as it was a couple of years ago, but 9 hours of armin/tiesto/pvd/corsten et al is still significantly cheaper than 2 hours of U2, which nobosy seams to worry about. It only takes one good night for me to completely re-kindly my love of clubbing, and if its been good I never wonder if it was worth the money or not.

I don't think the problem is with the performance of DJ's at the moment, or even with the tunes that are being produced. The nights that I have had over X-mas have blown me away musically, and to me the appeal of the superclub is as great as ever. The problem is that people who are not so much into it, and who's quality of night is influenced by drugs will not see things the same way. I don't think there is a problem with the clubs themselves though

I'm starting to wonder if I'm just lousy at communicating on the internet or people are just masters at missing the point..

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Originally posted by JonDC I personally do not agree with this atall. My original post said that clubbers generally like to get wasted to have a good night, but you are saying that the nature of the superclub makes no odds atall. I mean you seem to be implying that clubbers tend to be serial bash-head junkies, which isn't true. The vast majority are casual users, who will grow out of it in a couple of years, and who are impresed by the decor of the main-arena club. They wouldnt be satisfied with the shit-hole next door just because they were smashed; they wouldn't get smashed at the shit-hole next door.

The casual user gravitates to whatever gets hyped up by the media and word of mouth. These days that is not people like PvD and Ferry Corsten, unlike back in '99. Therefore, it is very unlikely that they will want to shell out big bucks for getting wasted in superclubs these days, as there is very little via media hype that would make them willing to sacrifice that much money.

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As for the comment that superclubs are extortionate and are getting their comeuppance, again I disagree. It's a shame that seeing a superstar DJ isn't quite as cheap as it was a couple of years ago, but 9 hours of armin/tiesto/pvd/corsten et al is still significantly cheaper than 2 hours of U2, which nobosy seams to worry about. It only takes one good night for me to completely re-kindly my love of clubbing, and if its been good I never wonder if it was worth the money or not.

Comparing one of the biggest bands in the whole world to a DJ is completely pointless and irrelevant, as they are nowhere near the same level in terms of mainstream popularity. Plus, U2 aren't a bunch of guys who get paid to play other people's records. The sooner people stop lumping DJs into the musician-category because of these ridiculous stadium performances with tone deaf vocalist PAs, the better.

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I don't think the problem is with the performance of DJ's at the moment, or even with the tunes that are being produced. The nights that I have had over X-mas have blown me away musically, and to me the appeal of the superclub is as great as ever. The problem is that people who are not so much into it, and who's quality of night is influenced by drugs will not see things the same way. I don't think there is a problem with the clubs themselves though

They aren't so much into it because their attention has shifted to other things. Superclubs can appeal to you as much as they'd like, but it's no coincidence that the previously well-established club brands are dropping like flies these days. People are tired of getting the same package. If you don't mutate in the industry, you won't survive.

quote:

Originally posted by Beat Blog Some people? Without drugs, crowds of 20,000 would be reduced to 5,000, and the events would last for 4 hours, rather than 8 or 12. People would leave after a few hours, too tired or lazy to go on. The "stadium rave" as we know it would be dead. As you said, clubs would also start shutting their doors. I think this would actually be great. Huge, stadium raves are fun, but imagine if instead of having twenty shit clubs in town, you had two quality ones playing top-notch music all the time. The crowd would become so much more intimate and connected, just like back when clubs like Wigan Casino and Paradise Garage were open, it was like a family, you knew everyone in the place, every week!

This is called listening to another genre

Thank fuck real clubbing is going back underground for a few years, at least in London. Its where the best parties are at anyway. If I want nostagia I'll go to one of the monthly Crasher classics nights.

Didn't read the whole thread, maybe I will later...
Anyway, I go to parties often (not the big name ones, but still), I never do drugs and I always have a great time.
Say whatever you but drugs are not necessary to have a good time.
If you can't have fun without them, you need to seek help.

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Originally posted by Gauss Didn't read the whole thread, maybe I will later... Anyway, I go to parties often (not the big name ones, but still), I never do drugs and I always have a great time. Say whatever you but drugs are not necessary to have a good time. If you can't have fun without them, you need to seek help.

Yes but for many people they are necessary - its a significant part of their clubbing experience. It's not really my place to question anybody's morals, I am just concerned that it will affect attendance in clubs

When i am sober i enjoy watching a person look all fucked up.... makes me laugh. I dont want them to fuck off!

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