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Great Carl Craig interview

http://www.thewire.co.uk/articles/948/?pageno=1

excerpt:

quote:

There's a new scene coming up in Romania, with Petre, Raresh and Rhadoo. Yeah, I've heard about Romania doing that style. Obviously there's been a lot of hype around them, in part because I think people need new places to colonize, they need a new story. But I'm curious about the localism of scenes, and to what extent local scenes are still important, or made irrelevant by the Internet and everybody flying all over the place. Local scenes are way important! I come from a local scene. Or maybe not important, but even possible. Of course, but they've got to be possible. Local scenes are only possible based on the clubs or the parties that people can throw. I think it's great that, like in Belgrade, they throw wonderful parties, it's amazing. In Romania I didn't have a good party, but maybe next time it will be a good one. It's nice to pioneer these new places, but in some of the old places, especially in the U.S., we definitely need that kind of thing to happen at various cities in the U.S., because it's just a bitch that everybody else in the world gets it, and we're so far stuck up our own asses. Why is that, that America still struggles, even a city like New York? We go by standards that are based on a country that's as large as Europe, and by people who don't know any better. Our standards are based on religion, and I think the standards over here have other origins, but they're completely over the religion thing in Europe because they've had so many bad experiences over time, in the history of it. And our history is so young and we don't know any fucking better, and we let people living in the backwoods of the United States that are Bible bashers tell us what is right and what's not right. I think America should be divided � it could still be the United States of America, but it could be divided into cultures like the far East, the East Coast, then the South East which includes part of the South, like Atlanta, and the Midwest, and base cultures on that. So instead of having states that are, each state has its own shit, have a country, basically, but the country would be a region. Then it would morph everything into that region. You could still have things that nationally work, because of course within the cultures here, a lot of people look to what happens in the English press. New scenes can pop up and it's interesting. I really feel that there needs to be a reduction of our culture, in some cases within the United States. It gives the possibility for somebody here, like Luciano or Ricardo to go to Romania and say, "There's something great happening in Romania, let's show you what's going on." Where here in the U.S., it's like, there's something great, how much money you got, and we'll show the rest of the world how great that shit is. It really sucks. It sucks for being able to promote products throughout the U.S. to your own people. It sucks that radio is determined by some fools in New York. It sucks that� all of it. You know, I'm not being unpatriotic, and I'm not saying anything that should lead up to misunderstanding my intentions. But I think that it just doesn't really give our culture an opportunity to grow. And you put in the effort � you and Gamall do the Demon Days parties across the country. Sure, yeah. I would love to see Detroit be a pinnacle of the whole shit, I would love for Detroit to be a new city, you know, New Detroit, like in Robocop. To be like a new city with a new attitude, with new ideas, that can be the starting point and the go-to point for everything creative in the United States. But that shit ain't happening. So we just gotta spread the word however we can, and if it's a club for 100 people, that's great, we spread the word to 100 people. If it's a club for 1000 people, even better.

He should stick to making music.

quote:

Originally posted by miamitranceman He should stick to making music.

As opposed to? Talking about stuff?

quote:

Originally posted by miamitranceman He should stick to making music.

Please don't post.



Amazing read, thanks very much.

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Originally posted by Clovis As opposed to? Talking about stuff?

Yes!

The reviewer asked him why the music scene struggles in the US and he launched into an unrelated diatribe about religion and morals.

Without being patronising, what did you find interesting about this interview?

At no stage is his current pick of tunes, current projects or his opinion of "the scene" as a whole discussed, it's just two "I couldn't give a fuck" answers to questions about Romania, and then two nonsensical rants. No insight at all into his thoughts about the actual music.

quote:

Without being patronising, what did you find interesting about this interview?

Natural, like being down the pub with your mate after a couple of pints.

So yeah, of course you veer off, of course you can't precisely talk about your thoughts about music - cliche shit, but language can't always cover it.

I dont think he was prepared for some of those questions, thats all. Its kinda hard to come up with a great answer or a politically correct answer if your an artist to every question during what seems to be a live interview.

Great interview though, quite long. Been listening to a lot of C2 lately, its like his music was made to be listened to at this time of year, it all sounds so good right now as a warmup to the summer season, especially Landcruising.

I like some of the points he makes

quote:

Originally posted by Guest I like some of the points he makes

Indeed. Only now do I realize that real Detroit cannot be like the Detroit in Robocop; both patrolled by a crime fighting cyborg and the pinnacle of new electronic music.

I think what he said needed to be said and needs to be said more often.

quote:

Originally posted by Beat Blog Yes! The reviewer asked him why the music scene struggles in the US and he launched into an unrelated diatribe about religion and morals. Without being patronising, what did you find interesting about this interview? At no stage is his current pick of tunes, current projects or his opinion of "the scene" as a whole discussed, it's just two "I couldn't give a fuck" answers to questions about Romania, and then two nonsensical rants. No insight at all into his thoughts about the actual music.

Did we read the same interview?


Also, religion and morals are WHY the US does not have the scene Europe does.

quote:

Where here in the U.S., it's like, there's something great, how much money you got, and we'll show the rest of the world how great that shit is.

Regardless of how poor this sentence is grammatically, it definitely speaks to how EDM and the club scene in general works in the U.S.

Money talks, bullshit walks. People are so caught up in the superficial that there is absolutely no room for, and not really any thought of, people who just absolutely love electronic music.

Does this mean those folks don't exist? Absolutely not. Some of the worlds most passionate electronic musicians and DJ's come from the U.S. - unfortunately the rest of society is so far "up it's own ass" that they could give fuck all about giving anything that isn't top 40 or hip hop a chance in a club, so club owners don't bother pushing it more because they know they'll make money doing what works rather than taking a chance.

Just getting people through the door for a night of electronic music is a massive challenge, but getting them to stay there once they've arrived can often times be an even bigger challenge.

Great interview.

I can understand morals and the prejudice towards the term "dance music", but religion? If religion was that big of a barrier, America wouldn't have a big hardcore metal scene full of music with violent lyrics such as "I will abort you with a crowbar," and there wouldn't be a huge porn industry, and many other things.

I don't know, that was a really random of him to give such an answer. I can definitely understand if he just wasn't prepared for that question, because I myself have gone on senseless rants when asked a question that I never thought through and felt pressured to answer it right away.

Religion does play a pretty big role, mainly due to the Extreme Right Wing politicians who are telling us that electronic music is nothing but drug music, etc. The media's horrible interpretation is also to blame, as again, all they show is 1 or 2 kids that passed out, maybe one died from overdoing it, so the whole scene is labeled as a huge drug fest that if kids attend, there going to do some street drug and die from it. Its a real shame, but this country has a loooooong way to go before it grows up like most of Europe has. The issue of "How much money is in it" is another big one, and thats priority to most of the club owners as well. He pretty much hit on the right points I would say.

quote:

Originally posted by ibizzzaaa I can understand morals and the prejudice towards the term "dance music", but religion? If religion was that big of a barrier, America wouldn't have a big hardcore metal scene full of music with violent lyrics such as "I will abort you with a crowbar," and there wouldn't be a huge porn industry, and many other things. I don't know, that was a really random of him to give such an answer. I can definitely understand if he just wasn't prepared for that question, because I myself have gone on senseless rants when asked a question that I never thought through and felt pressured to answer it right away.

Metal music is popular because radio stations play it, makes money, and it was not as aggressively attacked as EDM has been. Sure the 80's had its share of bad media coverage, but nothing like what EDM has been labeled. They focused more on it causing brain damage (LOL), makes kids do stupid things, but not die from it. Its also been around much longer, or at least a commercial form of it from the 70's, and this country was different then, and more Liberal. EDM has been sorta kept underground more so than most forms of music, and therefore less commercialized, since most of the good tracks come out of Europe and elsewhere....IMO. Americans are stupid as a whole, and if its not on a Clear Channel radio station or TV, they don't know what is out there.

quote:

Originally posted by ibizzzaaa I can understand morals and the prejudice towards the term "dance music", but religion? If religion was that big of a barrier, America wouldn't have a big hardcore metal scene full of music with violent lyrics such as "I will abort you with a crowbar," and there wouldn't be a huge porn industry, and many other things. I don't know, that was a really random of him to give such an answer. I can definitely understand if he just wasn't prepared for that question, because I myself have gone on senseless rants when asked a question that I never thought through and felt pressured to answer it right away.

Just because things exist that defy the religious consensus doesn't mean that there isn't a massive influence of religion on the way the average American lives his or her daily life - and the clear influence of religion on politics is, I think, what Craig is talking about.

Implementing policy that has its roots in religious beliefs does have the affect of changing the way people live, and the kinds of popular entertainment within a culture. You'd be hard pressed to find the kinds of death metal you refer to being accepted by popular culture, which seems to me to be what Carl is talking about.

I think Carl was very prepared for that question - in fact, in my mind, the response given implies pretty clearly it's something he has thought long and hard about over the years.

I imagine that what he said has been brewing in his head for quite some time. I really doubt that this question cought him off gaurd. The way he presented it or got it off his chest may not have made a lot of sense if taken face value (I do this all time time) but read between the lines and you will know exactly why he is trying to say.

Again, he makes a lot of good points and I do agree with some of it. Last night, here in Philadelphia, is a prime example of EDM in the US. Josh Wink, Philly's own, barely pulled 80 people at Fluid. The party was absolutely insane and everyone that was there had a blast but I'm sure anywhere else in the world he would have had a MUCH better attendance then that.

I get what he's getting at, but when he starts going off about separate countries, that's a little much.

Hence, I agree with Beat Blog.

Well, I think that EDM is definitely better off being underground. History has showed how almost everything goes shit once it starts getting extra airtime and mass media attention; and that's regardless of whether we are talking about the pop culture of US, UK, Europe, whatever. The difference is that in most cases what goes mainstream in Europe is I guess you could say "more classy" quality-wise. But still, there are very few European major-label artists that I find interesting.

Besides, the question was regarding the lack of local scenes in America and elsewhere. It's hard for me to see something immensely popular being split into local scenes. Well, I guess hip-hop is split into east coast/west coast/southside "scenes", but come on - what they have going is just bullshit.

I can see lack of local scenes and unique sounds as an issue, but certainly not the lack of commercialization.

The religion does have a ponderable influence on politics. There is no doubt about that. But blaming it for lack of local scenes still seems random to me. Indie Rock in America used to be all about local scenes during late 80's and all of 90's. Then publications such as Pitchfork came along and began to draw more attention to indie. The weightiness of their opinion eventually grew to such dimensions, that the concept of local scenes is almost inexistent these days.

quote:

Originally posted by DOOMBOT Josh Wink, Philly's own, barely pulled 80 people at Fluid. The party was absolutely insane and everyone that was there had a blast but I'm sure anywhere else in the world he would have had a MUCH better attendance then that.

I can see myself having more fun at that party then the Digweed gig I went to once, where the club was packed with a sea of douche bags who would be just as happy at a Tiesto gig.

The reason why America doesnt have the scene that other parts of the world has has nothing to do with Religion or Morals. It has to do with culture, but its deeper than that, with racism, differences in socio economic classes included in the mix. People in other parts of the world have a strong culture, usually one race they share with most of the patrons (Latin America/Eastern European), so most of the parties are like family get togethers, tight knit communities (London/Germany), and most of the patrons are of similar social economic standings, focused on the music and having fun. I think the main thing people of all scenes have in common is similar morals when it comes to nightclubs. Americans simply arent built to have fun in the way the rest of the world does, we see fun in materialistic objects more than anything, there is an eccentric enigmatic few who see different, but for the most part culturally Americans dont have what it is needed for a "great scene." That said...we have a good scene in America if you know where to go and when to go, like Coachella most recently.

Is the new cool thing to suck the cocks of 'legendary' non-trance artists now? Instead of Tiesto? What Carl said isn't revolutionary and can be boiled down to 'money makes the world go round' with a sprinkle of anti-Americanism. What a damn genius. If some random guy had written all that crap, you wouldn't even give a shit.

quote:

Originally posted by ToxicGreenWaste Is the new cool thing to suck the cocks of 'legendary' non-trance artists now? Instead of Tiesto? What Carl said isn't revolutionary and can be boiled down to 'money makes the world go round' with a sprinkle of anti-Americanism. What a damn genius. If some random guy had written all that crap, you wouldn't even give a shit.

lol TA's are either hating or sucking a cock.

quote:

Originally posted by ToxicGreenWaste Is the new cool thing to suck the cocks of 'legendary' non-trance artists now? Instead of Tiesto? What Carl said isn't revolutionary and can be boiled down to 'money makes the world go round' with a sprinkle of anti-Americanism. What a damn genius. If some random guy had written all that crap, you wouldn't even give a shit.

I didn't say it made him a fucking genius you prat, I said it was a good interview because the questions and discussion went beyond "what is it like touring" or "what do you think about trance?". There was frank discussion on an array of themes including a lot of historical stuff that most interviews just skim over.

Its hilarious to me that everyone is trivializing the small excerpt I posted (which I thought was an interesting albeit poorly articulated run of Q&A) and clearly not taking in the interview as a whole. Read the whole thing you idiots.

Fuck dude, you couldn't be more off, and I'm not trying to patronize you here but hear me on this because I can tell you for a fact that this perception is wrong.

You're using the status quo as an argument as to why there is this status quo.

quote:

Originally posted by LionsLair The reason why America doesnt have the scene that other parts of the world has has nothing to do with Religion or Morals. It has to do with culture, but its deeper than that, with racism, differences in socio economic classes included in the mix. People in other parts of the world have a strong culture, usually one race they share with most of the patrons (Latin America/Eastern European), so most of the parties are like family get togethers, tight knit communities (London/Germany), and most of the patrons are of similar social economic standings, focused on the music and having fun. I think the main thing people of all scenes have in common is similar morals when it comes to nightclubs.

First of all, to say that people in other countries have fun at parties because they identify with each other's culture and race is complete bollocks. Obviously you've never partied in Europe or anywhere outside of the US. In Ibiza you have people from all over the world partying together and frankly the race/culture issue is almost completely removed. Same goes for social status. In Paris I partied at Rex club next to hipster kids with 1000 euro tables of alcohol and kids wearing cheap clothes and drinking the alcohol they snuck in, everyone on the same page and everyone having fun. DANCE culture is a thing they have in the rest of the world that is severely lacking in the US. People are used to clubbing and partying into the wee hours of the morning, we are not.

quote:

Americans simply arent built to have fun in the way the rest of the world does, we see fun in materialistic objects more than anything, there is an eccentric enigmatic few who see different, but for the most part culturally Americans dont have what it is needed for a "great scene." That said...we have a good scene in America if you know where to go and when to go, like Coachella most recently.

It has nothing to do with how we're built and everything to do with how we've been trained and conditioned, and the norms that are beaten into us since we're kids. But this can be reversed and toppled, obviously, since as RJT pointed out, there are plenty of die hard partyers and dance music fans who are on the same page as their European counterparts. We see fun in materialistic objects because thats what we've been trained to do, not because we're incapable of looking past that. And using Coachella as an example of a "good scene" is abysmal. A bunch of kids blowing their wads to boyz noize and justice and hordes more shitty pop dance music is not the pinnacle of the dance music experience imo. The only place I ever experienced vibes akin to those I found in Europe was in Miami for WMC at a few select parties and even those were nothing compared to what happens in Europe on any given weekend.

The bottom line is freedom. We tout ourselves as the land of the free but the reason why the rest of the world is out on the weekends having the time of their lives while we're going to hip-hop clubs till 2am and blowing 2 grand to sit next to a bottle of grey goose is precisely because of the LACK of freedom. We cannot grow a healthy dance music scene in the US with such ridiculous restrictions and laws pushing in the other direction.
The 2am liquor rule alone does much of the damage in California, as do curfews, age limits, vastly harsher drug penalties, the amazing difficulty of acquiring the correct permits to throw LEGAL parties at proper venues...etc. The consolidation of the media and prevalent culture in the US also play a big part, such as the inability for dance music to make any inroads into the mainstream without being completely watered down and reduced to nothing more than an echo of the creativity and uniqueness that make it worthwhile in the first place. Religion ties into this due to the fact that without such a huge christian right and conservative movement in this country we would most likely be up to speed with the rest of the world. The culture of repression stems almost entirely from them and them alone.

In the end I think nothing will ever change if we take your "this is just how it is, and we just can't do that because" stance...nothing good will ever come about if we assert that this is the way things are. I hate to sound like a presidential candidate, but change is needed.

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