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Posted by Cobalt on May-10-2008 19:58:

Good Songwriting In Dance Music

I don't mean pretentious BT wankery or Underworld jibber-jabber. Just good songwriting.

Suggestions?

Posted by RapidFire on May-10-2008 20:01:

faithless

Posted by MrJiveBoJingles on May-10-2008 20:03:

What is "pretentious" about BT?

Posted by PETRAN on May-10-2008 20:04:

What, you mean "good songwriting" in modern EDM?

And what exactly do we mean by "good"?

Posted by Cobalt on May-10-2008 20:06:

quote:
Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles
What is "pretentious" about BT?

His lyrics try desperately hard to be important, but are usually empty and forgettable. It's no comment on his production abilities.

Yes, Faithless fits the bill. But I'm wondering if there are any artists lesser known.

Posted by MrJiveBoJingles on May-10-2008 20:07:

quote:
Originally posted by Cobalt
His lyrics try desperately hard to be important, but are usually empty and forgettable. It's no comment on his production abilities.

Ahh. I basically don't listen to lyrics (even if a song has them), so I wouldn't know...

So are you looking for good lyrics in dance music or what?

Posted by Cobalt on May-10-2008 20:08:

quote:
Originally posted by PETRAN
And what exactly do we mean by "good"?

Uh-oh, I don't think I'm fielding that one.

Posted by PETRAN on May-10-2008 20:08:

quote:
Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles
What is "pretentious" about BT?

I guess that you can criticise his last album as being "over-produced" in effects. Plus, one can get the impression that some things were done purely for the purpose of showing-off his engineering skill, but then again it is a matter of taste. "Pretentious or not", BT IMO, does excellent high-quality song-writing.

Posted by PETRAN on May-10-2008 20:09:

oh, you mean songs, like EDM tracks with vocals?

Posted by Cobalt on May-10-2008 20:11:

quote:
Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles
Ahh. I basically don't listen to lyrics (even if a song has them), so I wouldn't know...

So are you looking for good lyrics in dance music or what?

Sorry for the ambiguity. I explicitly mean lyrics, and their delivery in production. I thought that was necessarily implied by "songwriting", but I forgot that the word can sometimes mean production more generally.

Posted by MrJiveBoJingles on May-10-2008 20:11:

I'm pretty sure good lyrics are one of the rarest things in EDM...

Posted by Cobalt on May-10-2008 20:12:

quote:
Originally posted by PETRAN
oh, you mean songs, like EDM tracks with vocals?

Yes. Generally that's what songwriting means, but I forgot that it's used more loosely in EDM vocabulary.

Posted by Cobalt on May-10-2008 20:13:

quote:
Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles
I'm pretty sure good lyrics are one of the rarest things in EDM...

Hence the topic.

Posted by MrJiveBoJingles on May-10-2008 20:17:

For lyrical content, trance tends to be one of the worst.

Trance and lyrics simply were not meant to be together.

Posted by Cobalt on May-10-2008 20:22:

If I can take some commercial license with "dance music", one reason I still listen to Madonna's Ray of Light is the combination of solid songwriting with Orbit's technical prowess. (No comment on her career decline since.)

As another example, Flesh was a mainroom anthem in part because of Jan Johnston's lyrics.

Surely there are better?

quote:
Trance and lyrics simply were not meant to be together.

Generally I agree, which is why I'm asking about dance music more broadly. Aren't there solid house songwriters out there?

Posted by distant on May-10-2008 20:33:

Do you consider grime dance music?

Posted by Forever Delayed on May-10-2008 20:41:

quote:
Originally posted by distant
Do you consider grime dance music?

Does anyone?

Posted by phineasncole on May-10-2008 20:47:

quote:
Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles
For lyrical content, trance tends to be one of the worst.

Trance and lyrics simply were not meant to be together.

trance and lyrics ?? or do you mean vocals?

trance, is a genre which consists of many songs, and many with lyrics.

...lyrics is just one facet of a song.

I think this view is narrow minded.. Some of the best trance songs ever consists of vocals/lyrics !! Vocals/lyrics give extended life to many trance songs, where instrumentals usually become forgotten. also vocals are what many new listeners gravitate to. vocals are often a gateway for new listeners.

in regards to the worse lyrics.. hip hop takes the cake!!

Posted by Cobalt on May-10-2008 20:48:

quote:
Originally posted by distant
Do you consider grime dance music?

Do you consider grime vocals to be songs?

Posted by TranceArmstrong on May-10-2008 20:50:

Efdemin - Just A Track is kind of cool

Posted by distant on May-10-2008 20:52:

Where do you draw the line between dance and non-dance music?

Posted by Cobalt on May-10-2008 20:53:

quote:
Originally posted by phineasncole
I think this view is narrow minded.. Some of the best trance songs ever consists of vocals/lyrics !! Vocals/lyrics give extended life to many trance songs, where instrumentals usually become forgotten. also vocals are what many new listeners gravitate to. vocals are often a gateway for new listeners.

in regards to the worse lyrics.. hip hop takes the cake!!

Please tell me you're an alt. If not, take this to another thread, please.

Posted by phineasncole on May-10-2008 20:56:

what is an alt ??

Posted by Cobalt on May-10-2008 20:57:

quote:
Originally posted by distant
Where do you draw the line between dance and non-dance music?

I don't.

But Simon & Garfunkle or the Beatles probably don't belong here.

Posted by Cobalt on May-10-2008 20:59:

quote:
Originally posted by phineasncole
what is an alt ??

It's a fake account that someone creates for the purpose of making havoc. Generally alts pretend to ask loaded questions or voice frustrating, naive positions for the purpose of derailing threads.

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